pointers to servicing gears

MW said:

Hi

I've had my first 'proper' cycle for 18 months now, a Shogun Spirit
http://www.falconcycles.co.uk/CORP/ROAD/spirit.html with which I've
been hugely impressed.

I've done approach 3000m on it over this time, and I've learnt how to
replace tubes and tyres, and done some degreasing and cleaning up.

The main prob at present is that the gears aren't shifting as cleanly
as they used to (Shimano 2200), and I reckon its probably about time
(if not more than about time) that the gears might need some specific
attention. Are there any good websits that peeps can recommend -
and pointers as to which of the following are going to need looking at

- chain (need replacing?)
- the shifters on the handlebars
- the cables
- the front chain shifter thingie
- the rear derailleurs etc

I could take it into the local bike shop, but would like to build up
the expertise to do it myself.

M

Sorry in a rush>
You'll get web site recommendations here shortly.
BUT drive train maintenance falls into 3 categories:
1. TLC eg lube
2. Deal with /one single/ issue eg. rear shift doesn't always
3. End to end
Don't get them mixed. Good luck.

--
Peter Fox
Beer, dancing, cycling and lots more at www.eminent.demon.co.uk

MW said:

Are there any good websits that peeps can recommend -
and pointers as to which of the following are going to need looking at

Type this into google: "site:sheldonbrown.com maintenance"

Quoted message said:

- chain (need replacing?)
- the shifters on the handlebars
- the cables
- the front chain shifter thingie
- the rear derailleurs etc

I think these pages may cover four out of five of your bullet points:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chains.html
http://sheldonbrown.com/cables.html
http://sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html

Quoted message said:

I could take it into the local bike shop, but would like to build up
the expertise to do it myself.

Yep, much more fun, and handy to know how they all work if something
goes awry when you're out and about.

Graham

MW said:

Hi

I've had my first 'proper' cycle for 18 months now, a Shogun Spirit
http://www.falconcycles.co.uk/CORP/ROAD/spirit.html with which I've
been hugely impressed.

I've done approach 3000m on it over this time, and I've learnt how to
replace tubes and tyres, and done some degreasing and cleaning up.

The main prob at present is that the gears aren't shifting as cleanly
as they used to (Shimano 2200), and I reckon its probably about time
(if not more than about time) that the gears might need some specific
attention. Are there any good websits that peeps can recommend -
and pointers as to which of the following are going to need looking at

- chain (need replacing?)

It may not help with the shifting problem, but the chain will be due for
replacement by now anyway. The cassette (rear sprockets) probably will have
to be changed too as they are probably too worn now to work with a new
chain. Chainrings (front sprockets) generally last longer, so don't worry
about them for now.

Quoted message said:

- the shifters on the handlebars

Possible, but hopefully not. Shimano ones should last several times longer
than 3000m.

Quoted message said:

- the cables

Not a bad idea to change them every now and then, though first I would try
simply adjusting the tension.

Quoted message said:

- the front chain shifter thingie
- the rear derailleurs etc

Some adjustment may be necessary, but they should not need replacing.

Quoted message said:

I could take it into the local bike shop, but would like to build up
the expertise to do it myself.

Good idea.

See www.sheldonbrown.com

and http://www.parktool.com/repair/

~PB

MW writtificated

Quoted message said:

- chain (need replacing?)
- the shifters on the handlebars
- the cables
- the front chain shifter thingie
- the rear derailleurs etc

Wheely good instructions (with pictures) at <www.parktool.com>

When the rear mech isn't shifting well it's normally just a case of
twiddling some screws. If the bike has had a lot of use it's always worth
replacing the cables too. Cables with a teflon lining are great: smoother-
faster-easier shifting for longer. The gears'll need tweaking once the
cables have bedded in but it's worth it.

Have a look at the cassette on the back. Are the sprockets worn (they'll
look a bit like sharks teeth if they are). Same with the chainrings on the
front. After 3000 miles the chain definately will be 🙂 Word of warning:
the teeth are meant to be a funny shape, so it might look worn even tho it
isn't. I think Park have pics to compare yours to.

If the cassette is badly worn then a new chain might skip. This is both
annoying and, if it happens when you're standing up, a potential ball ache.
You'll have to make the decision whether to run the whole transmission into
the ground with the old chain or replace the cassette and possibly the
chainset too.

MW said:

The main prob at present is that the gears aren't shifting as cleanly
as they used to (Shimano 2200), and I reckon its probably about time
(if not more than about time) that the gears might need some specific
attention. Are there any good websits that peeps can recommend -
and pointers as to which of the following are going to need looking at

- chain (need replacing?)
- the shifters on the handlebars
- the cables
- the front chain shifter thingie
- the rear derailleurs etc

Sheldon Brown's website (http://www.sheldonbrown.com/) and Park tools
(http://www.parktool.com/repair/) are good resources if you know what
you need to do, but not how to do it. Learning to do the work
yourself is great as you'll understand how everything works and will
gradually be able to pinpoint problems from vague symptoms you get
while riding. It also saves a load of money if you're doing it often
(and have the time to tinker!)

Shifters rarely go wrong so probably don't need much looking at. One
of mine possibly has a design fault and the cable frets at the outlet
causing it to eventually snap. I've learnt that if I do "2 clicks" to
change one gear then it means my cable has just gone ping again and
needs replacing.

Cables stretch over time, especially if you stop with them in tension
(e.g. big cog at front, big cog at back) like I always do. If these
are old and have stretched replace them before fiddling with anything
else to avoid wasting too much time. If you've suddenly lost a gear
or two, check the cable hasn't fretted (see above).
Cables can also get bunged up over time. If you're having problems
shifting onto smaller cogs front/back then this could be the problem,
particularly on the front if the cable runs under the bottom bracket
where it is fully exposed to mud and dirt. Another possible cause of
this is a dodgy spring in the dérailleur but whenever I've suspected
this a new, clean cable has solved it.

Chains also stretch over time. Sheldon Brown's website has a section
on how to measure chain stretch and what to do about it. If your
chain is badly stretched then replace all your gears and chain at the
same time, if necessary keep using the worn out parts for a couple
more weeks until all the replacement bits arrive because mixing old
and new is not good in this situation! (and if you're going to be
ditching the old ones anyway it doesn't matter if you destroy them a
bit more). I think I've been averaging a chain every 6 months and had
to replace the front chainset recently because I'd let the chain get
so stretched that it wore it out quite badly - expensive and possibly
avoidable.

My rear dérailleur has a thumbscrew which is useful for fine
adjustment once you've got things roughly right. I've got a similar
one on the shifter for the front but don't find it as useful.
If your chain falls off the cogs it's useful to learn what the screws
do and if you're lucky your dérailleur will let you actually see how
these work which makes it really easy to work out what needs adjusting
and by how much.
If you're having trouble with the front dérailleur, you might need to
slide it up or down a couple of mm, or rotate it around the post a
tiny bit. I couldn't get into all gears until I tried this but it had
never been a problem until recently! If you fiddle with it make sure
you tighten it up well afterwards so the cable doesn't pull it around/
down again, and observe whether or not the dérailleur rotates as you
tighten it back up!

If you adjust the gears in your 'workshop' and get them right, go for
a ride up and down the road and make sure they still work just as
perfectly when you put some serious force through the system. I've
found it's really easy to get gears working in the workshop only to
find they're awful when actually riding.

Finally, IMO if it's not broken don't take it to bits for the sake of
it, as I find gear adjustment really really fiddly and time consuming.

peter

naked_draughtsman writtificated

Quoted message said:

Finally, IMO if it's not broken don't take it to bits for the sake of
it, as I find gear adjustment really really fiddly and time consuming.

Top tip: one of these makes everything so much easier:
<http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLqrymode.a4p?f%5FProductID=7328>

In article <[email hidden]>, Mark T
pleasegivegenerously@warmail*turn_up_the_heat_to_reply*.com.invalid
says...

Quoted message said:

naked_draughtsman writtificated

Quoted message said:

Finally, IMO if it's not broken don't take it to bits for the sake of
it, as I find gear adjustment really really fiddly and time consuming.

Top tip: one of these makes everything so much easier:
<http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLqrymode.a4p?f%5FProductID=7328>

If you like bending/kneeling down to do everything.

In message <[email hidden]>, Peter Fox
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

MW said:

Hi
I've had my first 'proper' cycle for 18 months now, a Shogun Spirit
http://www.falconcycles.co.uk/CORP/ROAD/spirit.html with which I've
been hugely impressed.
I've done approach 3000m on it over this time, and I've learnt how
to
replace tubes and tyres, and done some degreasing and cleaning up.
The main prob at present is that the gears aren't shifting as
cleanly
as they used to (Shimano 2200), and I reckon its probably about time
(if not more than about time) that the gears might need some specific
attention. Are there any good websits that peeps can recommend -
and pointers as to which of the following are going to need looking at
- chain (need replacing?)
- the shifters on the handlebars - the cables
- the front chain shifter thingie
- the rear derailleurs etc
I could take it into the local bike shop, but would like to build up
the expertise to do it myself.
M

Sorry in a rush>
You'll get web site recommendations here shortly.
BUT drive train maintenance falls into 3 categories:
1. TLC eg lube
2. Deal with /one single/ issue eg. rear shift doesn't always
3. End to end
Don't get them mixed. Good luck.

For Shimano gear adjustment this Youtube video is really good.

Cheers

--
bob

Mark T said:

naked_draughtsman writtificated

Quoted message said:

Finally, IMO if it's not broken don't take it to bits for the sake of
it, as I find gear adjustment really really fiddly and time consuming.

Top tip: one of these makes everything so much easier:
<http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLqrymode.a4p?f%5FProductID=7328>

If you're going to get a workstand (and I agree it's an extremely good
idea), get a proper one. Something like this:

<http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLqrymode.a4p?f%5FProductID=8437>

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

'Victories are not solutions.'
;; John Hume, Northern Irish politician, on Radio Scotland 1/2/95
;; Nobel Peace Prize laureate 1998; few have deserved it so much

MW said:

Hi

I've had my first 'proper' cycle for 18 months now, a Shogun Spirit
http://www.falconcycles.co.uk/CORP/ROAD/spirit.html with which I've
been hugely impressed.

I've done approach 3000m on it over this time, and I've learnt how to
replace tubes and tyres, and done some degreasing and cleaning up.

The main prob at present is that the gears aren't shifting as cleanly
as they used to (Shimano 2200), and I reckon its probably about time
(if not more than about time) that the gears might need some specific
attention. Are there any good websits that peeps can recommend -
and pointers as to which of the following are going to need looking at

- chain (need replacing?)

First thing to check is, is the chain actually worn? If it is the it needs
replacing - if too worn then the cassette needs replacing too. With
reasonable maintenance, though, a chain should last longer than 3000 miles,
so don't simply assume it's stuffed. A good quality chain gauge is a good
idea - something like this:

http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLqrymode.a4p?f%5FProductID=4493

You can also check for chainwear by taking the chain off the bike,
stretching it out, and measuring the length of twelve full links. Some
people swear that's the only proper way of measuring a chain, but I'll let
them explain the method since I don't use it.

If it isn't worn out, do clean and lubricate it. The preferred method is
the 'Sheldon shake' - a quick google for that will explain how.

Quoted message said:

- the shifters on the handlebars

Almost certainly not - which is a good thing, as they're pretty expensive
components. They're worn out when the cable slips from detente to detente
without you clicking the levers. Shimano ones are not serviceable - when
they're shot you have to replace the whole thing.

Quoted message said:

- the cables

Probably. And make sure you replace the sleeve as well - with proper gear
cable sleeve. Brake cable sleeve, while stronger, is very slightly more
compressible, which makes for imprecise shifting.

Quoted message said:

- the front chain shifter thingie

Almost certainly not.

Quoted message said:

- the rear derailleurs etc

Almost certainly not. But definitely disassemble, clean, lubricate, and
reassemble the jockey wheel cage - crud there can interfere with the
crispness of shifting (because the top jockey wheel needs to be able to
float laterally a bit to align the chain sweetly with the cog it's on.

Quoted message said:

I could take it into the local bike shop, but would like to build up
the expertise to do it myself.

Excellent plan. 'Zinn and the Art of [Road|Mountain] Bike Maintenance' is
worth the price:

<http://www.amazon.co.uk/Zinn-Art-Mountain-Bike-Maintenance/dp/193138259X/>
<http://www.amazon.co.uk/Zinn-Art-Road-Bike-Maintenance/dp/1931382697/>

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; part time troll.

Rob Morley writtificated

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Top tip: one of these makes everything so much easier:
<http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLqrymode.a4p?f%5FProductID=7328>

If you like bending/kneeling down to do everything.

I presume you meant spending £80 on a 'proper' workstand is better than £15
on the wickle stand. I guess it depends on how much money you've got and
how bad your back gets with 5 or so minutes of sitting around.

I'm poor and my bad back is fine with it. I guess you're richer but less
fortunate 😉

Mark T said:

I presume you meant spending £80 on a 'proper' workstand is better than £15
on the wickle stand. I guess it depends on how much money you've got and
how bad your back gets with 5 or so minutes of sitting around.

I think more a case of how often you'll be using it. If it's with any
sort of regularity then you'll soon be at the point where you appreciate
a full size stand every time you use it, and the £80 will have long been
forgotten.

It's a bit like why pay £500+ for a bike when you can get one for much
less which is entirely adequate? The answer is that better is better,
and the more you use it the more you get to appreciate it.

(I don't have a workstand, I've not seen one that would work well with
the 'bents, plus I probably do less maintenance work than I really ought
to...)

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

In article <[email hidden]>, Mark T
pleasegivegenerously@warmail*turn_up_the_heat_to_reply*.com.invalid
says...

Quoted message said:

Rob Morley writtificated

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Top tip: one of these makes everything so much easier:
<http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebwPNLqrymode.a4p?f%5FProductID=7328>

If you like bending/kneeling down to do everything.

I presume you meant spending £80 on a 'proper' workstand is better than£15
on the wickle stand. I guess it depends on how much money you've got and
how bad your back gets with 5 or so minutes of sitting around.

I'm poor and my bad back is fine with it. I guess you're richer but less
fortunate 😉

I'm poor and knackered, and I don't have a workstand. I do have a
stepladder, and a wooden thing that attaches to it (actually I made it
to hold a paint tray) on which I can hang a bike by the top tube. But
as I've pointed out before, a couple of bits of cord hanging from the
ceiling does a reasonable job of supporting a bike at very little cost.
I still have a couple of those Lidl pulley thingies for hoisting bikes
out of the way, that I haven't got around to fitting yet.