Re: "New" Cholesterol Tests?

Dr. Andrew B. Chung said:

Steve Harris said:

"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email hidden]> wrote in
message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Steve Harris [email hidden] wrote:

> "Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email hidden]> wrote
> in message news:<[email hidden]>...
>
>> Diseases have arisen from the original sin committed by
>> Adam.
>>
>> From Adam there is now death.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So no diseases in humans before Adam?

No. There *would* have been no disease in either Adam or Eve had
they remained in Eden.

Quoted message said:

That presents a problem inasmuch as we have evidence of diseases
in human remains for hundreds of thousands of years.

There were humans before Adam and Eve. These humans would not have
had God's blessing to be disease-free.

So let's see the logic here, Steve. Before Adam, there were diseases.
After Adam, there were diseases. Don't see any difference.

There are two mutually exclusive stories of the creation in Genesis.
In the first there is a reference to "men and women." In the Adam
story the reference is to "the man."

Bob

In article <[email hidden]>,

Steve Harris said:

"Bob (this one)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

May somebody do something for your hag-ridden belief-addled brain. You
must need some major drugs or delusional thinking and denial to be
able to think well enough to get through medical school, and still
believe all this self-contradicatory [censored] you do. Amazing.

It all started, according to him, with the standard "near-death"
oxygen deprivation that engenders hallucinations.

That would explain a lot. He made it through medical school, a
residency, and a Ph.D. program, and then something fried his brain.

IIRC, lesions of the (left?) parietal lobe can cause hyperreligiosity,
especially the belief that God is acting or speaking through you. I
don't know whether Chung's rapid progression in this syndrome could be
due to an old lesion, or whether it could be evidence that some kind of
damage is continuing. Maybe somebody with more knowledge of neurology
than I have can comment.

At any rate, arguing with him is not going to change things. It only
reinforces his conviction that he is being persecuted for his special
status as infallible spokesman for and agent of God. It also raises his
interlocutors' blood pressure.

I'd be afraid to go to a doctor who manifests Chung's symptoms, in
particular that whatever happens to a patient is God's will, and that
since God is working through him, whatever he thinks or does is ipso
facto incontestibly right. E.g. his 2-pound diet is not just a novel
approach that might be of help to some obese people, it's God's work,
the One and Only True Way for absolutely everyone under all circumstances.

Has his condition progressed to the point where he's a danger to his
patients?

(Btw, before everybody jumps on me, I'm *not* saying that religious
belief means a person has brain damage!)

"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

There were humans before Adam and Eve. These humans would not have had God's blessing to be disease-free.

If there were humans before Adam, what's the point of special creation
of Adam and Eve in genesis? Why is it that when Adam is created god
says that it's not good for him to be alone? He wasn't alone.
According to you, there were plenty of human women to choose from on
the plant. What, you think God hadn't got his rapid transit system
down, and couldn't bring one into Eden?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you believe your bible, Adam can't be much
more than 6000 years ago.

Actually, the Holy Bible does not give dates.

Doesn't matter; it doesn't have to. There's a complete genesis in
there, and in the NT there's even another one from Joseph to Adam.
People have spent half their lives lining it all up. It's basically
4000 years or so from Adam to Jesus, no getting around it.

http://www.achievebalance.com/data/timeline/b.htm

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

But if you give
the bible license to be metaphorical, then you can't trust anything it
says. Because a metaphor, taken literally, is simply a lie.

I would suggest you view the Bible as simply truthful.

Sorry, no can do. A view that it's simple reporting gives the timeline
above. The bible reports that we're all descended from 8 people who
survived the Noachean flood of 2400 BC or so. If that weren't true,
then Eve, created 4000 BC or so, could hardly be the "mother of all
living", which the bible says she is. But we know too much about
Egyptian history to believe everybody on Earth but 8 people drowned in
2400 BC. Also, the tree-ring data hardly supports Noah's flood. So the
bible is not telling the literal truth. Genesis and and so on, is a
Hebrew folktale. The NT is just an updating, in Greek.

SBH

"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

We are discussing diseases in humans.

So no diseases in humans before Adam?

No. There *would* have been no disease in either Adam or Eve had they remained in Eden.

Quoted message said:

That presents a problem
inasmuch as we have evidence of diseases in human remains for hundreds
of thousands of years.

There were humans before Adam and Eve. These humans would not have had God's blessing to be disease-free.

COMMENT:
Earlier in this very thread you wrote:

"Diseases have arisen from the original sin committed by Adam.
From Adam there is now death."

Make up your mind. First you say diseases have arisen from the
original sin committed by Adam, and *from* Adam there is now death.
Then you say there were humans with diseases and death *before* Adam.
Which is it? You tell one wild tale on day, and another a few days
later.

Tell us about these pre-Adamic humans with diseases and death that you
believe in. Did they suffer? Why did god let them suffer or make them
suffer? Did they sin? Could they sin?

What is god up to, torturing innocent humans with diseases and death,
long before Adam? I believe you say you walk with Jesus; what does he
say about this? Sounds nasty.

SBH

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If you believe your bible, Adam can't be much
more than 6000 years ago.

Actually, the Holy Bible does not give dates.

Quoted message said:

And if you don't believe in the literal
interpretation of your bible, then it doesn't matter.

Actually, it has been my choice to take God's Word for the truth.

Quoted message said:

Because it might
not literally mean "death" where it says death.

What specifically are you referring to?

Quoted message said:

If believe in the literal interpretation of Psalms 36, 61, and
especially 91: "He will cover you with his feathers, and under his
wings you will find refuge," then god is a giant bird.

In a word, He is omnipotent.

This is infinitely greater than totipotent.

Quoted message said:

But if you give
the bible license to be metaphorical, then you can't trust anything it
says. Because a metaphor, taken literally, is simply a lie.

I would suggest you view the Bible as simply truthful.

Quoted message said:

SBH

You remain in my prayers, dear Dr. Harris whom I love.

Please consider the following to save yourself:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?I22222129

Servant to the humblest person in the universe,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

**
Who is the humblest person in the universe?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?L26062048

What is all this about?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?R20632B48

Is this spam?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?N69721867

On 1 Sep 2004 19:56:02 -0700, Steve Harris [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

In the tale, somebody actually thinks to ask Jesus if some congenital
problem is due to the sin of the person who got it, or the sin of his
parents, and Jesus says "neither." Which doesn't exactly fit with
standard Christian teaching about the Fall of Adam, but never mind.

Standard Christian teaching? No such thing exists, Steve.

Quoted message said:

Jesus says the purpose of the problem is to fullfil righteousness.
Leaving us to wonder why he does anything about it.

I enjoy the wonder and the mystery, Steve. I am not surprised it upsets
you. You see mystery as unacceptable in a world you feel the need to be
factual to be useful, to be under your control and understanding; I see the
mystery as a great precursor of things eternal, nothing to fear, a
requirement of a God that I will never understand while on Earth.

Your need to know is killing you spiritually.

Quoted message said:

This healing of diseases things cuts either way. If wounds are good
for people, why heal them? If they aren't, why didn't a loving and
all powerful got heal them long ago?

See above.

Quoted message said:

Sorry, Chung, the Jesus of the scriptures is quite the [censored]
artist. In that, at least, he reminds me very much of you.

You spend an inordinate amount of your temporal time and effort on
"[censored]" artists, Steve; I'll add that to the wonders and mysteries
column, Steve, why you would waste your time clock doing so.