Kew Crit 17.4.04

Quoted message said:

Originally posted by flyingdutch Didnt feel much pep in the leg
on arrival. maybe they will 'come->to-life' as the rac
progresses, me hope

When you are forced to work hard, you forget that you have tired legs.
until the sprint! :

Quoted message said:

easier than last week's effort

Pace always changes weekly. Some riders are fresh so attack, sometime
stronger riders are competing at higher level races, etc.

Quoted message said:

Despite nagging from the commissaire, most of my group >still 'Sat-up
onto the tail of the C'ers for a lap

Sitting up means you aren't going hard - you are on the tops of the bar
- usually after a hard effort or when you give up. Sitting on a faste
bunch is a no-no. I'd attack the bunch while they were asleep on th
back of C... just because I don't like this 'cheating' (for want of
better word)

Quoted message said:

conscious of not constantly looking at my computer to watch the 30min
tick away. As i had forgot to 'zero' it at the start it >wa
irrelevant anyway

You need to remember to zero it at the start of the race but don't star
at it during the race - it'll mess with your head... "oh god.. 20 whol
minutes to go! Noo!

Quoted message said:

I heard (i think i heard) a bell and wandered if that was ours

It should be pretty obvious which bell is yours. You'll only get it whe
your bunch is crossing the line for the last lap. Problems can aris
when your bunch is being passed by another bunch on the line... but yo
should know it's YOUR last lap because the race director would've bee
holding up 3 laps to go, 2 laps to go signs (then it's bell lap)

Quoted message said:

42T and spinning was taking the stress out of all the changin

I don't know that course, but you'll find most people don't move out o
the big ring in races. Less risk of dropping chain should you have t
change to the big ring and much more potential for speed when needed
to chase breaks, etc

Quoted message said:

Then we pass the line and the Bell is donged at us. Right, 3 laps t
go, my memory recalls from the start-brief

No, bell lap is always the last lap. LAST lap. dingaling.. "this must b
the last lap!". I don't know what the briefing guy was thinking when h
"briefed" you, but there should be signs for 3 laps and 2 laps to go an
bell is always the last lap

Quoted message said:

The pace ups a bit and i wheel-suck like a 'hippy-on-heat'

Not a pretty image :

Quoted message said:

AND THE BUGGER IS HOLDING UP THE FLAG!#@#!@#@#!!!!

Did I mention bell lap is the LAST lap? (You don't need to be tol
this, right?

Quoted message said:

What happened to 3 laps? Cdale guy says he thought the same >thing, s
obviously we both made the same mistake. Dooooh

Hmm, maybe these Kew people are strange.

Quoted message said:

Pity as I was starting to feel better at the end than I had a
the start

Ahh.. now you see the benefit of warming up 🙂 Get to the race earlie
and get your HR up and you will feel better from the start. Pity I can'
do that at METEC tonight... always late to that

Quoted message said:

So second goal achieved. Didnt get droppe

Noice! Keep going and you'll have a win soon

hipp

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G'day

sounds like a better effort this week, race fitness & experience shoul
help improvement every week. Did Hippy mention that the bell is alway
the LAST lap?.....just wanted to make sure.....LOL...I'm not sure abou
that 42T chainring either. I don't know the course real well, but i
would want to be an enormous hill to consider changing to the smal
ring. Any attacks that come, all things being equal, will normally com
going up a hill, (harder for the weaker riders to hold on.....shows th
attacker the level of committment the bunch has to the 'chase'😉, so yo
don't want to get caught in the small chainring when tha
happens...5secs to change up can mean a lot more work chasing, rathe
than sucking wheel. Hippy's right about the warm up too. Your warm u
should start slow, just rolling the legs over & then build in intensit
toward race time. Ideally, you would arrive at the start line with 1mi
to go, with your heart at 'race pace'. Zero the speedo, particularl
important to know the 'time' (of a limited time race, such as
crit).This will help you make tactical decisions (when you start makin
them), such as whether to chase, or leave the bugger 'out there' fo
awhile, when to launch your own attack etc etc....it'll all com
together., the real important thing at the moment is just kee
racing...you'll learn more & more every week

Cheers

Hitch

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Hitchy said:

G'day,
sounds like a better effort this week, race fitness & experience should
help improvement every week. Did Hippy mention that the bell is always
the LAST lap?.....just wanted to make sure.....LOL...I'm not sure about
that 42T chainring either. I don't know the course real well, but it
would want to be an enormous hill to consider changing to the small
ring. Any attacks that come, all things being equal, will normally come
going up a hill, (harder for the weaker riders to hold on.....shows the
attacker the level of committment the bunch has to the 'chase'😉, so you
don't want to get caught in the small chainring when that
happens...5secs to change up can mean a lot more work chasing, rather
than sucking wheel. Hippy's right about the warm up too. Your warm up
should start slow, just rolling the legs over & then build in intensity
toward race time. Ideally, you would arrive at the start line with 1min
to go, with your heart at 'race pace'. Zero the speedo, particularly
important to know the 'time' (of a limited time race, such as a
crit).This will help you make tactical decisions (when you start making
them), such as whether to chase, or leave the bugger 'out there' for
awhile, when to launch your own attack etc etc....it'll all come
together., the real important thing at the moment is just keep
racing...you'll learn more & more every week,
Cheers,
Hitchy

I was going to the front at the top 100m of the hill almost every tim
cos I was spinning better, but OK, stomping next wee

and what does that Bell mean again ??? 😄 😄 :

(you can ring ma beeeellll, ring my bell. memory of [censored] late eightie
one-hit-wonder in lycra

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flyingdutch said:

I was going to the front at the top 100m of the hill almost every time
cos I was spinning better, but OK, stomping next week
and what does that Bell mean again ??? 😄 😄 😄
(you can ring ma beeeellll, ring my bell. memory of [censored] late eighties
one-hit-wonder in lycra)

Flying dude, good to see that you're having fun. I find improving th
biggest motivator with cycling (and my other passion - snow skiing)

I think you can also spin in the big chainring, you'll just need t
put it on a lower gear at the back. It's better to keep it in the bi
ring for that circuit in case of attacks after the hill or down th
back straight

I agree with you about being at the front because of your spinnin
actually. When out of the saddle up the hill, unless you can reall
push a big gear, the cadence you can get up to will be lower than i
you sit down

I experienced this in my last race on that circuit. I found that rathe
than standing, I could put it into the next lowest gear and remain i
the saddle and get more power output because of my increased cadence
I'll definitely be trying that approach next time I race out there (las
race next Wednesday?

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Quoted message said:

Originally posted by jazmo I experienced this in my last race on tha
circuit. I found that rather than standing, I could put it into th
next lowest gear and remain in the saddle and get more power outpu
because of my increased cadence

You use less energy by pedaling seated too. Watch the XC racers - it'
very rare seeing any of them stand up. Sitting down is a lot mor
efficient for heavier dudes (I find) whereas the lighter roadies ca
often ride while standing up for ages... I usually try to remain seated
If it's a long climb though it's good to get off the saddle an
'freshen' the legs with a different position and riding style. You wil
usually push the next higher gear when standing up. Lots of this kind o
info is out there in racing/riding books and websites... just gotta hav
time to absorb it all and then throw it all out the window whe
something totally different works for you. ;

I'm having a bad run at the moment Jaz, so if you want to kill m
tonight at METEC, you have a good chance :

hipp

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flyingdutch said:

I was going to the front at the top 100m of the hill almost every time
cos I was spinning better, but OK, stomping next week
and what does that Bell mean again ??? 😄 😄 😄
(you can ring ma beeeellll, ring my bell. memory of [censored] late eighties
one-hit-wonder in lycra)

g'day

I seem to recall reading in some post that you're around 85kgs? Hills i
crits are an interesting proposition for bigger guys.(gravity sucks!)
you've really got 2 choices....Don't go to to front going up hill if yo
can help it....suck wheel & let the skinny guys do the work, save th
legs at all costs, especially if its an uphill sprint to the finish. Th
only time I would change that tactic is :1/ you're struggling to hol
onto the skinny guys going up the hill. In this instance, its probabl
best to go to the front, that way you get to 'set the pace' up the hill
Go at your pace, not someone elses. 9 times out of 10 they will all jus
sit on you anyway. Canny guys will see this tactic for what it is, bu
there's not usually many of them in a D or C race (who can do anythin
about it anyway!). The only other time you should go to the front (u
hill) is if YOU are intent on making the bunch suffer!.....half [censored]
attacks really only hurt yourself, if you're gunna do it, you've gott
be committed to giving it a good 'go'. before considering an attack
you'll have sussed out who's in the bunch, (you'll get to know how goo
the regulars are), how you're feeling, the time of the race (yo
probably don't wanna go to early, if you do, it just gives them mor
time to hunt you down!)....Now that you know that you can hang on (
what the bell is about .....LOL) try some tactics next week......what
the old quote..."I love it when a plan comes together"

cheers

Hitch

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hippy said:

I'm having a bad run at the moment Jaz, so if you want to kill me
tonight at METEC, you have a good chance 🙂
hippy

I don't think I'll be out there tonight

I've had a bit of illness during the week which I don't think I'
completely over yet

I'll leave the killing up to Rick. He's able to do a better job of tha
anyway. ;

All the best for tonight

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Quoted message said:

Originally posted by jazmo I don't think I'll be out there tonight
I've had a bit of illness during the week which I don't think I'
completely over yet

Me too.. it's called 'triathlon'

Quoted message said:

I'll leave the killing up to Rick. He's able to do a better job of tha
anyway. 😉 All the best for tonight

Cheers! I'll let you know how much he beats me by :

hipp
- confidence with a capital

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flyingdutch said:

My 2nd go at racing Me and a dude on a yello C'dale alternated at thef
ront and it felt like we were going to drop the other 3.
Then we pass the line and the Bell is donged at us. Right, 3 laps to go,
my memory recalls from the start-brief. The pace ups a bit and i wheel-
suck like a 'hippy-on-heat'! Cdale man and another go to the front going
ito the hairpin and try to take off going up the hill, me sittng and
spinning. Im aiming to have a go down the back straight. the other 3
come up next to and infront of me. we approach the line again AND THE
BUGGER IS HOLDING UP THE FLAG!#@#!@#@#!!!!!
What happened to 3 laps? Cdale guy says he thought the same thing, so
obviously we both made the same mistake. Dooooh!

It's already been said, but the bell is the last lap. If you hear
whistle, that's a sprint lap (unless they've lost the bell)

If someone's on a Cannondale, there's a 99% chance they are (or were)
triathlete. Hence, don't take any racing tactics from them, like tryin
to keep the pace high towards the end of a race, or thinking that th
bell means three to go (ie. dragging people around to set them up fo
the sprint)

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Hitchy said:

g'day,
I seem to recall reading in some post that you're around 85kgs? cheers,

84kg (and counting) now!!

much cheaper than buying CFibre stuff!!!!!

-

"flyingdutch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

My 2nd go at racing

Didnt feel much pep in the legs on arrival. maybe they will 'come-to-
life' as the race progresses, me hopes

I counted 14 D'ers roll off up the hill

approx 10 laps later and we were all still together. All very
civilised and unless my thoughts were decieving me, easier than last
week's effort.

Going over the top of the hill we split into 2 with approx 6-7 going
slowly off ahead. Cgrade finally caught us. They were definetley going
slower than last week and all together too. They past, but this time
they werent going to get me on that Left hairpin. Despite nagging from
the commissaire, most of my group still 'Sat-up' onto the tail of the
C'ers for a lap.

We kept going around and around (inMurray Walker voice) and i had been
conscious of not constantly looking at my computer to watch the 30mins
tick away. As i had forgot to 'zero' it at the start it was irrelevant
anyway! I was guessing 5-10 mins to go... I heard (i think i heard) a
bell and wandered if that was ours. Passed the line and nothing was said
so I assumed I was imagining things. I was alternating between going to
the back or to the front (usually on the hill; my tactic of just
sticking on the 42T and spinning was taking the stress out of all the
changing).

Me and a dude on a yello C'dale alternated at thef ront and it felt like
we were going to drop the other 3.

Then we pass the line and the Bell is donged at us. Right, 3 laps to go,
my memory recalls from the start-brief. The pace ups a bit and i wheel-
suck like a 'hippy-on-heat'! Cdale man and another go to the front going
ito the hairpin and try to take off going up the hill, me sittng and
spinning. Im aiming to have a go down the back straight. the other 3
come up next to and infront of me. we approach the line again AND THE
BUGGER IS HOLDING UP THE FLAG!#@#!@#@#!!!!!

What happened to 3 laps? Cdale guy says he thought the same thing, so
obviously we both made the same mistake. Dooooh!

Put that one down to alearning experience, then (Hue eeddiiooott,
Stimpy!)

Pity as I was starting to feel better at the end than I had at the
start. What gave me a real buzz was how fresh i felt when I got home
and how fast the pedals turned this morning ( in the dark with no
redlights too:-) ).

So second goal achieved. Didnt get dropped

Next weeks adventure will be staying with that front half...

Which rider were you (ie What color jersey etc)? What was your ride? I
was standing near the registration point in the Richmond Cyclery colours
prior to the start of the C/D races. I stopped of at the Kew Loop on the
way home from work on the off chance that a couple of mates might have
turned up to race, but they didn't. I was also keeping an eye out for a
guy on a Peugeot matching the description of Hippy but he wasn't there
either 😉. I stayed until the race started and then headed north for home,
along the boulevard, doing big gear, seated, hill sprints along the way. I
have not raced at the Loop this year because it has not really fitted in
with my summer training program which is primarily aimed at the Track. For
me Weds are fairly light days, with the hill sprints thrown in for some
strength training along the way, prior to my Thursday afternoon track
torture (yes - torture is the correct term to describe it) sessions at the
Coburg velodrome. No pain - No gain so I keep telling myelf.

Geoff

Geoff said:

"Which rider were you (ie What color jersey etc)? What was your
ride? Geoff

Green (light) metallic steel853 frame, chrome stays, carbon forks
black wheel

Orange/Black/white Arthur Andersen top, Red Helme

think i spotted Ben, Alias 'EatToRide' after on a red Blucher..

-

"flyingdutch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Geoff said:

"Which rider were you (ie What color jersey etc)? What was your
ride? Geoff

Green (light) metallic steel853 frame, chrome stays, carbon forks,
black wheels

Orange/Black/white Arthur Andersen top, Red Helmet

think i spotted Ben, Alias 'EatToRide' after on a red Blucher...

I remember the seeing the guy on the red Blucher but don't remember seeing
you.

Shabby <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

flyingdutch said:

My 2nd go at racing Me and a dude on a yello C'dale alternated at thef
ront and it felt like we were going to drop the other 3.
Then we pass the line and the Bell is donged at us. Right, 3 laps to go,
my memory recalls from the start-brief. The pace ups a bit and i wheel-
suck like a 'hippy-on-heat'! Cdale man and another go to the front going
ito the hairpin and try to take off going up the hill, me sittng and
spinning. Im aiming to have a go down the back straight. the other 3
come up next to and infront of me. we approach the line again AND THE
BUGGER IS HOLDING UP THE FLAG!#@#!@#@#!!!!!
What happened to 3 laps? Cdale guy says he thought the same thing, so
obviously we both made the same mistake. Dooooh!

It's already been said, but the bell is the last lap. If you hear a
whistle, that's a sprint lap (unless they've lost the bell).

If someone's on a Cannondale, there's a 99% chance they are (or were) a
triathlete. Hence, don't take any racing tactics from them, like trying
to keep the pace high towards the end of a race, or thinking that the
bell means three to go (ie. dragging people around to set them up for
the sprint).

That's right - if Gilberto Simoni makes a late break, don't bother
because he probably miscounted the laps...

tee hee

Ritch

Quoted message said:

Originally posted by Geoff I was also keeping an eye out for a guy o
a Peugeot matching the description of Hippy but he wasn't ther
either 😉

He was busy suffering a woeful climb up the 1:20..

Methinks time off the bike could be needed

hipp

-

Quoted message said:

Originally posted by flyingdutch
I read somewhere (so it automatically becomes a fact!) that
if you take 1 week out of normal training it takes you 6
weeks to regain the same level of fitness. Now that's
gonna mess with your head Hipsta:eek: 😕 😄

You [censored]! :P It's too bad coz I'm going O.S. for 4 weeks, so trainin
stops regardless of what I want to happen. Screw the bike, I'm going o
holiday!! :

I've taken more than 6 wks off before and come back and won races, so
guess (as usual) it all 'depends'. If I'm just going to get slower an
slower with what I am doing now, then obviously 'something' needs t
change. I can't see myself doing more, other than starting riding t
work again (when I get better lights?) and that would have to be a well
managed, keep eye on HRM, low-intensity thing, not then usual chase-fes
I make it

Anyone with coaching experience out there? What can I do to go faster
Train more or train less? How can I tell if I am adequately recovered?
need to speak to Carl again about coaching.. I'm never going to develo
an effective program alone. Ahh, this is supposed to be fun :

hipp

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Geoff said:

"I remember the seeing the guy on the red Blucher but don't remember
seeing you.

Story of my life!:

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hippy said:

Quoted message said:

Originally posted by Geoff I was also keeping an eye out for a guy on
a Peugeot matching the description of Hippy but he wasn't there
either 😉.

He was busy suffering a woeful climb up the 1:20...
Methinks time off the bike could be needed?
hippy

I read somewhere (so it automatically becomes a fact!) that if you tak
1 week out of normal training it takes you 6 weeks to regain the sam
level of fitness. Now that's gonna mess with your head Hipsta:eek
😕 :

-

Quoted message said:

Anyone with coaching experience out there? What can I do to go faster?
Train more or train less? How can I tell if I am adequately recovered? I
need to speak to Carl again about coaching.. I'm never going to develop
an effective program alone. Ahh, this is supposed to be fun :P
hippy

G'day hippy,

lets talk when you come back from the 'Womans weekly world discovery
tour thingy'. Whilst training regimes are different for all cyclists,
one of the few constants is that 'Thou shall not train hard ALL the
time'. You need to throw in 'easy' days with 'hard' days, easy weeks,
with hard weeks. Charging up the 1/20 as fast as you can will do you
more harm than good , if that is the only 'type' of training you are
doing. think about what you want to achieve (realistically) from your
cycling. Once you have goals set, you can design a training program to
help you achieve them,

cheers,

Hitchy

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