upperbody training

[leanman]

caught the end of a conversation a couple weekend warriors were having on a recent ride. the were talking about upperbody weight training.
one guy had a nice plan, but the other guy blew my mind.. just hearing why he dosent want to do any lifting blew me away.
in a nutshell, he isnt using any of his daily energy up for weights when all that energy can be going to the bike training.
unreal...
guys a cat 4 the past 4-5 years. 45 years old. works 8 hours a day. first thing i thought is where's the balance in his body. all leg training(riding) and wont lift a few times a week.
just curious to what everyoine does as far as weigt training or any kind of exercises.i dont know at all, but i imagine 99% of us on this board are guys that train when we can and race when we can, but do have familys and jobs, so having a balanced body seems to be only normal..plus what real man wouldnt be embarassed as hell if he cant get down right nowand do 50 pushups or a dozen pullups..
curious as to what everyone does to stay strong and fit.
thanks

 

[cyclissimo]

caught the end of a conversation a couple weekend warriors were having on a recent ride. ...one guy had a nice plan, but the other guy blew my mind.. just hearing why he dosent want to do any lifting blew me away...

Damn you really do spend a lot of time judging your riding companions and worrying about what they're thinking.

...in a nutshell, he isnt using any of his daily energy up for weights when all that energy can be going to the bike training....unreal...

No, that's a very real and well educated stance in terms of how weight training impacts cycling performance. Read some of this: http://www.cyclingforums.com/cycling-training/126133-gyming-improve-power.html

In a nutshell that's the exercise physiologists take on weights for cyclists. They're not specific to cycling, they may have benefits outside of cycling but in terms of improving cycling performance your time and energy would better be spent on the bike. The 'balance' argument is pure speculation.

Your 'real man' nonsense is just that, you want to do pushups down at the Y with the real men, knock yourself out. But you're in no position to pass judgment on riders who've actually made their own educated decisions as to the best use of their training time.

 

[leanman]

cyclissimo
just questions i ask. i am in no way judging people. they all can do what they want. just like you can tell me my upper body training will hamper my riding.
just asking what workouts people do thats all.
not at all worried about these guys plans. just like i could care less about yours. but i would be a bit curious as to why if i heard you say you didnt train upper body...
i was just out on an ez spin when i came up on them and heard them talking..
what floors me is their talk. almost bragging.. how these guys talk about how they live breath and sleep cycling. the point i'm making is they are just local guys like you and me. not pros that have to get results.
where they go wrong is they have an additute like they are in the last few days of the tour and want to use no energy for anything but riding.
.
i always thought if you got it you got it. pros do, we dont. they get put on a plan by the best coaches to have a BALANCED body.you would think a local cat 4 would want to have a balanced body.i aint worth a ****, but i do train hard, but also train hard lifting. i guess i was just curious as to why this guy choosesnot to exercise..

 

[DancenMacabre]

You are not serious right? C'mon, admit it and say you are kidding?

Cuz if you are serious then its not a sage comment.

A few bonus points at no charge to you:

1 - not everyone on this board is a guy

2 - the most unbalanced bodies i have ever seen where when i did hella weight training in the gym. you talk about all upper body & no legs. Lotsa guys looking like they were right out of jurassic park , as in T-REX!

3 - you, and everybody else here, has limited time/energy to train. you can divvy it up as you like but nothing will make your available training time go up OR make the time real life takes, you know job/family, go down.

4 - same thing with recovery. weights & enduro biking may differ in many ways but they'll make you tired. like training time, recovery ability is also limited.

5 - seems to me the real men i know and admire, would be embarassed about more important things than doing some # of pushups. You know, things like not providing for their family & loved ones, screwing up their relationships, being dishonest, being lazy at work.

 

[cyclissimo]

... pros do, we dont. they get put on a plan by the best coaches to have a BALANCED body....

Righhhhht, like this guy who at the time was the best road bike climber in the pro ranks. Yeah lot's of balance there...

 

[64Paramount]

You are not serious right? C'mon, admit it and say you are kidding?

Cuz if you are serious then its not a sage comment.

A few bonus points at no charge to you:

1 - not everyone on this board is a guy

2 - the most unbalanced bodies i have ever seen where when i did hella weight training in the gym. you talk about all upper body & no legs. Lotsa guys looking like they were right out of jurassic park , as in T-REX!

3 - you, and everybody else here, has limited time/energy to train. you can divvy it up as you like but nothing will make your available training time go up OR make the time real life takes, you know job/family, go down.

4 - same thing with recovery. weights & enduro biking may differ in many ways but they'll make you tired. like training time, recovery ability is also limited.

5 - seems to me the real men i know and admire, would be embarassed about more important things than doing some # of pushups. You know, things like not providing for their family & loved ones, screwing up their relationships, being dishonest, being lazy at work.

Good points, Dancen!

 

[Enriss]

2 - the most unbalanced bodies i have ever seen where when i did hella weight training in the gym. you talk about all upper body & no legs. Lotsa guys looking like they were right out of jurassic park , as in T-REX!

Yeah, there are way too many "bro" types who hang out in gyms and train for "t3h bicept peak" and huge chesticles.

 

[105k]

Damn you really do spend a lot of time judging your riding companions and worrying about what they're thinking.
No, that's a very real and well educated stance in terms of how weight training impacts cycling performance. Read some of this: http://www.cyclingforums.com/cycling-training/126133-gyming-improve-power.html

In a nutshell that's the exercise physiologists take on weights for cyclists. They're not specific to cycling, they may have benefits outside of cycling but in terms of improving cycling performance your time and energy would better be spent on the bike. The 'balance' argument is pure speculation.

Your 'real man' nonsense is just that, you want to do pushups down at the Y with the real men, knock yourself out. But you're in no position to pass judgment on riders who've actually made their own educated decisions as to the best use of their training time.

That study was done on already establish elite cyclist. People are making out as if working the leg muscles wont even help the cyclist.

Some form of strength and stretching maintenance would be essential for most mere mortals. Lets not forget there are more benefits to weight training than just "power". If the study is testing to see if elite cyclist can gain extra power by continuing a strength training regime while the other group discontinues, then maybe there wouldn't be any favorable results in power in the weight training group over the period of time the study was conducted.

 

[cyclissimo]

That study was done on already establish elite cyclist...

That study??? I linked a 29 page discussion not a single study, exactly what study are you referring to?

Some form of strength and stretching maintenance would be essential for most mere mortals...

O.K. that's an opinion not a statement of fact. What evidence do you have that Some form of strength and stretching maintenance would be essential for mere mortals? Let's not even get into the stretching debate, and yes it is a debate as to whether it's good, bad or indifferent.

But since you're not convinced by 'That study' how about these:
The effects of strength training on endurance perf... [Med Sci Sports Exerc. 1999] - PubMed result
The effects of replacing a portion of endurance tr... [Eur J Appl Physiol. 2001] - PubMed result
High resistance/low repetition vs. low resistance/... [J Strength Cond Res. 2007] - PubMed result

And yes, they are based on 'trained' athletes which includes just about anyone on these forums that rides more than a few days a week or races not necessarily professionals or full time athletes.

 

[jsirabella]

2 - the most unbalanced bodies i have ever seen where when i did hella weight training in the gym. you talk about all upper body & no legs. Lotsa guys looking like they were right out of jurassic park , as in T-REX!

I agree all good points but telling me that cyclist have big legs...hmmm. In anycase most weightlifters dislike leg day. I know I was never crazy about it. But compound exercises were my favorite....even though I can get felt to post by saying that squat are not a leg exercise but a lower back exercise....

As far as the OP...interesting post in a cycling forum. Well try mountain bike or cyclocross for upper body strength. It definitely requires atleast some.

Cycling is alot like golfing...geared for the weekend warrior and the older gent as you can do pretty well with a limited amount of time investment. Come to think of it that can go back to the strength training required in cycling. Obviously if these folks in there 50's can still perform that well...it tells you something.

-js

 

[grahamspringett]

What exactly is a balanced body? A good cyclist doesn't have thighs like tree trunks and arms like twigs. They're just normal guys.

It's just that their heart, lungs and muscles are efficient at shifting oxygen and fuel to muscles. Huge leg strength is nothing to do with it. I can roll a 53x11 just like any other pro, it's just that I can't do it anywhere near as long as the pros do.

I read somewhere that if you're strong enough to climb stairs, you've got enough strength to road race.

I'm having a pretty decent season this year and haven't touched weights since I was a junior. It's all about training your aerobic engine to deliver a constant flow of power to the pistons, not about having huge legs and huge biceps. As far as I'm concerned upper body muscle mass is extra weight. I'd rather be lean.

Feel free to lift weights and go for a toned upper and lower body. But if you want to be a good cyclist, weights are more than likely a waste of time and energy for busy amateurs. Don't express incredulity if you hear local low-grade amateurs saying they don't do weights - they're making the best of their limited time to train. They're probably more on the right lines than you are as far as racing is concerned.

 

[frenchyge]

i aint worth a ****, but i do train hard, but also train hard lifting.

Maybe you could be worth a **** if you really put your mind to one thing or the other.

Some people would prefer to be good at something rather than being equally not worth a **** at anything.

 

[bubsy]

l'm pretty sure a large percentage of posters here reguardless of what cat they are don't touch weights upper or lower body me included but l'm far from an upper body midget.
Also the chicken is a stick from top to bottom barely any meat on his legs, glutes or calves.

 

[grahamspringett]

l'm pretty sure a large percentage of posters here reguardless of what cat they are don't touch weights upper or lower body me included but l'm far from an upper body midget.
Also the chicken is a stick from top to bottom barely any meat on his legs, glutes or calves.

Bet you won't want upper body muscle mass on Sunday morning, Bubs! 32km up the mountain with legs spinning all the way. Arms are just there to stop your chin hitting the stem so you won't need huge biceps.

 

[bubsy]

........

 

[daveryanwyoming]

...I read somewhere that if you're strong enough to climb stairs, you've got enough strength to road race....

Yeah IIRC, Ric says something like: if you can stand up from a chair you've got more than enough strength to ride and race...

Here's a screen shot from WKO+ showing data from a race this past summer. It took a whopping 53 pounds per pedal stroke to deliver 416 watts or nearly 6 watts per kg. Sure I only held that for a minute and pros manage that for an hour or more but the difference isn't leg strength as moving my body weight up a flight of stairs requires more than three times that force per step. The difference is the ability to continue supplying fuel to my muscles at that rate for extended periods and that's all about metabolic fitness, not leg strength.

But this thread isn't really about leg strength, seems more like a troll for upper body fitness that real men should all aspire to have.

-Dave
P.S. I also like quiche...

 

[frenchyge]

But this thread isn't really about leg strength, seems more like a troll for upper body fitness that real men should all aspire to have.

....AND women. Let's be fair, and inclusive.

 

[daveryanwyoming]

....AND women. Let's be fair, and inclusive.

I'm with ya, but no sense dragging down both genders when the OP was real clear about why we should do upper body work:

...what real man wouldnt be embarassed as hell if he cant get down right nowand do 50 pushups or a dozen pullups..

I'm guessin' the 'real man' standing on the TDF podium or winning the local hill climb wouldn't be too embarrassed, but maybe that's one of those fallacies by definition...

-Dave

[edit] Dohhh, real men don't use smiley faces either...

 

[DancenMacabre]

Thanks Frenchy & Dave for making sure I didnt get left out. Now for sure, I'm in the club, ya'know?

 

[swampy1970]

Righhhhht, like this guy who at the time was the best road bike climber in the pro ranks. Yeah lot's of balance there...

He is balanced - fecking skinny all over. Doesn't matter what part of the body you're looking at (or trying to avoid looking at) you can be rest assured that most Sparrows have more meat on them...