Taking psyllium fiber every day harmful?

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful? I take my multi-vitamins
in the morning or afternoon.

Don't take the multivitamin with the psyllium.

It will do you no good. :-)

Other than that, taking psyllium fiber daily IMHO is not harmful.

Take the vitamins with meals, take the fiber supplement right before you
go to bed, at least 2 hours after your last meal.
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

It will do you no good. :-)

Other than that, taking psyllium fiber daily IMHO is not harmful.

Take the vitamins with meals, take the fiber supplement right before you
go to bed, at least 2 hours after your last meal.

Good advise , but is it not habit forming . One should stop
when bowels get regulated . IMHO Please .

Kam

--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

In article
<[email hidden]>,

Kamalakar Pasupuleti said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

It will do you no good. :-)

Other than that, taking psyllium fiber daily IMHO is not harmful.

Take the vitamins with meals, take the fiber supplement right before you
go to bed, at least 2 hours after your last meal.

Good advise , but is it not habit forming . One should stop
when bowels get regulated . IMHO Please .

Kam

True...

But Bowel regulation only comes with proper diet.
If he does not eat enough fiber in the diet, Psyllium is a good way to
handle it.

Less habit forming and safer since it's a plant fiber rather than using
routine chemical laxatives which I understand can be dangerous and VERY
habit forming.

A diet high in fresh high fiber vegatables and fresh meats is far
better, but it's difficult to keep to a good diet with reasonable volume
when one is trying to reduce body weight.

Decreased dietary volume can contribute to constipation.

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]

Quoted message said:

But Bowel regulation only comes with proper diet.
If he does not eat enough fiber in the diet, Psyllium is a good way to
handle it.

I agree

Quoted message said:

A diet high in fresh high fiber vegatables and fresh meats is far

Meats are lacking in fiber and so need to add vegetables
and especially greens .

Quoted message said:

Decreased dietary volume can contribute to constipation.
Cheers

Kam

--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

Quoted message said:

10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?

I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
regularity and to trap toxins.

Quoted message said:

I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.

Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

Quoted message said:

10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?

I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
regularity and to trap toxins.

Quoted message said:

I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.

Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.

Not entirely accurate...
One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the intestines
moving faster. It increases water retention also in the gut. That can be
detrimental to maximum absorption of suppelemental tablets. They need
time to dissolve and be absorbed.

That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at least
2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
supplements he is going to take. I take most of my vitamins right after
lunch personally.
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

Quoted message said:

10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?

I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
regularity and to trap toxins.

Quoted message said:

I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.

Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.

Not entirely accurate...
One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the intestines
moving faster.

Soluble fiber is not a laxative. It simply increases the volume the
fecal matter which, in turn, makes it easy on the intestines to move
the stuff forward. Fecal matter without volume is a sure fire way of
getting diverticulosis.

Quoted message said:

It increases water retention also in the gut. That can be
detrimental to maximum absorption of suppelemental tablets. They need
time to dissolve and be absorbed.

Water-soluble vitamins are absorbed quite efficiently by the bowels.

Quoted message said:

That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at least
2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
supplements he is going to take.

I see more health benefits in taking soluble fiber right before the
meals.

Quoted message said:

I take most of my vitamins right after lunch personally.

Same here.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

On 18 Aug 2005 00:57:40 -0700, [email hidden] wrote:
>
>10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
>husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?
>

I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
regularity and to trap toxins.

>
>I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.
>

Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.

Not entirely accurate...
One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the intestines
moving faster.

Soluble fiber is not a laxative. It simply increases the volume the
fecal matter which, in turn, makes it easy on the intestines to move
the stuff forward. Fecal matter without volume is a sure fire way of
getting diverticulosis.

Agreed, but it still speeds transit time.
And increases stool volume/colon fluid retention.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It increases water retention also in the gut. That can be
detrimental to maximum absorption of suppelemental tablets. They need
time to dissolve and be absorbed.

Water-soluble vitamins are absorbed quite efficiently by the bowels.

If allowed proper time to do so.

Have you ever done a colon cleansing using large amounts of psyllium
husk? It forms a gelatinous mass. That would generally keep any
pills/powders grabbed up in such a matrix from coming into contact with
the bowel walls so it COULD be absorbed.

I'm talking about maximum absorption allowance. :-)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at least
2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
supplements he is going to take.

I see more health benefits in taking soluble fiber right before the
meals.

How so?
Less calorie absorption is all I can think of.
I s'pose it would aid in weight loss but you may also end up with
deficiencies. See above.

I HAVE done fiber colon cleansings so I know from personal experience
what psyllium fiber does!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I take most of my vitamins right after lunch personally.

Same here.

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:

> On 18 Aug 2005 00:57:40 -0700, [email hidden] wrote:
> >
> >10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
> >husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?
> >
>
> I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
> regularity and to trap toxins.
>
> >
> >I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.
> >
>
> Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
> Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
> fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.

Not entirely accurate...
One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the intestines
moving faster.

Soluble fiber is not a laxative. It simply increases the volume the
fecal matter which, in turn, makes it easy on the intestines to move
the stuff forward. Fecal matter without volume is a sure fire way of
getting diverticulosis.

Agreed, but it still speeds transit time.
And increases stool volume/colon fluid retention.

The bowels expect bulky foods to work properly. If one only eats meat
or refined carbs, the bowels aren't going to be able to work properly
and fecal metal stays around longer. From this point of view, bulky
foods don't speed up transit, they simply bring transit time to what
is normal.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It increases water retention also in the gut. That can be
detrimental to maximum absorption of suppelemental tablets. They need
time to dissolve and be absorbed.

Water-soluble vitamins are absorbed quite efficiently by the bowels.

If allowed proper time to do so.

Unless one has diarrhea, I honestly don't see any problem. And, if you
have diarrhea, you have bigger problems to worry about.

Quoted message said:

Have you ever done a colon cleansing using large amounts of psyllium
husk?

Yes, I did the Arise & Shine cleanse once.

Quoted message said:

It forms a gelatinous mass. That would generally keep any
pills/powders grabbed up in such a matrix from coming into contact with
the bowel walls so it COULD be absorbed.

If the pills/powders are water soluble, they find a way. If they are
not water soluble, they'll get trapped.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at least
2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
supplements he is going to take.

I see more health benefits in taking soluble fiber right before the
meals.

How so? Less calorie absorption is all I can think of.

Several reasons: it reduces the glycemic index/load of whatever you
eat; it traps toxins, fat and even cholesterol released into the
bowels; it helps one feel fuller for longer periods of time.

Quoted message said:

I HAVE done fiber colon cleansings so I know from personal experience
what psyllium fiber does!

Well, I've done the cleanse and I take, as I said, 20g/day of psyllium
fiber. As such, I also feel qualified to speak from personal
experience! ;-)

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:23:00 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
<[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>In article <[email hidden]>,
> Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>> On 18 Aug 2005 00:57:40 -0700, [email hidden] wrote:
>> >
>> >10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
>> >husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?
>> >
>>
>> I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
>> regularity and to trap toxins.
>>
>> >
>> >I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.
>> >
>>
>> Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
>> Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
>> fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.
>
>Not entirely accurate...
>One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the intestines
>moving faster.
>

Soluble fiber is not a laxative. It simply increases the volume the
fecal matter which, in turn, makes it easy on the intestines to move
the stuff forward. Fecal matter without volume is a sure fire way of
getting diverticulosis.

Agreed, but it still speeds transit time.
And increases stool volume/colon fluid retention.

The bowels expect bulky foods to work properly. If one only eats meat
or refined carbs, the bowels aren't going to be able to work properly
and fecal metal stays around longer. From this point of view, bulky
foods don't speed up transit, they simply bring transit time to what
is normal.

y'know, that's actually a good point. ;-)
Optimal bowel evacuation is 2 to 3 times per day.
How many people can claim that?

Transit time IMHO should _not_ be 72 hours.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>It increases water retention also in the gut. That can be
>detrimental to maximum absorption of suppelemental tablets. They need
>time to dissolve and be absorbed.
>

Water-soluble vitamins are absorbed quite efficiently by the bowels.

If allowed proper time to do so.

Unless one has diarrhea, I honestly don't see any problem. And, if you
have diarrhea, you have bigger problems to worry about.

Again, agreed...

My main concern with psyllium specifically is the matrix it tends to
form. Of course that can depend on how much you take. I worry about
vitamin supplements getting "trapped" in the gel and wasted. Supplements
are too expensive to take the risk.

I've not needed to take psyllium for a very long time but when I did,
that was the reason I always took it at night.

Plus, taking it at that time guarantees a good morning BM. ;-)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Have you ever done a colon cleansing using large amounts of psyllium
husk?

Yes, I did the Arise & Shine cleanse once.

I don't remember the name of the program I used, but it involved 3 days
of only psyllium husk shakes combined with chlorophyll and bentonite.
Chased 1 hour after drinking it (3 times per day) with 2 senna tablets.

You don't eat any food for those three days.

Doing one of those can be enlightening, but I won't elaborate. <G>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It forms a gelatinous mass. That would generally keep any
pills/powders grabbed up in such a matrix from coming into contact with
the bowel walls so it COULD be absorbed.

If the pills/powders are water soluble, they find a way. If they are
not water soluble, they'll get trapped.

So do you take your fat soluble vitamins at a separate time?
E, A, and D I believe are the primary ones. Plus EFA or fish oil supps
if you use those.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at least
>2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
>supplements he is going to take.
>

I see more health benefits in taking soluble fiber right before the
meals.

How so? Less calorie absorption is all I can think of.

Several reasons: it reduces the glycemic index/load of whatever you
eat; it traps toxins, fat and even cholesterol released into the
bowels; it helps one feel fuller for longer periods of time.

Good points.....
Personally, I like a good load of greens instead.
Brocolli, cauliflower, baby spinach, swiss chard, bok choy, bean
sprouts, celery, that sort of thing.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I HAVE done fiber colon cleansings so I know from personal experience
what psyllium fiber does!

Well, I've done the cleanse and I take, as I said, 20g/day of psyllium
fiber. As such, I also feel qualified to speak from personal
experience! ;-)

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:

> On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:23:00 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
> <[email hidden]> wrote:
> >
> >In article <[email hidden]>,
> > Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
> >
> >> On 18 Aug 2005 00:57:40 -0700, [email hidden] wrote:
> >> >
> >> >10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
> >> >husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?
> >> >
> >>
> >> I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
> >> regularity and to trap toxins.
> >>
> >> >
> >> >I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.
> >> >
> >>
> >> Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
> >> Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
> >> fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.
> >
> >Not entirely accurate...
> >One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the intestines
> >moving faster.
> >
>
> Soluble fiber is not a laxative. It simply increases the volume the
> fecal matter which, in turn, makes it easy on the intestines to move
> the stuff forward. Fecal matter without volume is a sure fire way of
> getting diverticulosis.

Agreed, but it still speeds transit time.
And increases stool volume/colon fluid retention.

The bowels expect bulky foods to work properly. If one only eats meat
or refined carbs, the bowels aren't going to be able to work properly
and fecal metal stays around longer. From this point of view, bulky
foods don't speed up transit, they simply bring transit time to what
is normal.

y'know, that's actually a good point. ;-)
Optimal bowel evacuation is 2 to 3 times per day.
How many people can claim that?

Well, I can't. I go once a day and that is it. With more insoluble
fiber, I think one could increase the frequency.

Quoted message said:

Transit time IMHO should _not_ be 72 hours.

Of course not! Did I insinuate that anywhere?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
> >
> >It increases water retention also in the gut. That can be
> >detrimental to maximum absorption of suppelemental tablets. They need
> >time to dissolve and be absorbed.
> >
>
> Water-soluble vitamins are absorbed quite efficiently by the bowels.

If allowed proper time to do so.

Unless one has diarrhea, I honestly don't see any problem. And, if you
have diarrhea, you have bigger problems to worry about.

My main concern with psyllium specifically is the matrix it tends to
form. Of course that can depend on how much you take. I worry about
vitamin supplements getting "trapped" in the gel and wasted. Supplements
are too expensive to take the risk.

From my reading on the subject, fiber is only a problem for
fat-soluble supplements. I know that I'm getting my money's worth when
urine stays fluorescent yellow for several hours! ;-)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Have you ever done a colon cleansing using large amounts of psyllium
husk?

Yes, I did the Arise & Shine cleanse once.

I don't remember the name of the program I used, but it involved 3 days
of only psyllium husk shakes combined with chlorophyll and bentonite.
Chased 1 hour after drinking it (3 times per day) with 2 senna tablets.

That was nothing man! The Arise & Shine Cleanse is a full 1 *MONTH*,
eheheh. Check it out here:
http://www.ariseandshine.com/

It appears they now have a 7-day cleanse for sissies! ;-)

Quoted message said:

Doing one of those can be enlightening, but I won't elaborate. <G>

Oh, I'm pretty sure I know what you are talking about!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It forms a gelatinous mass. That would generally keep any
pills/powders grabbed up in such a matrix from coming into contact with
the bowel walls so it COULD be absorbed.

If the pills/powders are water soluble, they find a way. If they are
not water soluble, they'll get trapped.

So do you take your fat soluble vitamins at a separate time?
E, A, and D I believe are the primary ones. Plus EFA or fish oil supps
if you use those.

No, I don't, for the following reason: Fat-soluble supplements require
ingestion of fat. But with ingestion of fat, I want to take soluble
fiber. Conclusion: it is quite possible I'm wasting some of those
vitamins but given that I megadose on all of them, I don't see that as
a big issue.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
> >
> >That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at least
> >2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
> >supplements he is going to take.
> >
>
> I see more health benefits in taking soluble fiber right before the
> meals.

How so? Less calorie absorption is all I can think of.

Several reasons: it reduces the glycemic index/load of whatever you
eat; it traps toxins, fat and even cholesterol released into the
bowels; it helps one feel fuller for longer periods of time.

Good points.....
Personally, I like a good load of greens instead.
Brocolli, cauliflower, baby spinach, swiss chard, bok choy, bean
sprouts, celery, that sort of thing.

That is the ideal situation. Thing is, with very few exceptions, I
simply can't tolerate vegetables. An enema doesn't cause me as much
displeasure. That's why I have a heard time accepting the notion that
humans are naturally vegans. How can I be naturally a vegan if I feel
so much displeasure eating vegetables?

By the way, all the soluble fiber on those veget5ables is going to
have the exact some effect on the fat-soluble supplements...

"Just Cocky" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:23:00 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
<[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>In article <[email hidden]>,
> Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>> On 18 Aug 2005 00:57:40 -0700, [email hidden] wrote:
>> >
>> >10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
>> >husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?
>> >
>>
>> I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
>> regularity and to trap toxins.
>>
>> >
>> >I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.
>> >
>>
>> Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
>> Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
>> fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.
>
>Not entirely accurate...
>One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the
>intestines
>moving faster.
>

Soluble fiber is not a laxative. It simply increases the volume the
fecal matter which, in turn, makes it easy on the intestines to move
the stuff forward. Fecal matter without volume is a sure fire way of
getting diverticulosis.

Agreed, but it still speeds transit time.
And increases stool volume/colon fluid retention.

The bowels expect bulky foods to work properly. If one only eats meat
or refined carbs, the bowels aren't going to be able to work properly
and fecal metal stays around longer. From this point of view, bulky
foods don't speed up transit, they simply bring transit time to what
is normal.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>It increases water retention also in the gut. That can be
>detrimental to maximum absorption of suppelemental tablets. They need
>time to dissolve and be absorbed.
>

Water-soluble vitamins are absorbed quite efficiently by the bowels.

If allowed proper time to do so.

Unless one has diarrhea, I honestly don't see any problem. And, if you
have diarrhea, you have bigger problems to worry about.

Quoted message said:

Have you ever done a colon cleansing using large amounts of psyllium
husk?

Yes, I did the Arise & Shine cleanse once.

Quoted message said:

It forms a gelatinous mass. That would generally keep any
pills/powders grabbed up in such a matrix from coming into contact with
the bowel walls so it COULD be absorbed.

If the pills/powders are water soluble, they find a way. If they are
not water soluble, they'll get trapped.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at
>least
>2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
>supplements he is going to take.
>

I see more health benefits in taking soluble fiber right before the
meals.

How so? Less calorie absorption is all I can think of.

Several reasons: it reduces the glycemic index/load of whatever you
eat; it traps toxins, fat and even cholesterol released into the
bowels; it helps one feel fuller for longer periods of time.

Quoted message said:

I HAVE done fiber colon cleansings so I know from personal experience
what psyllium fiber does!

Well, I've done the cleanse and I take, as I said, 20g/day of psyllium
fiber. As such, I also feel qualified to speak from personal
experience! ;-)

You're the man on [censored], Cocky. : o )

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:43:44 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
<[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>In article <[email hidden]>,
> Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:23:00 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
>> <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> >
>> >In article <[email hidden]>,
>> > Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 18 Aug 2005 00:57:40 -0700, [email hidden] wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
>> >> >husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
>> >> regularity and to trap toxins.
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
>> >> Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
>> >> fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.
>> >
>> >Not entirely accurate...
>> >One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the
>> >intestines
>> >moving faster.
>> >
>>
>> Soluble fiber is not a laxative. It simply increases the volume the
>> fecal matter which, in turn, makes it easy on the intestines to move
>> the stuff forward. Fecal matter without volume is a sure fire way of
>> getting diverticulosis.
>
>Agreed, but it still speeds transit time.
>And increases stool volume/colon fluid retention.
>

The bowels expect bulky foods to work properly. If one only eats meat
or refined carbs, the bowels aren't going to be able to work properly
and fecal metal stays around longer. From this point of view, bulky
foods don't speed up transit, they simply bring transit time to what
is normal.

y'know, that's actually a good point. ;-)
Optimal bowel evacuation is 2 to 3 times per day.
How many people can claim that?

Well, I can't. I go once a day and that is it. With more insoluble
fiber, I think one could increase the frequency.

Well, I have chronic hypomagnesemia (my endocrinologist says it's a
congenital renal tubule defect) so have to supplement quite a bit of
magnesium. 3 to 5 per day is about par for me.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Transit time IMHO should _not_ be 72 hours.

Of course not! Did I insinuate that anywhere?

Sorry... did not mean to intimate that you did. :-)
I work in health care and abstinance time for most special stool testing
is 72 hours to make sure the bowels are clear of specific subtances,
hence that number......72 hours seems to be normal for the general
(crappy diet) population.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>
>> >
>> >It increases water retention also in the gut. That can be
>> >detrimental to maximum absorption of suppelemental tablets. They need
>> >time to dissolve and be absorbed.
>> >
>>
>> Water-soluble vitamins are absorbed quite efficiently by the bowels.
>
>If allowed proper time to do so.
>

Unless one has diarrhea, I honestly don't see any problem. And, if you
have diarrhea, you have bigger problems to worry about.

My main concern with psyllium specifically is the matrix it tends to
form. Of course that can depend on how much you take. I worry about
vitamin supplements getting "trapped" in the gel and wasted. Supplements
are too expensive to take the risk.

From my reading on the subject, fiber is only a problem for
fat-soluble supplements. I know that I'm getting my money's worth when
urine stays fluorescent yellow for several hours! ;-)

<smiles> Too true!
I use Solgar brand multi (VM-75) as it's high in B-complex. Since
B-vitamins are vital for optimal cellular function AND they are water
soluble, they really do need to be supplemented daily if you can't get
enough in your diet.

Usually keeps bright yellow for a good 12 hours.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>Have you ever done a colon cleansing using large amounts of psyllium
>husk?
>

Yes, I did the Arise & Shine cleanse once.

I don't remember the name of the program I used, but it involved 3 days
of only psyllium husk shakes combined with chlorophyll and bentonite.
Chased 1 hour after drinking it (3 times per day) with 2 senna tablets.

That was nothing man! The Arise & Shine Cleanse is a full 1 *MONTH*,
eheheh. Check it out here:
http://www.ariseandshine.com/

It appears they now have a 7-day cleanse for sissies! ;-)

But... the cleanse program I used excluded food. It was the fiber shakes
only. 'course you were not hungry at all. <lol>

I'll check that site out just for grins. :-)

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Doing one of those can be enlightening, but I won't elaborate. <G>

Oh, I'm pretty sure I know what you are talking about!

<snicker>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>It forms a gelatinous mass. That would generally keep any
>pills/powders grabbed up in such a matrix from coming into contact with
>the bowel walls so it COULD be absorbed.
>

If the pills/powders are water soluble, they find a way. If they are
not water soluble, they'll get trapped.

So do you take your fat soluble vitamins at a separate time?
E, A, and D I believe are the primary ones. Plus EFA or fish oil supps
if you use those.

No, I don't, for the following reason: Fat-soluble supplements require
ingestion of fat. But with ingestion of fat, I want to take soluble
fiber. Conclusion: it is quite possible I'm wasting some of those
vitamins but given that I megadose on all of them, I don't see that as
a big issue.

Ah. Megadose and some is bound to get thru. ;-)
Do be careful tho' with vitamin A! Too much can really cause some liver
problems in the long term if it builds up to toxic levels.

But I'm sure you know that.

One of the first symptoms of hypervitaminosis A is cheloid scarring.

One can just take Beta Carotene instead of A if they are worried about
that.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>>
>> >
>> >That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at
>> >least
>> >2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
>> >supplements he is going to take.
>> >
>>
>> I see more health benefits in taking soluble fiber right before the
>> meals.
>
>How so? Less calorie absorption is all I can think of.
>

Several reasons: it reduces the glycemic index/load of whatever you
eat; it traps toxins, fat and even cholesterol released into the
bowels; it helps one feel fuller for longer periods of time.

Good points.....
Personally, I like a good load of greens instead.
Brocolli, cauliflower, baby spinach, swiss chard, bok choy, bean
sprouts, celery, that sort of thing.

That is the ideal situation. Thing is, with very few exceptions, I
simply can't tolerate vegetables. An enema doesn't cause me as much
displeasure. That's why I have a heard time accepting the notion that
humans are naturally vegans. How can I be naturally a vegan if I feel
so much displeasure eating vegetables?

IBS can be caused by a sensitivity to too much Cellulose.
Try mushrooms. Their cell walls are chitin instead of cellulose so you
may tolerate that better.

I can't handle RAW veggies at all. Makes me deathly ill, and I have to
watch the volume if the higher fiber stuff such as brocolli.

Quoted message said:

By the way, all the soluble fiber on those veget5ables is going to
have the exact some effect on the fat-soluble supplements...

Most veggies are not soluble fiber..... :-)
That's generally reserved to specific grains. Psyllium and oat bran are
two that I know for sure, there are probably others.

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:

> On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:43:44 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
> <[email hidden]> wrote:
> >
> >In article <[email hidden]>,
> > Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
> >
> >> On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:23:00 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
> >> <[email hidden]> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >In article <[email hidden]>,
> >> > Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> On 18 Aug 2005 00:57:40 -0700, [email hidden] wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder (ispaghula
> >> >> >husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to create
> >> >> regularity and to trap toxins.
> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> >I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
> >> >> Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
> >> >> fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.
> >> >
> >> >Not entirely accurate...
> >> >One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the
> >> >intestines
> >> >moving faster.
> >> >
> >>
> >> Soluble fiber is not a laxative. It simply increases the volume the
> >> fecal matter which, in turn, makes it easy on the intestines to move
> >> the stuff forward. Fecal matter without volume is a sure fire way of
> >> getting diverticulosis.
> >
> >Agreed, but it still speeds transit time.
> >And increases stool volume/colon fluid retention.
> >
>
> The bowels expect bulky foods to work properly. If one only eats meat
> or refined carbs, the bowels aren't going to be able to work properly
> and fecal metal stays around longer. From this point of view, bulky
> foods don't speed up transit, they simply bring transit time to what
> is normal.

y'know, that's actually a good point. ;-)
Optimal bowel evacuation is 2 to 3 times per day.
How many people can claim that?

Well, I can't. I go once a day and that is it. With more insoluble
fiber, I think one could increase the frequency.

Well, I have chronic hypomagnesemia (my endocrinologist says it's a
congenital renal tubule defect) so have to supplement quite a bit of
magnesium. 3 to 5 per day is about par for me.

Wow! Are you taking magnesium oxide? I've read somewhere that
magnesium citrate is easier on the bowels. Do you take calcium
together with the magnesium?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
> >
> >Have you ever done a colon cleansing using large amounts of psyllium
> >husk?
> >
>
> Yes, I did the Arise & Shine cleanse once.

I don't remember the name of the program I used, but it involved 3 days
of only psyllium husk shakes combined with chlorophyll and bentonite.
Chased 1 hour after drinking it (3 times per day) with 2 senna tablets.

That was nothing man! The Arise & Shine Cleanse is a full 1 *MONTH*,
eheheh. Check it out here:
http://www.ariseandshine.com/

It appears they now have a 7-day cleanse for sissies! ;-)

But... the cleanse program I used excluded food. It was the fiber shakes
only. 'course you were not hungry at all. <lol>

Actually, the author of the program has it's own website. The guy
appears to be somewhat of a nutcase but his cleanse program worked
well for me: http://www.cleanse.net/

The not eating part comes on the last seven days. The guys rationale
is that you should reduce food intake slowly for the grand 7-day
finalle.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
> >
> >It forms a gelatinous mass. That would generally keep any
> >pills/powders grabbed up in such a matrix from coming into contact with
> >the bowel walls so it COULD be absorbed.
> >
>
> If the pills/powders are water soluble, they find a way. If they are
> not water soluble, they'll get trapped.

So do you take your fat soluble vitamins at a separate time?
E, A, and D I believe are the primary ones. Plus EFA or fish oil supps
if you use those.

No, I don't, for the following reason: Fat-soluble supplements require
ingestion of fat. But with ingestion of fat, I want to take soluble
fiber. Conclusion: it is quite possible I'm wasting some of those
vitamins but given that I megadose on all of them, I don't see that as
a big issue.

Ah. Megadose and some is bound to get thru. ;-)
Do be careful tho' with vitamin A! Too much can really cause some liver
problems in the long term if it builds up to toxic levels.

Yeah, most of it is beta carotene.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
> >
> >>
> >> >
> >> >That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at
> >> >least
> >> >2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
> >> >supplements he is going to take.
> >> >
> >>
> >> I see more health benefits in taking soluble fiber right before the
> >> meals.
> >
> >How so? Less calorie absorption is all I can think of.
> >
>
> Several reasons: it reduces the glycemic index/load of whatever you
> eat; it traps toxins, fat and even cholesterol released into the
> bowels; it helps one feel fuller for longer periods of time.

Good points.....
Personally, I like a good load of greens instead.
Brocolli, cauliflower, baby spinach, swiss chard, bok choy, bean
sprouts, celery, that sort of thing.

That is the ideal situation. Thing is, with very few exceptions, I
simply can't tolerate vegetables. An enema doesn't cause me as much
displeasure. That's why I have a heard time accepting the notion that
humans are naturally vegans. How can I be naturally a vegan if I feel
so much displeasure eating vegetables?

IBS can be caused by a sensitivity to too much Cellulose.
Try mushrooms. Their cell walls are chitin instead of cellulose so you
may tolerate that better.

I was talking about taste! :-)

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 14:13:53 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
<[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>In article <[email hidden]>,
> Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:43:44 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
>> <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> >
>> >In article <[email hidden]>,
>> > Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:23:00 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
>> >> <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >In article <[email hidden]>,
>> >> > Just Cocky <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> On 18 Aug 2005 00:57:40 -0700, [email hidden] wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >10g of my fiber intake every day is from psyllium powder
>> >> >> >(ispaghula
>> >> >> >husk). Does anyone know if this is harmful?
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I take around 20g/day. My bowels love it. It's a great way to
>> >> >> create
>> >> >> regularity and to trap toxins.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >I take my multi-vitamins in the morning or afternoon.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Generally, they should be taken with food for maximum absorption.
>> >> >> Taking them with fiber is not an issue unless you are taking
>> >> >> fat-soluble vitamins or other oils, like fish oil, for example.
>> >> >
>> >> >Not entirely accurate...
>> >> >One of the reasons to use fiber/bulk laxatives is to keep the
>> >> >intestines
>> >> >moving faster.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> Soluble fiber is not a laxative. It simply increases the volume the
>> >> fecal matter which, in turn, makes it easy on the intestines to move
>> >> the stuff forward. Fecal matter without volume is a sure fire way of
>> >> getting diverticulosis.
>> >
>> >Agreed, but it still speeds transit time.
>> >And increases stool volume/colon fluid retention.
>> >
>>
>> The bowels expect bulky foods to work properly. If one only eats meat
>> or refined carbs, the bowels aren't going to be able to work properly
>> and fecal metal stays around longer. From this point of view, bulky
>> foods don't speed up transit, they simply bring transit time to what
>> is normal.
>
>y'know, that's actually a good point. ;-)
>Optimal bowel evacuation is 2 to 3 times per day.
>How many people can claim that?
>

Well, I can't. I go once a day and that is it. With more insoluble
fiber, I think one could increase the frequency.

Well, I have chronic hypomagnesemia (my endocrinologist says it's a
congenital renal tubule defect) so have to supplement quite a bit of
magnesium. 3 to 5 per day is about par for me.

Wow! Are you taking magnesium oxide? I've read somewhere that
magnesium citrate is easier on the bowels. Do you take calcium
together with the magnesium?

Cal/Mag/Phos balanced supplement. :-)
You get better absorption/utilization when you take those three in
combination. "Now" brand combines citrate and oxide in their formula.

I also supplement trace minerals.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
>>
>> >
>> >Have you ever done a colon cleansing using large amounts of psyllium
>> >husk?
>> >
>>
>> Yes, I did the Arise & Shine cleanse once.
>
>I don't remember the name of the program I used, but it involved 3 days
>of only psyllium husk shakes combined with chlorophyll and bentonite.
>Chased 1 hour after drinking it (3 times per day) with 2 senna tablets.
>

That was nothing man! The Arise & Shine Cleanse is a full 1 *MONTH*,
eheheh. Check it out here:
http://www.ariseandshine.com/

It appears they now have a 7-day cleanse for sissies! ;-)

But... the cleanse program I used excluded food. It was the fiber shakes
only. 'course you were not hungry at all. <lol>

Actually, the author of the program has it's own website. The guy
appears to be somewhat of a nutcase but his cleanse program worked
well for me: http://www.cleanse.net/

The not eating part comes on the last seven days. The guys rationale
is that you should reduce food intake slowly for the grand 7-day
finalle.

Interesting reading.

A good Gastroenterologist will recommend cleansing annually.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>
>> >
>> >It forms a gelatinous mass. That would generally keep any
>> >pills/powders grabbed up in such a matrix from coming into contact
>> >with
>> >the bowel walls so it COULD be absorbed.
>> >
>>
>> If the pills/powders are water soluble, they find a way. If they are
>> not water soluble, they'll get trapped.
>
>So do you take your fat soluble vitamins at a separate time?
>E, A, and D I believe are the primary ones. Plus EFA or fish oil supps
>if you use those.
>

No, I don't, for the following reason: Fat-soluble supplements require
ingestion of fat. But with ingestion of fat, I want to take soluble
fiber. Conclusion: it is quite possible I'm wasting some of those
vitamins but given that I megadose on all of them, I don't see that as
a big issue.

Ah. Megadose and some is bound to get thru. ;-)
Do be careful tho' with vitamin A! Too much can really cause some liver
problems in the long term if it builds up to toxic levels.

Yeah, most of it is beta carotene.

Just don't take so much that you turn orange...
And no, I'm not kidding! Some Dr.'s have seen it.
It's harmless, just looks funny.

I once did it to myself using Canthaxanthin but that was a carotenoid
internal tanning agent. The ad said it would give you a brown tinge like
a natural tan, but it really did turn me orange. <lol> Faded within a
week or so once I quit using it.

Guess my skin is too light.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>
>> >
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >That was why I recommended he take psyllium before retiring and at
>> >> >least
>> >> >2 hours after the final meal of they day, along with whatever
>> >> >supplements he is going to take.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> I see more health benefits in taking soluble fiber right before the
>> >> meals.
>> >
>> >How so? Less calorie absorption is all I can think of.
>> >
>>
>> Several reasons: it reduces the glycemic index/load of whatever you
>> eat; it traps toxins, fat and even cholesterol released into the
>> bowels; it helps one feel fuller for longer periods of time.
>
>Good points.....
>Personally, I like a good load of greens instead.
>Brocolli, cauliflower, baby spinach, swiss chard, bok choy, bean
>sprouts, celery, that sort of thing.
>

That is the ideal situation. Thing is, with very few exceptions, I
simply can't tolerate vegetables. An enema doesn't cause me as much
displeasure. That's why I have a heard time accepting the notion that
humans are naturally vegans. How can I be naturally a vegan if I feel
so much displeasure eating vegetables?

IBS can be caused by a sensitivity to too much Cellulose.
Try mushrooms. Their cell walls are chitin instead of cellulose so you
may tolerate that better.

I was talking about taste! :-)

Oh! I see. :-)
You just don't like veggies.....

I've got no suggestions for that, unless it's maybe cooking technique?

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

OmManiPadmeOmelet <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

Quoted message said:

Transit time IMHO should _not_ be 72 hours.

Of course not! Did I insinuate that anywhere?

Sorry... did not mean to intimate that you did. :-)
I work in health care and abstinance time for most special stool
testing is 72 hours to make sure the bowels are clear of specific
subtances, hence that number......72 hours seems to be normal for the
general (crappy diet) population.

Stop and think statistically for a moment. 72 hours can't be the *typical*
transit time because if it were, about half the people being tested would
*still* have those specific substances in their bowels and the
recommendation would be worthless. The recommendation is going to be based
on the *maximum* transit times observed in the general population and will
in fact be *higher* than that maximum in order to allow a margin of safety.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Eric Bohlman said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Just Cocky said:

>Transit time IMHO should _not_ be 72 hours.
>

Of course not! Did I insinuate that anywhere?

Sorry... did not mean to intimate that you did. :-)
I work in health care and abstinance time for most special stool
testing is 72 hours to make sure the bowels are clear of specific
subtances, hence that number......72 hours seems to be normal for the
general (crappy diet) population.

Stop and think statistically for a moment. 72 hours can't be the *typical*
transit time because if it were, about half the people being tested would
*still* have those specific substances in their bowels and the
recommendation would be worthless. The recommendation is going to be based
on the *maximum* transit times observed in the general population and will
in fact be *higher* than that maximum in order to allow a margin of safety.

The law of averages on the bell curve usually tries to hit the upper
limits of the abnormal. ;-)

There are some people who only have a BM once per week.

And, those that are getting stool testing get it because they are having
problems. Chronic consipation seems to be epidemic...

Please note the above, I said average for the "crappy diet" population.
We are not referring to normal or average individuals.

HTH?

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson