new chain won't line up with small chain ring

[bcsst26]

I just replaced my chain. I have a specialized allez sport 2004 triple. It is a nine speed so I replaced the chain with a Shimano HG 73. The chain seems like it won't go on the small chain ring at all. I can shift to the medium or large and it works fine. I can shift on the rear cassette to every cog and there is no skipping at all. Every thing seems to work fine except the chail won't line up with the small chain ring. This is the first time that I replaced my chain. I have about 2800 miles on my bike. I ride mostly on the middle and large chain ring. I kept the chain and derailing system cleaned and oiled. Any thoughts what can cause this??

 

[John M]

I just replaced my chain. I have a specialized allez sport 2004 triple. It is a nine speed so I replaced the chain with a Shimano HG 73. The chain seems like it won't go on the small chain ring at all. I can shift to the medium or large and it works fine. I can shift on the rear cassette to every cog and there is no skipping at all. Every thing seems to work fine except the chail won't line up with the small chain ring. This is the first time that I replaced my chain. I have about 2800 miles on my bike. I ride mostly on the middle and large chain ring. I kept the chain and derailing system cleaned and oiled. Any thoughts what can cause this??

Sounds like a front derailleur adjustment issue. Did you disconnect and then reconnect the front derailleur cable or otherwise adjust something with the front derailleur?

Also make sure that chain is same length as old (provided that old chain was sized correctly). I do not think that chain length is the source of your problem.

 

[bcsst26]

Sounds like a front derailleur adjustment issue. Did you disconnect and then reconnect the front derailleur cable or otherwise adjust something with the front derailleur?

Also make sure that chain is same length as old (provided that old chain was sized correctly). I do not think that chain length is the source of your problem.

I lined up the old and new chain to make sure I had the same number of links. I didn't adjust the front derailleur at all. I also didn't disconnect any cables. Do you think maybe that my small chain ring is worn out. I checked it and it looks fine. I do not think this is the cause since all the other cassettees and chainrings look fine and I probably use the small chainring the least. Also the chain is really sticky with the lubricant that came with it. Do you think oiling it well will make a difference?

 

[capwater]

Clean that **** off the chain ASAP! It's cosmoline and intended to be a preservative, not a lube. Do that and then check back in.

 

[John M]

I lined up the old and new chain to make sure I had the same number of links. I didn't adjust the front derailleur at all. I also didn't disconnect any cables. Do you think maybe that my small chain ring is worn out. I checked it and it looks fine. I do not think this is the cause since all the other cassettees and chainrings look fine and I probably use the small chainring the least. Also the chain is really sticky with the lubricant that came with it. Do you think oiling it well will make a difference?

Did you remove the crankset from the bicycle and perhaps did not get it pushed all the way back onto the bottom bracket? If, as you say, the "chain won't line up with the small chainring", then something has altered the position of the chainring in relation to where the front derailleur puts the chain it when you try to downshift to the small ring. Did you remove the small chainring from the crankarm and reinstall it incorrectly (tooth markings should face inward in inner ring of Shimano triple and little notch lined up with the crankarm)?

I doubt that it is so gunked up by cosmoline (which is just a lightweight rust-preventing grease) that the chain can't engage the chainring. I also agree with you that the chainring is probably not worn out.

 

[bcsst26]

Did you remove the crankset from the bicycle and perhaps did not get it pushed all the way back onto the bottom bracket? If, as you say, the "chain won't line up with the small chainring", then something has altered the position of the chainring in relation to where the front derailleur puts the chain it when you try to downshift to the small ring. Did you remove the small chainring from the crankarm and reinstall it incorrectly (tooth markings should face inward in inner ring of Shimano triple and little notch lined up with the crankarm)?

I doubt that it is so gunked up by cosmoline (which is just a lightweight rust-preventing grease) that the chain can't engage the chainring. I also agree with you that the chainring is probably not worn out.

I haven't removed anything. I am at work so I haven't tried to clean the chain of cosmoline yet. My old chain worked fine. I never had any shifting issues just decided I should put a new one on. The chain will stay on some of the teeth but then won't be lined up with the other ones. If I keep the chain moving it will eventually come off the small chainring. The chain never seems to allow all the teeth to take their place. If I shift to the middle or large chain ring then all is solved. Everything works great even the rear cassette. The only thing I can think of is the chain is the wrong one which I do not think so. Could the spacing between the teeth on the small chainring and the others be different. I doubt. Just want to get this resolved without paying the local shop. Need to save money.

 

[John M]

I haven't removed anything. I am at work so I haven't tried to clean the chain of cosmoline yet. My old chain worked fine. I never had any shifting issues just decided I should put a new one on. The chain will stay on some of the teeth but then won't be lined up with the other ones. If I keep the chain moving it will eventually come off the small chainring. The chain never seems to allow all the teeth to take their place. If I shift to the middle or large chain ring then all is solved. Everything works great even the rear cassette. The only thing I can think of is the chain is the wrong one which I do not think so. Could the spacing between the teeth on the small chainring and the others be different. I doubt. Just want to get this resolved without paying the local shop. Need to save money.

Maybe it is chainring wear. If the small chainring is used with the smaller rear cogs it will wear faster becuase of the sharp angle that the chain takes. The old chain could have worked because it would have worn together with the chainring. Take a look at these pictures on Sheldon Brown's website to see if that might be your problem. He is referring to rear cog sprockets, but the principle is the same.

http://sheldonbrown.com/chains.html

And Text quoted from that page:

"A new chain on a worn sprocket. Most of the driving is happening on the left side, where the chain first engages the sprocket. Due to the mismatch in pitch, the rollers in the part of the chain that is about to leave the sprocket is doing very little to push their teeth forward, instead, they are being forced upward by the slope of the teeth.
Since the teeth/rollers on our left are doing most of the work the load is concentrated on them.

In addition, as the roller follows its tooth around the sprocket it rolls up the "ramp," while under load. This promotes wear to the insides of the rollers and to the "bushings" they roll on. With a properly meshed chain, the roller only turns a tiny bit as it rolls onto and off of the chain.

Due to the pitch mismatch, the chain will not reliably mesh with the sprocket under load, and will tend to jump forward, skipping over the teeth."

You could also be having some "chain suck", which could also be caused by a new chain on an a worn chainring.

See this link for a discussion of chain suck: http://www.fagan.co.za/Bikes/Csuck/

Chain suck could also be caused by the gunkiness of the grease and should get better with cleaning and relubing it.

Good luck. You have the right chain. HG73 should work with any Shimano 9s drivetrain.

 

[bcsst26]

Maybe it is chainring wear. If the small chainring is used with the smaller rear cogs it will wear faster becuase of the sharp angle that the chain takes. The old chain could have worked because it would have worn together with the chainring. Take a look at these pictures on Sheldon Brown's website to see if that might be your problem. He is referring to rear cog sprockets, but the principle is the same.

http://sheldonbrown.com/chains.html

And Text quoted from that page:

"A new chain on a worn sprocket. Most of the driving is happening on the left side, where the chain first engages the sprocket. Due to the mismatch in pitch, the rollers in the part of the chain that is about to leave the sprocket is doing very little to push their teeth forward, instead, they are being forced upward by the slope of the teeth.
Since the teeth/rollers on our left are doing most of the work the load is concentrated on them.

In addition, as the roller follows its tooth around the sprocket it rolls up the "ramp," while under load. This promotes wear to the insides of the rollers and to the "bushings" they roll on. With a properly meshed chain, the roller only turns a tiny bit as it rolls onto and off of the chain.

Due to the pitch mismatch, the chain will not reliably mesh with the sprocket under load, and will tend to jump forward, skipping over the teeth."

You could also be having some "chain suck", which could also be caused by a new chain on an a worn chainring.

See this link for a discussion of chain suck: http://www.fagan.co.za/Bikes/Csuck/

Chain suck could also be caused by the gunkiness of the grease and should get better with cleaning and relubing it.

Good luck. You have the right chain. HG73 should work with any Shimano 9s drivetrain.

Thanks for your help. I will look at it when I get home. I already looked at Sheldon's page and read some things about wear of chainrings. I try and never use the small chainring with the small sprockets in the back. I will try and clean it well and lube it well and then see what happens. If anyone else has any ideas let me know. I just read about chain suck and I do not think that is it. My chain really isn't fully getting on the small chain ring. Lets say for example 5 teeth will get in the chain then say 10 don't line up then 15 do. I will check for wear extra well. Keep the suggestions coming.

 

[bcsst26]

I am at home now and got rid of the grease and oiled the chain. I still have the same problem. The chain will catch on the small ring but as the teeth go into the chain eventually the teeth will hit the bushing instead of the whole. Any ideas?

 

[capwater]

I am at home now and got rid of the grease and oiled the chain. I still have the same problem. The chain will catch on the small ring but as the teeth go into the chain eventually the teeth will hit the bushing instead of the whole. Any ideas?

I can't see how your granny ring is that worn , sounds way off.

 

[daveornee]

I just replaced my chain. I have a specialized allez sport 2004 triple. It is a nine speed so I replaced the chain with a Shimano HG 73. The chain seems like it won't go on the small chain ring at all. I can shift to the medium or large and it works fine. I can shift on the rear cassette to every cog and there is no skipping at all. Every thing seems to work fine except the chail won't line up with the small chain ring. This is the first time that I replaced my chain. I have about 2800 miles on my bike. I ride mostly on the middle and large chain ring. I kept the chain and derailing system cleaned and oiled. Any thoughts what can cause this??

http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=75
Sometimes new chains are considerably more laterally stiff.
You might have a situation where your front derailer is slightly out of adjustment and the new chain shows the error. Take a look at the adjustments:
http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=75
Does the chain wrap OK on the small ring without pedal pressure?

 

[bcsst26]

http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=75
Sometimes new chains are considerably more laterally stiff.
You might have a situation where your front derailer is slightly out of adjustment and the new chain shows the error. Take a look at the adjustments:
http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=75
Does the chain wrap OK on the small ring without pedal pressure?

The chain doesn't wrap ok without pedal pressure. I tried to play around with the front derailer with not luck. I guess my chainring is worn out. I compared it to the other rings though and it looks the same. Also I compared it to my rear cassette and it is the same. It seems to me that my chain is too small or the teeth are to spread out. A bunch of the teeth will go in with no problem then a bunch won't.

 

[daveornee]

The chain doesn't wrap ok without pedal pressure. I tried to play around with the front derailer with not luck. I guess my chainring is worn out. I compared it to the other rings though and it looks the same. Also I compared it to my rear cassette and it is the same. It seems to me that my chain is too small or the teeth are to spread out. A bunch of the teeth will go in with no problem then a bunch won't.

Sounds like you found your problem;
since it wraps on everything but the small chainring.
It is hard to compare different diameter rings and cogs for chain wear.
It is however, very strange that some teeth of the small ring wrap well and others don't. I can't visualize what you are seeing, but I also can't come up with an explanation of how some teeth would be worn on a ring and others not.
What does your chainline look like with chain in middle ring and middle cog???
When you pedal backward does the chain flow smoothly over all other combinations of gears??? (no stiff or bent link??).

 

[Al R 1955]

Off the track of your current problem........... My suggestion is in the future have two chains & alternate them at about 1000 km (600 miles)intervals so as to even out the wear.My first road chain (8 speed) lasted 9 K km before slipping on the cassette so I replaced chain & cassette,then the new chain slipped on the chain rings, so then installed new front.
With the alternating arrangement I am expecting around 14 K km before I replace the lot.
I am currently trialling 3 chains on a 30 speed set up. I shall see if this is cost effective?
Anyone have other suggestion on getting the most out of the drive train.

 

[capwater]

Could be a wacked out chainline and the stiffness of the new chain exacerbates the problem. Do you ride in the granny ring much?

 

[bcsst26]

Could be a wacked out chainline and the stiffness of the new chain exacerbates the problem. Do you ride in the granny ring much?

I didn't ride in the granny that much. Once in a while. Most of my riding was done on the large or middle ring. When I shift to the middle or large ring everything is fine. Even when I peddal backwards. Guess I will have to take this one to the shop. Hopefully it won't cost to much.

 

[capwater]

I didn't ride in the granny that much. Once in a while. Most of my riding was done on the large or middle ring. When I shift to the middle or large ring everything is fine. Even when I peddal backwards. Guess I will have to take this one to the shop. Hopefully it won't cost to much.

Well I'm stumped. New chain on almost new granny ring should be a near perfect match. Let us know how you make out.....

 

[bcsst26]

Well I'm stumped. New chain on almost new granny ring should be a near perfect match. Let us know how you make out.....

Went to the bike shop tonight. I had the guy stumped for a while. He agreeded that nothing looked worn out. What he did then was grind the small ring down a little. That did the trick. He thinks that some metal or burs were coming up and that prevented the chain from coming down onto the teeth. I would have never guessed. All well next time I know. Thanks for all your help.

 

[gclark8]

I wonder if it was a 7/8 speed crankset with a 9 speed chain?

 

[capwater]

Went to the bike shop tonight. I had the guy stumped for a while. He agreeded that nothing looked worn out. What he did then was grind the small ring down a little. That did the trick. He thinks that some metal or burs were coming up and that prevented the chain from coming down onto the teeth. I would have never guessed. All well next time I know. Thanks for all your help.

That is just flat out f*cked up. Never heard of such a thing, assuming you have all the right parts. If you had metal burrs I would have though the old chain would have experienced the same problem. Oh well, glad you are all squared away.