Is Einstein manic-depressive?

"inquire-mind" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

See this article

talentdevelop.comPage108.htmlOpen ↗

More than likely not... read a more recent biography using
the full release of the Princeton Papers, like _The Private
Lives of Albert Einstein_ by Roger Highfield and Paul
Carter, 1993 ... take particular note of the treatment of
his second son's illness.

For an interesting note of mental illness in the highly
intelligent, read up on Nikola Tesla.

Mental illness strikes about 1% of the population... it is
generally genetic and not necesarily connected to
intelligence.

HCN said:

"inquire-mind" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

See this article

talentdevelop.comPage108.htmlOpen ↗

More than likely not... read a more recent biography using
the full release of the Princeton Papers, like _The Private
Lives of Albert Einstein_ by Roger Highfield and Paul
Carter, 1993 ... take particular note of the treatment of
his second son's illness.

For an interesting note of mental illness in the highly
intelligent, read up on Nikola Tesla.

Mental illness strikes about 1% of the population... it is
generally genetic and not necesarily connected to
intelligence.

Curious where you got that figure. Schizophrenia alone
affects 1% of the population, and the percentage of people
who suffer major depression during their lifetime is at
least double-digits.

PF

"PF Riley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

HCN said:

..> >Mental illness strikes about 1% of the population... it
is generally genetic

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and not necesarily connected to intelligence.

Curious where you got that figure. Schizophrenia alone
affects 1% of the population, and the percentage of people
who suffer major depression during their lifetime is at
least double-digits.

PF

I got it from _When Someone You Love Has a Mental Illness: A
Handbook for Family, Friends, and Caregivers_ by Rebecca
Woolis and Agnes Hatfield

It may not be quite accurate, but its depth and focus was
required for our family about a month ago... I would check
the figures in it, but I gave it my mother-in-law. This book
seemed to put ALL mental illness in two catagories:
schizophrenia and some mood disorders (like bipolar)....
including those that have depression combined with
schizophrenia. The family member who is the focus of concern
is someone we thought was suffering from depression for many
years... but the hospital where she was involuntarily placed
diagnosed her as bipolar.

I can believe that the number of persons who have suffered
depression goes into the double digits --- I spent some time
being depressed when my mother died: but within a few weeks
I recovered to a point of living a normal life without
medication. How many folks actually let the depression take
over their lives and become clinically depressed?

Anyway, I usually take exception to people buying into the
"Einstein Myth"... his social and academic achievement has
been warped by a couple of very loyal assistents. They
would not even allow family members to write about Einstein
and kept many papers unavailable to the public. It was only
until they died (in their 90's!) that much of the
information was released in the "Princeton Papers". As a
parent of a child with oral motor dyspraxia I especially
hate the "Einstein didn't talk until he was 3, 4. 5 or
later" bit --- he could speak complete sentences by the
time his sister was born (like that has any bearing on my
kid's outcome... who has benefitted from many many years of
speech therapy).

Nikola Tesla is a completely different story.

"HCN" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<i%O7c.65955$SR1.114908@attbi_s04>...

Quoted message said:

"PF Riley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:21:40 GMT, "HCN" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

..> >Mental illness strikes about 1% of the population...
it is generally genetic

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and not necesarily connected to intelligence.

Curious where you got that figure. Schizophrenia alone
affects 1% of the population, and the percentage of
people who suffer major depression during their lifetime
is at least double-digits.

PF

I got it from _When Someone You Love Has a Mental Illness:
A Handbook for Family, Friends, and Caregivers_ by Rebecca
Woolis and Agnes Hatfield

It may not be quite accurate, but its depth and focus was
required for our family about a month ago... I would check
the figures in it, but I gave it my mother-in-law. This
book seemed to put ALL mental illness in two catagories:
schizophrenia and some mood disorders (like bipolar)....
including those that have depression combined with
schizophrenia. The family member who is the focus of
concern is someone we thought was suffering from
depression for many years... but the hospital where she
was involuntarily placed diagnosed her as bipolar.

In those years that she was thought to be suffering from
depression,
was that family member able to accomplish things, *any*
thing at all?
How big or small those things wre, if she was able to
accomplish them?

Quoted message said:

I can believe that the number of persons who have suffered
depression goes into the double digits --- I spent some
time being depressed when my mother died: but within a few
weeks I recovered to a point of living a normal life
without medication. How many folks actually let the
depression take over their lives and become clinically
depressed?

Anyway, I usually take exception to people buying into the
"Einstein Myth"... his social and academic achievement has
been warped by a couple of very loyal assistents. They
would not even allow family members to write about
Einstein and kept many papers unavailable to the public.
It was only until they died (in their 90's!) that much of
the information was released in the "Princeton Papers". As
a parent of a child with oral motor dyspraxia I especially
hate the "Einstein didn't talk until he was 3, 4. 5 or
later" bit --- he could speak complete sentences by the
time his sister was born (like that has any bearing on my
kid's outcome... who has benefitted from many many years
of speech therapy).

Nikola Tesla is a completely different story.

"inquire-mind" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"HCN" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<i%O7c.65955$SR1.114908@attbi_s04>... ...> >

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I got it from _When Someone You Love Has a Mental
Illness: A Handbook

for

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Family, Friends, and Caregivers_ by Rebecca Woolis and
Agnes Hatfield

It may not be quite accurate, but its depth and focus
was required for

our

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

family about a month ago... I would check the figures in
it, but I gave

it

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

my mother-in-law. This book seemed to put ALL mental
illness in two catagories: schizophrenia and some mood
disorders (like bipolar).... including those that have
depression combined with schizophrenia. The family
member who is the focus of concern is someone we thought
was suffering from depression for many years... but the
hospital where she

was

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

involuntarily placed diagnosed her as bipolar.

In those years that she was thought to be suffering from
depression,
was that family member able to accomplish things, *any*
thing at all?
How big or small those things wre, if she was able to
accomplish them?

...

Actually, yes. She did go to work, gardened and create
beautiful stitchery to give to friends and family. But about
5 years ago I think things started to change. It was subtle
and very slow. She got herself fired from work and has tried
various things to get work without having to leave the house
(home CPA course, writing romance stories, some craft stuff,
lots of time on the internet)... all started in spit and
spurts, but never finishing. With
20/20 hindsight it seems the starting new projects and never
finishing were related to bipolar cycles, what she did to
get fired was more than likely during a manic stage.
Slowly over the years her house became very cluttered...
which her neat-freak family were surprised by (but
interpreted as her rebelling against them versus being a
sign of disease).

Good luck.... fortunately for me I get to watch this all
from a safe distance (I'll more than likely get a new update
at the next big family gathering on Easter Sunday).

HCN said:

I can believe that the number of persons who have suffered
depression goes into the double digits --- I spent some
time being depressed when my mother died: but within a few
weeks I recovered to a point of living a normal life
without medication.

This sounds like normal grieving, not mental illness. When
I talk about depression as a mental illness, I mean
maladptive depression resulting in significant social
and/or occupational dysfunction lasting for months and
months on end.

Quoted message said:

How many folks actually let the depression take over their
lives and become clinically depressed?

Ah, with statements like these, do we wonder why mental
illness is still so stigmatized in our society? Let me
correct you: People don't "let" depression take over their
lives. Please don't assume that it's because of weakness on
the part of the patients that they succumb to depression.

PF

"PF Riley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

HCN said:

..> Ah, with statements like these, do we wonder why mental
illness is

Quoted message said:

still so stigmatized in our society? Let me correct you:
People don't "let" depression take over their lives.
Please don't assume that it's because of weakness on the
part of the patients that they succumb to depression.

PF

Thanks... I am learning how to deal with my inclinations to
yell "Get over it!!!"... I am trying not to be a slow
learner, but it is frustrating, especially when this subject
dominates family get-togethers.

Things I have learned since Christmas:

1) It is genetic
2) More common than we think
3) Attitudes have changed, but they need to change more
4) The social safety net is full of holes... and mental
health care is expensive
5) Newer privacy laws (HIPPA?) can keep information away,
even from her mother
6) This could happen to anyone

In article tx98c.66566$JL2.926229@attbi_s03 said:

"PF Riley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

HCN said:

..> Ah, with statements like these, do we wonder why mental
illness is

Quoted message said:

still so stigmatized in our society? Let me correct you:
People don't "let" depression take over their lives.
Please don't assume that it's because of weakness on the
part of the patients that they succumb to depression.

PF

Thanks... I am learning how to deal with my inclinations to
yell "Get over it!!!"... I am trying not to be a slow
learner, but it is frustrating, especially when this
subject dominates family get-togethers.

Friend: What do you have to be depressed about? Clinically
depressed person with insight: Nothing really. That's why
it's a disease.

Exasperated person to depressed person: Why don't you just
pull up your socks and get on with it like the rest of us?
Exasperated person to Type I diabetic: Why don't you just
make insulin and eat what you want like the rest of us?

One of the worst things about depression and other mental
illnesses is that the victim knows they aren't behaving
normally, wants to behave normally, can't behave normally
and can't explain to others (and to themselves) why they
can't do so.

Quoted message said:

Things I have learned since Christmas:
1) It is genetic

There's a strong genetic component, but it isn't the
whole story.

Quoted message said:

2) More common than we think

Many people with depression, anxiety and other problems can
conceal their symptoms from most observers, and many people
with these conditions are able to live normal lives with
appropriate drugs or other treatemnt. So they are all around
you, but invisible.

Quoted message said:

3) Attitudes have changed, but they need to change more

Yes.

Quoted message said:

4) The social safety net is full of holes... and mental
health care is expensive

It's practically absent for people with chronic disabling
mental disease like schizophrenia.

Quoted message said:

5) Newer privacy laws (HIPPA?) can keep information away,
even from her mother

Rightly so, if the patient is not a minor. If she wants her
doctor to talk to her mother, she can ask him or her to.

Quoted message said:

6) This could happen to anyone

Indeed. And unlike most serious health problems, the patient
often experiences rejection or incomprehension instead of
sympathy and support from family and friends.

[email hidden] (PF Riley) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

HCN said:

I can believe that the number of persons who have
suffered depression goes into the double digits --- I
spent some time being depressed when my mother died: but
within a few weeks I recovered to a point of living a
normal life without medication.

This sounds like normal grieving, not mental illness. When
I talk about depression as a mental illness, I mean
maladptive depression resulting in significant social
and/or occupational dysfunction lasting for months and
months on end.

Quoted message said:

How many folks actually let the depression take over
their lives and become clinically depressed?

Ah, with statements like these, do we wonder why mental
illness is still so stigmatized in our society?

Actualy, most societies but this society with all it's
advancement, it is sad, isn't it?

Quoted message said:

Let me correct you: People don't "let" depression take over
their lives. Please don't assume that it's because of
weakness on the part of the patients that they succumb to
depression.

PF