Locks,which type.

Sam Salt said:

I am considering replacing my present D Lock as I find it a bit on the heavy side ( 1.75Kg ).Having
looked around a bit I am undecided whether to go for another lighter D lock or try one of the
'chain & padlock' types.Having viewed a few sites I have found it annoying that manufacturers
rarely quote the weight of a lock which I would imagine is at least one of the parameters used when
making a selection. I know,the heavier the more secure,but there are limits. Anyway ,has anyone got
any comments or recommendations on the two types ?

Hi Sam

During my regular around town trundles I carry a long cable lock. I find this to be satisfactory for
general "leave locked to a lamp post for a moment" usage.

I'm quite aware that these locks are probably not the stongest available but they do, IMO, deter the
casual thief.

However, if I know I'm going to leave my bike in one place for several hours I use both the cable
lock an my D lock.

Without measuring, I'd have to guess that my cable lock is between five and six feet long.

Regards James

--
"Sorry mate, I didn't see you" is not a satisfactory excuse.

James Hodson said:

Sam Salt said:

I am considering replacing my present D Lock as I find it a bit on the heavy side ( 1.75Kg
).Having looked around a bit I am undecided whether to go for another lighter D lock or try one of
the 'chain & padlock' types.Having viewed a few sites I have found it annoying that manufacturers
rarely quote the weight of a lock which I would imagine is at least one of the parameters used
when making a selection. I know,the heavier the more secure,but there are limits. Anyway ,has
anyone got any comments or recommendations on the two types ?

Hi Sam

During my regular around town trundles I carry a long cable lock. I find this to be satisfactory
for general "leave locked to a lamp post for a moment" usage.

I'm quite aware that these locks are probably not the stongest available but they do, IMO, deter
the casual thief.

However, if I know I'm going to leave my bike in one place for several hours I use both the cable
lock an my D lock.

Without measuring, I'd have to guess that my cable lock is between five and six feet long.

I use a cable lock for casual use if I am going any distance. I leave a decent armoured cable lock
at work for commuting (I could use it as an anchor as well as a lock) which is OK for nipping into
town with at lunchtime if I need to. The main trick I find is to lock the bike somewhere well
populated, preferably next to a nicer looking bike (to the 'nick it to flog down the pub' crowd)
with a smaller lock than yours. Alternatively don't lock it but take it with you.

I have used D-Locks and find them limiting. I have also had to break a D-lock (it took less than 15
seconds which is quite scary). To date I have never had a bike stolen (silly thing to say) though
the one I bought and reconditioned for my then girlfriend (now wife) was stolen despite being
extremely untrendy.

If you go regularly to the same place and can leave a lock there, do. It makes life so much easier.

..d

James Hodson said:

Sam Salt said:

I am considering replacing my present D Lock as I find it a bit on the heavy side ( 1.75Kg
).Having looked around a bit I am undecided whether to go for another lighter D lock or try one
of the 'chain & padlock' types.Having viewed a few sites I have found it annoying that
manufacturers rarely quote the weight of a lock which I would imagine is at least one of the
parameters used when making a selection. I know,the heavier the more secure,but there are limits.
Anyway ,has anyone got any comments or recommendations on the two types ?

Hi Sam

During my regular around town trundles I carry a long cable lock. I find this to be satisfactory
for general "leave locked to a lamp post for a moment" usage.

I'm quite aware that these locks are probably not the stongest available but they do, IMO, deter
the casual thief.

However, if I know I'm going to leave my bike in one place for several hours I use both the cable
lock an my D lock.

Without measuring, I'd have to guess that my cable lock is between five and six feet long.

Regards James

James,sorry forgot to mention I have a cable lock as well.It is the weight of the D lock I am trying
to overcome but I don't think there is a way round it to be honest.I thought the chain and padlock
type might be easier for transporting as well. Sam salt

---
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Sam Salt said:

I am considering replacing my present D Lock as I find it a bit on the heavy side ( 1.75Kg
).Having looked around a bit I am undecided whether to go for another lighter D lock or try one of
the 'chain & padlock' types.Having viewed a few sites I have found it annoying that manufacturers
rarely quote the weight of a lock which I would imagine is at least one of the parameters used
when making a selection. I know,the heavier the more secure,but there are limits. Anyway ,has
anyone got any comments or recommendations on the two types ?

I think this very much depends where you are. In quiet and peaceful parts of the country a cable
lock will do fine (it's all I have), but in most cities and many large towns I imagine a big D lock
is more or less essential.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) jasmine.org.uk~simonOpen ↗

;; Friends don't send friends HTML formatted emails.

Sam Salt said:

I am considering replacing my present D Lock as I find it a bit on the heavy side ( 1.75Kg
).Having looked around a bit I am undecided whether to go for another lighter D lock or try one of
the 'chain & padlock' types.

Except for the very largest and heaviest ones (that might be even heavier than a D lock), chain or
cable types won't be anything like as secure as a good D lock.

Quoted message said:

Having viewed a few sites I have found it annoying that manufacturers rarely quote the weight of a
lock which I would imagine is at least one of the parameters used when making a selection.

Cycling Plus magazine quote weights in their reviews and tests. Well worth getting a copy (they
attempt to break them with the techniques theives use). I missed their last D-lock test issue
unfortunately.

Security wheel skewers is a good additional measure. These are sold by traders at good prices on
www.ebay.co.uk . Some just use ordinary Allen keys, some special keys. Some packages include a
security seatbolt as well.

Quoted message said:

Also,has anyone dealt with CycleXpress who seem to have some keen prices on many things and free
postage.

Yes, good service.

~PB

Quoted message said:

Having looked around a bit I am undecided whether to go for another lighter D lock or try one of
the 'chain & padlock' types

Snippity...

One thing to bear in mind is what your insurance company says as regards lock type. If, for example,
the insurance company specifies a D-lock, and you've used a different one, you end up rendering your
insurance null & void in the event of a claim.

Cheers, helen s

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fortune h*$el*$$e**nd***$o$ts***i*$*$m**m$$o*n**s@$*$a$$o**l.c**$*$om$$

Sam Salt said:

Also,has anyone dealt with CycleXpress who seem to have some keen prices on many things and
free postage.

Very reliable bunch. I order from them regularly and haven't been disappointed yet.
--

"Bob"

Email address is spam trapped.
To reply directly remove the beverage.

Make sure your accessories are secure also, I lost my seat. I put a large jubilee clip around the
seat post/allen bolt and use one of those Kryptonite combination replacement bolts for quick release
seat post/wheels. (allen bolts are not always a deterrent). Kryptonite D-Locks are supposed to be
the best...I put mine through the frame/front wheel around a fixed object. And yes, in a prominent
place. I think stations are notorious for attempted theft.

"Call me Bob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Sam Salt said:

Also,has anyone dealt with CycleXpress who seem to have some keen prices

on

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

many things and free postage.

Very reliable bunch. I order from them regularly and haven't been disappointed yet.
--

"Bob"

Email address is spam trapped. To reply directly remove the beverage.

On 27 Dec 2003 09:14:19 GMT, [email hidden]

(dirtylitterboxofferingstospammers) said:

One thing to bear in mind is what your insurance company says as regards lock type. If, for
example, the insurance company specifies a D-lock, and you've used a different one, you end up
rendering your insurance null & void in the event of a claim.

I've mentioned this before in this NG but ...

Several years ago I left a bike fastened to a pub bench with a D-lock. The bike was nicked. The
thieves used a hand-held device to drill out the copper or brass (I don't know the material) part
of the lock.

The insurance company refused to pay out; they considered a pub bench not to be "an immovable
object". They're correct; but how many people would wish to be seen walking down a street with a
bike attached to a bench?

Fortunately I got the nicked bike back several days later. Unfortunately, I'd already bought a
replacement.

James

--
"Sorry mate, I didn't see you" is not a satisfactory excuse.

Sam Salt said:

James,sorry forgot to mention I have a cable lock as well.It is the weight of the D lock I am
trying to overcome but I don't think there is a way round it to be honest.I thought the chain and
padlock type might be easier for transporting as well.

No need to apologise, Sam. My cable lock fits into the bracket on the bike and I carry the D-lock in
my rucksack as and when I feel I need it.

A chain and padlock type combination sounds rather heavy to me.

James

--
"Sorry mate, I didn't see you" is not a satisfactory excuse.

James Hodson said:

I've mentioned this before in this NG but ...

Several years ago I left a bike fastened to a pub bench with a D-lock. The bike was nicked. The
thieves used a hand-held device to drill out the copper or brass (I don't know the material) part
of the lock.

The insurance company refused to pay out; they considered a pub bench not to be "an
immovable object".

Are you going to tell us the name of this shyster company so that we can all avoid them in the
future? The [censored] stole your insurance premium just as effectively as the scumbag that whipped
your bike.

--

"Bob"

Email address is spam trapped.
To reply directly remove the beverage.

The type of lock you might consider appropriate is probably going to be based on a number of
considerations. If you live in a small town in the middel of nowhere and have an old rusty bike of
modest value, a modest lock is appropriate.

If you live in drug infested Vancouver, Canada, cheap bikes with a value of 50 to 100 dollars are
stolen or stripped of their wheels because the thief can obtain anywhere from 2 to 5 dollars for a
wheel at a pawn shop at 9:00 a.m. the following morning (they lineup outside at opening) and the
replacement cost of a front wheel is at least 15 to 35 dollars. It might be said that in Oliver
Twist's time street kids pickpocketed and today they "lift" (steal) a front wheel for instant cash.

In the mornings near bike racks and in the alleyways you can see the twisted U parts of the U/D

locks abandoned - the bike long gone. Pete Biggs said:

Sam Salt said:

I am considering replacing my present D Lock as I find it a bit on the heavy side ( 1.75Kg
).Having looked around a bit I am undecided whether to go for another lighter D lock or try one
of the 'chain & padlock' types.

Except for the very largest and heaviest ones (that might be even heavier than a D lock), chain or
cable types won't be anything like as secure as a good D lock.

Quoted message said:

Having viewed a few sites I have found it annoying that manufacturers rarely quote the weight of
a lock which I would imagine is at least one of the parameters used when making a selection.

Cycling Plus magazine quote weights in their reviews and tests. Well worth getting a copy (they
attempt to break them with the techniques theives use). I missed their last D-lock test issue
unfortunately.

Security wheel skewers is a good additional measure. These are sold by traders at good prices on
www.ebay.co.uk . Some just use ordinary Allen keys, some special keys. Some packages include a
security seatbolt as well.

Quoted message said:

Also,has anyone dealt with CycleXpress who seem to have some keen prices on many things and free
postage.

Yes, good service.

~PB

The type of lock you might consider appropriate is probably going to be based on a number of
considerations. If you live in a small town in the middel of nowhere and have an old rusty bike of
modest value, a modest lock is appropriate.

If you live in drug infested Vancouver, Canada, cheap bikes with a value of 50 to 100 dollars are
stolen or stripped of their wheels because the thief can obtain anywhere from 2 to 5 dollars for a
wheel at a pawn shop at 9:00 a.m. the following morning (they lineup outside at opening) and the
replacement cost of a front wheel is at least 15 to 35 dollars.

It might be said that in Oliver Twist's time street kids pickpocketed and today they "lift" (steal)
a front wheel for instant cash.

In the mornings near bike racks and in the alleyways you can see the twisted U parts of the U/D
locks abandoned - the bike long gone.

occupant said:

If you live in drug infested Vancouver, Canada, cheap bikes with a value of 50 to 100 dollars are
stolen or stripped of their wheels because the thief can obtain anywhere from 2 to 5 dollars for a
wheel at a pawn shop at 9:00 a.m. the following morning (they lineup outside at opening) and the
replacement cost of a front wheel is at least 15 to 35 dollars.

Since they are unlikely to want to redeem the wheels from the pawn shop presumably there is a good
choice of replacement wheels available at a small margin over $2-5 - unless you disagree in
principle to buying from there given their origins.

Tony

James Hodson said:

Several years ago I left a bike fastened to a pub bench with a D-lock. The bike was nicked. The
thieves used a hand-held device to drill out the copper or brass (I don't know the material) part
of the lock. The insurance company refused to pay out; they considered a pub bench not to be "an
immovable object".

They are weasels - which firm was it, so I can avoid them? The theft was accomplished by violating
the (presumably approved) lock not by removing the bench, surely - was the bench moved at all?

Guy
===
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chapmancentral.demon.co.ukchapmancentral.demon.co.ukOpen ↗

"Pete Biggs" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Sam Salt said:

I am considering replacing my present D Lock as I find it a bit on the heavy side ( 1.75Kg
).Having looked around a bit I am undecided whether to go for another lighter D lock or try one
of the 'chain & padlock' types.

Except for the very largest and heaviest ones (that might be even heavier than a D lock), chain or
cable types won't be anything like as secure as a good D lock.

Quoted message said:

Having viewed a few sites I have found it annoying that manufacturers rarely quote the weight of
a lock which I would imagine is at least one of the parameters used when making a selection.

Cycling Plus magazine quote weights in their reviews and tests. Well worth getting a copy (they
attempt to break them with the techniques theives use). I missed their last D-lock test issue
unfortunately.

I have a copy of the tests from the May issue of this year. I don't know if that's the most recent.
The best D-lock they reckon was the Trelock BS610 at UKP 49.99 and 1kg. They tested 14 locks of
various types with 5 making it through both stages of their test (each stage being 5 mins. of
different types of attack). Next best D-lock was the Abus Granit - XPlus at UKP 59.99 and 1.6 kg.
The only chain lock to survive was the impressive looking Kryptonite New York Fahgettaboudit at UKP
99.95 and 3.8 kgs. Their best cable lock was the Abus Granit 1000 Steel-o-Flex at UKP 49.99 and 1.9
kgs. The last survivor was the VK Double Lock at UKP 39.99 and 1.5 kgs. This looks a bit like hand
cuffs and might not fit all frames, say Cycling +. I know these tests are often a bit hit and miss -
maybe the perfect lock just never got tested. But at least you can compare between the ones that are
tested. What surprised me in this test was the rating of another Trelock model (LL400 at UKP 49.99
and 1.1 kgs.). If I saw it in a shop next to the one that won the test I might think they were of
similar standard (same maker, price and weight) but it only lasted 12 seconds into the 10 minute
test attack. Anyway, hope this helps Sam,

tony R.

Call me Bob said:

Quoted message said:

The insurance company refused to pay out; they considered a pub bench not to be "an immovable
object".

Are you going to tell us the name of this shyster company so that we can all avoid them in the
future? The [censored] stole your insurance premium just as effectively as the scumbag that whipped
your bike.

Sorry, Bob, I can't recall the company. As I mentioned, I got the bike back a few days later (a day
or two after I'd bought a replacement bike) and sold the nicked machine for a few hundred pounds
soon afterwards. So, I was a little [censored] - but not too much financial harm done.

However, another insurance claim really did annoy me. I managed to delaminate one ski in a bit of a
wipe-out in the early 90s. (For wipe-out read huge crash.) Naturally, when I returned home, I
claimed on my holiday insurance for onea pair of skis. IIRC, they cost between £300 and £400.

"No!" said the insurance people. "You only broke one ski so the maximum you can claim for is £150
(or whatever half the value was) - less, of course, the £100 excess." £50 for a £300+ pair of skis.

Have any skiers who read this NG ever been into, say, Snow & Rock and asked to buy one ski?
Thought not.

James

--
"Sorry mate, I didn't see you" is not a satisfactory excuse.

tony R wrote: [C+ tests]

Quoted message said:

I know these tests are often a bit hit and miss - maybe the perfect lock just never got tested.
But at least you can compare between the ones that are tested.

Indeed. Here are some older C+ test results to bulk it out (some of these or similar versions may
still be on sale):

December 2001 - best D-locks (unbroken in the tests):

AXA Secu City Plus £30 1524g Squire Paramount Plus £55 2020g Abus Granite X-Plus £60 1469g Halfords
HTS 320mm £35 1604g Kryptonite New York 3000 £70 1656g

- - - - - - - - - - April 2000 - best locks D-locks (unbroken in the tests):

Squire Protector Kryptonite New York Kryptonite New York Noose (chain not D-lock) £70
Squire Paramount

Best Buy although broken in 5 mins: Squire Patriot

turkeys (from both tests): Magnum Extreme - attack time: 4 secs Squire Patriot Plus - 8 secs [see
"]http://tinyurl.com/2lhk4] Kryptonite EV2000 - 40 secs Magnum Ultimate LS - 50 secs Basta Safe XL - 1
min 10 secs Luma Tigre - 1 min 5 secs Halfords 245mm Shackle Lock - 15 secs [~£13 model with red end
cap. I've also seen an identical-looking lock under the Luma brand name. -PB]

~PB

Sam Salt said:

James,sorry forgot to mention I have a cable lock as well.It is the weight of the D lock I am
trying to overcome but I don't think there is a way round it to be honest.I thought the chain and
padlock type might be easier for transporting as well. Sam salt

Have you tried looking for a lighter D-lock? If I remember correctly, the Abus "Granit" locks are
remarkably light (at least compared to their "Sinus Plus" range). You can also get very narrow D-
locks designed to go round the back wheel (rim/tyre, not spokes!) inside the rear triangle.
(According to Sheldon Brown, it's near-impossible to cut through a wheel rim so this is as good as
locking the frame.)

--
Daniel Auger - [email hidden] (Please remove Granta to get a valid address.)

Daniel Auger said:

Have you tried looking for a lighter D-lock? If I remember correctly, the Abus "Granit" locks are
remarkably light (at least compared to their "Sinus Plus" range). You can also get very narrow D-
locks designed to go round the back wheel (rim/tyre, not spokes!) inside the rear triangle.
(According to Sheldon Brown, it's near-impossible to cut through a wheel rim so this is as good as
locking the frame.)

I have a mini kryptonite

wiggle.co.ukv2 product detail.aspOpen ↗

It is a lot smaller and lighter than a full size d-lock, but still has room for 2 rims, 2 seat stays
and a sheffield stand.

--
Andy Morris

AndyAtJinkasDotFreeserve.Co.UK

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