Remove 1 cog & use 9spd k7 as 8spd??

(BigBenBiker) said:

Hi All,

Can I remove the largest cog one a 9 speed cassete, and used that as
an speed cassete?

Yes and no. It will work *if* you're using friction shifters (that is,
non-indexing) or you are using *9-speed* shifters. 9-speed cogs are
closer together than 8-speed (see http://www.sheldonbrown.com/
cribsheet-spacing.html ) and therefore won't work with 9-speed
shifters. 9-speed (Shimano) cassettes are the same width as 8-speed
cassettes, so you'd gain nothing by removing the cog.

The only time where this might be a practical idea would be if you are
upgrading a 7-speed bike to 8-speed and you don't want to swap out the
cassette body. See http://www.sheldonbrown.com/k7.html#up7 "8 Of 9 On
7" for details.

Jeff

Works fine the other way - I have two bikes with a 9-speed 11-32 Shimano
cassette installed on a 7-speed cassette body by discarding the smallest 11t
cog. And it wasn't that I was upgrading an old 7-speed bike: I built the
wheels that way deliberately to get rear wheels with less dish on touring
bikes where an 11t cog is pretty much a waste of space.

Nick

"BigBenBiker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hi All,

Can I remove the largest cog one a 9 speed cassete, and used that as
an speed cassete?

On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:56:58 +1100, "Nick Payne" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Works fine the other way - I have two bikes with a 9-speed 11-32 Shimano
cassette installed on a 7-speed cassette body by discarding the smallest 11t
cog. And it wasn't that I was upgrading an old 7-speed bike: I built the
wheels that way deliberately to get rear wheels with less dish on touring
bikes where an 11t cog is pretty much a waste of space.

Let's see if I understand you... From a 9 spd cassete you removed 1
cog - the smallest one, right?

1) How did manage to you close the cassete (since the 11 teeth ne
would be the closing one)?
2) If you removed 1 cog from a 9 spd cassete, you still had 8 cogs -
did that work with your 7 spd indexed gear shifter?

PS - Can you mix cogs from a Shimano cassete, with cogs from a Sram
cassete? I'm always p****d off that I can't find online the
information about the cog sizes in a "MTB cassete" from Shimano,
although I can always find that information about "road cassetes" from
Sh, and both "MTB and road cassetes" from Sram! Bloody big S!

Regards,
jbr

Ride your 2 wheels, but in order to ride them yet another day!
bbb

On Fri, 09 Feb 2007 22:13:23 GMT, [email hidden] (BigBenBiker)

Quoted message said:

Hi All,

Can I remove the largest cog one a 9 speed cassete, and used that as
an speed cassete?

OK, I'm now considering mix and match cogs from two 8 spd cassetes
from Sram.

I already now there noe particular in doing this with Shimano
cassetes, and although I assume it should just abot the same with Sram
cassetes, I though I should better ask before I part with money: anu
problem with doing this with Sram cassetes?

By the way, if anyone knows if, and where I - I'm in Europe, Portugal
- I can find a 28-12 8 spd cassete, let me know, because that's what
'm planning to "build", and apparently nobody makes such cassete
anymore - I believe there as a time Shimano did

Thanks,
jbr

Ride your 2 wheels, but in order to ride them yet another day!
bbb

"BigBenBiker" <[email hidden]> a écrit:

Quoted message said:

OK, I'm now considering mix and match cogs from two 8 spd
cassetes from Sram.

Quoted message said:

I already now there noe particular in doing this with Shimano
cassetes, and although I assume it should just abot the same
with Sram cassetes, I though I should better ask before I part
with money: anu problem with doing this with Sram cassetes?

The cheaper SRAM cassettes, like the cheaper Shimano cassettes, have
separate sprockets, and can be disassembled and mixed in the same way. The
more expensive models use spiders, like the more expensive Shimano
cassettes.

Quoted message said:

By the way, if anyone knows if, and where I - I'm in Europe, Portugal
- I can find a 28-12 8 spd cassete, let me know, because that's what
I'm planning to "build", and apparently nobody makes such cassete
anymore - I believe there was a time Shimano did

The only 12-28 8spd Shimano cassette was XTR-level - light and quite
expensive.

Rose Versand in Germany still list the XTR M900 cassette in 12-28 and 12-32:

http://www.roseversand.de/output/controller.aspx?cid=156&detail=10&detail2=3113

Any Shimano stockist should be able to order you one, but they may not be
able to match the price.

XXCycle list a Miche 8-speed "à la carte" cassette:

http://www.xxcycle.com/php/_all/shop/cassette_a_la_carte_8_vitesses_choice_your_8_speeds.php

IRD make a 12-28 (that differs from the XTR by using a 20t sprocket instead
of a 21t) but I don't know a European stockist:

http://www.interlocracing.com/cassettes_steel.html

James Thomson

BigBenBiker said:

On Fri, 09 Feb 2007 22:13:23 GMT, [email hidden] (BigBenBiker)

Quoted message said:

Hi All,

Can I remove the largest cog one a 9 speed cassete, and used that as
an speed cassete?

OK, I'm now considering mix and match cogs from two 8 spd cassetes
from Sram.

I already now there noe particular in doing this with Shimano
cassetes, and although I assume it should just abot the same with Sram
cassetes, I though I should better ask before I part with money: anu
problem with doing this with Sram cassetes?

By the way, if anyone knows if, and where I - I'm in Europe, Portugal
- I can find a 28-12 8 spd cassete, let me know, because that's what
'm planning to "build", and apparently nobody makes such cassete
anymore - I believe there as a time Shimano did

Shimano here (=NL) still has stock I think: 8-speed KCSM900I8228
CASSETTE, 8-SPEED GOLD FINISH 12-13-14-16-18-21-24-28T @ 70 euro's

a hg 50 12-26 with two loose cogs will be cheaper though, as will a
respaced 7 speed 13-28 with a loose 12 😉

--
---
Marten Gerritsen

INFOapestaartjeM-GINEERINGpuntNL
www.m-gineering.nl

(BigBenBiker) said:

On Fri, 09 Feb 2007 22:13:23 GMT, [email hidden] (BigBenBiker)

Quoted message said:

Hi All,

Quoted message said:

Can I remove the largest cog one a 9 speed cassete, and used that as
an speed cassete?

OK, I'm now considering mix and match cogs from two 8 spd cassetes
from Sram.

I already now there noe particular in doing this with Shimano
cassetes, and although I assume it should just abot the same with Sram
cassetes, I though I should better ask before I part with money: anu
problem with doing this with Sram cassetes?

By the way, if anyone knows if, and where I - I'm in Europe, Portugal
- I can find a 28-12 8 spd cassete, let me know, because that's what
'm planning to "build", and apparently nobody makes such cassete
anymore - I believe there as a time Shimano did

Contact XX Cycle in France:

http://www.xxcycle.com/

They will supply *true* custom cassettes from Miche - any ratios you
want (from the available cogs) in 8, 9 or 10 speed, Shimano or Campy
compatible.

Quoted message said:

Thanks,
jbr

Ride your 2 wheels, but in order to ride them yet another day!
bbb

"BigBenBiker" <[email hidden]> a écrit:

Quoted message said:

Let's see if I understand you... From a 9 spd cassete you
removed 1 cog - the smallest one, right?

Quoted message said:

1) How did manage to you close the cassete (since the 11
teeth one would be the closing one)?

All Shimano 9-speed 12t sprockets will work in the first position, so any
Shimano 9-speed cassette that begins 11-12... can become a 12-up. You do
need to use a lockring designed for 12t .

Quoted message said:

2) If you removed 1 cog from a 9 spd cassete, you still had 8 cogs -
did that work with your 7 spd indexed gear shifter?

No, you use a 9spd shifter to index the remaining 8 sprockets, and set the
derailleur stop to exclude the overshift to the missing ninth.

Quoted message said:

PS - Can you mix cogs from a Shimano cassete, with cogs from
a Sram cassete?

Yes, just keep SRAM spacers paired with SRAM sprockets, and Shimano spacers
paired with Shimano sprockets.

Quoted message said:

I'm always p****d off that I can't find online the information about the
cog sizes in a "MTB cassete" from Shimano, although I can always
find that information about "road cassetes" from Sh, and both "MTB
and road cassetes" from Sram! Bloody big S!

Try here:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/k7.html

and here:

http://www.m-gineering.nl/cassettg.htm

James Thomson

James Thomson said:

Quoted message said:

PS - Can you mix cogs from a Shimano cassete, with cogs from
a Sram cassete?

Yes, just keep SRAM spacers paired with SRAM sprockets, and Shimano spacers
paired with Shimano sprockets.

Ok, thanks for the info.

Quoted message said:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/k7.html

Sheldon and I are on diferent sides of the Atlantic, whic I guess
makes it a pain for both parties to make business - specially on these
scale.

Quoted message said:

http://www.m-gineering.nl/cassettg.htm

I have found here some cassetes I have found nowhere else. Although I
think the particular one I want - a 12-28, 8 spd - is no longer on
production, I've e-mailed them, specially because i didn't find the
store intuitive at all. Let's wait and see.

Thanks!
jbr

Ride your 2 wheels, but in order to ride them yet another day!
bbb

"M-gineering" <[email hidden]> a écrit:

Quoted message said:

a hg 50 12-26 with two loose cogs will be cheaper though, as will a
respaced 7 speed 13-28 with a loose 12 😉

.... or a respaced 7 speed 12-28 with a loose 13.

James Thomson

"BigBenBiker" <[email hidden]> a écrit:

James Thomson said:

Quoted message said:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/k7.html

Quoted message said:

Sheldon and I are on diferent sides of the Atlantic, which I
guess makes it a pain for both parties to make business -
specially on these scale.

You asked for *information* on Shimano sprocket combinations. See my other
post for suggestions on where to buy.

James Thomson

James Thomson said:

The cheaper SRAM cassettes, like the cheaper Shimano cassettes, have
separate sprockets, and can be disassembled and mixed in the same way. The
more expensive models use spiders, like the more expensive Shimano
cassettes.

Good to know, thank you.

Quoted message said:

The only 12-28 8spd Shimano cassette was XTR-level - light and quite
expensive.

I know the price of the XTR cassete, and I'm not willing to pay it.

Quoted message said:

XXCycle list a Miche 8-speed "à la carte" cassette:

http://www.xxcycle.com/php/_all/shop/cassette_a_la_carte_8_vitesses_choice_your_8_speeds.php

Had no idea of what Miche cassetes were about, and sepecially the
possibility of having them assembled "à la carte". Why didn't anyone
think of this before??
Have already contacted XX cycle to inquire about possibility of having
my custom made cassete.

Quoted message said:

IRD make a 12-28 (that differs from the XTR by using a 20t sprocket instead
of a 21t) but I don't know a European stockist:

http://www.interlocracing.com/cassettes_steel.html

I'm hoping to have my Miche with a 21t

Quoted message said:

James Thomson

You're my hero James! Yes your surname really Thomson, or is that a
disguise ordered by M? LOL

Thanks a lot!
jbr

Ride your 2 wheels, but in order to ride them yet another day!
bbb

Ozark Bicycle said:

Contact XX Cycle in France:

http://www.xxcycle.com/

They will supply *true* custom cassettes from Miche - any ratios you
want (from the available cogs) in 8, 9 or 10 speed, Shimano or Campy
compatible.

Just did! Now waiting for their reply.

Thanks a lot!
jbr

Ride your 2 wheels, but in order to ride them yet another day!
bbb

BigBenBiker said:

By the way, if anyone knows if, and where I - I'm in Europe, Portugal
- I can find a 28-12 8 spd cassete, let me know, because that's what
'm planning to "build", and apparently nobody makes such cassete
anymore - I believe there as a time Shimano did

www.anysystem.de (Marchisio)

~PB

Pete Biggs said:

www.anysystem.de (Marchisio)

Marchisio might prove to be a tad expensive, ~80 euros, though
consdering the quality, it might be worth it. Afair they make
sprockets of the toughest steel possible.

--
Adam Kadlubek

Miche is doing it right. I think they sell bulk cogsets to LBS's for
about $1 per cog (some big minimum order like 250 cogs). That way,
the LBS can "build it your way".

- Don Gillies
San Diego, CA

(BigBenBiker) said:

Quoted message said:

http://www.xxcycle.com/php/_all/shop/cassette_a_la_carte_8_vitesses_c...

Had no idea of what Miche cassetes were about, and sepecially the
possibility of having them assembled "à la carte". Why didn't anyone
think of this before??

This was normal 25 years ago. Almost any bike shop had collections of
loose sprockets and a variety of freewheel bodies from which they
could customize any gear combination you wanted. Shimano Uniglide
cassette sprockets were even easier, since they all fit the same
spline pattern.

When Shimano introduced "Hyperglide" in 1990, that changed somewhat.
According to Shimano, the ramps and reliefs in the cogs had to line up
in a particular orientation to ease the chain from one sprocket to
another. This meant that they couldn't allow random combination of
sprockets, eliminating "custom" cassette combinations.

Sheldon assembles his custom cassettes from combinations of loose
sprockets and dissassembled cassettes. I suspect that they have some
slightly inferior shift action occasionally, but that's speculation on
my part. I don't have one of his cassettes or a Miche cassette to
compare to my Shimano/SRAM collection.

Jeff

Pete Biggs said:

www.anysystem.de (Marchisio)

I'm sorry, but I'm not interested in all the explanations of which and
every part should go where to make a cassete: I just want a cassete,
with the number of speeds of my choice, for the hub of my choice, and
with the sprocket sizes of my choice.

Miche, or XXCycles, apparently does that much more straightforward, so
that's were I'm trying to order from.

Regards,
jbr

Ride your 2 wheels, but in order to ride them yet another day!
bbb

On 12 Feb 2007 10:17:44 -0800, [email hidden] (Donald Gillies)

Quoted message said:

Miche is doing it right. I think they sell bulk cogsets to LBS's for
about $1 per cog (some big minimum order like 250 cogs). That way,
the LBS can "build it your way".

Don,

Besides XXcycles, who else is selling Miche "à la carte" cassettes??
(I swear I googled it, but could find nothing; in Miche's own website,
all they have is their representatives in a reduced number of
countries...)

And while they list a representative in the UK, I couldn't any store
there selling Miche cassetes :-()

jbr

Ride your 2 wheels, but in order to ride them yet another day!
bbb