Theoretical Powerlifting Question

John Hanson said:

If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
optimum training, sleeping, eating schedule for a drug free lifter?

Of course I realize there are no drug free lifters, but lets pretend.

"John Hanson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
optimum training, sleeping, eating schedule for a drug free lifter? In
other words, the lifters job was to compete in powerlifting and he was
compensated handsomely for it. Would you lift 4 days/week? 5? 6?
Perhaps twice/day, 5 days per week? How about maintaining a bodyfat
percentage? 12-15%? 10%?

I don't know the answer off the top of my head but we have decades of
such lifters from the Eastern Bloc, whose schedules are all pretty well
known. And, if memory serves, while their training programs have shown
many similarities to one another, they've been different enough to prove
that more than one schedule can be made to work. I'd think you
basically show up at the gym and spend the day there 6 days a week.

-S-
http://www.kbnj.com

On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 08:37:21 -0500, "Steve Freides"
<[email hidden]> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

"John Hanson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
optimum training, sleeping, eating schedule for a drug free lifter? In
other words, the lifters job was to compete in powerlifting and he was
compensated handsomely for it. Would you lift 4 days/week? 5? 6?
Perhaps twice/day, 5 days per week? How about maintaining a bodyfat
percentage? 12-15%? 10%?

I don't know the answer off the top of my head but we have decades of
such lifters from the Eastern Bloc, whose schedules are all pretty well
known. And, if memory serves, while their training programs have shown
many similarities to one another, they've been different enough to prove
that more than one schedule can be made to work. I'd think you
basically show up at the gym and spend the day there 6 days a week.

But there is a difference between the Eastern Bloc lifters and the one
in my hypothetical. Those Eastern Bloc lifters had/have poor
nutrition and really good drugs. One of my teammates likes to tell
the story of being in the Chech Republic for Worlds at the after meet
dinner party. He said the lifters from Russia as well as another
country or two would go into the buffet line and put food in their
pockets for the ride home because they had nothing to eat. I've heard
these stories from other people too. Clary was telling me that back
in the 80s, a Russian lifter got his protein from the half gallon of
milk he was issued each day. That was basically it...that and lots of
drugs.

Also, they didn't have much of a personal life nor any money meaning
that a pro lifter in this country could be waited on hand and foot. I
don't know if it was Coan or Bridges but I also heard stories that
back in their heyday, they would sleep 12 hours per day. I think
Coan's family was fairly well off so he might have fit that lifestyle
but I'm pretty sure it was Bridges who slept 12 hours/day. So, it is
my opinion that the Eastern Bloc training is less than optimal for a
drug free lifter who has a lot of time on his hands. I'm not saying
that either of those lifters didn't use drugs either but my question
is intended more for drug free lifters.

In article <[email hidden]>,

John Hanson said:

On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 08:37:21 -0500, "Steve Freides"
<[email hidden]> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

"John Hanson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
optimum training, sleeping, eating schedule for a drug free lifter? In
other words, the lifters job was to compete in powerlifting and he was
compensated handsomely for it. Would you lift 4 days/week? 5? 6?
Perhaps twice/day, 5 days per week? How about maintaining a bodyfat
percentage? 12-15%? 10%?

I don't know the answer off the top of my head but we have decades of
such lifters from the Eastern Bloc, whose schedules are all pretty well
known. And, if memory serves, while their training programs have shown
many similarities to one another, they've been different enough to prove
that more than one schedule can be made to work. I'd think you
basically show up at the gym and spend the day there 6 days a week.

But there is a difference between the Eastern Bloc lifters and the one
in my hypothetical. Those Eastern Bloc lifters had/have poor
nutrition and really good drugs. One of my teammates likes to tell
the story of being in the Chech Republic for Worlds at the after meet
dinner party. He said the lifters from Russia as well as another
country or two would go into the buffet line and put food in their
pockets for the ride home because they had nothing to eat. I've heard
these stories from other people too. Clary was telling me that back
in the 80s, a Russian lifter got his protein from the half gallon of
milk he was issued each day. That was basically it...that and lots of
drugs.

Also, they didn't have much of a personal life nor any money meaning
that a pro lifter in this country could be waited on hand and foot. I
don't know if it was Coan or Bridges but I also heard stories that
back in their heyday, they would sleep 12 hours per day. I think
Coan's family was fairly well off so he might have fit that lifestyle
but I'm pretty sure it was Bridges who slept 12 hours/day. So, it is
my opinion that the Eastern Bloc training is less than optimal for a
drug free lifter who has a lot of time on his hands. I'm not saying
that either of those lifters didn't use drugs either but my question
is intended more for drug free lifters.

I don't think there is one road to Rome - or one best training program
for all people for all time. Even if the goal is powerlifting and you
had all the time to devote to it - there is not one 'best' way.

I would say that in the overall set-up of training you would still be
best organizing in such a way that you have stressed weeks where you
work harder than average and deload weeks where you allow adaptative
responses.

Training could be anywhere from 3 days per week to 6 days per week and
multiple training sessions per day would make a lot of sense no matter
how many days per week are trained. Systematic restoration methods also
would be built into the training means - including contrast baths,
lighter workouts, massage and possibly electrostimulation. Overall the
emphasis would be on increasing work capacity, so over time the number
of training sessions would increase until somewhere near capacity was
met.

Obviously if you are anything but a superheavy keeping body fat levels
in the low double digits makes sense. You would want a nutrition plan
that matches the overall training plan. The _average_ hours of sleep for
the American Olympic team at Atlanta was 9 hours per night and most of
them also napped for an hout or two in the afternoon. This would also
make sense as the overall work capacity increased the need for more rest
would also increase.

--
Keith

Hobbes said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
John Hanson <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

I don't think there is one road to Rome - or one best training program
for all people for all time. Even if the goal is powerlifting and you
had all the time to devote to it - there is not one 'best' way.

My understanding is that you need to completely change your training
program from time to time to keep the gains coming. It doesn't matter
how good your routine is, you'll have to do another one eventually.

So it's a bit hard to guess what a perfect routine would be!

Not that I'd know, being a dumb grrl and all.

Dally

In article <[email hidden]>, Dally <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Hobbes said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
John Hanson <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

I don't think there is one road to Rome - or one best training program
for all people for all time. Even if the goal is powerlifting and you
had all the time to devote to it - there is not one 'best' way.

My understanding is that you need to completely change your training
program from time to time to keep the gains coming. It doesn't matter
how good your routine is, you'll have to do another one eventually.

So it's a bit hard to guess what a perfect routine would be!

No, you need to vary training parameters. Ed Coan has used essentially
the same training program for years, but being periodized it has a lot
of variation in terms of volume and intensity.

Most good powerlifters and weightlifters don't use much variety in terms
of exercise selection. Even Westside uses the same basic exercises with
minor variations in terms of ROM or the bar. But of course there is
variety in terms of intensity (as measured in WS case by the classic
lift) and overall load.

--
Keith

Dally said:

My understanding is that you need to completely change your training
program from time to time to keep the gains coming.

...and my understanding that this is simply not true - at least from a
physiological point of view. You may need a change of pace from
time-to-time to keep interest and motivation up, however.

Ellis

John Hanson said:

If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
optimum training,

3 mornings a week, squat, bench, and deadlift. Start the cycle with
50% 1RM. Squat to failure, bench to failure, deadlift almost to
failure. Add 10# to the squat bar every session. Add enough weight to
the bar on bench and deadlift to keep reps roughly even with squat. Go
to a new 1RM, take two weeks off, repeat. Aim new 1RM for meets.

Quoted message said:

sleeping,

8-9 hours a night and a one hour afternoon nap.

Quoted message said:

eating schedule

Six meals a day, lots of milk, meat, peanut butter, fruit, veggies.

Quoted message said:

for a drug free lifter?

Wholly drug-free or No Illegal Drugs drug-free? I'd miss caffeine.

Quoted message said:

other words, the lifters job was to compete in powerlifting and he was
compensated handsomely for it. Would you lift 4 days/week? 5? 6?
Perhaps twice/day, 5 days per week? How about maintaining a bodyfat
percentage? 12-15%? 10%?

I'd stay at the top of my best weight class, and try hard to stay out
of superheavy.

On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 11:15:17 -0600, Hobbes <[email hidden]>
wrote in misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

John Hanson said:

On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 08:37:21 -0500, "Steve Freides"
<[email hidden]> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

"John Hanson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
> lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
> optimum training, sleeping, eating schedule for a drug free lifter? In
> other words, the lifters job was to compete in powerlifting and he was
> compensated handsomely for it. Would you lift 4 days/week? 5? 6?
> Perhaps twice/day, 5 days per week? How about maintaining a bodyfat
> percentage? 12-15%? 10%?

I don't know the answer off the top of my head but we have decades of
such lifters from the Eastern Bloc, whose schedules are all pretty well
known. And, if memory serves, while their training programs have shown
many similarities to one another, they've been different enough to prove
that more than one schedule can be made to work. I'd think you
basically show up at the gym and spend the day there 6 days a week.

But there is a difference between the Eastern Bloc lifters and the one
in my hypothetical. Those Eastern Bloc lifters had/have poor
nutrition and really good drugs. One of my teammates likes to tell
the story of being in the Chech Republic for Worlds at the after meet
dinner party. He said the lifters from Russia as well as another
country or two would go into the buffet line and put food in their
pockets for the ride home because they had nothing to eat. I've heard
these stories from other people too. Clary was telling me that back
in the 80s, a Russian lifter got his protein from the half gallon of
milk he was issued each day. That was basically it...that and lots of
drugs.

Also, they didn't have much of a personal life nor any money meaning
that a pro lifter in this country could be waited on hand and foot. I
don't know if it was Coan or Bridges but I also heard stories that
back in their heyday, they would sleep 12 hours per day. I think
Coan's family was fairly well off so he might have fit that lifestyle
but I'm pretty sure it was Bridges who slept 12 hours/day. So, it is
my opinion that the Eastern Bloc training is less than optimal for a
drug free lifter who has a lot of time on his hands. I'm not saying
that either of those lifters didn't use drugs either but my question
is intended more for drug free lifters.

I don't think there is one road to Rome - or one best training program
for all people for all time. Even if the goal is powerlifting and you
had all the time to devote to it - there is not one 'best' way.

I'm sure that is correct.

Quoted message said:

I would say that in the overall set-up of training you would still be
best organizing in such a way that you have stressed weeks where you
work harder than average and deload weeks where you allow adaptative
responses.

I try to follow that training regimen. Which brings up a question.
I've been squatting Monday, heavy benching on Wednesday, deadlifting
on Friday and a short speed bench workout on Sunday. The rest of my
teammates do a two week cycle going M-squat, W-bench, F-deadlift,
M-bench, W-squat, F-light bench, light assistance and repeat the
following Monday. Anywho, every 4th week I do the second part of
their workout which is then my light week.

So, my next light week will be the week of the 10th. That gives me
two more heavy weeks going into meet week which will be just going to
my openers in the squat and deadlift on Monday and maybe 3-4 sets of
8-10 in the bench on Wednesday. Is there anything you'd change about
this plan?

Quoted message said:

Training could be anywhere from 3 days per week to 6 days per week and
multiple training sessions per day would make a lot of sense no matter
how many days per week are trained. Systematic restoration methods also
would be built into the training means - including contrast baths,
lighter workouts, massage and possibly electrostimulation. Overall the
emphasis would be on increasing work capacity, so over time the number
of training sessions would increase until somewhere near capacity was
met.

Obviously if you are anything but a superheavy keeping body fat levels
in the low double digits makes sense. You would want a nutrition plan
that matches the overall training plan. The _average_ hours of sleep for
the American Olympic team at Atlanta was 9 hours per night and most of
them also napped for an hout or two in the afternoon. This would also
make sense as the overall work capacity increased the need for more rest
would also increase.

That makes sense. Would you ever want to add more fat in the off
season to help protect the joints? I've now known a couple of guys
who lift big weights who've dropped a great deal of weight and bodyfat
(one got into boxing) and they both said their joints really bothered
them as the fat came off.

On 29 Mar 2006 18:51:16 -0800, [email hidden] wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

John Hanson said:

If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
optimum training,

3 mornings a week, squat, bench, and deadlift. Start the cycle with
50% 1RM. Squat to failure, bench to failure, deadlift almost to
failure. Add 10# to the squat bar every session. Add enough weight to
the bar on bench and deadlift to keep reps roughly even with squat. Go
to a new 1RM, take two weeks off, repeat. Aim new 1RM for meets.

I've never heard anything so ridiculous in my life. Why would you
want to lift to failure all the time? Plus, if I were to start at 50%
1RM and add ten pounds every session in the squat, I'd be maxing out 3
times/week for about 10 weeks.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

sleeping,

8-9 hours a night and a one hour afternoon nap.

Okay, this makes sense.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

eating schedule

Six meals a day, lots of milk, meat, peanut butter, fruit, veggies.

Again, that makes sense.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

for a drug free lifter?

Wholly drug-free or No Illegal Drugs drug-free? I'd miss caffeine.

Only what is not banned by WADA. You could smoke a joint even, I
suppose.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

other words, the lifters job was to compete in powerlifting and he was
compensated handsomely for it. Would you lift 4 days/week? 5? 6?
Perhaps twice/day, 5 days per week? How about maintaining a bodyfat
percentage? 12-15%? 10%?

I'd stay at the top of my best weight class, and try hard to stay out
of superheavy.

And yet again, that makes sense.

John Hanson said:

But there is a difference between the Eastern Bloc lifters and the one
in my hypothetical. Those Eastern Bloc lifters had/have poor
nutrition and really good drugs. One of my teammates likes to tell
the story of being in the Chech Republic for Worlds at the after meet
dinner party. He said the lifters from Russia as well as another
country or two would go into the buffet line and put food in their
pockets for the ride home because they had nothing to eat. I've heard
these stories from other people too. Clary was telling me that back
in the 80s, a Russian lifter got his protein from the half gallon of
milk he was issued each day. That was basically it...that and lots of
drugs.

Don't know about drugs, but these food stories are fairytales. Food
wasn't "issued", but bought from grocery stores. The only exception
was at the time of USSR collapse, when the amount of certain products
you could buy was restricted. There was much smaller variety of food
than in the US, e.g. tangerines would generally only appear around New
Year, but no shortage of basic food including meat, fish and
vegetables. Pollock frozen fillet ("spinka mintaya"😉 was so cheap and
commonly deemed to be foul tasting, that it was considered cat
food. That powerlifter from the 80s should have upped his butch and
just eat the freaking pollock :-)

John Hanson said:

On 29 Mar 2006 18:51:16 -0800, [email hidden] wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

John Hanson said:

If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
optimum training,

3 mornings a week, squat, bench, and deadlift. Start the cycle with
50% 1RM. Squat to failure, bench to failure, deadlift almost to
failure. Add 10# to the squat bar every session. Add enough weight to
the bar on bench and deadlift to keep reps roughly even with squat. Go
to a new 1RM, take two weeks off, repeat. Aim new 1RM for meets.

Quoted message said:

I've never heard anything so ridiculous in my life. Why would you
want to lift to failure all the time?

'Want to?'

Quoted message said:

Plus, if I were to start at 50%
1RM and add ten pounds every session in the squat, I'd be maxing out 3
times/week for about 10 weeks.

Is that 600# raw and deep or 600# wide-stance good morning to parallel
wrapped like a mummy? If the former, wow. If the latter, I can suggest
a way to shorten your cycle....

In article <[email hidden]>,

John Hanson said:

I try to follow that training regimen. Which brings up a question.
I've been squatting Monday, heavy benching on Wednesday, deadlifting
on Friday and a short speed bench workout on Sunday. The rest of my
teammates do a two week cycle going M-squat, W-bench, F-deadlift,
M-bench, W-squat, F-light bench, light assistance and repeat the
following Monday. Anywho, every 4th week I do the second part of
their workout which is then my light week.

So, my next light week will be the week of the 10th. That gives me
two more heavy weeks going into meet week which will be just going to
my openers in the squat and deadlift on Monday and maybe 3-4 sets of
8-10 in the bench on Wednesday. Is there anything you'd change about
this plan?

I wouldn't do the heavy deadlift workout the friday of the second heavy
week. I'd go to your opener on the first week in the deadlift and then
just do speed/technique work on the second. But other than that, I'd do
pretty much what you suggest.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Training could be anywhere from 3 days per week to 6 days per week and
multiple training sessions per day would make a lot of sense no matter
how many days per week are trained. Systematic restoration methods also
would be built into the training means - including contrast baths,
lighter workouts, massage and possibly electrostimulation. Overall the
emphasis would be on increasing work capacity, so over time the number
of training sessions would increase until somewhere near capacity was
met.

Obviously if you are anything but a superheavy keeping body fat levels
in the low double digits makes sense. You would want a nutrition plan
that matches the overall training plan. The _average_ hours of sleep for
the American Olympic team at Atlanta was 9 hours per night and most of
them also napped for an hout or two in the afternoon. This would also
make sense as the overall work capacity increased the need for more rest
would also increase.

That makes sense. Would you ever want to add more fat in the off
season to help protect the joints? I've now known a couple of guys
who lift big weights who've dropped a great deal of weight and bodyfat
(one got into boxing) and they both said their joints really bothered
them as the fat came off.

I think the mechanism there is that they get used to the cushioning of
the fat and their joints adapt to that. When it isn't there they have a
greater range of motion and then their joints no longer have the
cushion. I wouldn't get fat between meets and I'd do ROM exercises aimed
at joint health - particularly the knees and shoulders. I wish I'd paid
more attention to my shoulders when I was powerlifting.

I kind of like these 'windmills' for the shoulders.

http://jva.ontariostrongman.ca/WINDMILLS.htm

Bottom line is high levels of fat aren't necessary for joint health.
Especially if you have large muscles.

--
Keith

On 30 Mar 2006 06:01:52 -0800, [email hidden] wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

John Hanson said:

On 29 Mar 2006 18:51:16 -0800, [email hidden] wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

John Hanson wrote:
> If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
> lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
> optimum training,

3 mornings a week, squat, bench, and deadlift. Start the cycle with
50% 1RM. Squat to failure, bench to failure, deadlift almost to
failure. Add 10# to the squat bar every session. Add enough weight to
the bar on bench and deadlift to keep reps roughly even with squat. Go
to a new 1RM, take two weeks off, repeat. Aim new 1RM for meets.

Quoted message said:

I've never heard anything so ridiculous in my life. Why would you
want to lift to failure all the time?

'Want to?'

Quoted message said:

Plus, if I were to start at 50%
1RM and add ten pounds every session in the squat, I'd be maxing out 3
times/week for about 10 weeks.

Is that 600# raw and deep or 600# wide-stance good morning to parallel
wrapped like a mummy? If the former, wow. If the latter, I can suggest
a way to shorten your cycle....

Below parallel and wrapped. As a "professional", that number would
climb to well above 700, I'm certain. I can only squat about 450 raw
and very deep. But, if I were a "professional", I'm sure the raw
numbers would be a lot higher after a while too. Besides, I've only
been training regularly for less than 4 years and I work full time.
Oh, and, I have damned good squat form and I don't go very wide. What
are your numbers?

On Thu, 30 Mar 2006 08:14:30 -0600, Hobbes <[email hidden]>
wrote in misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

John Hanson said:

I try to follow that training regimen. Which brings up a question.
I've been squatting Monday, heavy benching on Wednesday, deadlifting
on Friday and a short speed bench workout on Sunday. The rest of my
teammates do a two week cycle going M-squat, W-bench, F-deadlift,
M-bench, W-squat, F-light bench, light assistance and repeat the
following Monday. Anywho, every 4th week I do the second part of
their workout which is then my light week.

So, my next light week will be the week of the 10th. That gives me
two more heavy weeks going into meet week which will be just going to
my openers in the squat and deadlift on Monday and maybe 3-4 sets of
8-10 in the bench on Wednesday. Is there anything you'd change about
this plan?

I wouldn't do the heavy deadlift workout the friday of the second heavy
week. I'd go to your opener on the first week in the deadlift and then
just do speed/technique work on the second. But other than that, I'd do
pretty much what you suggest.

Good idea. What I'll probably do is what Cain calls setups the Friday
before. It's basically singles with a moderate weight in full gear.
Setup like you're in a meet, pull the weight, put it back down and
step off the platform, repeat a few times.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Training could be anywhere from 3 days per week to 6 days per week and
multiple training sessions per day would make a lot of sense no matter
how many days per week are trained. Systematic restoration methods also
would be built into the training means - including contrast baths,
lighter workouts, massage and possibly electrostimulation. Overall the
emphasis would be on increasing work capacity, so over time the number
of training sessions would increase until somewhere near capacity was
met.

Obviously if you are anything but a superheavy keeping body fat levels
in the low double digits makes sense. You would want a nutrition plan
that matches the overall training plan. The _average_ hours of sleep for
the American Olympic team at Atlanta was 9 hours per night and most of
them also napped for an hout or two in the afternoon. This would also
make sense as the overall work capacity increased the need for more rest
would also increase.

That makes sense. Would you ever want to add more fat in the off
season to help protect the joints? I've now known a couple of guys
who lift big weights who've dropped a great deal of weight and bodyfat
(one got into boxing) and they both said their joints really bothered
them as the fat came off.

I think the mechanism there is that they get used to the cushioning of
the fat and their joints adapt to that. When it isn't there they have a
greater range of motion and then their joints no longer have the
cushion. I wouldn't get fat between meets and I'd do ROM exercises aimed
at joint health - particularly the knees and shoulders. I wish I'd paid
more attention to my shoulders when I was powerlifting.

I kind of like these 'windmills' for the shoulders.

http://jva.ontariostrongman.ca/WINDMILLS.htm

Bottom line is high levels of fat aren't necessary for joint health.
Especially if you have large muscles.

I should have pointed out that these guys were probably around 15% and
dropped to single digits. So, I wouldn't say they were really fat.

Another side note, I'm cutting weight now and I thought it was going
fairly well. I was 230.0 Monday morning, 228.2 Tuesday and 229.4
Wednesday morning.

At the gym last night in the locker room, I slid the weight on the
scale over to about 234.5 with the intention of getting on and sliding
it back until the scale balanced. Keep in mind I've just started
taking creatine regularly and drinking lots of water. Anywho, I get
on and the scale indicator never moves. My immediate thought is I'm
242 for sure for Killeen and now all my plans are screwed. Then I
look down and one of the guys at the gym has put his foot on the
scale. Good humor.

I was 226.6 this morning.

On 30 Mar 2006 07:06:07 GMT, DZ
<[email hidden]> wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

John Hanson said:

But there is a difference between the Eastern Bloc lifters and the one
in my hypothetical. Those Eastern Bloc lifters had/have poor
nutrition and really good drugs. One of my teammates likes to tell
the story of being in the Chech Republic for Worlds at the after meet
dinner party. He said the lifters from Russia as well as another
country or two would go into the buffet line and put food in their
pockets for the ride home because they had nothing to eat. I've heard
these stories from other people too. Clary was telling me that back
in the 80s, a Russian lifter got his protein from the half gallon of
milk he was issued each day. That was basically it...that and lots of
drugs.

Don't know about drugs, but these food stories are fairytales. Food
wasn't "issued", but bought from grocery stores. The only exception
was at the time of USSR collapse, when the amount of certain products
you could buy was restricted. There was much smaller variety of food
than in the US, e.g. tangerines would generally only appear around New
Year, but no shortage of basic food including meat, fish and
vegetables. Pollock frozen fillet ("spinka mintaya"😉 was so cheap and
commonly deemed to be foul tasting, that it was considered cat
food. That powerlifter from the 80s should have upped his butch and
just eat the freaking pollock :-)

The Chech Republic thing happened in 2000.

"John Hanson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 30 Mar 2006 06:01:52 -0800, [email hidden] wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

John Hanson said:

On 29 Mar 2006 18:51:16 -0800, [email hidden] wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

>
>John Hanson wrote:
>> If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
>> lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
>> optimum training,
>
>3 mornings a week, squat, bench, and deadlift. Start the cycle with
>50% 1RM. Squat to failure, bench to failure, deadlift almost to
>failure. Add 10# to the squat bar every session. Add enough weight to
>the bar on bench and deadlift to keep reps roughly even with squat. Go
>to a new 1RM, take two weeks off, repeat. Aim new 1RM for meets.

Quoted message said:

I've never heard anything so ridiculous in my life. Why would you
want to lift to failure all the time?

'Want to?'

Quoted message said:

Plus, if I were to start at 50%
1RM and add ten pounds every session in the squat, I'd be maxing out 3
times/week for about 10 weeks.

Is that 600# raw and deep or 600# wide-stance good morning to parallel
wrapped like a mummy? If the former, wow. If the latter, I can suggest
a way to shorten your cycle....

Below parallel and wrapped. As a "professional", that number would
climb to well above 700, I'm certain. I can only squat about 450 raw
and very deep. But, if I were a "professional", I'm sure the raw
numbers would be a lot higher after a while too. Besides, I've only
been training regularly for less than 4 years and I work full time.
Oh, and, I have damned good squat form and I don't go very wide. What
are your numbers?

IIRC, T is a she - with a 2.5x bwt squat rock bottom, no wraps.

On Thu, 30 Mar 2006 09:18:25 -0600, "Ranieri" <nah> wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

"John Hanson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 30 Mar 2006 06:01:52 -0800, [email hidden] wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

Quoted message said:

John Hanson wrote:
> On 29 Mar 2006 18:51:16 -0800, [email hidden] wrote in
> misc.fitness.weights:
>
> >
> >John Hanson wrote:
> >> If there were such a thing as a professional powerlifting, where
> >> lifters got paid on par with golfers, what do you think would be the
> >> optimum training,
> >
> >3 mornings a week, squat, bench, and deadlift. Start the cycle with
> >50% 1RM. Squat to failure, bench to failure, deadlift almost to
> >failure. Add 10# to the squat bar every session. Add enough weight to
> >the bar on bench and deadlift to keep reps roughly even with squat. Go
> >to a new 1RM, take two weeks off, repeat. Aim new 1RM for meets.

> I've never heard anything so ridiculous in my life. Why would you
> want to lift to failure all the time?

'Want to?'

> Plus, if I were to start at 50%
> 1RM and add ten pounds every session in the squat, I'd be maxing out 3
> times/week for about 10 weeks.

Is that 600# raw and deep or 600# wide-stance good morning to parallel
wrapped like a mummy? If the former, wow. If the latter, I can suggest
a way to shorten your cycle....

Below parallel and wrapped. As a "professional", that number would
climb to well above 700, I'm certain. I can only squat about 450 raw
and very deep. But, if I were a "professional", I'm sure the raw
numbers would be a lot higher after a while too. Besides, I've only
been training regularly for less than 4 years and I work full time.
Oh, and, I have damned good squat form and I don't go very wide. What
are your numbers?

IIRC, T is a she - with a 2.5x bwt squat rock bottom, no wraps.

That's pretty damned good. Perhaps T and I should have a squat off.
We'll use the wilkes formula.

John Hanson said:

DZ said:

John Hanson said:

But there is a difference between the Eastern Bloc lifters and the one
in my hypothetical. Those Eastern Bloc lifters had/have poor
nutrition and really good drugs. One of my teammates likes to tell
the story of being in the Chech Republic for Worlds at the after meet
dinner party. He said the lifters from Russia as well as another
country or two would go into the buffet line and put food in their
pockets for the ride home because they had nothing to eat. I've heard
these stories from other people too. Clary was telling me that back
in the 80s, a Russian lifter got his protein from the half gallon of
milk he was issued each day. That was basically it...that and lots of
drugs.

Don't know about drugs, but these food stories are fairytales. Food
wasn't "issued", but bought from grocery stores. The only exception
was at the time of USSR collapse, when the amount of certain products
you could buy was restricted. There was much smaller variety of food
than in the US, e.g. tangerines would generally only appear around New
Year, but no shortage of basic food including meat, fish and
vegetables. Pollock frozen fillet ("spinka mintaya"😉 was so cheap and
commonly deemed to be foul tasting, that it was considered cat
food. That powerlifter from the 80s should have upped his butch and
just eat the freaking pollock :-)

The Chech Republic thing happened in 2000.

I spent about 2 months in Russia that year. By that time, you could
buy there just about anything you can imagine. It's just hard to
believe those powerlifters "had nothing to eat" unless they lived off
unemployment benefits. But I remember some of my US coworkers
hurriedly swallowing free pizza at every meeting, as if they were
deprived of any food for the entire week. Being a Russian, I'd stuff
my pants full with greasy polska kielbasa at any powerlifter meet
dinner party, just for giggles.