Tavistock 7/12/06



On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 08:52:10 +0000, Tony Raven <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Paul Boyd wrote on 09/12/2006 07:53 +0100:
>>
>> Unfortunately this is one of those cases where what happens in real life
>> is dangerously opposite to what the HC says. Yes, a flash of the
>> headlights can cause misunderstanding, but 95% or more of drivers know
>> what the flasher (pardon the phrase!) intends, or what they think the
>> flasher means.
>>
>
>I was always taught that flashing the headlights had no meaning and that
>it was still my responsibility to check the road and ensure it was safe
>to proceed irrespective of what another driver might be attempting to
>indicate to me with his headlights.

I don't think that it could ever be wrong to interpret a flash to
mean, 'please take extra care', whether a pedestrian crossing a road,
or a motor vehicle driver driving within the speed limit on a
motorway.
 
Will Cove wrote on 09/12/2006 09:44 +0100:
>
> If anything, I overestimated the speed of the guy. A gap developed ahead
> of him in the traffic after his shenanigans at the roundabout, which
> meant that motorised traffic was moving much faster than him when free
> flowing conditions were restored. Two or three cars behind me also
> overtook him and when things slowed down a hundred or so yards later, he
> started making his way back through the "queue".

I can never understand this urge to get past the cyclist so as to be
able to join the back of the next queue quicker. I've lost count of the
number of times cars will be desperate to get past me only to have to
brake hard and block my path because of the traffic queued in front of them.

--
Tony

"...has many omissions and contains much that is apocryphal, or at least
wildly inaccurate..."
Douglas Adams; The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
 
On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 10:10:04 +0000, Tony Raven <[email protected]> wrote:

> I can never understand this urge to get past the cyclist so as to be
> able to join the back of the next queue quicker. I've lost count of the
> number of times cars will be desperate to get past me only to have to
> brake hard and block my path because of the traffic queued in front of them.

Or indeed, pull out straddling the white line, get alongside, then
brake hard because they can't get any further and end up stationary
in the middle of the road blocking the oncoming traffic too.

I've even been stationary in the primary position at the back of a
queue and the car coming up behind has sort-of joined the queue
alongside me more in the other lane than this one. Then, when
something comes teh other way, they seem surprised their car won't
slide perpendicular o teh direction its wheels point.

I think there are a reasonable minority of drivers who absolutely
literally cannot think beyond the vehicle in front - if it's a bike,
overtake it, regardless of what is ahead of it.

I've seen it while driving, too - I had a tailgater, obviously
desperate to overtake me, despite solid oncoming queue of traffic, and
me at near the speed limit. An oncoming emergency vehicle (don't
remember what, but flashing headlights, flashing blue lights etc) was
coming towards me straddling the white line, so I pulled over to the
left and slowed. Numpty behind decided this provided an opportunity
to overtake me, causing himself to come to a stop bumper-to-bumper
with said oncoming flashing lights. He then seemed to enter a
catatonic state, so I had to pull ahead to let the emergency through.

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|
 
"Will Cove" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> If anything, I overestimated the speed of the guy. A gap developed ahead
> of him in the traffic after his shenanigans at the roundabout, which
> meant that motorised traffic was moving much faster than him when free
> flowing conditions were restored. Two or three cars behind me also
> overtook him and when things slowed down a hundred or so yards later, he
> started making his way back through the "queue". I kept an eye on him and
> prepared to move a little further right to give him room to pass (I'd
> also have slowed down as he passed to give both of us a safety zone).

A whole hundred yards of free flowing conditions? Why bother overtaking him
in the first place?

clive
 
"Clive George" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> A whole hundred yards of free flowing conditions? Why bother
> overtaking him in the first place?

The gap was opening when I overtook and even when the traffic slowed and
the cyclist got back up to speed he only had a differential speed of about
half a mile per hour. Not overtaking would have been making inadequate
progress.

BTW, I wonder why he felt such a low speed differential was worth the risk
of "undertaking" other road users who possibly couldn't see him.
 
Will Cove wrote on 09/12/2006 12:26 +0100:
> "Clive George" <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>> A whole hundred yards of free flowing conditions? Why bother
>> overtaking him in the first place?
>
> The gap was opening when I overtook and even when the traffic slowed and
> the cyclist got back up to speed he only had a differential speed of about
> half a mile per hour. Not overtaking would have been making inadequate
> progress.
>
> BTW, I wonder why he felt such a low speed differential was worth the risk
> of "undertaking" other road users who possibly couldn't see him.

100yds at 0.5mph differential speed would take 400s or almost 7 minutes
for him to catch up, ignoring his getting up to speed. It would take
him the best part of 20s to pass a single car. And you reckon you
overestimated his speed?

--
Tony

"...has many omissions and contains much that is apocryphal, or at least
wildly inaccurate..."
Douglas Adams; The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
 
In article <[email protected]>
Will Cove <[email protected]> wrote:
> Rob Morley <[email protected]> wrote in news:MPG.1fe36a4a1bc3c5a98a932
> @news.individual.net:
>
> >> I was driving the Mitsubishi 4x4 that you seemed hell bent on hitting.
> >>
> > Oh look, a tractor driver.
>
> I also drive a white van and use the 4x4 to tow a caravan - so want to
> enlighten us with even more of your bigotry?
>
Yeah OK - you're a tedious deluded self-rightous old[1] fart, a
(probable) member of the Caravan Club and a (wannabe?) member of the
IAM. How's that?

[1] Regardless of date of birth.
 
"Will Cove" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Now, I didn't post to have a go at the guy, I posted because I want him
> to understand what could have happened if things had been slightly
> different so that he can take stock and hopefully keep safe.

Out of interest, do you post to all relevant newsgroups in all such
situations, or do you single out cyclists for special attention? If so, it's
nice of you to think of us, and you are to be commended for being such a
public-pirited chap.

Perhaps we should all report to URD when we see motorists driving
dangerously?
 
Will Cove wrote:
>
> I overtook you shortly after that but kept a close watch on you until you
> disappeared from sight. I suspected that you'd turned off the A386. As I
> approached the road on the left a little before the the river, there was
> a Jag on the other side of the A386 waiting to turn right. Since he was
> holding up a long queue of traffic in his direction and since there was a
> continuous stream of traffic in my direction, I intended doing the
> courteous thing and slowed down to open a gap in front of me. My next
> action would have been to flash my headlights - except at that point you
> moved out of my nearside blind spot (where you'd been tailgating me) and
> started to pass me on the left. I accelerated away and in doing so might
> have saved your life. Let me project what might have happened if I hadn't
> checked my nearside mirror at that point and had not seen you:
>
> I'd have flashed the Jag, who would have passed in front of me. At that
> stage he couldn't see you and you couldn't see him because my car was in
> the way. The driver probably wouldn't have seen you at all because from
> his perspective the road was clear and his attention would have been on
> the road into which he was turning. Judging by the cavalier manner in
> which you handled the roundabout, I suspect that you wouldn't have been
> able to stop. If you were lucky the Jag would have gone far enough for
> you to run into his wing because otherwise you'd have gone under it.

I agreed up to this point that the cyclist was riding poorly and should
have been more visible, but really you should not stop for no reason
and flash someone out of a side road when you have right of way,
particularly if there is traffic behind you. Perhaps have some
consideration for them?

It annoys me intensely when I am on a cycle and some car driver decides
to yield right of way when I am parallel to them or just behind them
and I have to yell that I do not intend to yield. As a car driver, you
should know I am there and know that I am not likely to want to stop to
give way when the right of way is with me.
 
Tom Crispin wrote:
> On 08 Dec 2006 09:12:43 GMT, Will Cove <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >My next
> >action would have been to flash my headlights
>
> The one and only time I've been knocked off my bike was when I was
> cycling in a shared use cycle/bus lane. Some fool in the parrallel
> lane flased a car waiting to turn right, and without looking the car
> crossed the cycle lane and hit the rear of my bike.
>
> If you think flashing a car for any reason, other than to make them
> you aware of your presence, is right, you need to study the highway
> code.

I had the same problem on the A41 Finchley Road heading South crossing
Heath Drive. The traffic was stationary, I was in the bus lane and
someone decided to flash the white van waiting to turning right
opposite, who then turned right into my path. There was no way I could
avoid hitting it.
 
Quoting Will Cove <[email protected]>:
>Rob Morley <[email protected]> wrote in news:MPG.1fe36a4a1bc3c5a98a932
>>>I was driving the Mitsubishi 4x4 that you seemed hell bent on hitting.
>>Oh look, a tractor driver.
>I also drive a white van and use the 4x4 to tow a caravan

It is well known that caravans could only be moved by Shire horses before
the popularity of 4x4 barges, since it is impossible for ordinary motor
cars to do so.
--
David Damerell <[email protected]> Distortion Field!
Today is Monday, December.
 
In article <g2v*[email protected]>
David Damerell <[email protected]> wrote:
> Quoting Will Cove <[email protected]>:
> >Rob Morley <[email protected]> wrote in news:MPG.1fe36a4a1bc3c5a98a932
> >>>I was driving the Mitsubishi 4x4 that you seemed hell bent on hitting.
> >>Oh look, a tractor driver.
> >I also drive a white van and use the 4x4 to tow a caravan
>
> It is well known that caravans could only be moved by Shire horses before
> the popularity of 4x4 barges, since it is impossible for ordinary motor
> cars to do so.
>
What you want is a nice Audi A6 Quattro 3.0 TDi auto with air shocks.
:)
 
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