Question for Low-Carbers

In article <[email hidden]>,

Ranee Mueller said:

I was interested in changing some of my diet stuff now, rather than
waiting until I could get on the medicine, if that even turns out to be
what I should do. However, I am not really interested in it for the
weight loss, though that is nice. Is it really feasible to jump to a
later stage in, say, the South Beach diet, or even the maintenance diet,
or would that negate the health benefits? I'll be talking to my doctor
about it, but I was interested in some input from people who actually
live with the diet.

Ranee, you should consult with a dietician who has experience dealing
with whatever your condition is. Your family doctor or perhaps a nearby
hospital can referred you to a qualified dietician. If I were you, I
would not take advice from strangers on RFC, even that I am sure it will
be offered with the best of intentions. No one can advise you without
knowing a lot more about your condition than you have disclosed.

On Thu 02 Mar 2006 05:58:12p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Stan
Horwitz?

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Ranee Mueller said:

I was interested in changing some of my diet stuff now, rather than
waiting until I could get on the medicine, if that even turns out to be
what I should do. However, I am not really interested in it for the
weight loss, though that is nice. Is it really feasible to jump to a
later stage in, say, the South Beach diet, or even the maintenance diet,
or would that negate the health benefits? I'll be talking to my doctor
about it, but I was interested in some input from people who actually
live with the diet.

Ranee, you should consult with a dietician who has experience dealing
with whatever your condition is. Your family doctor or perhaps a nearby
hospital can referred you to a qualified dietician. If I were you, I
would not take advice from strangers on RFC, even that I am sure it will
be offered with the best of intentions. No one can advise you without
knowing a lot more about your condition than you have disclosed.

I don't disagree with what Stan says, however, many people do not eat a
balanced diet as a matter of course, and they are not following any
specific diet. It's just their habit.

I see no particular reason why you couldn't raise your protein intake and
somewhat lower your carb intake, while still maintaining a "non weight
loss" caloric intake, with relative safety.

I am a diagnosed Type 2 diabetic taking prescribed doses of glyburide and
glucophage, who has also been on Weight Watchers since the beginning of
January. Having lost nearly 30 pounds to date, my doctor has taken me off
the glucophage altogether, and expects to eliminate the glyburide in the
future.

I know you indicated that you were not interested in losing weight, but I
don't know if you are at your ideal weight. Even a small weight loss can
alter one's insulin resistance. You might find that a lower carb diet will
have an effect on you, even without significant weight loss.

--
Wayne Boatwright o¿o
____________________

BIOYA

"Ranee Mueller" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have a condition that I've had since I was a teenager, and it

has

Quoted message said:

many complicated side effects on my health. Anyway, recently a

doctor

Quoted message said:

told me that it may be related to insulin resistance, >

[snipped]

Quoted message said:

Thank you!

Regards,
Ranee

THE authority on low carbohydrate diets is the late Robert Atkins,
M.D. His _early_ books are the definitive source of his thousands of
clinical trials. (Perhaps you can still locate them at a source like
Amazon.com.) I shall not make any attempt here to go into the details
of this regimen, as Dr. Atkins has spelled it all out in his books

The LAST person to have been trained in anything of this sort is a
Registered Dietician, then comes your physician. they still believe
there is nutritional value in pasta (not as much as in Wonder Bread),
but a wonderful fun/fake food nevertheless. I am personally
acquainted with several R.D.'s whom I am very fond of, but their
dietary ignorance (from the University programs they were trained
with - financed by the food industry) is jaw-droppingly abysmal.

My personal dietary experience is based upon my hypersensitivity to
any commercially produced foods that trigger a rush of insulin that
put me to sleep for 30 minutes. Maintaining my weight, not reducing
it, has always been my goal.

Only with, and because of ,a lower (read: controlled) carbohydrate
diet was I finally able to keep my head & body balanced. This was an
enormous victory and a protocol that I have followed easily &
successfully for 20 years. ***It is simplicity itself: learn how to
count grams of carbohydrates (charts abound) and keep records
initially on how you feel after a day of 'x' number of grams of
carbohydrate. One hundred grams per day is the usual middle ground,
and you can go up or down from there. Keep tweeking your intake until
you feel/know you are well-balanced.*** There is nothing radical in
this approach and nothing dangerous to you and/or a fetus/nursing
child. The only extremes of a low carbohydrate diet are experienced
by those who wish to lose substantial amounts of weight - not your
goal.

No comment on any medication, as that is not my field. However, since
your physician's first resort was to medication instead of regulating
your carbohydrate intake, that should tell you all you need to know
about his training in all matters dietary. Caveat emptor.

If your condition is insulin-related, there is everything to gain and
nothing to lose by giving this protocol a genuine test.

Best of the best to you,

--
Mabry
C=;-{ }

Ranee Mueller said:

This is mostly directed at diabetics and those who do low-carb diets
because of their health, rather than just wishing to lose weight.

I have a condition that I've had since I was a teenager, and it has
many complicated side effects on my health. Anyway, recently a doctor
told me that it may be related to insulin resistance, though I am not
diabetic, and said that in cases like mine metformin/glucophage has
worked in restoring normalcy to women with my condition. However, it is
contra-indicated for pregnant and nursing women, so it's not a
possibility for quite some time. It also has some side effects that can
be pretty serious, and using a high protein diet in conjunction with
(this was the best option, then it was diet alone, then medicine alone)
the medication was indicated to be the best way to combat the problem,
and even showed promise for allowing the patient to wean from the
medication and offset some of the side effects of the drug.

I was interested in changing some of my diet stuff now, rather than
waiting until I could get on the medicine, if that even turns out to be
what I should do. However, I am not really interested in it for the
weight loss, though that is nice. Is it really feasible to jump to a
later stage in, say, the South Beach diet, or even the maintenance diet,
or would that negate the health benefits? I'll be talking to my doctor
about it, but I was interested in some input from people who actually
live with the diet.

Thank you!

Regards,
Ranee

Ranee, we've done SB for almost two years, with occasional vacations
from the regimen. I think the original idea was to go through the
first stage of the diet because it somehow alters the body's metabolic
"habits" with respect to metabolizing carbs. I'm not sure at all
about this, though. D read the books. I just read through the
acceptable and unacceptable food lists and went from there. If you'd
like, I'm certain D wouldn't mind an email query from you on the
topic.

Yup. I just checked with D and though she doesn't feel that she's
really qualified to answer your question about a jump to the third
phase of SB, she said that she'd be happy to talk to you about it.
I'm modom and she's dodom. We're both at koyote, and koyote's a dot
com.
--
modom

"My baby's got no clothes
'Cause she's makin' chicken soup."

-- Chuck E. Weiss

In article <[email hidden]>,

Ranee Mueller said:

This is mostly directed at diabetics and those who do low-carb diets
because of their health, rather than just wishing to lose weight.

I have a condition that I've had since I was a teenager, and it has
many complicated side effects on my health. Anyway, recently a doctor
told me that it may be related to insulin resistance, though I am not
diabetic, and said that in cases like mine metformin/glucophage has
worked in restoring normalcy to women with my condition. However, it is
contra-indicated for pregnant and nursing women, so it's not a
possibility for quite some time. It also has some side effects that can
be pretty serious, and using a high protein diet in conjunction with
(this was the best option, then it was diet alone, then medicine alone)
the medication was indicated to be the best way to combat the problem,
and even showed promise for allowing the patient to wean from the
medication and offset some of the side effects of the drug.

I was interested in changing some of my diet stuff now, rather than
waiting until I could get on the medicine, if that even turns out to be
what I should do. However, I am not really interested in it for the
weight loss, though that is nice. Is it really feasible to jump to a
later stage in, say, the South Beach diet, or even the maintenance diet,
or would that negate the health benefits? I'll be talking to my doctor
about it, but I was interested in some input from people who actually
live with the diet.

Thank you!

Regards,
Ranee

If you stay between, say, 70 and 100 grams of carbs per day and just get
most of your carbs from green veggies, you should be ok.

I take it you are pregnant? In that case, you don't want to go low
enough on carbs to be in ketosis.

I have to go below 40 grams per day and avoid all starches and sugars to
go into Ketosis.....

I am on Metformin. The side effects are not fun for the first month or
so, but they subside if you can handle it. My doctor had me go to a
higher dose over a 4 week period so it did not make me as sick. 500 mg.
for one week, then 1,000 mg. for one week, then 1,500 mg for one week,
then the final dose of 2,000 mg per day. 1,000 mg. twice per day.

Good luck!

Insulin resistance sucks.......
--
Peace, Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

Ranee Mueller said:

I was interested in changing some of my diet stuff now, rather than
waiting until I could get on the medicine, if that even turns out to be
what I should do. However, I am not really interested in it for the
weight loss, though that is nice. Is it really feasible to jump to a
later stage in, say, the South Beach diet, or even the maintenance diet,
or would that negate the health benefits? I'll be talking to my doctor
about it, but I was interested in some input from people who actually
live with the diet.

I am an insulin resistant type 2; after changing to a low glycemic diet, I
have been medication free for the past 3 years with HbA1C numbers in the
low 5s (quite normal). Though it may not work for everyone, the glycemic
approach works very well for me. It is based upon how quickly a given food
is converted by the body; slower is better. Check the web, your local
library and/or Amazon for books on the glycemic index and glycemic load.

--
To email, replace Cujo with Juno

L, not -L wrote on 02 Mar 2006 in rec.food.cooking

Quoted message said:

Ranee Mueller said:

I was interested in changing some of my diet stuff now, rather
than
waiting until I could get on the medicine, if that even turns out to
be what I should do. However, I am not really interested in it for
the weight loss, though that is nice. Is it really feasible to jump
to a later stage in, say, the South Beach diet, or even the
maintenance diet, or would that negate the health benefits? I'll be
talking to my doctor about it, but I was interested in some input
from people who actually live with the diet.

I am an insulin resistant type 2; after changing to a low glycemic
diet, I have been medication free for the past 3 years with HbA1C
numbers in the low 5s (quite normal). Though it may not work for
everyone, the glycemic approach works very well for me. It is based
upon how quickly a given food is converted by the body; slower is
better. Check the web, your local library and/or Amazon for books on
the glycemic index and glycemic load.

Glycemic index doesn't work for me. To my body a carb is a carb, no benifit
from the harder to digest ones. I've been trying to stay under 25g of carbs
a day for about a yr and a half with some occassional cheating...My Bg is
now normal (HBA1C 4.8- 5.2 mmol) and I don't spike as much. But that's not
just the low carb...I've lost a mess of weight as well. I do well better
without the carbs. I eat a lot of salads with ranch dressing, stir fries,
Brocolli, Cauliflower, zuchinni, mushrooms, bell peppers and green beans
with various protien sources (eggs, meats, cheese and nuts). I am not truly
suffering...but I do miss rice and the easy sandwich type meal. I'm down
from 265 to floating between 195-200, soon I hope that changes for the
better

Pizza is my cheat of choice.

Let your Glucose meter decide for you what you should and shouldn't eat in
the way of carbs. That way you might not have to restrict yourself too
much. The folks at alt.support.diabetes phrase that better than I do. See
http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org for better info.

--
-Alan

Mabry said:

The LAST person to have been trained in anything of this sort is a
Registered Dietician, then comes your physician. they still believe
there is nutritional value in pasta (not as much as in Wonder Bread),
but a wonderful fun/fake food nevertheless.

Damn.. how do the Italians manage to survive?
Yes, I know what their serving size is and how it works into the entire
meal but it is still an important part of the diet.
Is it only Americans who find carbs dangerous?
Goomba

"Ranee Mueller" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

This is mostly directed at diabetics and those who do low-carb diets
because of their health, rather than just wishing to lose weight.

I have a condition that I've had since I was a teenager, and it has
many complicated side effects on my health. Anyway, recently a doctor
told me that it may be related to insulin resistance, though I am not
diabetic, and said that in cases like mine metformin/glucophage has
worked in restoring normalcy to women with my condition. However, it is
contra-indicated for pregnant and nursing women, so it's not a
possibility for quite some time. It also has some side effects that can
be pretty serious, and using a high protein diet in conjunction with
(this was the best option, then it was diet alone, then medicine alone)
the medication was indicated to be the best way to combat the problem,
and even showed promise for allowing the patient to wean from the
medication and offset some of the side effects of the drug.

I was interested in changing some of my diet stuff now, rather than
waiting until I could get on the medicine, if that even turns out to be
what I should do. However, I am not really interested in it for the
weight loss, though that is nice. Is it really feasible to jump to a
later stage in, say, the South Beach diet, or even the maintenance diet,
or would that negate the health benefits? I'll be talking to my doctor
about it, but I was interested in some input from people who actually
live with the diet.

Thank you!

Regards,
Ranee

Ranee,

First, sorry to hear about a chronic health issue...those are a pain in the
neck, yes?
There's no reason you couldn't jump into the maintenance portion of those
diets if you chose, or you could do what I do and use the system of 3's.
Look at your plate. Imagine a line, dividing it in half. Divide one of the
halves in half. You now have 3 sections. The largest section is
veggies/salad. The two small are for a protein and a carb. Of course, some
carbs are better than others, but you don't have to *always* choose the
whole grain over the biscuit. I find the less "rules" there are, the better
I am, and the better I eat. I've been doing this for a while now and feel
better than I have in ages.
I have insulin resistance, type II diabetes, and a separate metabolic
disorder. I take metformin (glucophage) twice a day, along with glyburide
and another medication for the metabolic syndrome. (And Prilosec, but that's
nothing.) The main side effect I've experienced has been occasional stomach
upset and nausea. Every once in a while I get a metallic taste but it
usually doesn't last very long. The worst side effect would be low blood
sugar, hypoglycemia. It can come on quickly, and sometimes the signs aren't
that noticeable when there's other things going on. For the most part
though, it's been a pretty easy regimen, especially compared to insulin
shots.
Hope this helps.

kimberly

"Mabry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:4PNNf.3026$p43.2517@fed1read05...

Quoted message said:

"Ranee Mueller" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have a condition that I've had since I was a teenager, and it

has

Quoted message said:

many complicated side effects on my health. Anyway, recently a

doctor

Quoted message said:

told me that it may be related to insulin resistance, >

[snipped]

Quoted message said:

Thank you!

Regards,
Ranee

THE authority on low carbohydrate diets is the late Robert Atkins,
M.D. His _early_ books are the definitive source of his thousands of
clinical trials. (Perhaps you can still locate them at a source like
Amazon.com.) I shall not make any attempt here to go into the details
of this regimen, as Dr. Atkins has spelled it all out in his books

The LAST person to have been trained in anything of this sort is a
Registered Dietician, then comes your physician. they still believe
there is nutritional value in pasta (not as much as in Wonder Bread),
but a wonderful fun/fake food nevertheless. I am personally
acquainted with several R.D.'s whom I am very fond of, but their
dietary ignorance (from the University programs they were trained
with - financed by the food industry) is jaw-droppingly abysmal.

My personal dietary experience is based upon my hypersensitivity to
any commercially produced foods that trigger a rush of insulin that
put me to sleep for 30 minutes. Maintaining my weight, not reducing
it, has always been my goal.

Only with, and because of ,a lower (read: controlled) carbohydrate
diet was I finally able to keep my head & body balanced. This was an
enormous victory and a protocol that I have followed easily &
successfully for 20 years. ***It is simplicity itself: learn how to
count grams of carbohydrates (charts abound) and keep records
initially on how you feel after a day of 'x' number of grams of
carbohydrate. One hundred grams per day is the usual middle ground,
and you can go up or down from there. Keep tweeking your intake until
you feel/know you are well-balanced.*** There is nothing radical in
this approach and nothing dangerous to you and/or a fetus/nursing
child. The only extremes of a low carbohydrate diet are experienced
by those who wish to lose substantial amounts of weight - not your
goal.

No comment on any medication, as that is not my field. However, since
your physician's first resort was to medication instead of regulating
your carbohydrate intake, that should tell you all you need to know
about his training in all matters dietary. Caveat emptor.

If your condition is insulin-related, there is everything to gain and
nothing to lose by giving this protocol a genuine test.

Best of the best to you,

--
Mabry

No offense to you, but Atkins was a quack.

Ranee Mueller said:

This is mostly directed at diabetics and those who do low-carb diets
because of their health, rather than just wishing to lose weight.

I have a condition that I've had since I was a teenager, and it has
many complicated side effects on my health. Anyway, recently a doctor
told me that it may be related to insulin resistance, though I am not
diabetic, and said that in cases like mine metformin/glucophage has
worked in restoring normalcy to women with my condition. However, it is
contra-indicated for pregnant and nursing women, so it's not a
possibility for quite some time. It also has some side effects that can
be pretty serious, and using a high protein diet in conjunction with
(this was the best option, then it was diet alone, then medicine alone)
the medication was indicated to be the best way to combat the problem,
and even showed promise for allowing the patient to wean from the
medication and offset some of the side effects of the drug.

I was interested in changing some of my diet stuff now, rather than
waiting until I could get on the medicine, if that even turns out to be
what I should do. However, I am not really interested in it for the
weight loss, though that is nice. Is it really feasible to jump to a
later stage in, say, the South Beach diet, or even the maintenance diet,
or would that negate the health benefits? I'll be talking to my doctor
about it, but I was interested in some input from people who actually
live with the diet.

Low carb diets are not "high protein." Your body will tell you how
much protein it wants. Low on protein? That steak will look
beautiful. Running a protein surplus? Even if you love rare strip
steak as much as I do, it just won't seem appealing. There's a good
reason for that. Metabolizing protein for energy instead of
building/rebuilding tissues liberates amines that are toxic. In
humans, those end up excreted mostly as urea in urine. Anyway, protein
is a less than ideal source of calories. In low carb dieting you might
be likely to replace some of the carbs with calories from protein, but
the goal is to replace them with calories from good fats like those in
avocadoes and olives. Monounsaturated fats are good for you.

You can skip to the later stage, but it will likely be harder. The
"induction" regimes jump start the process of going ketogenic. They
get you past the freak out that your body experiences switching over
from burning primarily carbs, to primarily fats. I've had a rough year
(I won't go into it) and have fallen off the low carb wagon. The first
time I did the low carb thing, I went from ~195, down to 160 in six
months.

Stuff like potatoes are like addictive drugs. We may be tempted to put
a bit more butter on that potato than we should, but that isn't the
issue. Your body never screams out to you, "I desperately crave fat,"
unless you are doing some stupid ultra-low-fat diet, which, by the way,
is really stupid. Bodies do, however, insist on the carbs. I broke
the addiction for more than two years. I need to do it again, this
time permanently.

Good luck and be well.

Quoted message said:

Thank you!

Regards,
Ranee

--Bryan

"Mr Libido Incognito" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Glycemic index doesn't work for me. To my body a carb is a carb, no
benifit
from the harder to digest ones. I've been trying to stay under 25g of
carbs
a day for about a yr and a half with some occassional cheating...My Bg is
now normal (HBA1C 4.8- 5.2 mmol) and I don't spike as much. But that's not
just the low carb...I've lost a mess of weight as well. I do well better
without the carbs. I eat a lot of salads with ranch dressing, stir fries,
Brocolli, Cauliflower, zuchinni, mushrooms, bell peppers and green beans
with various protien sources (eggs, meats, cheese and nuts). I am not
truly
suffering...but I do miss rice and the easy sandwich type meal. I'm down
from 265 to floating between 195-200, soon I hope that changes for the
better

Pizza is my cheat of choice.

Let your Glucose meter decide for you what you should and shouldn't eat in
the way of carbs. That way you might not have to restrict yourself too
much. The folks at alt.support.diabetes phrase that better than I do. See
http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org for better info.

--
-Alan

My problem is potatoes. They not only cause an immediate blood sugar rise
but they cause a sustained rise in my blood sugar.

Ms P

"Nexis" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:1UPNf.1989$Uc2.1935@fed1read04...

Quoted message said:

[snipped]

Quoted message said:

No offense to you, but Atkins was a quack.

Come, come now. The hurling of barenaked epithets hardly garners much
respect for the Hurler.

--
Mabry
C=;-{ }

Ranee Mueller said:

This is mostly directed at diabetics and those who do low-carb diets
because of their health, rather than just wishing to lose weight.

[...]

Quoted message said:

However, I am not really interested in it for the
weight loss, though that is nice. Is it really feasible to jump to a
later stage in, say, the South Beach diet, or even the maintenance diet,
or would that negate the health benefits? I'll be talking to my doctor
about it, but I was interested in some input from people who actually
live with the diet.

Check out <alt.support.diet.low-carb>

The FAQ is published every day and it has a zillion links for every
conceivable question you might have, about all aspects of low-carbing.

There are many knowledgeable people there who either know the answers or
can steer you to them.

Pastorio