Talking of the TdF ...

Don Whybrow said:

I was watching the ITV4 show on Monday night. It was a rest day so they
were giving a re-cap of the previous week. The Saturday stage ended with
the peloton finishing outside the time allowed given that they crossed
the line nearly half an hour behind the 5 man breakaway. I know it would
resulted in the smallest field ever going into the last week, but am I
the only one that sees this as a case of the powers that be changing the
rules because they don't like the result.

--
Don Whybrow

Sequi Bonum Non Time

If you're happy and you know it, clunk your chains.

FWIW, my understanding of the rules is that the referees (judges,
umpires, whatevers) have significant latitude in how they apply the
rules. Considering the magnitude of the race and the extent to which
details are not under the control of the race organizers, I suspect
that significant latitude is probably a necessity.

While axing the field to 5 riders might have made for an interesting
race, I suspect that many of the advertisers would be very unhappy with
that result.

Actually, IIRC, teams that lose too many riders are required to
withdraw; I believe that the threshhold is 5 riders. If that is
correct, eliminating the peloton would have effectively have eliminated
ALL of the riders, which, of course, would really have annoyed the
advertisers and the broadcasters and the thousands of people who
travelled to France to see the race.

Jeff
----
Power corrupts. Absolute power is a lot of fun.

"Don Whybrow" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was watching the ITV4 show on Monday night. It was a rest day so they
were giving a re-cap of the previous week. The Saturday stage ended with
the peloton finishing outside the time allowed given that they crossed the
line nearly half an hour behind the 5 man breakaway. I know it would
resulted in the smallest field ever going into the last week, but am I the
only one that sees this as a case of the powers that be changing the rules
because they don't like the result.

TdF regs are here:
http://www.letour.fr/2006/TDF/LIVE/docs/reglement_2006_us.pdf
includes:
If the percentage of eliminated riders rises above 20% of starters in the
stage, permitted fi nishing times
may be increased upon the decision of the stewards committee, with the
agreement of

the race management.

Peter

"Don Whybrow" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was watching the ITV4 show on Monday night. It was a rest day so they
were giving a re-cap of the previous week. The Saturday stage ended with
the peloton finishing outside the time allowed given that they crossed the
line nearly half an hour behind the 5 man breakaway. I know it would
resulted in the smallest field ever going into the last week, but am I the
only one that sees this as a case of the powers that be changing the rules
because they don't like the result.

--
Don Whybrow

Sequi Bonum Non Time

If you're happy and you know it, clunk your chains.

Ah, but there were loads of French riders at risk so the rules were changed
..... and it was odd that none of the riders eliminated in the pre-race
dopage issues were French .....

RG

Quoted message said:

Ah, but there were loads of French riders at risk so the rules were changed
.... and it was odd that none of the riders eliminated in the pre-race
dopage issues were French .....
RG

Ahh but...
The rules weren't changed, they include a rule for this possibility and
have done for donkeys years.

Robert

RG said:

"Don Whybrow" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I was watching the ITV4 show on Monday night. It was a rest day so they
were giving a re-cap of the previous week. The Saturday stage ended with
the peloton finishing outside the time allowed given that they crossed the
line nearly half an hour behind the 5 man breakaway. I know it would
resulted in the smallest field ever going into the last week, but am I the
only one that sees this as a case of the powers that be changing the rules
because they don't like the result.

--
Don Whybrow

Sequi Bonum Non Time

If you're happy and you know it, clunk your chains.

Ah, but there were loads of French riders at risk so the rules were changed
.... and it was odd that none of the riders eliminated in the pre-race
dopage issues were French .....

RG

Thats not the point. The cut off is there so that climbers dont just
twiddle along on the flat & come in 2 hours after everyone else and
sprinters dont finish hilly stages after dark. If a breakaway goes and
the peloton dont chase then no organiser s going to exclude all the
overall leaders.

Stan Cox

in message said:

.... and it was odd that none of the riders eliminated in the pre-race
dopage issues were French .....

Ah, don't be stupid. The clinic which was caught was a Spanish clinic.
Therefore, most of the riders who were caught were Spanish. Nobody
thinks it was the only clinic.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; Semper in faecibus sumus, sole profundum variat.

Quoted message said:

Don Whybrow wrote:
Actually, IIRC, teams that lose too many riders are required to
withdraw; I believe that the threshhold is 5 riders.

You can't start the race with less than 5 riders in your team. You can
finish it with only one.

--
Peter Headland

in message <[email hidden]>, Peter

Headland (') said:

Quoted message said:

Don Whybrow wrote:
Actually, IIRC, teams that lose too many riders are required to
withdraw; I believe that the threshhold is 5 riders.

You can't start the race with less than 5 riders in your team. You can
finish it with only one.

How do you do in the team classification, then, if there are less than
three? I thought the team classification was taken on the time of your
third rider over the line each day.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

to err is human, to lisp divine
;; attributed to Kim Philby, oddly enough.

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Peter

Headland (') said:

Quoted message said:

Don Whybrow wrote:
Actually, IIRC, teams that lose too many riders are required to
withdraw; I believe that the threshhold is 5 riders.

You can't start the race with less than 5 riders in your team. You can
finish it with only one.

How do you do in the team classification, then, if there are less than
three? I thought the team classification was taken on the time of your
third rider over the line each day.

Without actually looking up the regs (why break with usenet tradition?) I
think you're mixing two rules. 1) The team points are based on the team's
best three riders' positions on each stage: and 2) The time for a TTT is
that of the 5th rider to finish.

Mike

in message
<[email hidden]>, Mike

Causer (') said:

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>,

Peter Headland (') said:

> Don Whybrow wrote:
> Actually, IIRC, teams that lose too many riders are required to
> withdraw; I believe that the threshhold is 5 riders.

You can't start the race with less than 5 riders in your team. You
can finish it with only one.

How do you do in the team classification, then, if there are less than
three? I thought the team classification was taken on the time of your
third rider over the line each day.

Without actually looking up the regs (why break with usenet tradition?)
I
think you're mixing two rules. 1) The team points are based on the
team's
best three riders' positions on each stage: and 2) The time for a TTT
is that of the 5th rider to finish.

Yes, OK, but, what if the team has fewer than three riders?

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
,/| _.--''^``-...___.._.,;
/, \'. _-' ,--,,,--'''
{ \ `_-'' ' /
`;;' ; ; ;
._..--'' ._,,, _..' .;.'
(,_....----''' (,..--''

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Peter

Headland (') said:

Quoted message said:

Don Whybrow wrote:
Actually, IIRC, teams that lose too many riders are required to
withdraw; I believe that the threshhold is 5 riders.

You can't start the race with less than 5 riders in your team. You can
finish it with only one.

How do you do in the team classification, then, if there are less than
three? I thought the team classification was taken on the time of your
third rider over the line each day.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

to err is human, to lisp divine
;; attributed to Kim Philby, oddly enough.

I thought they added the time of the top three riders overall for each
team for the team classification. So if you have less that three riders
in the race your total will be very low so you will do very badly. I
have not reviewed the rules though becasuse I don't really care.

Simon Brooke said:

Yes, OK, but, what if the team has fewer than three riders?

http://www.letour.fr/2006/TDF/LIVE/docs/reglement_2006_us.pdf

e) General team ranking
(ar t. 2.6.016)

The general team ranking is established by adding together the best
individual times of each team in all the stages.

If there is a tie between teams in stage rankings, the three best
places achieved in that stage by each team are added together. If
there is a tie between teams in the general ranking, the teams are
separated by adding up the number of stage victories per team, then
by the number of second places, and so on, until the number of
places obtained by one or the other team allows for a clear ranking
to be established. If there is still a tie, the winner will be the
team with the rider with the best position in the general individual
classification.

Any team reduced to fewer than three riders will be disqualfied from
the general team ranking.

Mike

In article <[email hidden]>

MSeries said:

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Peter

Headland (') said:

> Don Whybrow wrote:
> Actually, IIRC, teams that lose too many riders are required to
> withdraw; I believe that the threshhold is 5 riders.

You can't start the race with less than 5 riders in your team. You can
finish it with only one.

How do you do in the team classification, then, if there are less than
three? I thought the team classification was taken on the time of your
third rider over the line each day.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

to err is human, to lisp divine
;; attributed to Kim Philby, oddly enough.

I thought they added the time of the top three riders overall for each
team for the team classification. So if you have less that three riders
in the race your total will be very low so you will do very badly.

Clue: lower time = faster