King Headset Problem Continues

"David Peake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:02Wwg.2311$fL3.2210@trnddc07...

Quoted message said:

As I posted before, I am having problems with my King headset. While it
adjusts fine, the bearing cap does not seat down evenly on the upper cup.
While I was talking to a mechanic, he mentioned that King headset bearings
can "bend, and that sometimes they need to be bent back". I worked in a
shop for over seven years, and I've never heard such a thing. However,
this mechanic is very experienced and his advice to me in the past has
been correct.

About the bike: 1998 Litespeed Classic, with a Reynolds Ouzo Pro fork (1"
steerer). A few years ago, I had an accident in which the bike struck a
car (The fool turned in front of me). After inspecting both the frame and
fork thoroughly, it was determined that they were safe to ride again.

What I am wondering is this: (A.) Could this sort of impact "bend" King
headset bearings? (B.) Can they be "bent" back? If so, how do I do it?
(C.) Should I even care as the headset adjusts fine? (D.) Some have
indicated to me that this is "normal wear" on King headset and that this
means it's time to replace it. Does this sound reasonable?

In no particular order, I have done the following: replaced the base plate
(aka crown race), the bearing cap, removed and reinstalled the headset in
the opposite direction (meaning that the part that faced the front of the
bike now faces the rear). Some have suggested on this forum that the
headtube needs to be faced, but this headset was installed on a new frame
when the bike was purchased. I've never had any problems up until this
point.

As usual, thank you for all of your input.

What material is the steerer? Maybe this is a frame/steerer issue and not a
HS issue.

Jeffrey

me said:

"David Peake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:02Wwg.2311$fL3.2210@trnddc07...

Quoted message said:

As I posted before, I am having problems with my King headset. While it
adjusts fine, the bearing cap does not seat down evenly on
the upper cup. While I was talking to a mechanic, he mentioned that
King headset bearings can "bend, and that sometimes they need to be
bent back". I worked in a shop for over seven years, and I've never
heard such a thing. However, this mechanic is very experienced and
his advice to me in the past has been correct.

About the bike: 1998 Litespeed Classic, with a Reynolds Ouzo Pro
fork (1" steerer). A few years ago, I had an accident in which the
bike struck a car (The fool turned in front of me). After
inspecting both the frame and fork thoroughly, it was determined
that they were safe to ride again. What I am wondering is this: (A.)
Could this sort of impact "bend"
King headset bearings? (B.) Can they be "bent" back? If so, how do I
do it? (C.) Should I even care as the headset adjusts fine? (D.) Some
have indicated to me that this is "normal wear" on King headset
and that this means it's time to replace it. Does this sound
reasonable? In no particular order, I have done the following: replaced
the base
plate (aka crown race), the bearing cap, removed and reinstalled the
headset in the opposite direction (meaning that the part that faced
the front of the bike now faces the rear). Some have suggested on
this forum that the headtube needs to be faced, but this headset was
installed on a new frame when the bike was purchased. I've never had
any problems up until this point.

As usual, thank you for all of your input.

What material is the steerer? Maybe this is a frame/steerer issue
and not a HS issue.

When my friend (has tools) helped me install my King HS a while back, the
crown race ("base plate" above?) went on WAY too easily. (Brand-new fork
w/aluminum steerer.) Just recently I've tried to snug up the HS a bit, and
that loose plate down there seems to be the culprit. Not sure which
component (race or steerer) is slightly out of spec; doesn't seem to be a
safety concern so I guess I'll just live with it...

Bill "wasn't that fascinating?" S.

Bill Sornson said:

me said:

"David Peake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:02Wwg.2311$fL3.2210@trnddc07...

Quoted message said:

As I posted before, I am having problems with my King headset.
While it adjusts fine, the bearing cap does not seat down evenly on
the upper cup. While I was talking to a mechanic, he mentioned that
King headset bearings can "bend, and that sometimes they need to be
bent back". I worked in a shop for over seven years, and I've never
heard such a thing. However, this mechanic is very experienced and
his advice to me in the past has been correct.

About the bike: 1998 Litespeed Classic, with a Reynolds Ouzo Pro
fork (1" steerer). A few years ago, I had an accident in which the
bike struck a car (The fool turned in front of me). After
inspecting both the frame and fork thoroughly, it was determined
that they were safe to ride again. What I am wondering is this: (A.)
Could this sort of impact "bend"
King headset bearings? (B.) Can they be "bent" back? If so, how do I
do it? (C.) Should I even care as the headset adjusts fine? (D.)
Some have indicated to me that this is "normal wear" on King headset
and that this means it's time to replace it. Does this sound
reasonable? In no particular order, I have done the following:
replaced the base
plate (aka crown race), the bearing cap, removed and reinstalled the
headset in the opposite direction (meaning that the part that faced
the front of the bike now faces the rear). Some have suggested on
this forum that the headtube needs to be faced, but this headset was
installed on a new frame when the bike was purchased. I've never had
any problems up until this point.

As usual, thank you for all of your input.

What material is the steerer? Maybe this is a frame/steerer issue
and not a HS issue.

When my friend (has tools) helped me install my King HS a while back,
the crown race ("base plate" above?) went on WAY too easily. (Brand-new
fork w/aluminum steerer.) Just recently I've tried to
snug up the HS a bit, and that loose plate down there seems to be the
culprit. Not sure which component (race or steerer) is slightly out
of spec; doesn't seem to be a safety concern so I guess I'll just
live with it...
Bill "wasn't that fascinating?" S.

Have you checked ISO specs? Is the crown seat/crown race 30.0mm with an
interference fit? One is 30.2mm and one is 30.0mm.
--
Phil Lee, Squid

Phil Lee said:

Bill Sornson wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

When my friend (has tools) helped me install my King HS a while back,
the crown race ("base plate" above?) went on WAY too easily.
(Brand-new fork w/aluminum steerer.) Just recently I've tried to
snug up the HS a bit, and that loose plate down there seems to be the
culprit. Not sure which component (race or steerer) is slightly out
of spec; doesn't seem to be a safety concern so I guess I'll just
live with it...
Bill "wasn't that fascinating?" S.

Have you checked ISO specs? Is the crown seat/crown race 30.0mm
with an interference fit? One is 30.2mm and one is 30.0mm.

You mean the doohickey that slides over the whatchamacallit?

I'll get right on that.

BS (well...)

David Peake said:

As I posted before, I am having problems with my King headset. While it
adjusts fine, the bearing cap does not seat down evenly on the upper cup.
While I was talking to a mechanic, he mentioned that King headset bearings
can "bend, and that sometimes they need to be bent back". I worked in a
shop for over seven years, and I've never heard such a thing. However, this
mechanic is very experienced and his advice to me in the past has been
correct.

About the bike: 1998 Litespeed Classic, with a Reynolds Ouzo Pro fork (1"
steerer). A few years ago, I had an accident in which the bike struck a car
(The fool turned in front of me). After inspecting both the frame and fork
thoroughly, it was determined that they were safe to ride again.

What I am wondering is this: (A.) Could this sort of impact "bend" King
headset bearings? (B.) Can they be "bent" back? If so, how do I do it? (C.)
Should I even care as the headset adjusts fine? (D.) Some have indicated
to me that this is "normal wear" on King headset and that this means it's
time to replace it. Does this sound reasonable?

In no particular order, I have done the following: replaced the base plate
(aka crown race), the bearing cap, removed and reinstalled the headset in
the opposite direction (meaning that the part that faced the front of the
bike now faces the rear). Some have suggested on this forum that the
headtube needs to be faced, but this headset was installed on a new frame
when the bike was purchased. I've never had any problems up until this
point.

As usual, thank you for all of your input.

Did you ever get the headtube faced? In the last thread you seemed
unaware that it was necessary (it is). If you have not gotten it
faced, take care of that and see if the problem is then fixed.

- rick

In article <02Wwg.2311$fL3.2210@trnddc07>, David Peake

Quoted message said:

As I posted before, I am having problems with my King headset. While it
adjusts fine, the bearing cap does not seat down evenly on the upper cup.
While I was talking to a mechanic, he mentioned that King headset bearings
can "bend, and that sometimes they need to be bent back". I worked in a
shop for over seven years, and I've never heard such a thing. However, this
mechanic is very experienced and his advice to me in the past has been
correct.

About the bike: 1998 Litespeed Classic, with a Reynolds Ouzo Pro fork (1"
steerer). A few years ago, I had an accident in which the bike struck a car
(The fool turned in front of me). After inspecting both the frame and fork
thoroughly, it was determined that they were safe to ride again.

What I am wondering is this: (A.) Could this sort of impact "bend" King
headset bearings? (B.) Can they be "bent" back? If so, how do I do it? (C.)
Should I even care as the headset adjusts fine? (D.) Some have indicated
to me that this is "normal wear" on King headset and that this means it's
time to replace it. Does this sound reasonable?

In no particular order, I have done the following: replaced the base plate
(aka crown race), the bearing cap, removed and reinstalled the headset in
the opposite direction (meaning that the part that faced the front of the
bike now faces the rear). Some have suggested on this forum that the
headtube needs to be faced, but this headset was installed on a new frame
when the bike was purchased. I've never had any problems up until this
point.

As usual, thank you for all of your input.

Here are my recommendations:
a) Face the headtube and the stem. You mention an accident (I don't
recall that in your prior posts). Though the headtube/fork have been
deemed to be road worthy doesn't necessarily mean that they haven't'
been deformed.
b) Do NOT bend the HS's bearings - if it's at all possible. Does
this 'mechanic' actually propose to 'bend' the bearing's cartridge
housing? If the cartridges are damaged replace them for heaven's sake.
This applies to the cups as well -- IIRC they're anodized Al and are
not malleable anyway.

Was the CK HS installed at the time of purchase or was this an upgrade?
When exactly did the misaligned bearing cap problem first manifest
itself? Was it immediately after your accident?

Luke

Quoted message said:

"me" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What material is the steerer? Maybe this is a frame/steerer issue and not
a HS issue.

Jeffrey

The steerer is carbon fiber.

"Luke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <02Wwg.2311$fL3.2210@trnddc07>, David Peake
<[email hidden]> wrote:

Was the CK HS installed at the time of purchase or was this an upgrade?
When exactly did the misaligned bearing cap problem first manifest
itself? Was it immediately after your accident?

Luke

The headset was installed shortly after purchase. While an upgrade, I would
consider it to be original, as it was installed probably within 100 miles of
riding.

I've just noticed the uneven gap; I'm not sure how long it's been there.
The reason why I noticed it was I installed a new stem.

David Peake said:

As I posted before, I am having problems with my King headset. While it
adjusts fine, the bearing cap does not seat down evenly on the upper cup.
While I was talking to a mechanic, he mentioned that King headset bearings
can "bend, and that sometimes they need to be bent back". I worked in a
shop for over seven years, and I've never heard such a thing. However, this
mechanic is very experienced and his advice to me in the past has been
correct.

About the bike: 1998 Litespeed Classic, with a Reynolds Ouzo Pro fork (1"
steerer). A few years ago, I had an accident in which the bike struck a car
(The fool turned in front of me). After inspecting both the frame and fork
thoroughly, it was determined that they were safe to ride again.

What I am wondering is this: (A.) Could this sort of impact "bend" King
headset bearings? (B.) Can they be "bent" back? If so, how do I do it? (C.)
Should I even care as the headset adjusts fine? (D.) Some have indicated
to me that this is "normal wear" on King headset and that this means it's
time to replace it. Does this sound reasonable?

10 yr warranty on King HS'...not worn out, IMO...send it back and have
them look at it...they are very good at warranty issues.

Quoted message said:

In no particular order, I have done the following: replaced the base plate
(aka crown race), the bearing cap, removed and reinstalled the headset in
the opposite direction (meaning that the part that faced the front of the
bike now faces the rear). Some have suggested on this forum that the
headtube needs to be faced, but this headset was installed on a new frame
when the bike was purchased. I've never had any problems up until this
point.

As usual, thank you for all of your input.

In article <[email hidden]>, Qui

si parla Campagnolo said:

10 yr warranty on King HS'...not worn out, IMO...send it back and have
them look at it...they are very good at warranty issues.

Second that.

Bill Sornson said:

Phil Lee said:

Bill Sornson wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

When my friend (has tools) helped me install my King HS a while
back, the crown race ("base plate" above?) went on WAY too easily.
(Brand-new fork w/aluminum steerer.) Just recently I've tried to
snug up the HS a bit, and that loose plate down there seems to be
the culprit. Not sure which component (race or steerer) is
slightly out of spec; doesn't seem to be a safety concern so I
guess I'll just live with it...
Bill "wasn't that fascinating?" S.

Have you checked ISO specs? Is the crown seat/crown race 30.0mm
with an interference fit? One is 30.2mm and one is 30.0mm.

You mean the doohickey that slides over the whatchamacallit?

I'll get right on that.

BS (well...)

Check this cribsheet out:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/cribsheet-headsets.html

Whip out your calipers. Measure the inner diameter of the crown race. It
should be 26.4mm if it's 1 inch, 30.0mm if it's 1 1/8". The crown seat on
the fork should measure the same or just slightly over. If it's larger
instead of equal or smaller, then you'll need to figure out which one is out
of spec. Even though it might not be dangerous, it's "bad form." Heh heh.
--
Phil Lee, Squid

Phil Lee said:

Bill Sornson said:

Phil Lee said:

Bill Sornson wrote:

Quoted message said:

> When my friend (has tools) helped me install my King HS a while
> back, the crown race ("base plate" above?) went on WAY too easily.
> (Brand-new fork w/aluminum steerer.) Just recently I've tried to
> snug up the HS a bit, and that loose plate down there seems to be
> the culprit. Not sure which component (race or steerer) is
> slightly out of spec; doesn't seem to be a safety concern so I
> guess I'll just live with it...
> Bill "wasn't that fascinating?" S.

Have you checked ISO specs? Is the crown seat/crown race 30.0mm
with an interference fit? One is 30.2mm and one is 30.0mm.

You mean the doohickey that slides over the whatchamacallit?

I'll get right on that.

BS (well...)

Check this cribsheet out:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/cribsheet-headsets.html

Whip out your calipers. Measure the inner diameter of the crown
race. It should be 26.4mm if it's 1 inch, 30.0mm if it's 1 1/8". The
crown seat on the fork should measure the same or just slightly
over. If it's larger instead of equal or smaller, then you'll need
to figure out which one is out of spec. Even though it might not be
dangerous, it's "bad form." Heh heh.

I'll just enjoy my angst, TYVM.

<eg>

PS: Whip out my /what/?!? Closest thing to "calipers" I have is an old
plastic ruler (broken on one end) with inches on one side and centimeters on
the other. I'd try to wrap it around the steer tube, but... (SNAP!)

Bill Sornson said:

Phil Lee said:

Bill Sornson said:

Phil Lee, Squid wrote:
> Bill Sornson wrote:

>> When my friend (has tools) helped me install my King HS a while
>> back, the crown race ("base plate" above?) went on WAY too easily.
>> (Brand-new fork w/aluminum steerer.) Just recently I've tried to
>> snug up the HS a bit, and that loose plate down there seems to be
>> the culprit. Not sure which component (race or steerer) is
>> slightly out of spec; doesn't seem to be a safety concern so I
>> guess I'll just live with it...
>> Bill "wasn't that fascinating?" S.
>
> Have you checked ISO specs? Is the crown seat/crown race 30.0mm
> with an interference fit? One is 30.2mm and one is 30.0mm.

You mean the doohickey that slides over the whatchamacallit?

I'll get right on that.

BS (well...)

Check this cribsheet out:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/cribsheet-headsets.html

Whip out your calipers. Measure the inner diameter of the crown
race. It should be 26.4mm if it's 1 inch, 30.0mm if it's 1 1/8". The
crown seat on the fork should measure the same or just slightly
over. If it's larger instead of equal or smaller, then you'll need
to figure out which one is out of spec. Even though it might not be
dangerous, it's "bad form." Heh heh.

I'll just enjoy my angst, TYVM.

The bike gremlins may come out and get you...

Quoted message said:

<eg>

I wonder if other people wonder what you mean by this... not everyone has
OE-Quotefix.

Quoted message said:

PS: Whip out my /what/?!? Closest thing to "calipers" I have is an
old plastic ruler (broken on one end) with inches on one side and
centimeters on the other. I'd try to wrap it around the steer tube,
but... (SNAP!)

Take a piece of string. Very accurately measure the circumference of the
tubing with the string. Measure it and divide by apple pie. Then you have
your diameter! Feel free to use the old broken plastic ruler.

--
Phil Lee, Squid

Phil Lee said:

I wonder if other people wonder what you mean by this... not everyone
has OE-Quotefix.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

PS: Whip out my /what/?!? Closest thing to "calipers" I have is an
old plastic ruler (broken on one end) with inches on one side and
centimeters on the other. I'd try to wrap it around the steer tube,
but... (SNAP!)

Quoted message said:

Take a piece of string. Very accurately measure the circumference of
the tubing with the string. Measure it and divide by apple pie. Then you
have your diameter! Feel free to use the old broken plastic
ruler.

Sigh. I've got lemon meringue...