Phonak wins and cycling loses: hearing aid company posts record sales!!!!



R

rpm120

Guest
Can you hear me now? This is unbelievable!! Maybe Phonak saw no dip
in hearing aid sales so they kept sponsoring the drug cheats and then
like a stock, they got out when the scandals got to be too much. So
Phonak might be the only winner with the recent drug scandals.


- Phonak may be cutting their links with the sport, but it seems that
the old saw "all publicity is good publicity" can certainly be
applied to the Swiss hearing aids manufacturer. Despite the doping
scandal involving Tour de France winner Floyd Landis and other negative
publicity in recent months, Phonak's sales have hit record levels.
"The image that is sent out after a positive test is not good, but it
helps the brand to become known. Phonak is beating sales' records,"
confirmed team directeur Juan Fernandez.
http://www.procycling.com/news.aspx?ID=2394
 
rpm120 wrote:
> Can you hear me now? This is unbelievable!! Maybe Phonak saw no dip
> in hearing aid sales so they kept sponsoring the drug cheats and then
> like a stock, they got out when the scandals got to be too much. So
> Phonak might be the only winner with the recent drug scandals.
>
>
> - Phonak may be cutting their links with the sport, but it seems that
> the old saw "all publicity is good publicity" can certainly be
> applied to the Swiss hearing aids manufacturer. Despite the doping
> scandal involving Tour de France winner Floyd Landis and other negative
> publicity in recent months, Phonak's sales have hit record levels.
> "The image that is sent out after a positive test is not good, but it
> helps the brand to become known. Phonak is beating sales' records,"
> confirmed team directeur Juan Fernandez.
> http://www.procycling.com/news.aspx?ID=2394


well, they spent a lot of money sponsoring a top cycling team- it's not
the sponsors fault there were those that chose to become cheats- it is
good the sponsor did not get financially burned as a result. hopefully
no one suggests this was all part of the plan.
 
B

Bill C

Guest
[email protected] wrote:
> rpm120 wrote:
> > Can you hear me now? This is unbelievable!! Maybe Phonak saw no dip
> > in hearing aid sales so they kept sponsoring the drug cheats and then
> > like a stock, they got out when the scandals got to be too much. So
> > Phonak might be the only winner with the recent drug scandals.
> >
> >
> > - Phonak may be cutting their links with the sport, but it seems that
> > the old saw "all publicity is good publicity" can certainly be
> > applied to the Swiss hearing aids manufacturer. Despite the doping
> > scandal involving Tour de France winner Floyd Landis and other negative
> > publicity in recent months, Phonak's sales have hit record levels.
> > "The image that is sent out after a positive test is not good, but it
> > helps the brand to become known. Phonak is beating sales' records,"
> > confirmed team directeur Juan Fernandez.
> > http://www.procycling.com/news.aspx?ID=2394

>
> well, they spent a lot of money sponsoring a top cycling team- it's not
> the sponsors fault there were those that chose to become cheats- it is
> good the sponsor did not get financially burned as a result. hopefully
> no one suggests this was all part of the plan.


Maybe people have decided where the real problem is, and still love
the sport, it's teams, and riders.
Bill C
 
R

rpm120

Guest
[email protected] wrote:
> rpm120 wrote:
> > Can you hear me now? This is unbelievable!! Maybe Phonak saw no dip
> > in hearing aid sales so they kept sponsoring the drug cheats and then
> > like a stock, they got out when the scandals got to be too much. So
> > Phonak might be the only winner with the recent drug scandals.
> >
> >
> > - Phonak may be cutting their links with the sport, but it seems that
> > the old saw "all publicity is good publicity" can certainly be
> > applied to the Swiss hearing aids manufacturer. Despite the doping
> > scandal involving Tour de France winner Floyd Landis and other negative
> > publicity in recent months, Phonak's sales have hit record levels.
> > "The image that is sent out after a positive test is not good, but it
> > helps the brand to become known. Phonak is beating sales' records,"
> > confirmed team directeur Juan Fernandez.
> > http://www.procycling.com/news.aspx?ID=2394

>
> well, they spent a lot of money sponsoring a top cycling team- it's not
> the sponsors fault there were those that chose to become cheats- it is
> good the sponsor did not get financially burned as a result. hopefully
> no one suggests this was all part of the plan.



Phonak provided the funds and probably nothing more. If the management
was involved, then it doesn't really matter because I have a hard time
believing that all the riders on Phonak doped in order to get a
contract. So there was a bad choice made by Floyd Landis. The worst
situation would be that Phonak knowingly gave money to a corrupt team
that required doping because they were getting good advertising. This
last scenario seems very unlikely to me!
 
Bill C wrote:

> Maybe people have decided where the real problem is, and still love
> the sport, it's teams, and riders.


dumbass,

the riders need to be held accountable. sure they feel pressure from
the team or whatever and sure there are fuentes type that profit from
doping, but the biggest beneficiary of doping is the rider who wins a
race by cheating.

after the festina affair, a guy like voet who was merely the driver for
the drugs was vilified and run out, but all the riders continued their
careers in cycling with six digit salaries or entered team management.

surprisingly it's not the UCI, but rather the tour organizer that is
probably most effecitve at solving the doping problem. the UCI doesn't
have anything at stake, but as we see, the Tour stands to lose money
(eg. skoda and the german TV contract) because of the floyd affair. so
in retrospect excluding ullrich and basso and the liberty riders seems
justified.
 
R

rpm120

Guest
He's not a dumbass, rather he's an idealist with the disney land dream
of how people will "love the sport again" and all that. As we all
know, big money and fame really mess things up. The drug scandals have
made the Tour like a scripted reality TV show.

I think that the whole sport will loose out unless things change. The
UCI has plenty at stake. Doesn't the UCI make a significant portion of
money from licensing fees for teams, riders, promoters? It seems like
the UCI is more on the side of protecting riders and letting things
stay as they are. Perhaps the teams and grand tours will be the first
to suffer financial troubles and then it trickles down to the UCI and
other governing bodies.




[email protected] wrote:
> Bill C wrote:
>
> > Maybe people have decided where the real problem is, and still love
> > the sport, it's teams, and riders.

>
> dumbass,
>
> the riders need to be held accountable. sure they feel pressure from
> the team or whatever and sure there are fuentes type that profit from
> doping, but the biggest beneficiary of doping is the rider who wins a
> race by cheating.
>
> after the festina affair, a guy like voet who was merely the driver for
> the drugs was vilified and run out, but all the riders continued their
> careers in cycling with six digit salaries or entered team management.
>
> surprisingly it's not the UCI, but rather the tour organizer that is
> probably most effecitve at solving the doping problem. the UCI doesn't
> have anything at stake, but as we see, the Tour stands to lose money
> (eg. skoda and the german TV contract) because of the floyd affair. so
> in retrospect excluding ullrich and basso and the liberty riders seems
> justified.
 
B

Bill C

Guest
rpm120 wrote:
> He's not a dumbass, rather he's an idealist with the disney land dream
> of how people will "love the sport again" and all that. As we all
> know, big money and fame really mess things up. The drug scandals have
> made the Tour like a scripted reality TV show.
>

Yep, the NFL is way down in revenues and ratings with their Athlete
felony a week program. Same for the NBA and soccer too.
Everybody hates them and they can't find any sponsors. Sorry to see
them all folding.
Bill C
 
S

Sandy

Guest
Bill C a écrit :
> rpm120 wrote:
>
>> He's not a dumbass, rather he's an idealist with the disney land dream
>> of how people will "love the sport again" and all that. As we all
>> know, big money and fame really mess things up. The drug scandals have
>> made the Tour like a scripted reality TV show.
>>
>>

> Yep, the NFL is way down in revenues and ratings with their Athlete
> felony a week program. Same for the NBA and soccer too.
> Everybody hates them and they can't find any sponsors. Sorry to see
> them all folding.
> Bill C
>
>

Shame on you !
You let him get away with calling professional cycling a sport !
 
R

rpm120

Guest
Sandy wrote:
> Bill C a écrit :
> > rpm120 wrote:
> >
> >> He's not a dumbass, rather he's an idealist with the disney land dream
> >> of how people will "love the sport again" and all that. As we all
> >> know, big money and fame really mess things up. The drug scandals have
> >> made the Tour like a scripted reality TV show.
> >>
> >>

> > Yep, the NFL is way down in revenues and ratings with their Athlete
> > felony a week program. Same for the NBA and soccer too.
> > Everybody hates them and they can't find any sponsors. Sorry to see
> > them all folding.
> > Bill C
> >
> >

> Shame on you !
> You let him get away with calling professional cycling a sport !


Let me unconfuse you:
I think it is a "sport" surrounded by a circus/reality TV show. You
bring up the NFL, NBA, etc. which reminds me that cycling is not very
"entertaining or amusing"(def of game). The typical American jock does
not get what he wants from cycling. No instant replays or skillful
handling of the ball that directly reminds one of a game they just
played in the back yard. This guy won't watch an endurance event and
be able to scream at the TV while drinking beer and laughing at the
latest Budweiser commercial! There is no gladiator style "game". And
further, there is no passion for it because they don't know what it
feels like to put yourself in the red zone after 5 hours of hard riding
in a grand tour. Most Americans are more in touch with a hot dog
eating contest! It's all about relating to the public. The media all
over the world understands drug scandals. Everyone gets that. That's
why this "sport" has turned into a game/reality TV show. Maybe the
drug scandals are a conspiracy to add more American viewers?

You decide where cycling fits:

Sport: "An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is
governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken
competitively".

Game: "An activity providing entertainment or amusement; a pastime"
 
S

Smokey

Guest
rpm120 wrote:
> Can you hear me now? This is unbelievable!! Maybe Phonak saw no dip
> in hearing aid sales so they kept sponsoring the drug cheats and then
> like a stock, they got out when the scandals got to be too much. So
> Phonak might be the only winner with the recent drug scandals.
>
>
> - Phonak may be cutting their links with the sport, but it seems that
> the old saw "all publicity is good publicity" can certainly be
> applied to the Swiss hearing aids manufacturer. Despite the doping
> scandal involving Tour de France winner Floyd Landis and other negative
> publicity in recent months, Phonak's sales have hit record levels.
> "The image that is sent out after a positive test is not good, but it
> helps the brand to become known. Phonak is beating sales' records,"
> confirmed team directeur Juan Fernandez.
> http://www.procycling.com/news.aspx?ID=2394


Phonak sales may be up for one other reason; they make a good product.
I've been using their hearing aids for more than six years and have
been very satisfied with them. BTW, having a professional cycling team
had nothing to do with me purchasing their product.

Smokey
 
R

rpm120

Guest
Smokey wrote:
> rpm120 wrote:
> > Can you hear me now? This is unbelievable!! Maybe Phonak saw no dip
> > in hearing aid sales so they kept sponsoring the drug cheats and then
> > like a stock, they got out when the scandals got to be too much. So
> > Phonak might be the only winner with the recent drug scandals.
> >
> >
> > - Phonak may be cutting their links with the sport, but it seems that
> > the old saw "all publicity is good publicity" can certainly be
> > applied to the Swiss hearing aids manufacturer. Despite the doping
> > scandal involving Tour de France winner Floyd Landis and other negative
> > publicity in recent months, Phonak's sales have hit record levels.
> > "The image that is sent out after a positive test is not good, but it
> > helps the brand to become known. Phonak is beating sales' records,"
> > confirmed team directeur Juan Fernandez.
> > http://www.procycling.com/news.aspx?ID=2394

>
> Phonak sales may be up for one other reason; they make a good product.
> I've been using their hearing aids for more than six years and have
> been very satisfied with them. BTW, having a professional cycling team
> had nothing to do with me purchasing their product.
>
> Smokey


Glad to hear it Smokey. Was that too sarcastic? For your case, it
couldn't have had anything to do with it because Phonak started in
2002. For a medical product, I doubt anyone would be swayed very much
by team sponsorship. What I do think might happen is a doctor or
patient may hear of the brand name and then check out the product when
they otherwise would have not.
 
W

William O'Hara

Guest
>> of how people will "love the sport again" and all that. As we all
>> know, big money and fame really mess things up. The drug scandals have
>> made the Tour like a scripted reality TV show.
>>

> Yep, the NFL is way down in revenues and ratings with their Athlete
> felony a week program. Same for the NBA and soccer too.


If the NFL had WADA to do enforcement, then Brady would have
already been suspended. Their ratings would have skyrocketed!


--
---
William O'Hara
www.N1ey.com - Amateur Radio and Railfan Blog
www.yahoogroups.com/group/illinoiscentral - premier discussion list re:
ICRR
 
B

Bill C

Guest
William O'Hara wrote:

>
> If the NFL had WADA to do enforcement, then Brady would have
> already been suspended. Their ratings would have skyrocketed!
>
>
> --
> ---
> William O'Hara
> www.N1ey.com - Amateur Radio and Railfan Blog
> www.yahoogroups.com/group/illinoiscentral - premier discussion list re:
> ICRR


Yep he called to see about a place to train while he was at home one
offseason. That should be enough for them to at least ban him from
starting the rest of the preseason games while they investigate. He
actually called the guy once, he's guilty as hell by Wada standards.
Bill C
 
B

Bill C

Guest
rpm120 wrote:
> Sandy wrote:
> > Bill C a écrit :
> > > rpm120 wrote:
> > >
> > >> He's not a dumbass, rather he's an idealist with the disney land dream
> > >> of how people will "love the sport again" and all that. As we all
> > >> know, big money and fame really mess things up. The drug scandals have
> > >> made the Tour like a scripted reality TV show.
> > >>
> > >>
> > > Yep, the NFL is way down in revenues and ratings with their Athlete
> > > felony a week program. Same for the NBA and soccer too.
> > > Everybody hates them and they can't find any sponsors. Sorry to see
> > > them all folding.
> > > Bill C
> > >
> > >

> > Shame on you !
> > You let him get away with calling professional cycling a sport !

>
> Let me unconfuse you:
> I think it is a "sport" surrounded by a circus/reality TV show. You
> bring up the NFL, NBA, etc. which reminds me that cycling is not very
> "entertaining or amusing"(def of game). The typical American jock does
> not get what he wants from cycling. No instant replays or skillful
> handling of the ball that directly reminds one of a game they just
> played in the back yard. This guy won't watch an endurance event and
> be able to scream at the TV while drinking beer and laughing at the
> latest Budweiser commercial! There is no gladiator style "game". And
> further, there is no passion for it because they don't know what it
> feels like to put yourself in the red zone after 5 hours of hard riding
> in a grand tour. Most Americans are more in touch with a hot dog
> eating contest! It's all about relating to the public. The media all
> over the world understands drug scandals. Everyone gets that. That's
> why this "sport" has turned into a game/reality TV show. Maybe the
> drug scandals are a conspiracy to add more American viewers?
>
> You decide where cycling fits:
>
> Sport: "An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is
> governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken
> competitively".
>
> Game: "An activity providing entertainment or amusement; a pastime"

Not sure where you are coming from. In my world, what something
actually is, is NOT defined by it's public perception. Popularity is
what it is, and it's pretty meaningless unless you are talking about
that rare thing that can harness it for long periods of time.
Everything else is cyclical in popularity, but the number of observers
and fans has no effect on the core of what something really is. Kids
playing Little League might very well be more "baseball" than the pro
circus.
If your saying cycling isn't going to become Nascar I agree, and am
glad of that. The trickle down has made it damned near impossible for
me to take the family to the local race track due to the increased
prices. The racing isn't any better now than 25 years ago when I was
going to 2 or 3 nights of racing a week, but the popularity has limited
WHO can go now. The core gans are the ones who still show up at the
local level and for them the sport is really still the same.
Simply put, popular perception is almost never reality. I'm willing to
bet that even without the big money events people will continue to come
out and race hard. Do you think that US D3 riders were making any real
money? I'd bet that almost all of them made well below minimum wage
when you account for all the training hours and tons of people are
killing themselves to get those slots.
Money and commercialism aren't the sport. The sport are the Cat 2
riders in a P/1/2 killing themselves to compete and make it to the P
level.
Cycling doesn't offer the instant gratification that our mentally
challenged, spastic time span, MTV weaned American public wants, but
that doesn't make the sport any less.
What is, is. And the cores are timeless for those who take the time
and effort to see.
Bill C
 
S

Sandy

Guest
Bill C a écrit :
> rpm120 wrote:
>
>> Sandy wrote:
>>
>>> Bill C a écrit :
>>>
>>>> rpm120 wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> He's not a dumbass, rather he's an idealist with the disney land dream
>>>>> of how people will "love the sport again" and all that. As we all
>>>>> know, big money and fame really mess things up. The drug scandals have
>>>>> made the Tour like a scripted reality TV show.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Yep, the NFL is way down in revenues and ratings with their Athlete
>>>> felony a week program. Same for the NBA and soccer too.
>>>> Everybody hates them and they can't find any sponsors. Sorry to see
>>>> them all folding.
>>>> Bill C
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Shame on you !
>>> You let him get away with calling professional cycling a sport !
>>>

>> Let me unconfuse you:
>> I think it is a "sport" surrounded by a circus/reality TV show. You
>> bring up the NFL, NBA, etc. which reminds me that cycling is not very
>> "entertaining or amusing"(def of game). The typical American jock does
>> not get what he wants from cycling. No instant replays or skillful
>> handling of the ball that directly reminds one of a game they just
>> played in the back yard. This guy won't watch an endurance event and
>> be able to scream at the TV while drinking beer and laughing at the
>> latest Budweiser commercial! There is no gladiator style "game". And
>> further, there is no passion for it because they don't know what it
>> feels like to put yourself in the red zone after 5 hours of hard riding
>> in a grand tour. Most Americans are more in touch with a hot dog
>> eating contest! It's all about relating to the public. The media all
>> over the world understands drug scandals. Everyone gets that. That's
>> why this "sport" has turned into a game/reality TV show. Maybe the
>> drug scandals are a conspiracy to add more American viewers?
>>
>> You decide where cycling fits:
>>
>> Sport: "An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is
>> governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken
>> competitively".
>>
>> Game: "An activity providing entertainment or amusement; a pastime"
>>

> Not sure where you are coming from. In my world, what something
> actually is, is NOT defined by it's public perception. Popularity is
> what it is, and it's pretty meaningless unless you are talking about
> that rare thing that can harness it for long periods of time.
> Everything else is cyclical in popularity, but the number of observers
> and fans has no effect on the core of what something really is. Kids
> playing Little League might very well be more "baseball" than the pro
> circus.
> If your saying cycling isn't going to become Nascar I agree, and am
> glad of that. The trickle down has made it damned near impossible for
> me to take the family to the local race track due to the increased
> prices. The racing isn't any better now than 25 years ago when I was
> going to 2 or 3 nights of racing a week, but the popularity has limited
> WHO can go now. The core gans are the ones who still show up at the
> local level and for them the sport is really still the same.
> Simply put, popular perception is almost never reality. I'm willing to
> bet that even without the big money events people will continue to come
> out and race hard. Do you think that US D3 riders were making any real
> money? I'd bet that almost all of them made well below minimum wage
> when you account for all the training hours and tons of people are
> killing themselves to get those slots.
> Money and commercialism aren't the sport. The sport are the Cat 2
> riders in a P/1/2 killing themselves to compete and make it to the P
> level.
> Cycling doesn't offer the instant gratification that our mentally
> challenged, spastic time span, MTV weaned American public wants, but
> that doesn't make the sport any less.
> What is, is. And the cores are timeless for those who take the time
> and effort to see.
> Bill C
>
>

HEY !!! Randomly Pointing M&M 120 :

Hey, when YOU use the word "you" and fail to distinguish two different
writers, is it because YOU learned nothing in YOUR alightings at school
grounds, or was it just the down feeling after YOUR last PowerBar high
phhhttted away ?
 
R

Raptor

Guest
rpm120 wrote:
> - Phonak may be cutting their links with the sport, but it seems that
> the old saw "all publicity is good publicity" can certainly be
> applied to the Swiss hearing aids manufacturer. Despite the doping
> scandal involving Tour de France winner Floyd Landis and other negative
> publicity in recent months, Phonak's sales have hit record levels.
> "The image that is sent out after a positive test is not good, but it
> helps the brand to become known. Phonak is beating sales' records,"
> confirmed team directeur Juan Fernandez.
> http://www.procycling.com/news.aspx?ID=2394


WADA and the UCI just need to get "better" "tests."

--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
I have nothing but contempt and anger for those who betray the
trust by exposing the name of our sources. They are, in my view,
the most insidious of traitors."
George H.W. Bush, April 16, 1999,
 
Bill C wrote:
> rpm120 wrote:
> > He's not a dumbass, rather he's an idealist with the disney land dream
> > of how people will "love the sport again" and all that. As we all
> > know, big money and fame really mess things up. The drug scandals have
> > made the Tour like a scripted reality TV show.
> >

> Yep, the NFL is way down in revenues and ratings with their Athlete
> felony a week program. Same for the NBA and soccer too.
> Everybody hates them and they can't find any sponsors. Sorry to see
> them all folding.


dumbass,

there is a big difference between cycling and the NFL. the NFL is the
organizer of the games, it collects TV revenue, it makes the rules and
it employs the players (indirectly).

if there is ever a problem which might hurt revenue (over-celebration,
uniform violations) it is cracked down on hard. In the case of
baseball, the doping issue became too visible and they are now forced
to deal with it.

the way cycling is set up as a business is stupid. every party has a
different set of interests, and they don't line up well with one
another.

In the NFL if a team has a lousy record or doesn't make the playoffs,
it's sponsor doesn't disappear, it doesn't fold. In fact there's a
system in place so that it can become better.

Logically the race organizers should form a league and employ riders.
There could be franchise owners that "own" a race and franchise owners
that own a team, and they could make and enforce the rules in a way
that is in the best interests of everyone involved (including the
riders).
 
R

rpm120

Guest
[email protected] wrote:
> Bill C wrote:
> > rpm120 wrote:
> > > He's not a dumbass, rather he's an idealist with the disney land dream
> > > of how people will "love the sport again" and all that. As we all
> > > know, big money and fame really mess things up. The drug scandals have
> > > made the Tour like a scripted reality TV show.
> > >

> > Yep, the NFL is way down in revenues and ratings with their Athlete
> > felony a week program. Same for the NBA and soccer too.
> > Everybody hates them and they can't find any sponsors. Sorry to see
> > them all folding.

>
> dumbass,
>
> there is a big difference between cycling and the NFL. the NFL is the
> organizer of the games, it collects TV revenue, it makes the rules and
> it employs the players (indirectly).
>
> if there is ever a problem which might hurt revenue (over-celebration,
> uniform violations) it is cracked down on hard. In the case of
> baseball, the doping issue became too visible and they are now forced
> to deal with it.
>
> the way cycling is set up as a business is stupid. every party has a
> different set of interests, and they don't line up well with one
> another.
>
> In the NFL if a team has a lousy record or doesn't make the playoffs,
> it's sponsor doesn't disappear, it doesn't fold. In fact there's a
> system in place so that it can become better.
>
> Logically the race organizers should form a league and employ riders.
> There could be franchise owners that "own" a race and franchise owners
> that own a team, and they could make and enforce the rules in a way
> that is in the best interests of everyone involved (including the
> riders).



Bill C:
Your right about the core of cycling remaining unchanged no matter how
many of the fastest riders get caught for cheating. Cycling as a
professional sport might be on the decline, but it will always have the
core. I was just talking to a junior rider a few days ago and Floyd
Landis came up. I told him about Marco Pinotti who swears up and down
that he is clean and will take any test to prove that he is clean.
Marco was Italian National TT champ last year. He's a support rider
most of the time, but good enough to get 3rd to Basso and Ullrich in a
Giro ITT. Marco jokes on his website that he should get 1st now! The
junior said, "after seeing Floyd, it's hard to think you can ride
clean". A sad state of affairs.

amit.ghosh:
Anybody who starts a post with "dumbass" is not worth the time of day.
I skimmed your post and it said something about the NFL and how you
think cycling should be structured. I won't read it for any
intelligent reply because you come off like. . .well . . .a dumbass!
 
S

Stu Fleming

Guest
Raptor wrote:

>
> WADA and the UCI just need to get "better" "tests."
>


Like actually testing the athlete's urine, not the "clean".
 

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