Re: The antidote

vernon said:

"DavidR" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I went to work on my bike yesterday. In the evening I rode out to visit my
mother.
This made 16 miles altogether.

Quoted message said:

Gosh how uneventful.

I think that this is the case for the 'silent majority' of cyclists :-)

I'm so glad that I don't live in any of the 'war zones' that are regularly
reported upon.....

I had to cycle across Norwich with loppers, shears and four heavy bags
of coffee in my panniers. WVM behind revved at the lights and hugged
my back wheel as I ploughed uphill. It wasn't safe for him to overtake
and he didn't, so at the summit I turned in the saddle and showed him
a hand, then a thumb up and got the same back. He realised I was
thanking him although I hadn't acknowledged him the whole climb.

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

Sorry for shouting.

In message <[email hidden]>

spindrift said:

It wasn't safe for him to overtake
and he didn't, so at the summit I turned in the saddle and showed him
a hand, then a thumb up and got the same back.

Good ; I try not to do it sarcastically, and mostly succeed. Well
said!
--
Charles
Brompton P6R-Plus; CarryFreedom -YL, in Motspur Park
LCC; CTC.

spindrift said:

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

Yup, consideration breeds consideration IME, whatever vehicle you're
controlling.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

spindrift said:

I had to cycle across Norwich with loppers, shears and four heavy bags
of coffee in my panniers. WVM behind revved at the lights and hugged
my back wheel as I ploughed uphill. It wasn't safe for him to overtake
and he didn't, so at the summit I turned in the saddle and showed him
a hand, then a thumb up and got the same back. He realised I was
thanking him although I hadn't acknowledged him the whole climb.

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

Speaking as a driver, I have to say I don't expect thanks from cyclists, and
would prefer you kept both hands on the handlebars except when signalling.

vernon said:

"DavidR" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

I went to work on my bike yesterday. In the evening I rode out to visit my
mother.
This made 16 miles altogether.

Quoted message said:

Gosh how uneventful.

I think that this is the case for the 'silent majority' of cyclists :-)

I'm so glad that I don't live in any of the 'war zones' that are regularly
reported upon.....

Agreed. I've had some lovely commutes lately, across the hill tops in
watery sunshine, looking at the mist in the valleys below, then
descending into the mist for the last mile. I feel really lucky with
my commute. Virtually no issues with drivers - although I've had three
school buses come rather close in the past few months, one
particularly badly.

Rob

spindrift said:

I had to cycle across Norwich with loppers, shears and four heavy bags
of coffee in my panniers. WVM behind revved at the lights and hugged
my back wheel as I ploughed uphill. It wasn't safe for him to overtake
and he didn't, so at the summit I turned in the saddle and showed him
a hand, then a thumb up and got the same back. He realised I was
thanking him although I hadn't acknowledged him the whole climb.

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

I'd love to acknowledge/thank drivers who wait for a safe place to
pass on my rural commute but don't really know how to do it. Typical
situation is me doing 15-20 mph on a bend. The good drivers stay
behind me until the straight, then go past fairly quickly. With the
speeds involved and not knowing quite when they are going to come
past, turning to make eye contact isn't really an option and a
handwave seems too ambiguous.

Any other ideas?

Rob

Quoted message said:

spindrift said:

I had to cycle across Norwich with loppers, shears and four heavy bags
of coffee in my panniers. WVM behind revved at the lights and hugged
my back wheel as I ploughed uphill. It wasn't safe for him to overtake
and he didn't, so at the summit I turned in the saddle and showed him
a hand, then a thumb up and got the same back. He realised I was
thanking him although I hadn't acknowledged him the whole climb.

Quoted message said:

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

I'd love to acknowledge/thank drivers who wait for a safe place to
pass on my rural commute but don't really know how to do it. Typical
situation is me doing 15-20 mph on a bend. The good drivers stay
behind me until the straight, then go past fairly quickly. With the
speeds involved and not knowing quite when they are going to come
past, turning to make eye contact isn't really an option and a
handwave seems too ambiguous.

Any other ideas?

Rob

I raise my offside hand off the bars, keeping the heel of my hand on
the bar, usually they see it and it means I'm not made unsteady by
frantically waving like some kind of mentalist. No offence Sir
jeremy.

"spindrift" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

vernon said:

"DavidR" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I went to work on my bike yesterday. In the evening I rode out to visit
my
mother.
This made 16 miles altogether.

Quoted message said:

Gosh how uneventful.

I think that this is the case for the 'silent majority' of cyclists :-)

I'm so glad that I don't live in any of the 'war zones' that are
regularly
reported upon.....

I had to cycle across Norwich with loppers, shears and four heavy bags
of coffee in my panniers. WVM behind revved at the lights and hugged
my back wheel as I ploughed uphill. It wasn't safe for him to overtake
and he didn't, so at the summit I turned in the saddle and showed him
a hand, then a thumb up and got the same back. He realised I was
thanking him although I hadn't acknowledged him the whole climb.

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

Sorry for shouting.

I always try to wave a thanks or say thanks to any road user that shows me
courtesy. It works a treat - carrot much better than stick. Mind you I'll do
the same whether I'm walking, cycling or driving. Courtesy costs nothing.

spindrift said:

Quoted message said:

spindrift said:

I had to cycle across Norwich with loppers, shears and four heavy
bags of coffee in my panniers. WVM behind revved at the lights and
hugged my back wheel as I ploughed uphill. It wasn't safe for him
to overtake and he didn't, so at the summit I turned in the saddle
and showed him a hand, then a thumb up and got the same back. He
realised I was thanking him although I hadn't acknowledged him the
whole climb.

Quoted message said:

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

I'd love to acknowledge/thank drivers who wait for a safe place to
pass on my rural commute but don't really know how to do it. Typical
situation is me doing 15-20 mph on a bend. The good drivers stay
behind me until the straight, then go past fairly quickly. With the
speeds involved and not knowing quite when they are going to come
past, turning to make eye contact isn't really an option and a
handwave seems too ambiguous.

Any other ideas?

Rob

I raise my offside hand off the bars, keeping the heel of my hand on
the bar.

Ditto to that.

([email hidden]) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were
saying :

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

Quoted message said:

I'd love to acknowledge/thank drivers who wait for a safe place to
pass on my rural commute but don't really know how to do it. Typical
situation is me doing 15-20 mph on a bend. The good drivers stay
behind me until the straight, then go past fairly quickly. With the
speeds involved and not knowing quite when they are going to come
past, turning to make eye contact isn't really an option and a
handwave seems too ambiguous.

Just raise your right hand in a "Thanks" as they do pass you - if you want
to keep your hand on the bars, just raise the right fingers.

I find that if it's not clear to pass but somebody's about to anyway,
holding my right hand out in a clear "Don't overtake" usually works - then,
when it is clear, wave 'em past.

John Rowland said:

spindrift said:

I had to cycle across Norwich with loppers, shears and four heavy bags
of coffee in my panniers. WVM behind revved at the lights and hugged
my back wheel as I ploughed uphill. It wasn't safe for him to overtake
and he didn't, so at the summit I turned in the saddle and showed him
a hand, then a thumb up and got the same back. He realised I was
thanking him although I hadn't acknowledged him the whole climb.

Quoted message said:

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

Speaking as a driver, I have to say I don't expect thanks from cyclists, and
would prefer you kept both hands on the handlebars except when signalling.

Most cyclists are drivers old boy. Riding the bike that took me over
the Pyrenees, with thirty years urban cycling experience, on a hill
at 5mph with the van doing the same led me to believe that a gesture
of thanks was unlikely to kill anyone.

John Rowland said:

Speaking as a driver, I have to say I don't expect thanks from cyclists, and
would prefer you kept both hands on the handlebars except when signalling.

Speaking as a regular cyclist, occasional driver, and frequent
pedestrian, I have to say I expect[*] cyclists to be capable of riding
one-handed for short periods of time without becoming so unstable as to
endanger themselves or others.

-dan

[*] "expect" used here in the sense that I consider it a required skill
for the competent cyclist, not that I think it likely or certain that
any random cyclist is so capable.

John Rowland said the following on 11/10/2007 10:13:

Quoted message said:

Speaking as a driver, I have to say I don't expect thanks from cyclists, and
would prefer you kept both hands on the handlebars except when signalling.

Speaking as both a cyclist and a driver, I would expect any road user to
acknowledge a courtesy extended by another road user.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

On Oct 11, 10:13 am, "John Rowland"

Quoted message said:

Speaking as a driver, I have to say I don't expect thanks from cyclists, and
would prefer you kept both hands on the handlebars except when signalling.

The same nonsense is echoed in the Highway Code unfortunately.

--
Dave...

"wafflycat" <w*a*ff£y£cat*@£btco*nn£ect.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I always try to wave a thanks or say thanks to any road user that shows me
courtesy. It works a treat - carrot much better than stick. Mind you I'll
do the same whether I'm walking, cycling or driving. Courtesy costs
nothing.

Exactly. I also try not to impede drivers who want to overtake where it's
safe. The other day I was aware of a heavy diesel engine chugging behind me
as I was cycling. All the other traffic had overtaken, so why wasn't this
one doing so? A quick glance over my shoulder showed that it was a very wide
load which wouldn't have had the acceleration to overtake and get back onto
its own side of the road again in between gaps in the oncoming traffic.

So I raised my hand to acknowlege that I had sized up the situation, then
put on a spurt of power to get me to the next farm gateway as quickly as
possible, where I pulled off the road ofr a couple of seconds. The driver
flashed his hazard lights a couple of times as he overtook me, by way of a
thank-you.

Conversely I've driven behind bikes which won't move over to let traffic
past: they continue to ride two abreast, with the second one almost on the
white line, so unless there's a gap in the oncoming traffic that allows you
to pull completely onto the wrong side, you're stuck for the duration. Had
the bikes moved into single file and moved closer to the verge (where there
were no drain covers or other hazards) I could have overtaken safely,
leaving enough room between me and the bike and between me and the oncoming
traffic.

"Mortimer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Conversely I've driven behind bikes which won't move over to let traffic
past: they continue to ride two abreast, with the second one almost on the
white line, so unless there's a gap in the oncoming traffic that allows
you to pull completely onto the wrong side, you're stuck for the duration.
Had the bikes moved into single file and moved closer to the verge (where
there were no drain covers or other hazards) I could have overtaken
safely, leaving enough room between me and the bike and between me and the
oncoming traffic.

Now I ride on fairly major single-carriageway A-roads quite a lot, and IME a
lot of them aren't wide enough for a car to overtake safely when there's
oncoming motor traffic. There's room enough for it to be done without
hitting things, but that isn't necessarily "safely". Fortunately most people
seem to agree with me.

If the road is narrow enough such that two riders have the rightmost one
almost on the white line, I very much doubt that it's wider than the stuff
I'm riding.

If you could tell us where the road is where you had this problem, I could
check to see if it is indeed wide enough for what you describe.

cheers,
clive

Clive George said:

Now I ride on fairly major single-carriageway A-roads quite a lot, and
IME a lot of them aren't wide enough for a car to overtake safely when
there's oncoming motor traffic. There's room enough for it to be done
without hitting things, but that isn't necessarily "safely". Fortunately
most people seem to agree with me.

One of my colleagues was doing her commute cycle on such a road
recently. An HGV overtook, giving her lots of room. Unfortunately the
driver was making so sure the bike had space he neglected to check the
road in front so well and head-onned a car coming the other way. No
serious injury apparently, but the car driver had to be cut out by the
fire brigade...

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

"Peter Clinch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Clive George said:

Now I ride on fairly major single-carriageway A-roads quite a lot, and
IME a lot of them aren't wide enough for a car to overtake safely when
there's oncoming motor traffic. There's room enough for it to be done
without hitting things, but that isn't necessarily "safely". Fortunately
most people seem to agree with me.

One of my colleagues was doing her commute cycle on such a road
recently. An HGV overtook, giving her lots of room. Unfortunately the
driver was making so sure the bike had space he neglected to check the
road in front so well and head-onned a car coming the other way. No
serious injury apparently, but the car driver had to be cut out by the
fire brigade...

Never had that. However I have seen the cars coming the otherway braking
hard and/or swerving as far left as possible to avoid the person overtaking
me, so I suspect it's only a matter of time (with any luck, that time will
be longer than my lifetime). Mostly when the latter have overestimated the
transparency of the trees/walls/whatever at the side of the road.

I get a lot less of it in the dark though.

cheers,
clive

John Rowland said:

spindrift said:

I had to cycle across Norwich with loppers, shears and four heavy bags
of coffee in my panniers. WVM behind revved at the lights and hugged
my back wheel as I ploughed uphill. It wasn't safe for him to overtake
and he didn't, so at the summit I turned in the saddle and showed him
a hand, then a thumb up and got the same back. He realised I was
thanking him although I hadn't acknowledged him the whole climb.

Pass it on, too many people want to DEHUMANISE cyclists, thanking
considerate drivers HUMANISES us.

Speaking as a driver, I have to say I don't expect thanks from cyclists, and
would prefer you kept both hands on the handlebars except when signalling.

Do you keep both hands on your steering wheel when driving?

I speak only for myself here but I know that I am quite capable of
picking an appropriate moment to use just the one hand. Speaking as a
pedestrian, cyclist, driver and one time scooterist, it's only the
scooter that I never succeeded in using single-handed.

I /always/ thank and acknowledge noticeably considerate drivers. I like
to believe it encourages them to continue driving with consideration.

Similarly, I find that it helps to approach bad drivers
non-confrontationally. More often than not, it results in an apology.

Cheers,
Luke

--
Red Rose Ramblings, the diary of an Essex boy in
exile in Lancashire <http://www.shrimper.org.uk>