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Re: Request for analysis - new program

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01 / Original postRe: Request for analysis - new programTim Jones · 21 Apr 2006 02 / This pagePosts 1–12Page 1 of 1 · chronological order 03 / Latest replyPost #12Jason Earl · 21 Apr 2006

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
21 April 2006
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21 April 2006
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Tim Jones
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  1. Original post
    Tim Jones
    Archived post
    #1

    For this post, I am just going to do what you asked... :-)

    Quoted message said:

    Current: 220+/-5 Lbs. BF=30% (Wild-assed guess)
    Goals: 180 Lbs BF=20%

    Keep in mind that if your goal is to loose 40lbs, your workout routines
    should be much more focused on cardio than on strength. During weight
    loss, the strategy of weight lifting is to preserve as much muscle as
    possible. Typical weight lose, though, generally is a 60% fat and as
    much as 40% muscle. Increaing protein can offset this some.

    Quoted message said:

    Breakfast: Whole oats & coffee with half-and-half

    Where is your protein source for breakfast? Maybe add about 4 to 5
    eggs here, removing some of the egg yokes if you like. Also, keep in
    mind that for breakfast, the number of complex carbs you intake is
    almost insignificant simply due to the fact that you are going to need
    energy for the rest of your day....

    Quoted message said:

    Lunch: romaine lettuce Salad, low-fat dressing and chicken or tuna

    Where is your complex carb?? It will be pretty hard to perform later
    in the day on only salad and low fat dressing for energy....

    Quoted message said:

    Dinner: varies widely, avoiding red meat in favor of fish or chicken

    Avoid red meat if you like, but it is a wonderful source of protein.
    Also, in moderation it will cause no issues.

    Quoted message said:

    Snacks: single-serving fruit cups
    Drinks: 1/4-1/2 cup fruit juice

    Now here is where you need to be careful. During dieting you want to
    stay away from fructose, and lactose as much as you can. Why??

    Fructose is not a sugar, but rather a starch that must be converted in
    the liver to be useful. Unfortunately, though, the liver will always
    replentish its glycogen resources before converting to straight
    glucose. This is not good, because since the liver has the ability to
    dephosphate the glycogen and convert it directly to glucose, it will
    certainly effect your weight loss. In small quantities it is OK, but
    dont eat allot of fructose or you will notice a difference in your
    weight loss.

    Report
  2. JMW
    Archived post
    #2
    Tim Jones said:


    Fructose is not a sugar

    Since when is one of most common monosaccharides not a sugar?

    Report
  3. Tim Jones
    Archived post
    #3

    You are right, and I was wrong.

    Thanks for setting me straight.... :-)

    Report
  4. spodosaurus
    Archived post
    #4
    JMW said:
    Tim Jones said:

    Fructose is not a sugar

    Since when is one of most common monosaccharides not a sugar?

    You also missed this bit of trash talk:

    "This is not good, because since the liver has the ability to
    dephosphate the glycogen and convert it directly to glucose, it will
    certainly effect your weight loss."

    Since when does GLYCOGEN have PHOSPHATE groups??? He's looked at a
    picture in a high school biology book a long time ago and forgot that he
    actually has to read the words. He's getting all confused with the big
    words, and not even remembering the terms correctly. Hint:
    phosphorylation and dephosphorylation occur at several stages in the
    metabolism of glucose and its branching polymer, glycogen. I'm quite
    confident that he only looked at a picture because otherwise he'd know
    where a phosphorylated molecule of fructose fits in during this process

    Regards,

    Ari

    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/

    Report
  5. Tim Jones
    Archived post
    #5

    Once again, you are right. I was wrong. :-(

    Sometimes I step out of bounds of what my knowledge base is. You have
    helped to remind me that I need to add some other items to my nightly
    reading.... Thanks!!

    Report
  6. spodosaurus
    Archived post
    #6
    Tim Jones said:

    Once again, you are right. I was wrong. :-(

    Sometimes I step out of bounds of what my knowledge base is. You have
    helped to remind me that I need to add some other items to my nightly
    reading.... Thanks!!

    You'll find that I tend to get [censored] when people demonstrate ignorance.
    Normally I wouldn't have bothered pointing out your overstepping your
    education, but your comment about diet being unimportant was just
    ignorant beyond words. Without attention to the amount of food (and
    type, given that some foods are much more energy dense than others, if
    you do not read amount as being synonymouse with energy but rather mass)
    being consumed the person trying to lose weight will get slightly
    fitter, and perhaps stronger if training appropriately for that, but fat
    loss will be slow or nonexistant. Indeed, people tend to eat more [censored]
    after starting an exercise program thinking they've earned 'second
    helping credits' by sweating up the weight machines at the gym doing god
    knows how many useless repetitions. Without attention to diet weight
    loss is not going to occur at an appreciable rate, if at all, for most
    people. This is also from experience, with a 30kg decrement once slow
    and small changes were made to food intake. It also confirms anectdotal
    and published research...I believe JMW has a PDF database with some
    articles in it for you?

    Regards,

    Ari

    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/

    Report
  7. JMW
    Archived post
    #7
    spodosaurus spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com said:
    JMW said:
    Tim Jones said:

    Fructose is not a sugar

    Since when is one of most common monosaccharides not a sugar?

    You also missed this bit of trash talk:

    "This is not good, because since the liver has the ability to
    dephosphate the glycogen and convert it directly to glucose, it will
    certainly effect your weight loss."

    Since when does GLYCOGEN have PHOSPHATE groups??? He's looked at a
    picture in a high school biology book a long time ago and forgot that he
    actually has to read the words. He's getting all confused with the big
    words, and not even remembering the terms correctly. Hint:
    phosphorylation and dephosphorylation occur at several stages in the
    metabolism of glucose and its branching polymer, glycogen. I'm quite
    confident that he only looked at a picture because otherwise he'd know
    where a phosphorylated molecule of fructose fits in during this process

    I didn't miss that part. I was just leaving some little jewels for
    others. Actually, I thought it would be Dmitri who grabbed up that
    one.

    Report
  8. Tim Jones
    Archived post
    #8
    Quoted message said:

    Normally I wouldn't have bothered pointing out your overstepping your
    education, but your comment about diet being unimportant was just
    ignorant beyond words

    I think you missunderstood what I was trying to say. It is important
    for the individual to take baby steps. Adding an exercise program in
    addition to drastically changing their diet will only set them up for
    failure. Exercise is the most important part...

    Also, I have not seen one person who exercises daily and dont change
    their diet over time. I have found the most effective strategy is
    focusing on complience. Quality comes with time because the individual
    starts to notice differences in their energy levels depending on what
    they eat...

    Report
  9. spodosaurus
    Archived post
    #9
    Tim Jones said:
    Quoted message said:

    Normally I wouldn't have bothered pointing out your overstepping your
    education, but your comment about diet being unimportant was just
    ignorant beyond words

    I think you missunderstood what I was trying to say.

    Well, what you said was pretty clear:

    "Dont worry about your diet."

    But if the intended message was different, it didn't have much help
    getting to the rest of us :-)

    Quoted message said:

    It is important
    for the individual to take baby steps.

    I most certainly agree. It's about changing eating habits, not about
    'dieting' per se.

    Quoted message said:

    Adding an exercise program in
    addition to drastically changing their diet will only set them up for
    failure. Exercise is the most important part...

    For weight loss, it's MAYBE 60%, if that figure that I just made up
    means that what accounts for the majority of change is the most
    important part. However, the often stated equation of eat less +
    exercise more = weight loss (or sometimes body composition change)
    doesn't often work when you remove the dietary aspect.

    Quoted message said:


    Also, I have not seen one person who exercises daily and dont change
    their diet over time.

    I looked at one in the mirror for a long time, and receive compliments
    from the others at the gym who have been exercising almost daily but
    have no appreciable body composition change.

    Quoted message said:

    I have found the most effective strategy is
    focusing on complience. Quality comes with time because the individual
    starts to notice differences in their energy levels depending on what
    they eat...

    --
    spammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply

    I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
    neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
    hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
    marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
    transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
    http://www.abmdr.org.au/
    http://www.marrow.org/

    Report
  10. Steve Freides
    Archived post
    #10

    "spodosaurus" <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Tim Jones said:
    Quoted message said:

    Normally I wouldn't have bothered pointing out your overstepping your
    education, but your comment about diet being unimportant was just
    ignorant beyond words

    I think you missunderstood what I was trying to say.

    Well, what you said was pretty clear:

    "Dont worry about your diet."

    But if the intended message was different, it didn't have much help
    getting to the rest of us :-)

    Quoted message said:

    It is important
    for the individual to take baby steps.

    I most certainly agree. It's about changing eating habits, not about
    'dieting' per se.

    -snip-

    Some folks focus on exercise, some on diet. Whatever works...

    -S-
    http://www.kbnj.com

    Report
  11. DZ
    Archived post
    #11
    JMW said:
    spodosaurus spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com said:

    "This is not good, because since the liver has the ability to
    dephosphate the glycogen and convert it directly to glucose, it will
    certainly effect your weight loss."

    Since when does GLYCOGEN have PHOSPHATE groups??? He's looked at a
    picture in a high school biology book a long time ago and forgot that he
    actually has to read the words. He's getting all confused with the big
    words, and not even remembering the terms correctly. Hint:
    phosphorylation and dephosphorylation occur at several stages in the
    metabolism of glucose and its branching polymer, glycogen. I'm quite
    confident that he only looked at a picture because otherwise he'd know
    where a phosphorylated molecule of fructose fits in during this process

    I didn't miss that part. I was just leaving some little jewels for
    others. Actually, I thought it would be Dmitri who grabbed up that
    one.

    I don't pick at everything I think is wrong! Last time it was the
    "CrP -> ADP -> ATP" path that I nitpicked on. But that's mostly
    because of the other bit and the paper that I also posted the link to,
    talking about creatinine levels not increasing, which I thought is
    kind of interesting.

    Report
  12. Jason Earl
    Archived post
    #12
    Tim Jones said:
    Quoted message said:

    Normally I wouldn't have bothered pointing out your overstepping your
    education, but your comment about diet being unimportant was just
    ignorant beyond words

    I think you missunderstood what I was trying to say. It is
    important for the individual to take baby steps. Adding an exercise
    program in addition to drastically changing their diet will only set
    them up for failure. Exercise is the most important part...

    Also, I have not seen one person who exercises daily and dont change
    their diet over time. I have found the most effective strategy is
    focusing on complience. Quality comes with time because the
    individual starts to notice differences in their energy levels
    depending on what they eat...

    I totally agree. I think that one of the major reasons that people
    fail to stick with a healthier lifestyle is that they try and change
    too many things at once. The person decides to "get healthy" and
    instead of starting small and working up they try and totally change
    their diet while adding an hour and a half of exercise to their daily
    routine. I know that I personally failed several times to jump start
    a healthier lifestyle because I tried to do too much.

    I don't care how much willpower you have, or what your current
    exercise regime looks like, chances are good that when you first
    started it was with baby steps. For me it started with being
    religious about 30 minutes of cardio three times a week before going
    to work. Since then I have added weight training, improved my diet,
    and I am now starting to look into competing at something.

    Heck, pretty soon I will probably start referring to myself as an
    "athlete."

    Jason

    Report

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