Looking for "Chain-slap" solution...

Dan Volker said:

I have people I am beginning to enjoy riding with again, that are very fast expert class racers,
and they are riding on bikes like the Intense X-country bike, and on Santa Cruz Blurs. You could
put a top pro on a single speed, and he would get smoked by these guys on the trails we ride--
there is just too much variability in the terrain and obstacles--some sections have to be ridden
in a very small gear in order to navigate extremely technical turns with big roots, this followed
immediately by 20 mph plus sections you can haul ass on. Single speeders would have no hope,
except to keep up with the HFS contingent ( Huge Fat Slobs) :-)

That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I may never be. But I've ridden with plenty who went
just as fast on their single as they do on their multi on a variety of terrain.

Greg

--
"Destroy your safe and happy lives before it is too late, the battles we fought were long and hard,
just not to be consumed by rock n' roll..." - The Mekons

G.T. said:

Dan Volker wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Single speeders would have no hope, except to keep up with the HFS contingent ( Huge Fat
Slobs) :-)

That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I may never be. But I've ridden with plenty who
went just as fast on their single as they do on their multi on a variety of terrain.

...or faster than guys who do a fair amount of racing (or are generally at the front of the pack
when they ride back home.

I thought the funniest part was when he was talking about 25 mph like its some sort of unobtainable
speed on a singlespeed. I remember one particular section during that Idaho epic when I was zipping
along at 24-25, and I lost sight of JD on his SS pretty early on. I don't know how fast he was
going, but damn he was flyin!

Its OK to make assumptions about things you don't know (I guess), but putting them on a newsgroup
can make one look a bit...inexperienced.

--
-BB- To reply to me, drop the attitude (from my e-mail address, at least)

"G.T." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dan Volker wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I may never be. But I've ridden with plenty who
went just as fast on their single as they do on their multi on a variety of terrain.

Greg

I don't know Greg, maybe the gene pool you ride in is defective, or you really don't know what a
"variety of terrain means". Gears make a bike go faster in varried terrain. If a single speed bike
was really competitive with multi-geared bikes in varied terrain , then the Tour de France would be
ridden by a few guys on SS's....clue to Greg, it will never happen.

If you can't figure out how this relates to mountain biking, I feel a little sorry for you. And
here's another hint....in the Tour, ability levels between riders are much closer---VO2 max
levels and the maximum performance riders are capable of does not varry any where near as much as
it does in the kind of recreational, non-race based mountain biking, that some single speeders
apparently do.

I do have some experience on "single speed bikes". I did Veldrome racing for about 4 years--fixed
gear, no braking. I could ride an 88 inch gear faster than many road riders on "some" road courses,
but it would suck if there was a long steep hill, for both the uphill and downhill. Riding my track
bike on the road was fun once in a while, but it was only "optimal" at the Velodrome. I see how some
ss bikers could do well on some rocky trails that keep speeds between maybe 8 and 15 mph. If the
trail had sections that would allow much faster riding, the ss would be grossly inefficient, and the
only people you "ought" to be able to keep up to then would be other single speeders or fat guys on
geared bikes ;-)

I don't care how skilled the SS guys are you have ridden with, there is only so much range in
cadence that is going to be efficient--and again, this will come down to the ss boys being careful
to stick to trails with narrow speed potentials, so they can stay inside their efficient cadence
range. They might ride OK at a cadence of 40 or 50 for quite a while, but it would burn up muscle
glycogen quickly, and produce too much lactate if they were working hard to maintain a fast
pace....if they get over 120 cadence, which is really unlikely for a rigid SS biker, it would still
end up being to fast a cadence to be efficient. So unless you guys are trying to tell me that out
West, there is only a narrow speed range its cool to ride at, I guess I'm still too clueless to
understand what you see in these one speed wonderbikes... Regards, Dan V

On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:18:13 -0500, "Dan Volker"
<[email hidden]> wrote:

[snip roadie tech]

Quoted message said:

I'm still too clueless to understand what you see in these one speed wonderbikes...

Well put, you are clueless. Sounds like you've always have been and always will
be.....clueless that is.

Quoted message said:

Regards, Dan V

Affably, Bill The mind serves properly as a window glass rather than as a reflector, that is, the
mind should give an immediate view instead of an interpretation of the world.
:-]

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"G.T." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dan Volker wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I

may

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

never be. But I've ridden with plenty who went just as fast on their single as they do on their
multi on a variety of terrain.

Greg

I don't know Greg, maybe the gene pool you ride in is defective, or you really don't know what a
"variety of terrain means". Gears make a bike go faster in varried terrain.

Hey cluebie, it's not about the bike, it's about the rider.

Speaking of "variety of terrain," check out the course for the 24 hours of Adrenalin in Monterey,
CA. Much more variety than anything in your beloved pancake flat Florida.

The fastest lap times were turned by someone on a SS. That's just one example, among many.

"I can go much faster on constantly varrying terrain, with the ability to shift into bigger or
smaller gears as needed to hit the optimum speed."

Perhaps you're unable to vary your cadence, but accomplished riders certainly can. Even on an SS.

p.s. I'm another person that doesn't ride an SS but who has ridden with very fast folks on SSes.

Dan Volker said:

"G.T." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dan Volker wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I may never be. But I've ridden with plenty who
went just as fast on their single as they do on their multi on a variety of terrain.

Greg

I don't know Greg, maybe the gene pool you ride in is defective, or you really don't know what a
"variety of terrain means". Gears make a bike go faster in varried terrain. If a single speed bike
was really competitive with multi-geared bikes in varied terrain , then the Tour de France would
be ridden by a few guys on SS's....clue to Greg, it will never happen.

Seriously.

Greg

p e t e f a g e r l i n said:

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"G.T." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I may never be. But I've ridden with plenty who
went just as fast on their single as they do on their multi on a variety of terrain.

Greg

I don't know Greg, maybe the gene pool you ride in is defective, or you really don't know what a
"variety of terrain means". Gears make a bike go faster in varried terrain.

Hey cluebie, it's not about the bike, it's about the rider.

Speaking of "variety of terrain," check out the course for the 24 hours of Adrenalin in Monterey,
CA. Much more variety than anything in your beloved pancake flat Florida.

The fastest lap times were turned by someone on a SS. That's just one example, among many. {snip}

There's one good thing about Dan's flailing around on this SS stuff: it's that much less time he can
devote to trying to run his girlfriend's life for her.

Bill "smoked by SS-ers on too regular a basis" S.

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"JD" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:

Quoted message said:

What does NORBA have to do anything? Amateur racing is meaningless. In fact, as far as the type
of bicycle is concerned, professional racing is meaningless as well. Will you ever get it that
it's not the bike, it's the rider?

It has to do with hitting the highest speed possible at every moment--to some people, this is fun--
to me this is fun.

Another not very deft dodge. What does that have to do with NORBA?

Quoted message said:

I can go much faster on constantly varrying terrain, with the ability to shift into bigger or
smaller gears as needed to hit the optimum speed.

Who is to say one can't go fast in varying terrain on a singlespeed? Your statements are very funny,
obviously fueled by inexperience in mountain biking.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you like dueling it out with your friends on a trail, why shoot

yourself

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in the foot by getting a single speed bike ??

I agree, if you have limited bicycle handling skills. Again, it's not about the bike, it's about
the rider.

I think you are dramatically overstating skills

What you think and what is reality are two very different things. Suspension will NEVER make up for
solid bike handling skills.

Quoted message said:

---Florida riders do extremely well in races all over the country, including all over the west--so
I don't think your skills idea holds water.

Amateur racing doesn't mean a thing. The best riders in this area don't race, with the exception of
a couple of successful pros. What you think about the importance of skills is purely demented.

Quoted message said:

The speed would be the issue on the trails I care about--and that would be influenced heavily by
being able to shift. In many of these trails, maximum speed on some trail sections could be 6 mph,
on other sections max speed could be 16 mph, and on big flat sections with high speed turns, it
could be 25 mph. On the downhills the single speeder can coast, but that would not keep him in the
game with people well set up and skilled for high speed downhills.

The next time I'm twisting 30mph+ wheel to wheel with the Angry Man and other locals down the Prime
Cut on my singlespeed, I'll laugh just for you.

JD

"p e t e f a g e r l i n" <[email hidden]> had
this to say "]news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<Snip jealous reply>

uh oh! now you've done it. You've made JD's girlfriend mad and now he has to reply...

BB said:

G.T. said:

Dan Volker wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Single speeders would have no hope, except to keep up with the HFS contingent ( Huge Fat
Slobs) :-)

That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I may never be. But I've ridden with plenty who
went just as fast on their single as they do on their multi on a variety of terrain.

...or faster than guys who do a fair amount of racing (or are generally at the front of the pack
when they ride back home.

I thought the funniest part was when he was talking about 25 mph like its some sort of
unobtainable speed on a singlespeed. I remember one particular section during that Idaho epic when
I was zipping along at 24-25, and I lost sight of JD on his SS pretty early on. I don't know how
fast he was going, but damn he was flyin!

Its OK to make assumptions about things you don't know (I guess), but putting them on a newsgroup
can make one look a bit...inexperienced.

BB, you fall under the definition of "slow, fat guy", (see "Looking for certain type ..." thread)
Welcome to the club.
--
Craig (6'2", 180 lbs, 9% body fat, just to get an idea of my slow, fatness) Brossman, Durango
Colorado (remove ".nospam" to reply)

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"G.T." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dan Volker wrote:

The troll reveals his colors: Behold the GRC laced throughout the diatribe:

Quoted message said:

Tour de France would be ridden by a few guys on SS's

in the Tour, ability levels between riders are much closer

Quoted message said:

---VO2 max levels and the maximum performance

Quoted message said:

I did Veldrome racing

Quoted message said:

I could ride an 88 inch gear faster than many road riders on "some" road courses,

Quoted message said:

it was only "optimal" at the Velodrome.

Quoted message said:

there is only so much range in cadence that is going to be efficient

Quoted message said:

They might ride OK at a cadence of 40 or 50 for quite a while, but it would burn up muscle
glycogen quickly, and produce too much lactate if they were

working hard to maintain a fast pace....if they get over 120 cadence,

However, to give you credit, at least you'll admit that---->

Quoted message said:

I'm still too clueless to understand what you see in these one speed wonderbikes...

***you're finally making sense, Dan.***

Paladin

"Craig Brossman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

BB said:

G.T. said:

Dan Volker wrote:

Quoted message said:

> Single speeders would have no hope, except to keep up with the HFS contingent ( Huge Fat
> Slobs) :-)

That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I

may

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

never be. But I've ridden with plenty who went just as fast on their single as they do on their
multi on a variety of terrain.

...or faster than guys who do a fair amount of racing (or are generally

at

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the front of the pack when they ride back home.

I thought the funniest part was when he was talking about 25 mph like

its

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

some sort of unobtainable speed on a singlespeed. I remember one particular section during that
Idaho epic when I was zipping along at 24-25, and I lost sight of JD on his SS pretty early on.
I don't know

how

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

fast he was going, but damn he was flyin!

Its OK to make assumptions about things you don't know (I guess), but putting them on a
newsgroup can make one look a bit...inexperienced.

BB, you fall under the definition of "slow, fat guy", (see "Looking for certain type ..." thread)
Welcome to the club.
--
Craig (6'2", 180 lbs, 9% body fat, just to get an idea of my slow, fatness) Brossman, Durango
Colorado (remove ".nospam" to reply)

This whole thread is completely blowing my mind---the whole certainty that so many posters on this
NG have, that SS's are so competitive.

I can only form real opinions of what I've experienced, and I have never seen ANYTHING like what
you guys are saying. I'm riding the S. Florida trails 3 to 4 days per week ( Quiet Waters and
Jonathan Dickinson) , and each has at least 15 to 40 other riders on the trails at any given time
I'm out there. All the top racers from this area, and, "all the top riders who don't give a [censored]
about racing", ride these two trails, along with Markam and Oleta. I have seen ZERO single speeders
able to ride "with" any of the faster people on any of these trails. Its almost a joke.

I get to Ocala every couple of weeks, where there is some vertical--maybe 75 feet ( still almost
pancake flat), but there are still rolling hills, and we have old phosphate mines the trails go
through on trails like Croom, where a huge pit has been overgrown by plants and trees in the last 3
decades, and are now great vertical sections for the trails---though still not good vertical by
standards almost anywhere else in the country. And in the Ocala and north Florida areas, I have not
seen any SS bikers that can keep up with fast riders.

I would love to see first hand, a guy on a SS bike, able to do what you guys are so certain they can
do, on the South Florida trails. If that happened, and the SS guy really was able to ride with the
fast guys here, I would immediately change my opinions---but it would be based on known facts, not
just boasts on a NewsGroup.

Since most of you guys would look forward to riding our trails about as much as you would hitting
your thumb with a hammer, I don't think I'll hold my breath for this, but its still something I
would love to see.

I will be getting out west this summer for a week or so, to Utah, so maybe someone can point me to a
place in that area where a fast trail exists, and in which SS bikes are competitive with geared
bikes. I don't care about "slow, ultra technical trails". We have those here also, and while I can
ride them, I just don't find that to be fun. As long as there are plenty of fast sections on a
trail, I'm fine with a few technical sections thrown in to keep everyone honest:-)

Looking for "real" clues, Dan V

Dan Volker said:

This whole thread is completely blowing my mind---the whole certainty that so many posters on this
NG have, that SS's are so competitive. {snip}

At the risk of stating the obvious, Dan, you've been trolled and swallowed the hook whole.

Someone can post a question about a rear derailleur adjustment, and a few zealots will reply "get a
singlespeed" just to screw with the easily scrambled brains out there.

The fact is SS's aren't for everyone (or more literally, every body). If you're strong enough,
skilled enough, AND your knees can take it (mine can't), then it's a great way to enjoy the
simplicity of riding a bike (while totally spanking your geared 'n suspended compadres).

I'm totally humbled by what these guys can ride, grinding up trails on which I *NEED* fully granny
in a 34/17 or some other ridiculous gear ratio. (And yes, they DO go much faster BY NECESSITY.)

Might I suggest you take all this a little less "seriously" and have a bit more "fun"?!? Just a
thought...

Bill "happiest when I'm just out riding" S.

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> dug the hole deeper:

Quoted message said:

If a single speed bike was really competitive with multi-geared bikes in varied terrain , then the
Tour de France would be ridden by a few guys on SS's....clue to Greg, it will never happen.

What does the TDF have to do with mountain biking? Not a damn thing.

Quoted message said:

If you can't figure out how this relates to mountain biking, I feel a little sorry for you. And
here's another hint....in the Tour, ability levels between riders are much closer---VO2 max
levels and the maximum performance riders are capable of does not varry any where near as much as
it does in the kind of recreational, non-race based mountain biking, that some single speeders
apparently do.

I get the feeling that you are a roadie who occasionally rides a mountain bike. All of the roadie
and race references and still not a clue.

Quoted message said:

I do have some experience on "single speed bikes". I did Veldrome racing for about 4 years--fixed
gear, no braking. I could ride an 88 inch gear faster than many road riders on "some" road
courses, but it would suck if there was a long steep hill, for both the uphill and downhill.
Riding my track bike on the road was fun once in a while, but it was only "optimal" at the
Velodrome.

What does road riding, or velodrome racing have to do with mountain biking? Not a damn thing. Maybe
you should return to that, being that it's so full of neato buzzwords.

Quoted message said:

I see how some ss bikers could do well on some rocky trails that keep speeds between maybe 8 and
15 mph. If the trail had sections that would allow much faster riding, the ss would be grossly
inefficient, and the only people you "ought" to be able to keep up to then would be other single
speeders or fat guys on geared bikes

You're hysterical! Try getting out more.

Quoted message said:

I don't care how skilled the SS guys are you have ridden with, there is only so much range in
cadence that is going to be efficient--and again, this will come down to the ss boys being careful
to stick to trails with narrow speed potentials, so they can stay inside their efficient cadence
range. They might ride OK at a cadence of 40 or 50 for quite a while, but it would burn up muscle
glycogen quickly, and produce too much lactate if they were working hard to maintain a fast
pace....if they get over 120 cadence, which is really unlikely for a rigid SS biker, it would
still end up being to fast a cadence to be efficient. So unless you guys are trying to tell me
that out West, there is only a narrow speed range its cool to ride at, I guess I'm still too
clueless to understand what you see in these one speed wonderbikes...

More neato buzzwords from the wonderful world of roadies on mountain bikes. Mountan biking is not
about "efficient", "cadence", "speed potentials", "muscle glycogen", "lactate", and all of your
other psychoroadiebabble. It's about riding bicycles in the mountains.

JD

"JD" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> dug the hole deeper:

Quoted message said:

If a single speed bike was really competitive with multi-geared bikes in varied terrain ,
then the

Tour

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

de France would be ridden by a few guys on SS's....clue to Greg, it will never happen.

What does the TDF have to do with mountain biking? Not a damn thing.

If your really smooth in your mountain biking techniques, then you will flow over obstacles as
though they are barely there----so when the technique is really good, what's left is up, down,
and the flats....this relates to the TDF--power and speed going uphill, power and speed on the
flats, and speed going downhill. Its about getting the most from your body possible, as well as
from your bike.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you can't figure out how this relates to mountain biking, I feel a

little

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

sorry for you. And here's another hint....in the Tour, ability levels between riders are much
closer---VO2 max levels and the maximum

performance

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

riders are capable of does not varry any where near as much as it does

in

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the kind of recreational, non-race based mountain biking, that some

single

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

speeders apparently do.

I get the feeling that you are a roadie who occasionally rides a mountain bike. All of the roadie
and race references and still not a clue.

I was a roadie first, but now all I care about is mountain biking---I have not even ridden my road
bike in over 3 months. I don't think its such a bad thing to take what you learn in each sport, and
apply it to others where it will help. The only really important thing about mountain biking is how
to have the most amount of fun, but for some of us, dueling it out ( going fast) with our friends is
one enjoyable part of this :-)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I do have some experience on "single speed bikes". I did Veldrome racing

for

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

about 4 years--fixed gear, no braking. I could ride an 88 inch gear

faster

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

than many road riders on "some" road courses, but it would suck if there

was

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

a long steep hill, for both the uphill and downhill. Riding my track

bike on

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the road was fun once in a while, but it was only "optimal" at the Velodrome.

What does road riding, or velodrome racing have to do with mountain biking? Not a damn thing.
Maybe you should return to that, being that it's so full of neato buzzwords.

I guess you never watched matched sprints in the Olympics....you go from a cadence as slow as 1 to 5
revolutions per minute ( a track stand) to a cadence of maybe 30 or 40 for another minute, and then
suddenly you explode from a 40 cadence to one more like 140 or 160, and hold this just about as long
as you can. Durring this explosive sprint, you are often swerving sharply to left or right, in an
attempt to pass. There are some similarities to getting up a steep hill on a mountain bike, while
negotiating obstacles---and with the track bike you are using just the one gear, like the ss bikes
you guys like.

In what we call scratch races, you have maybe 40 or more riders on single geared track bikes,
modulating there power and endurance for an hour long race---sometimes cadence is in the 90's,
sometimes it is more like 130 or well above. This would seem to me to resemble a number of the
issues a SS mtn bike rider must deal with, if his skill level is sharp enough to have him really
flowing over the trail.

Quoted message said:

More neato buzzwords from the wonderful world of roadies on mountain bikes. Mountan biking is not
about "efficient", "cadence", "speed potentials", "muscle glycogen", "lactate", and all of your
other psychoroadiebabble. It's about riding bicycles in the mountains.

JD

Skill without concern for fitness is more like Trials riding. And you have every right to like
this. I care more about speed over Tsali type trails--and I have a right to like this. You guys are
the ones who started preaching about SS bikes being "better", on what I "thought" was a mountain
bike NG ;-)

I'm still looking forward to seeing a ss rider who can ride with any of my faster friends, here on
S. Florida trails. Regards, Dan V

Dan Volker retorted :

Quoted message said:

The only really important thing about mountain biking is how to have the most amount of fun, but
for some of us, dueling it out ( going fast) with our friends is one enjoyable part of this :-)

so are you Cookie or Sporkie?

I'll cast my vote for Cookie.

If that made a whooshing sound, you must have missed this the first second and third times I posted
it. teamsmack.orgride1.htmOpen ↗

"Penny S" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dan Volker retorted :

Quoted message said:

The only really important thing about mountain biking is how to have the most amount of fun, but
for some of us, dueling it out ( going fast) with our friends is one enjoyable part of this :-)

so are you Cookie or Sporkie?

I'll cast my vote for Cookie.

If that made a whooshing sound, you must have missed this the first

second

Quoted message said:

and third times I posted it. teamsmack.orgride1.htmOpen ↗

Funny stuff :-) Sorry, but I don't resemble either. Regards, Dan v

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"G.T." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dan Volker wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I may never be. But I've ridden with plenty who
went just as fast on their single as they do on their multi on a variety of terrain.

Greg

I don't know Greg, maybe the gene pool you ride in is defective, or you really don't know what a
"variety of terrain means". Gears make a bike go faster in varried terrain. If a single speed bike
was really competitive with multi-geared bikes in varied terrain , then the Tour de France would
be ridden by a few guys on SS's....clue to Greg, it will never happen.

LOL. First you extol the virtues of a Liquid, and now this. At first, I thought you knew something,
but now, I get it now...

Quoted message said:

I see how some ss bikers could do well on some rocky trails that keep speeds between maybe 8 and
15 mph. If the trail had sections that would allow much faster riding, the ss would be grossly
inefficient, and the only people you "ought" to be able to keep up to then would be other single
speeders or fat guys on geared bikes ;-)

Jeez, what a maroon. You need to ride with a couple of fat guys I know. Adam and Chris. Yeah, they
really schooled the SS crowd. LOL.

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I don't care how skilled the SS guys are you have ridden with, there is only so much range in
cadence that is going to be efficient--and again, this will come down to the ss boys being
careful to stick to trails with narrow speed potentials, so they can stay inside their efficient
cadence range.

Dude, you need a mint suppository to cure that bad breath. Do you always talk out of your ass like
this? I have seen these guys ride, and they can plain flat smoke your geared ass.

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I guess I'm still too clueless to understand what you see in these one speed wonderbikes...

Even a broken clock is right twice a day, Danny.

SS ain't my bag, but you have no idea what you're talking about.
--
Jonesy

"Dan Volker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

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"Craig Brossman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

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BB said:

On Fri, 20 Feb 2004 03:04:56 GMT, G.T. wrote:

>Dan Volker wrote:

>> Single speeders would have no hope, except to keep up with the HFS contingent ( Huge Fat
>> Slobs) :-)
>
>That's just about the most clueless thing I've read on a.m-b other than what comes out of
>scottdumbski. And I'm not a single-speeder. And I

may

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>never be. But I've ridden with plenty who went just as fast on their single as they do on
>their multi on a variety of terrain.

...or faster than guys who do a fair amount of racing (or are generally

at

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the front of the pack when they ride back home.

I thought the funniest part was when he was talking about 25 mph like

its

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some sort of unobtainable speed on a singlespeed. I remember one particular section during
that Idaho epic when I was zipping along at 24-25, and I lost sight of JD on his SS pretty
early on. I don't know

how

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fast he was going, but damn he was flyin!

Its OK to make assumptions about things you don't know (I guess), but putting them on a
newsgroup can make one look a bit...inexperienced.

BB, you fall under the definition of "slow, fat guy", (see "Looking for certain type ..."
thread) Welcome to the club.
--
Craig (6'2", 180 lbs, 9% body fat, just to get an idea of my slow, fatness) Brossman, Durango
Colorado (remove ".nospam" to reply)

This whole thread is completely blowing my mind---the whole certainty that so many posters on this
NG have, that SS's are so competitive.

Again, racing doesn't mean jack. Why are you so hung up on "competing"? Do you have some other
issues we don't want to know about?

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I can only form real opinions of what I've experienced, and I have never seen ANYTHING like what
you guys are saying.

Again, you need to get out more.

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I'm riding the S. Florida trails 3 to 4 days per week ( Quiet Waters and Jonathan Dickinson) , and
each has at least 15 to 40 other riders on the trails at any given time I'm out there. All the top
racers from this area, and, "all the top riders who don't give a [censored] about racing", ride these
two trails, along with Markam and Oleta. I have seen ZERO single speeders able to ride "with" any
of the faster people on any of these trails. Its almost a joke.

Don't kid yourself, Dan. Florida IS a joke.

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I get to Ocala every couple of weeks, where there is some vertical--maybe 75 feet ( still almost
pancake flat), but there are still rolling hills, and we have old phosphate mines the trails go
through on trails like Croom, where a huge pit has been overgrown by plants and trees in the last
3 decades, and are now great vertical sections for the trails---though still not good vertical by
standards almost anywhere else in the country. And in the Ocala and north Florida areas, I have
not seen any SS bikers that can keep up with fast riders.

Again with the Florida. You're hilarious.

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I would love to see first hand, a guy on a SS bike, able to do what you guys are so certain they
can do, on the South Florida trails. If that happened, and the SS guy really was able to ride with
the fast guys here, I would immediately change my opinions---but it would be based on known facts,
not just boasts on a NewsGroup.

How does one get "boasts on a newsgroup" from personal experience and witnessing this "phenomenon"
coming from several experienced and well traveled mountain bikers? See clue below:

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Since most of you guys would look forward to riding our trails about as much as you would hitting
your thumb with a hammer, I don't think I'll hold my breath for this, but its still something I
would love to see.

Why the hell would anyone want to travel to Florida for mountain biking, or even surfing for that
matter? Maybe if dodging geriatric drivers and laughing at snowbird yankees was a sport it would at
least draw in the curious.

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I will be getting out west this summer for a week or so, to Utah, so maybe someone can point me to
a place in that area where a fast trail exists, and in which SS bikes are competitive with geared
bikes. I don't care about "slow, ultra technical trails". We have those here also, and while I can
ride them, I just don't find that to be fun. As long as there are plenty of fast sections on a
trail, I'm fine with a few technical sections thrown in to keep everyone honest:-)

Make sure you go to Moab in the Summer. It'll be great for you and all of your amazing speed.

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Looking for "real" clues,

Here's one that keeps repeating: It's not about the bike, it's about the rider.

JD

"JD" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]... <snip>

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Here's one that keeps repeating: It's not about the bike, it's about the rider.

JD

I know here, our trails are sub-par, compared to other places, but it's still fun to get out and
ride them. The way I see it, it's not about the bike, nor about the rider. It's about the ride.

It's finally dried up enough here to do a little riding. This morning, I took the bike out on my
small, and average trails here on our land, with my average skills, and got dirty. I had fun.

I think I'll do it again tomorrow.