Vaccines cause autism--Geier

"john" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"In my view, this is not a scientific issue. This is about as proven
an issue as you're ever going to see, and what's occurring here is a
cover up under the guise of protecting the vaccine program. And I'm
for the vaccine program. You keep covering it up and your not going to
have a vaccine program," Geier

http://www.detnow.com/wxyz/ys_investigations/article/0,2132,WXYZ_15949_2650117,00.html

Interesting. Geier claims to have evidence that thimersal is still in
vaccines. Let's see it. Geier is correct in one respect. This is not a
scientific issue. There is no evidence to support the contention that
thimersal in vaccines causes autism. Science is about making hypotheses and
supporting them with evidence. No evidence, no science.

Nearly all of the scientific evidence to date shows that autism does not
cause autism.

And with the bottom line being tht there is no scientific reason to beleive
that thimersal causes autism, Geier's view has nothing to do with science.

Jeff

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Vaccines cause autism--Geier
From: "Jeff" [email hidden]
Date: 2/15/2004 1:02 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

"john" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"In my view, this is not a scientific issue. This is about as proven
an issue as you're ever going to see, and what's occurring here is a
cover up under the guise of protecting the vaccine program. And I'm
for the vaccine program. You keep covering it up and your not going to
have a vaccine program," Geier

http://www.detnow.com/wxyz/ys_investigations/article/0,2132,WXYZ_15949_26

50117,00.html

Quoted message said:

Interesting. Geier claims to have evidence that thimersal is still in
vaccines. Let's see it. Geier is correct in one respect. This is not a
scientific issue. There is no evidence to support the contention that
thimersal in vaccines causes autism. Science is about making hypotheses and
supporting them with evidence. No evidence, no science.

Nearly all of the scientific evidence to date shows that autism does not
cause autism.

And with the bottom line being tht there is no scientific reason to beleive
that thimersal causes autism, Geier's view has nothing to do with science.

Jeff

http://www.insightmag.com/news/573542.html

"We went to Atlanta," he continues, "to the CDC, and looked at the VSD data.
There is thimerosal-containing DTaP [diphtheria, tetanus and pertussis vaccine]
and thimerosal-free DTaP, so we asked a question: Among children that got a
minimum of either three consecutive thimerosal-containing DTaPs or three
consecutive thimerosal-free DTaPs, was there a difference in the number of
autism cases in the two groups? We found mega differences. More than 20 times
higher. The rate of autism in the children that got more than three doses of
thimerosal-containing DTaP vaccines was much, much higher. Almost all the
children that have autism in that group were the ones that got the
thimerosal-containing DTaP vaccine. The more thimerosal the greater the cases
of autism."

Mark Geier says, "Believe us, there is no scientific issue here. This is fraud.
The CDC and the FDA [Food and Drug Administration] know what is happening. They
just can't admit it because it is one of the worst things ever to have happened
to this United States. If a terrorist had done this, we wouldn't attack them,
we'd nuke them. We're talking about one in eight children in the U.S. that
currently are in special education, and that number is going to change to about
one in five. What percentage of our young population can we destroy before we
realize how serious this is?"

Lyn Redwood, a registered nurse, mother of an autistic child and president and
cofounder of www.SafeMinds.org (Sensible Action for Ending Mercury-Induced
Neurological Disorders), a nonprofit organization dedicated to ending
devastation caused by the needless use of mercury in medicines, tells Insight
that "there are so many problems with the study, but over time you can see how
all the manipulations of the data slowly bring down the signals for
neurological disorders. I think they were trying to get lower numbers. It must
be very hard to admit that a program that was designed to eradicate infectious
disease has resulted in an epidemic of a whole new kind of disease. But to
think that we weren't given a choice when the regulators and manufacturers knew
these products contained mercury is inconceivable."

Redwood says with a sigh, "On a scale of one to 10, I give the CDC study a big
fat zero. I think it started out good, but when they saw the early numbers it
scared the hell out of them. I don't have any faith in the CDC doing a decent
study of this matter. It's like having the tobacco industry monitor cigarettes
for safety. From a parent's perspective and from a health-care professional's
perspective it's maddening that we can't get products that are safe, and yet
we're forced by law to use them. They need to just get the thimerosal out. It's
barbaric."

Jan

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

http://www.insightmag.com/news/573542.html

Mark Geier says, "Believe us, there is no scientific issue here. This
is fraud. The CDC and the FDA [Food and Drug Administration] know what
is happening. They just can't admit it because it is one of the worst
things ever to have happened to this United States. If a terrorist had
done this, we wouldn't attack them, we'd nuke them. We're talking
about one in eight children in the U.S. that currently are in special
education, and that number is going to change to about one in five.
What percentage of our young population can we destroy before we
realize how serious this is?"

Geier is engaging in the logical fallacy of shifting the goalposts here,
magically jumping from the number of children with autism to the number of
children receiving special education services. But, IIRC, about half of
those children are simply receiving special reading instruction because of
dyslexia, and another quarter are simply receiving speech therapy. Only a
minority of students receiving special education services are doing so
because of severe impairments like autism.

As Mark Probert, among others, has pointed out, the reason the number of
children receiving special education services in the past couple of decades
has increased so much is simply that Congress managed to put some teeth
into the special-education laws; before they did, children with mild
impairments weren't getting the services they needed. It's rather like
what happened with crime in New York City back in 1951; the reported crime
rate increased massively, but the reason was simply that a new police
commissioner instituted reforms that stopped the police from discarding
reports of unsolved cases.

And once again, while the incidence of autism has increased, the incidence
of developmental disabilities (of which autism is one) in general has
increased much less, if at all.

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Vaccines cause autism--Geier
From: Eric Bohlman [email hidden]
Date: 2/15/2004 6:13 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

http://www.insightmag.com/news/573542.html

Mark Geier says, "Believe us, there is no scientific issue here. This
is fraud. The CDC and the FDA [Food and Drug Administration] know what
is happening. They just can't admit it because it is one of the worst
things ever to have happened to this United States. If a terrorist had
done this, we wouldn't attack them, we'd nuke them. We're talking
about one in eight children in the U.S. that currently are in special
education, and that number is going to change to about one in five.
What percentage of our young population can we destroy before we
realize how serious this is?"

Geier is engaging in the logical fallacy of shifting the goalposts here,
magically jumping from the number of children with autism to the number of
children receiving special education services. But, IIRC, about half of
those children are simply receiving special reading instruction because of
dyslexia, and another quarter are simply receiving speech therapy. Only a
minority of students receiving special education services are doing so
because of severe impairments like autism.

As Mark Probert, among others, has pointed out, the reason the number of
children receiving special education services in the past couple of decades
has increased so much is simply that Congress managed to put some teeth
into the special-education laws; before they did, children with mild
impairments weren't getting the services they needed. It's rather like
what happened with crime in New York City back in 1951; the reported crime
rate increased massively, but the reason was simply that a new police
commissioner instituted reforms that stopped the police from discarding
reports of unsolved cases.

And once again, while the incidence of autism has increased, the incidence
of developmental disabilities (of which autism is one) in general has
increased much less, if at all.

I doubt that.

http://www.drz.org/asp/conditions/ADD_ADHD_LD.asp

It is difficult to seperate the causes.

Anything that *Mark Probert and others* have said comes straight out of the
mouth of organized medicine. Once again making excuses so they are not to
blame.

http://www.chem-tox.com/pregnancy/mercury.htm

http://www.healingwithnutrition.com/adisease/add-adhd/toxicexposure.html

http://vitalpathhealthcentre.com/heavymetals.htm

http://www.panna.org/resources/gpc/gpc_200308.13.2.09.dv.html

Jan

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Vaccines cause autism--Geier
From: Eric Bohlman [email hidden]
Date: 2/15/2004 6:13 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

http://www.insightmag.com/news/573542.html

Mark Geier says, "Believe us, there is no scientific issue here. This
is fraud. The CDC and the FDA [Food and Drug Administration] know what
is happening. They just can't admit it because it is one of the worst
things ever to have happened to this United States. If a terrorist had
done this, we wouldn't attack them, we'd nuke them. We're talking
about one in eight children in the U.S. that currently are in special
education, and that number is going to change to about one in five.
What percentage of our young population can we destroy before we
realize how serious this is?"

Geier is engaging in the logical fallacy

Because he disagrees with organized medicine???

Mark Geier, M.D., Ph.D., is president of the Genetic Centers of America. He and
his son, David Geier, president of Medcon Inc., are consultants on vaccine
cases. David Geier tells Insight, "What happened here is Dr. Verstraeten goes
to the Institute of Medicine [IOM] and says that he looked at it in one
California HMO and it was statistical and he saw the effect, and then he did it
in another California HMO and it was statistical and he saw the effect, then he
went to Harvard Pilgrim HMO and he didn't see the effect. The IOM said it's
biologically plausible, but the epidemiology is mixed and therefore we're not
sure."

"In my opinion," explains Mark Geier, "if they had seen clear epidemiology they
would have recommended the immediate removal of thimerosal and hundreds of
children would have been saved.

Therein lies the problem.

While EGO games are being played, it took far too long to remove the
thimerosal, that should have never been used in the first place.

There remains a group of hard heads, who still say it was removed for political
reasons.

They can' admit it was a huge mistake.

Jan

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

From: Eric Bohlman [email hidden]
Date: 2/15/2004 6:13 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

And once again, while the incidence of autism has increased, the
incidence of developmental disabilities (of which autism is one) in
general has increased much less, if at all.

I doubt that.

http://www.drz.org/asp/conditions/ADD_ADHD_LD.asp

It is difficult to seperate the causes.

ADHD and learning disabilities are not considered developmental
disabilities, and so they don't show up in counts of kids diagnosed with
developmental disabilities. It's the latter counts I was talking about,
and they have *not* gone up anywhere near as much as autism counts, which
logically implies that as the incidence of autism has gone up, the
incidence of at least some other developmental disabilities has decreased.

And that in turn raises the *possibility* that many kids who are now being
diagnosed with autism would have been diagnosed with some other
developmental disability in the past. It's not the only possibility; one
thing could be resulting in fewer non-autistic DDs while something else
could be causing increased autism. But it's definitely one that needs to
be carefully considered.

I forgot to mention in my previous message that another reason the number
of kids requiring special education has increased is that premature babies
are now quite a bit more likely to survive than they were in the past, and
many of them wind up having special needs.

"Jeff" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"john" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"In my view, this is not a scientific issue. This is about as proven
an issue as you're ever going to see, and what's occurring here is a
cover up under the guise of protecting the vaccine program. And I'm
for the vaccine program. You keep covering it up and your not going to
have a vaccine program," Geier

http://www.detnow.com/wxyz/ys_investigations/article/0,2132,WXYZ_15949_2650117,00.html

Quoted message said:

Interesting. Geier claims to have evidence that thimersal is still in
vaccines. Let's see it. Geier is correct in one respect. This is not a
scientific issue. There is no evidence to support the contention that
thimersal in vaccines causes autism. Science is about making hypotheses

and

Quoted message said:

supporting them with evidence. No evidence, no science.

Nearly all of the scientific evidence to date shows that autism does not
cause autism.

(Jeff, you may want to re-word that).

Quoted message said:

And with the bottom line being tht there is no scientific reason to

beleive

Quoted message said:

that thimersal causes autism, Geier's view has nothing to do with science.

Jeff

"Jan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Vaccines cause autism--Geier
From: Eric Bohlman [email hidden]
Date: 2/15/2004 6:13 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

http://www.insightmag.com/news/573542.html

Mark Geier says, "Believe us, there is no scientific issue here. This
is fraud. The CDC and the FDA [Food and Drug Administration] know what
is happening. They just can't admit it because it is one of the worst
things ever to have happened to this United States. If a terrorist had
done this, we wouldn't attack them, we'd nuke them. We're talking
about one in eight children in the U.S. that currently are in special
education, and that number is going to change to about one in five.
What percentage of our young population can we destroy before we
realize how serious this is?"

Geier is engaging in the logical fallacy of shifting the goalposts here,
magically jumping from the number of children with autism to the number

of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

children receiving special education services. But, IIRC, about half of
those children are simply receiving special reading instruction because

of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

dyslexia, and another quarter are simply receiving speech therapy. Only

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

minority of students receiving special education services are doing so
because of severe impairments like autism.

As Mark Probert, among others, has pointed out, the reason the number of
children receiving special education services in the past couple of

decades

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

has increased so much is simply that Congress managed to put some teeth
into the special-education laws; before they did, children with mild
impairments weren't getting the services they needed. It's rather like
what happened with crime in New York City back in 1951; the reported

crime

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

rate increased massively, but the reason was simply that a new police
commissioner instituted reforms that stopped the police from discarding
reports of unsolved cases.

And once again, while the incidence of autism has increased, the

incidence

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

of developmental disabilities (of which autism is one) in general has
increased much less, if at all.

I doubt that.

http://www.drz.org/asp/conditions/ADD_ADHD_LD.asp

It is difficult to seperate the causes.

Anything that *Mark Probert and others* have said comes straight out of

the

Quoted message said:

mouth of organized medicine. Once again making excuses so they are not to
blame.

What Eric attributed to me was not an excuse, but a simple fact that, as
usual, Jan either does not understand, or cannot handle, or both.

If Jan was familiar with speciasl education, she would be familiar with the
1991 Department of Education Memorandum that told the states to start doing
their jobs and educating children by finding out why they are not learning.

Quoted message said:

http://www.chem-tox.com/pregnancy/mercury.htm

http://www.healingwithnutrition.com/adisease/add-adhd/toxicexposure.html

http://vitalpathhealthcentre.com/heavymetals.htm

http://www.panna.org/resources/gpc/gpc_200308.13.2.09.dv.html

Jan

Jeff said:

"john" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"In my view, this is not a scientific issue. This is about as proven
an issue as you're ever going to see, and what's occurring here is a
cover up under the guise of protecting the vaccine program. And I'm
for the vaccine program. You keep covering it up and your not going to
have a vaccine program," Geier

http://www.detnow.com/wxyz/ys_investigations/article/0,2132,WXYZ_15949_2650117,00.html

Interesting. Geier claims to have evidence that thimersal is still in
vaccines. Let's see it. Geier is correct in one respect. This is not a
scientific issue. There is no evidence to support the contention that
thimersal in vaccines causes autism. Science is about making hypotheses and
supporting them with evidence. No evidence, no science.

Nearly all of the scientific evidence to date shows that autism does not
cause autism.

And with the bottom line being tht there is no scientific reason to beleive
that thimersal causes autism, Geier's view has nothing to do with science.

Jeff

Mercury can cause autism. Thimersal is 1/2 mercury.

"Jeff" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"john" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"In my view, this is not a scientific issue. This is about as proven
an issue as you're ever going to see, and what's occurring here is a
cover up under the guise of protecting the vaccine program. And I'm
for the vaccine program. You keep covering it up and your not going to
have a vaccine program," Geier

http://www.detnow.com/wxyz/ys_investigations/article/0,2132,WXYZ_15949_2650117,00.html

Quoted message said:

Interesting. Geier claims to have evidence that thimersal is still in
vaccines. Let's see it. Geier is correct in one respect. This is not a
scientific issue. There is no evidence to support the contention that
thimersal in vaccines causes autism. Science is about making hypotheses

and

Quoted message said:

supporting them with evidence. No evidence, no science.

Nearly all of the scientific evidence to date shows that autism does not
cause autism.

I meant ot state that nearly all of the scientific evidence to date shows
that vaccines do not cause autism. Thanks Mark.

Quoted message said:

And with the bottom line being tht there is no scientific reason to

beleive

Quoted message said:

that thimersal causes autism, Geier's view has nothing to do with science.

Jeff

"Identity" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Jeff wrote:

....>

Quoted message said:

Mercury can cause autism. Thimersal is 1/2 mercury.

Proof please... it seems the most recent research counters that statement
(by the way, the "1/2" bit is due to the mercury atomic weight more than
anything else):

http://www.jfponline.com/content/2004/02/jfp_0204_00094.asp

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=14678319&dopt=Abstract

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=14595043&dopt=Abstract

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=12949291&dopt=Abstract

"Identity" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Jeff said:

"john" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"In my view, this is not a scientific issue. This is about as proven
an issue as you're ever going to see, and what's occurring here is a
cover up under the guise of protecting the vaccine program. And I'm
for the vaccine program. You keep covering it up and your not going to
have a vaccine program," Geier

http://www.detnow.com/wxyz/ys_investigations/article/0,2132,WXYZ_15949_2650117,00.html

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Interesting. Geier claims to have evidence that thimersal is still in
vaccines. Let's see it. Geier is correct in one respect. This is not a
scientific issue. There is no evidence to support the contention that
thimersal in vaccines causes autism. Science is about making hypotheses

and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

supporting them with evidence. No evidence, no science.

Nearly all of the scientific evidence to date shows that autism does not
cause autism.

And with the bottom line being tht there is no scientific reason to

beleive

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

that thimersal causes autism, Geier's view has nothing to do with

science.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Jeff

Mercury can cause autism. Thimersal is 1/2 mercury.

Care to post some real proof that there is a causl relationship?

"HCN" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:B_7Yb.197998$U%5.1042164@attbi_s03...

Quoted message said:

"Identity" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Jeff wrote:

...>

Quoted message said:

Mercury can cause autism. Thimersal is 1/2 mercury.

Proof please... it seems the most recent research counters that statement
(by the way, the "1/2" bit is due to the mercury atomic weight more than
anything else):

True, but the idea that it is 1/2 mercury is much scarier than what you
said....

Quoted message said:

http://www.jfponline.com/content/2004/02/jfp_0204_00094.asp

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=14678319&dopt=Abstract

Quoted message said:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=14595043&dopt=Abstract

Quoted message said:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=12949291&dopt=Abstract

Quoted message said:

"Eric Bohlman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

http://www.insightmag.com/news/573542.html

Mark Geier says, "Believe us, there is no scientific issue here. This
is fraud. The CDC and the FDA [Food and Drug Administration] know what
is happening. They just can't admit it because it is one of the worst
things ever to have happened to this United States. If a terrorist had
done this, we wouldn't attack them, we'd nuke them. We're talking
about one in eight children in the U.S. that currently are in special
education, and that number is going to change to about one in five.
What percentage of our young population can we destroy before we
realize how serious this is?"

Geier is engaging in the logical fallacy of shifting the goalposts here,
magically jumping from the number of children with autism to the number of
children receiving special education services. But, IIRC, about half of
those children are simply receiving special reading instruction because of
dyslexia, and another quarter are simply receiving speech therapy. Only a
minority of students receiving special education services are doing so
because of severe impairments like autism.

As Mark Probert, among others, has pointed out, the reason the number of
children receiving special education services in the past couple of

decades

Quoted message said:

has increased so much is simply that Congress managed to put some teeth
into the special-education laws;

snip....

Here is the relevant language from the memorandum SEA (State Education
Agency; LEA Local Education Agency):

"SEAs and LEAs have an affirmative obligation to evaluate a child who is
suspected of having a disability to determine the child's need for special
education and related services. Under Part B, SEAs and LEAs are required to
have procedures for locating, identifying and evaluating all children who
have a disability or are suspected of having a disability and are in need of
special education and related services. 34 CFR ''300.128 and 300.220. This
responsibility, known as "child find," is applicable to all children from
birth through 21, regardless of the severity of their disability."

http://www.add.org/content/legal/memo.htm

Once they started to look for ADHD, which was the original intent of the
memo, they started finding other problems, including autism.

Another point you made, i.e., the increased survival rate of premature
babies is right on. I was elected to be a school district trustee and began
my term on July 1, 1988. During that July I attended a conference in
Albany,NY which had a bunch of workshops, one being on the growth of special
education and what was fueling it.

The facilitator mentioned exactly that point, i.e., that more premature
babies were surviving and that they would also swell the ranks of special
education.

Which, in retropect, is a very interesting popint, since less than 1 month
later, on 8/8/88, my son was born 11 weeks early and began early
intervenetion whenhe was 4 mos. old and remains in a special school
(nicknamed "The Harvard of Special Education"😉 through today.

And, Jan calls this an excuse.

Identity <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Mercury can cause autism.

Please provide references to the peer-reviewed scientific literature
that support this assertion.

Quoted message said:

Thimersal is 1/2 mercury.

Table salt is 1/2 sodium. What is your point?

Quoted message said:

Identity <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Mercury can cause autism.

Please provide references to the peer-reviewed scientific literature
that support this assertion.

Quoted message said:

Thimersal is 1/2 mercury.

Table salt is 1/2 sodium. What is your point?

Table Salt Causes Autism!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"Mark ProbertFebruary 16, 2004" <[email hidden]>
wrote in news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

The facilitator mentioned exactly that point, i.e., that more
premature babies were surviving and that they would also swell the
ranks of special education.

It's interesting how what looks like bad news can often really be good news
in disguise. My favorite example was a recent study of the prevalence of
diabetes in Denmark. It had gone up quite a bit. But that turned out to
be something to celebrate, because the increase in prevalence (number of
diabetics per 10,000 people) wasn't the result of an increase in incidence
(number of new cases of diabetes diagnosed each year per 10,000 people).
It was the result of reduced mortality; diabetics were living longer after
diagnosis, thus swelling their ranks.

Identity <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Jeff said:

"john" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"In my view, this is not a scientific issue. This is about as proven
an issue as you're ever going to see, and what's occurring here is a
cover up under the guise of protecting the vaccine program. And I'm
for the vaccine program. You keep covering it up and your not going to
have a vaccine program," Geier

http://www.detnow.com/wxyz/ys_investigations/article/0,2132,WXYZ_15949_2650117,00.html

Interesting. Geier claims to have evidence that thimersal is still in
vaccines. Let's see it. Geier is correct in one respect. This is not a
scientific issue. There is no evidence to support the contention that
thimersal in vaccines causes autism. Science is about making hypotheses and
supporting them with evidence. No evidence, no science.

Nearly all of the scientific evidence to date shows that autism does not
cause autism.

And with the bottom line being tht there is no scientific reason to beleive
that thimersal causes autism, Geier's view has nothing to do with science.

Jeff

Mercury can cause autism. Thimersal is 1/2 mercury.

Sodium can cause horrendous chemical burns and explosive reactions;
table salt is 1/2 sodium.

Mark, MD

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Vaccines cause autism--Geier
From: Eric Bohlman [email hidden]
Date: 2/15/2004 11:36 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

From: Eric Bohlman [email hidden]
Date: 2/15/2004 6:13 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

And once again, while the incidence of autism has increased, the
incidence of developmental disabilities (of which autism is one) in
general has increased much less, if at all.

I doubt that.

http://www.drz.org/asp/conditions/ADD_ADHD_LD.asp

It is difficult to seperate the causes.

ADHD and learning disabilities are not considered developmental
disabilities, and so they don't show up in counts of kids diagnosed with
developmental disabilities. It's the latter counts I was talking about,
and they have *not* gone up anywhere near as much as autism counts, which
logically implies that as the incidence of autism has gone up, the
incidence of at least some other developmental disabilities has decreased.

And that in turn raises the *possibility* that many kids who are now being
diagnosed with autism would have been diagnosed with some other
developmental disability in the past. It's not the only possibility; one
thing could be resulting in fewer non-autistic DDs while something else
could be causing increased autism. But it's definitely one that needs to
be carefully considered.

I forgot to mention in my previous message that another reason the number
of kids requiring special education has increased is that premature babies
are now quite a bit more likely to survive than they were in the past, and
many of them wind up having special needs.

Me thinks you are trying to make excuses because conventional medicine has done
very little except *drug* kids.

They don't want to look at the real causes, because it lays them wide open to
show when they have erred.

Jan