Suspension?

salmon said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension. Not
actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill was
difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

Cheap full suspension is awful and not worth it. (0-500 quid)

Good and also expensive full suspension can be a joy to ride, (500-4000
quid) and depending on the terrain actualy easier to ride up hill. (not
more efficient, just easier)

You've got to ask yourself whether you need full suspension. Do the
trails you ride leave you feeling jarred and bust up everytime? Do you
spend a lot of the time out of the saddle using your knees to absorb
trail shock? Are you prone to flying off steps and drop offs at high
speed?

That's from a mtb view, I've not a clue how some of the urban or bent
full sus bikes perform.

Laters,

Marz

salmon said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension. Not
actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill was
difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

I found rear suspension quite bad for bouncing, even on the flat and
after i'd tightened it as much as possible (it was cheap though).
I don't have any problems with front suspension though, even cheap
stuff. It takes the edge off kerbs and potholes and if there's
anything seriously bumpy like a cycle path then I'll stand on the
pedals off road style so that I don't flatten my rear wheel too much!

peter

naked_draughtsman wrote on 17/01/2007 00:40 +0100:

Quoted message said:

I found rear suspension quite bad for bouncing, even on the flat and
after i'd tightened it as much as possible (it was cheap though).

Fit a good rear suspension shock like a Fifth Element and it won't be
bouncy, but it will probably increase the value of the bike by an order
of magnitude at the same time

--
Tony

"...has many omissions and contains much that is apocryphal, or at least
wildly inaccurate..."
Douglas Adams; The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

salmon said the following on 16/01/2007 23:23:

Quoted message said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension. Not
actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill was
difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

Simon will be along shortly, I'm sure, to offer better advice, but from
what I've read (I just have a hardtail), you need to be spending upwards
of £1500 to get a full sus bike that doesn't bob about, and even then
you need to choose carefully.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

On 01/16/2007 23:23:31 'salmon said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension. Not
actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill was
difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

I would think it depends on how soft the suspnsion is set up, a lot of
people by suspended bikes and then never tune the suspension for their
weight, or have it set on the soft side for off road, then ride on road
without stiffening it up.

--

Buck

Give a little person a little power and create a big problem.

http://www.catrike.co.uk

On 01/17/2007 00:40:33 'naked_draughtsman said:

salmon wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension. Not
actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill was
difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

Quoted message said:

I found rear suspension quite bad for bouncing, even on the flat and after
i'd tightened it as much as possible (it was cheap though). I don't have
any problems with front suspension though, even cheap stuff. It takes the
edge off kerbs and potholes and if there's anything seriously bumpy like a
cycle path then I'll stand on the pedals off road style so that I don't
flatten my rear wheel too much!

Quoted message said:

peter

I always found it was the other way around, I felt that rear suspension was
good on the road but that front made the steering feel unsettled, I guess it
is very much personal preference.

--

Buck

Give a little person a little power and create a big problem.

http://www.catrike.co.uk

salmon said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension. Not
actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill was
difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

Some (more expensive) shocks can be locked out - useful for climbing...

On 01/17/2007 09:34:37 ' cupra said:

salmon wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension. Not
actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill was
difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

Quoted message said:

Some (more expensive) shocks can be locked out - useful for climbing...

I have seen some front suspension that has an extra lever on the handlebars,
I assume that is for impromptu tuning to suit different conditions?
--

Buck

Give a little person a little power and create a big problem.

http://www.catrike.co.uk

salmon said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension.

In what context?

On road or off and suspension design, price range etc. will have a
marked effect on whteher the answer is "don't touch with 20' barge-pole"
or "you want this!".
Road-going suspension (e.g., Moultons) is generally designed to do a
different job to MTB, small, constant deviations rather than
bone-crunching impacts needing long travel, and one doesn't do the other
particularly well AFAICT.

Quoted message said:

actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill was
difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

Better designs will either lock out or not react to pedal bob. My
(recumbent) tourer has well designed full sus specifically engineered
/not/ to bob going up a hill, and indeed it doesn't. It wasn't cheap
though.
You can also affect it by riding style: spin up in a low gear will
bounce suspension much less than mashing a high one in many cases.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Buck said:

On 01/17/2007 09:34:37 ' cupra said:

salmon wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension. Not
actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill
was difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

Quoted message said:

Some (more expensive) shocks can be locked out - useful for
climbing...

I have seen some front suspension that has an extra lever on the
handlebars, I assume that is for impromptu tuning to suit different
conditions?

Yep - you can get this sort of system for front and rears....

Well designed (and set up for your weight) suspension will help keep
the wheels tracking rough ground, giving improved traction and
facilitating progress over very rough terrain. It will also reduce the
ground induced excitation of your body. Top-end MTB's now use
'platform' damping in the suspension, which is designed to minimise the
effect of your pedalling input, but still react to bigger bumps - like
everything else it needs careful setting up to work at its best. Some
recumbents use suspension for comfort, as its difficult to stand on the
pedals over bumps 😉
As others have said, good (useful) suspension isn't cheap, and it will
result in the bike weighing more than one without.

Buck said the following on 17/01/2007 09:41:

Quoted message said:

I have seen some front suspension that has an extra lever on the handlebars,
I assume that is for impromptu tuning to suit different conditions?

Yes - I have that on mine (Rockshox). It allows me to switch from
locked out to a pre-set damper setting - the pre-set position can be
adjusted with a dial on the bar, but not half-way down a rocky slope!

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

On 01/17/2007 10:00:46 'squeaker said:

Well designed (and set up for your weight) suspension will help keep the
wheels tracking rough ground, giving improved traction and facilitating
progress over very rough terrain. It will also reduce the ground induced
excitation of your body. Top-end MTB's now use 'platform' damping in the
suspension, which is designed to minimise the effect of your pedalling
input, but still react to bigger bumps - like everything else it needs
careful setting up to work at its best. Some recumbents use suspension
for comfort, as its difficult to stand on the pedals over bumps 😉 As
others have said, good (useful) suspension isn't cheap, and it will result
in the bike weighing more than one without.

I'm sure someone will disagree, but in my experience you can get away with
cheaper rear shocks on recumbents, in fact many 'bents with rear suspension use a pretty crappy shock, however it is generaly more "loaded" when in use
than an upright due to positioning of the riders body in relation to the suspension pivot. And it is not subject to the extremes of differing
loads due to the rider repositioning themselves, i.e. standing up.
--

Buck

Give a little person a little power and create a big problem.

http://www.catrike.co.uk

On 01/17/2007 10:14:09 Paul Boyd usenet.dont.work@plusnet said:

Buck said the following on 17/01/2007 09:41:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I have seen some front suspension that has an extra lever on the
handlebars, I assume that is for impromptu tuning to suit different
conditions?

Quoted message said:

Yes - I have that on mine (Rockshox). It allows me to switch from locked
out to a pre-set damper setting - the pre-set position can be adjusted
with a dial on the bar, but not half-way down a rocky slope!

Sounds like a good solution for a bike used off and on road.

--

Buck

Give a little person a little power and create a big problem.

http://www.catrike.co.uk

Buck said:

I'm sure someone will disagree, but in my experience you can get away
with cheaper rear shocks on recumbents, in fact many 'bents with rear
suspension use a pretty crappy shock, however it is generaly more
"loaded" when in use than an upright due to positioning of the riders
body in relation to the suspension pivot. And it is not subject to
the extremes of differing loads due to the rider repositioning
themselves, i.e. standing up.

I'm not sure, but I imagine the way you're pushing at right angles (or
thereabouts) to the direction of potential bounce is only going to help,
though having said that different setups will certainly bob more than
others. A Rainbow Lyner we tried out had small but perceptible bob on
every pedal stroke on a good, flat road, while my Streetmachine and
Roos' Fiero Tour don't (it's quite instructive regarding efficiency
seeing the back wheel move up and down over small road features while
the rack stays level).

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Buck said the following on 17/01/2007 10:19:

Quoted message said:

Sounds like a good solution for a bike used off and on road.

Exactly! I have to use it on-road to get to the off-road.

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/

salmon said:

Just like to gauge your opinions on front and rear suspension. Not
actually tried one but one person I asked said that cycling uphill was
difficult because it was like riding a bucking bronco. I hadn't
considered that and could see it could be awkward.

like others have said it depends, i have front on both a MTB and a
commutor bike on the commutor all it means it takes the edge off pot
holes and such.

the MTB being much more pricey and made for much bigger lumps and bumps
soaks up all, though you do get float which is hardly suprising, even
with a hard tail going hard up a steep hill you can get bobing around.

as others have said you can lock out suspention.

off road on a mid rangeish bike front is very nice system.

on road not sure it adds anything but weight.

either way i'd say if wnat to buy a bike make sure you have a ride to
see what it's like.

roger

Roger Merriman said:

on road not sure it adds anything but weight.

Depends if it's made (and competently made) for the road or not. I
think you'd have a very hard time convincing thousands of Moulton owners
(not to mention the good Dr. Moulton himself) that suspension on the
road is useless.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Roger Merriman said the following on 17/01/2007 11:38:

Quoted message said:

even
with a hard tail going hard up a steep hill you can get bobing around.

Not at the back you don't :-) That is really the main reason I have the
remote lockout for my fork though. When climbing hills I don't want my
fork bobbing up and down!

--
Paul Boyd
http://www.paul-boyd.co.uk/