iPod blamed for Aussie death

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Frank
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"Theo Bekkers" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Michael Warner said:

Theo Bekkers said:

> OTOH, I don't use it in the hills, because it prevents me from
> hearing cars coming up behind me, and I'd have to ride on
> the verge on the assumption that there's always one there.

Why? Because you think a car behind you has right of way?

No - because there's no reason to block it. I like to climb in
the middle of the lane, but I don't mind moving over to let
the odd car past. Forcing them to cross the centre line
to overtake me puts both of us at risk.

Do you intentionally block cars when there's no good reason
to do so? IMHO that's a stupid thing to do.

Stuart's response says all I would have, and more.

Riding on my side of the road is _not_ blocking cars.

If a car needs to cross the centre line to pass me why is that _my_

problem?

Quoted message said:

If they wish to pass me it is up to them to do it in a safe manner.

Theo

I see it as a legal right/social duty thing. Yes, you have the legal right
to claim the lane, the driver (the car doesn't do anything - the driver
does) has a legal duty to wait and only pass when safe... all that stuff
that's been discussed here ad nauseum (that means 'till we're sick of it,
Euan!). But (so I started a sentence with 'but' - get over it :-) life seems
to be easier if road use is handled as human space negotiation - legalities
are for when that breaks down. That means I have a legal right to claim the
lane but I have a social duty to sometimes not exercise my rights. That also
translates into, for eg, if a driver waits patiently before finding a safe
place to pass, giving them a nod or wave of appreciation, despite that they
have only done what they are legally obliged to do.

If it's not inconvenient for me to ride close to the edge and allow drivers
to pass more easily, that's fine; I'll ride on the edge. I can give up my
legal rights to fulfil my social obligations. If I *need* (not just want) to
claim the lane, I can and do. I'm not going to claim the lane just to prove
a point, especially to a driver who probably isn't aware of the debate
anyway. Sometimes we all have to give and take...

OK, that's oversimplified, but it'll do.

Cheers,

Frank

Michael Warner said:

Dale Stanbrough said:

Get a mirror for your bike. I've got one and it's enormously helpful.

I'm a roadie. I don't put mirrors, bells, reflectors or other
non-electronic rubbish on my racer. Go ahead, call me a law-
defying nut :-)

Law-defying nut? Nah, you're just a weight weenie! :-P

Tam

Plodder said:

the driver
does) has a legal duty to wait and only pass when safe... all that stuff
that's been discussed here ad nauseum (that means 'till we're sick of it,
Euan!).

Oh clever! Jab at my distaste for Latin and a jab at me hammering on about stuff that's been gone over time and time again. I doff my hat to you :-)

Quoted post said:

But (so I started a sentence with 'but' - get over it :-) life seems
to be easier if road use is handled as human space negotiation - legalities
are for when that breaks down. That means I have a legal right to claim the
lane but I have a social duty to sometimes not exercise my rights. That also
translates into, for eg, if a driver waits patiently before finding a safe
place to pass, giving them a nod or wave of appreciation, despite that they
have only done what they are legally obliged to do.

Which is exactly what vehicular cycling, or its more neutral designation and one I prefer; co-operative cycling, is all about! :-)

Plodder said:

If it's not inconvenient for me to ride close to the edge and allow drivers
to pass more easily, that's fine; I'll ride on the edge. I can give up my
legal rights to fulfil my social obligations. If I *need* (not just want) to
claim the lane, I can and do. I'm not going to claim the lane just to prove
a point, especially to a driver who probably isn't aware of the debate
anyway. Sometimes we all have to give and take...

Well said. Our legal rights should be a recourse to be used when
necessary, not a weapon for pissing off people against whom we have some
ideological grudge.

--
Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw

EuanB said:

I took a leap of faith with the Ground Effect Rock Lobster top, it's a
long sleeved summer top. It works in much the same way (I imagine, not
used one yet) as a bandana would. In hot weather it soaks with sweat
and that provides greater cooling whilst in motion. Sounds crazy but
it works, in my opinion really well.

I've just started wearing a new summer undershirt, a mesh thing with fairly
large holes in it. In hot weather it's a definite improvement over a jersey
alone - it stops my skin and the jersey clinging together, and seems to
keep them both dryer and cooler.

--
Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw

Tamyka Bell said:

Law-defying nut? Nah, you're just a weight weenie! :-P

Excuse me, I have to go weigh myself.

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Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw

Michael Warner said:

Tamyka Bell said:

Law-defying nut? Nah, you're just a weight weenie! :-P

Excuse me, I have to go weigh myself.

Have you dehydrated first?

T

"Graeme Dods" wrote

Quoted message said:

Theo Bekkers said:

I listened to AM radio, in a past life.

Since coming to Australia I've been forced to. I've not been able to

find a

Quoted message said:

decent FM station in WA.

94.5 does it for me.

Theo

"Plodder" wrote

Quoted message said:

"Theo Bekkers" wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Riding on my side of the road is _not_ blocking cars.

If a car needs to cross the centre line to pass me why is that

_my_

Quoted message said:

problem?

Quoted message said:

If they wish to pass me it is up to them to do it in a safe

manner.

Quoted message said:

I see it as a legal right/social duty thing. Yes, you have the legal

right

Quoted message said:

to claim the lane, the driver (the car doesn't do anything - the

driver

Quoted message said:

does) has a legal duty to wait and only pass when safe... all that

stuff

Quoted message said:

that's been discussed here ad nauseum (that means 'till we're sick

of it,

Quoted message said:

Euan!). But (so I started a sentence with 'but' - get over it :-)

life seems

Quoted message said:

to be easier if road use is handled as human space negotiation -

legalities

Quoted message said:

are for when that breaks down. That means I have a legal right to

claim the

Quoted message said:

lane but I have a social duty to sometimes not exercise my rights.

That also

Quoted message said:

translates into, for eg, if a driver waits patiently before finding

a safe

Quoted message said:

place to pass, giving them a nod or wave of appreciation, despite

that they

Quoted message said:

have only done what they are legally obliged to do.

If it's not inconvenient for me to ride close to the edge and allow

drivers

Quoted message said:

to pass more easily, that's fine; I'll ride on the edge. I can give

up my

Quoted message said:

legal rights to fulfil my social obligations. If I *need* (not just

want) to

Quoted message said:

claim the lane, I can and do. I'm not going to claim the lane just

to prove

Quoted message said:

a point, especially to a driver who probably isn't aware of the

debate

Quoted message said:

anyway. Sometimes we all have to give and take...

OK, that's oversimplified, but it'll do.

I can agree with that. My initial objection was that there was some
implied understanding that it was a requirement for me to get out of
the way of other vehicles. A social duty to share the road, yes.

Sometimes I require other vehicles to get out of my way but that is
when I'm in the fire truck, with the siren on. :-)

Theo

"Michael Warner" wrote

Quoted message said:

I'm a roadie. I don't put mirrors, bells, reflectors or other
non-electronic rubbish on my racer. Go ahead, call me a law-
defying nut :-)

You're a law-defying nut. What the Yanks call a scoff-law. :-)

I have a mirror on all my bikes. None have a bell, but one has a
whistle, the referee pea-type. OK, it's electronic, but it sounds like
the real deal.

I seem to have lost the reflectors on the roadie as well. Never did
figure out why I need them in daylight.

Theo

Theo Bekkers said:

94.5 does it for me.

If by "it" you mean "drives you to distraction with their bland music on
the radio and stupid advert featuring an ape who choses their play list"
then yes, it does it for me too. I must admit I prefer my radio to be
fairly music free, I used to listen to BBC Radio 4 back in the UK;
wonderful plays, comedies, documentaries, news etc. Still, that's what this
internet thingy is for. Shame I can't afford continuous wireless broadband
to listen to an internet stream in my car, mind you, the 8 hour time
difference would mean I was stuck with the shipping forecast on the way
into work (but that's an art form in itself, something which few
Australians would understand).

Time for another coffee I think 🙂

Graeme

"Graeme Dods" wrote

Quoted message said:

Theo Bekkers said:

94.5 does it for me.

If by "it" you mean "drives you to distraction with their bland

music on

Quoted message said:

the radio and stupid advert featuring an ape who choses their play

list"

Quoted message said:

then yes, it does it for me too. I must admit I prefer my radio to

be

Quoted message said:

fairly music free,

I prefer radio music to be background, non-intrusive, non-rap. And
that's 94.5 to me.
I hate talk-back radio. I prefer to do talk-back here, without the
sound, and with the option to ignore the people/subjects that I want
to ignore.

Theo

Michael Warner said:

I've just started wearing a new summer undershirt, a mesh thing with fairly
large holes in it. In hot weather it's a definite improvement over a jersey
alone - it stops my skin and the jersey clinging together, and seems to
keep them both dryer and cooler.

Thanks for the tip *cackles* more shopping :-)
--
Cheers | ~~ __@
Euan | ~~ _-\<,
Melbourne, Australia | ~ (*)/ (*)

Euan said:

Thanks for the tip *cackles* more shopping :-)

You can never have enough bike toys.

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Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw

Michael Warner said:

Euan said:

Thanks for the tip *cackles* more shopping :-)

You can never have enough bike toys.

Weeeell .... buying bike toys does stop me buying diving toys, so I'm
not all that convinced ... :-D

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