Basic Kitchen Equipment

Judith Umbria said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Judith, I started the thread as an extension to the thread "food snob"

where we are discussing the poor and one possible problem being lack of

equipment and cooking skills.>>

First I'd think you have to get them out of motels and cheap innercity
hotels! But really, I don't live in N America and the list that has
goings on about toast at length would mean nothing here.
If people in NA are to get healthy home-cooked meals, they need
vegetables plus proteins and therefore most times more than one pot.
Toaster ovens are a luxury product I think and I have never had one in
the US or anywhere.
Each culture has its own list. Some eat rice every meal, for others
pasta is non-negotiable, for others tortillas.

A vast majority of the poor do not live in motels or innercity hotels.
We have poor right here in my community and we are a heck of a long way
from a city! You will find poor living in cities, on the streets, in
homeless shelters, in row housing, in apartments, in single family
homes, in rural areas and anywhere else I haven't listed. I listed one
large and one small sauce pan with lids plus a fry pan. That should be
enough to be able to cook meat plus one or two side dishes such as
pasta, rice, or veggie. I did not list a toaster oven but I did list a
toaster as that opens up the possibilities for a lot of breakfast items
even if not cooked from scratch. IMO rice can be cooked in a pot on the
stove if you learn how. So with those basic utensils someone learning
to cook healthy home cooked meals would at least have a start. Again
this thread was started and directed at beginning cooks on limited
incomes. Obviously you do not fit that category.

ms_peacock said:

"~patches~" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Judith Umbria said:

>>Ok, so what are you criticizing for?

The thread is aimed at the MINIMAL needs.
--
Peace, Om. <<

But clearly the minimal needs are slowly being defined as N American.
If I were actually given the responsibility to outfit a minimal
kitchen, I'd try to give the user some scope for real cooking, which
would be impossible with one pot of any size. I certainly wouldn't
provide a steak knife and no other, no matter than anyone here used or
uses a steak knife exclusively. And I would know that using a
vegetable peeler won't get you far with an onion, for example. Or a
whole pepper. Or an orange. And before someone says use a chef's
knife, let's remember that a tool that is too big, not sharp enough or
otherwise not right for the job is dangerous.

Judith, I started the thread as an extension to the thread "food snob"
where we are discussing the poor and one possible problem being lack of
equipment and cooking skills. A basic list is nice in that it might help
someone see that they don't need a lot of equipment to start cooking.
Many of the items I initally listed can be found at a dollar store as
well. So if you take away the high cost of equipment there is even a
greater incentive to start cooking. A college student on their own or a
teenage mom with limited funds or someone on welfare could look at this
list and say ok, it isn't complicated and it isn't expensive - I could do
that. That is what my intentions were. I mentioned that this list is
significantly less than what my equipment is but everyone has to start
somewhere.

So you're somehow operating under the impression "the poor" have computers
and are reading usenet?

Has it ever occured to you that those without computers can access
computers at their public library? Students without computers can
access through schools. Boy that was a tough one but I'm sure if you
try hard enough you can wrap your head around it.

Quoted message said:

I do taxes. We ask two questions during the course of the process. One,
"do you have an email address," almost universally answered "no." Second,
"do you have a checking or savings account," also almost universally
answered "no."

So how is it you think your little exercise is helpful to anyone?

We've had words before and quite frankly I just don't care to respond to
you. If you can't see any value in discussion then you're worse of than
my initial assessment.

Quoted message said:

I personally don't think there are more than a handful of people on this
list that have ever even been poor.

Whatever

Bye

Quoted message said:

Ms P

"Michael "Dog3" Lonergan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Nancy Young" <[email hidden]> hitched up their panties and posted
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

"sarah bennett" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

I've never seen a suburban apartment that did not have a working
stove and oven.

I don't think I've ever lived anywhere it wasn't required
by law to have a working oven.

nancy

I have absolutely no idea about the laws. I do remember looking at a
house
to rent, when I first moved to St. Louis. The house had NO appliances. No
stove or fridge. I didn't rent it and bought a condo instead. I wonder
if
the laws have changed.

Michael

Like houses that are being sold, rental houses often require the tenant to
provide their own appliances. And, sometimes they don't.

"Default User" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Doug Kanter said:

"Default User" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Doug Kanter wrote:

[power cycles and effect on computers]

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

That's based on my experience as an electronics test engineer who
dealt with computer equipment. I turn off the monitor because it's
a big power draw and has high reliability compared to the other
items.

What's your contention based on?

It's based on mixed results of studies from companies like HP, Dell &
Compaq over the years, described several years ago in either PC
Magazine or PC World - I don't recall which. They said that
obviously, you shouldn't turn it off & on every time you get up to
use the bathroom, but on in the morning and off at the end of the
day? No extra wear they could point to.

Studies I read in days past seemed to indicate the other way, that the
heat swings of power cycles stressed the boards and components. It also
went along with my personal experience of the various workstations and
PCs we had in the labs, I tended to see fewer problems with the 24/7
machines.

Quoted message said:

My own experience seems to
bear out these ideas. There are 3 machines here, all with hard disks
over 8 years old. One runs day & night as a server. The other two are
shut down at night. No failures for any of them.

I haven't seen anything from you that changes my mind. That's the cool
thing, I only said that I "firmly believe" that it's true. It would
take compelling evidence to change that.

Apparently, we've both adopted practices based on our observations. What a
concept. What's interesting, though, is that we both seem to have seen the
same results: Equipment that lasts a long time. And, this has happened by
doing things both your way and mine. What does this mean?

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Nancy Young said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"Nancy Young" <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted message said:

> You buy your appliances at the crappy appliance store?
> Dishwashers suck, self cleaning ovens suck. (laugh)

I don't own a dishwasher.....

Yes, I know, you said. They have all these horrible flaws.
That all the ones I've ever used don't.

I don't think that was me...
The only things I have against dishwashers is the waste of space,
electricity and water.

Space: That's up to the individual. Probably true in some kitchens.

Electricity: Not likely, as long as you think in terms of TOTAL energy use.
If you wash dishes by hand, and rinse them properly, your water heater will
run more than it does when it provides hot water to a dishwasher, even if
it's a gas-fired water heater. So, one washing method balances the other.

Water: Guess how much water a modern dishwasher uses.

"jake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

jake said:

>>Is this heresy? I would leave all the baking/oven stuff out, event he
>>toaster. But then I'm from a culture where breakfast is sandwiches.
>
>
>same here. sammiches, frenchfries, corned beef. leftovers are far, far
>better than breakfasts, imho.
>
>Lena

I really meant just sandwiches! Nothing hot! Or cooked (other than
occasional boiled eggs, typically on Sundays). No porridge, no dinner
types of foods.

Classics: bread with PB, or jam, or cheese, or chocolate sprinkles, or
cold cuts. End of story.

Oh gee that sounds healthy!

Not...

Why do you find it unhealthy?

Know anything about nitrites in cold cuts?

Doug Kanter said:

CTRL-END is your friend. Go back to one of the long posts and try it. On
other other hand, I *do* know what you mean. How's that for balance? :-)

Actually, my newsreader requires I only hit TAB to jump to original
text. But, I rarely use it. Even more helpful, my newsreader
indicates how many lines are in each post. Anything over 40 lines I
usually ignore. I find those who can't be bothered trimming aren't
worth the bother reading. Not that you don't have anything to say,
but, by simple line count, I can easily spot those trends of posters
in a thread adding one or two lines to an ever expanding lump of
nothingness. In your particular case, your trim of 120+ line totally
faked me out! 😉

nb

"notbob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Doug Kanter said:

CTRL-END is your friend. Go back to one of the long posts and try it. On
other other hand, I *do* know what you mean. How's that for balance? :-)

Actually, my newsreader requires I only hit TAB to jump to original
text. But, I rarely use it. Even more helpful, my newsreader
indicates how many lines are in each post. Anything over 40 lines I
usually ignore. I find those who can't be bothered trimming aren't
worth the bother reading. Not that you don't have anything to say,
but, by simple line count, I can easily spot those trends of posters
in a thread adding one or two lines to an ever expanding lump of
nothingness. In your particular case, your trim of 120+ line totally
faked me out! 😉

nb

At least I try and insert lots of white space.

notbob said:

Doug Kanter said:

CTRL-END is your friend. Go back to one of the long posts and try it. On
other other hand, I *do* know what you mean. How's that for balance? :-)

Actually, my newsreader requires I only hit TAB to jump to original
text. But, I rarely use it. Even more helpful, my newsreader
indicates how many lines are in each post. Anything over 40 lines I
usually ignore. I find those who can't be bothered trimming aren't
worth the bother reading. Not that you don't have anything to say,
but, by simple line count, I can easily spot those trends of posters
in a thread adding one or two lines to an ever expanding lump of
nothingness. In your particular case, your trim of 120+ line totally
faked me out! 😉

When I'm only responding to some little part of a big post, I trim a lot.
But when I'm responding to most of the post, I don't bother trimming at
all. I've also found that having at least four lines of >>>> 's keeps the
confusion to a minimum (*you responded to me with _what?!* but... I said
the same thing two posts ago!)

Lena

notbob said:

indicates how many lines are in each post. Anything over 40 lines I
usually ignore. I find those who can't be bothered trimming aren't
worth the bother reading. Not that you don't have anything to say,
but, by simple line count, I can easily spot those trends of posters
in a thread adding one or two lines to an ever expanding lump of
nothingness. In your particular case, your trim of 120+ line totally
faked me out! 😉

nb

Sometimes this is deceiving as some replies are longer than 40 lines
themselves without the quoted part especially in the "food snob" thread.
A lot of posters are presenting some very interesting points and
information and some of those are long posts. You're missing some very
good points if of course that topic is of interest to you. I know I've
sure learned a lot from the other posters. I think what we are seeing
too is some pretty good thread drift. I don't think that is happening
on the basic kitchen equipment thread yet but I might be missing a
couple of the posts. The only thing I've see on that thread is a
complaint that the thread is geared towards NA kitchens.

Lena B Katz said:

I've also found that having at least four lines of >>>> 's keeps the
confusion to a minimum....

Who's confusion? If I want to know what was said three posts back,
I'll go back and read it. Like I said, 40 lines max.

nb

~patches~ said:

A lot of posters are presenting some very interesting points and

I agree. But, the rising thread count is very revealing. If I see:

lines
8
10
11
47

.....I know someone has added a substantial, possibly worthwhile,
contribution. But, more typically, its like:

40
42
46
50
52
55
64
etc...

Besides, as long as I've been on rfc, I pretty much know who's who and
most likely adding stuff like, "Oh, that's so cute ...tee hee" and
"so's yer momma, jerk...", etc, and who has something interesting to
say. I also may hit every post, regardless, in threads of extra
interest or those I originated. I don't killfile anyone, as I can
filter faster visually than waiting for my score file to do it's
thing. The "40+" rule is just a rule of thumb, not etched in stone.
I use it to save time, not exclude anyone.

nb

Doug Kanter said:

Apparently, we've both adopted practices based on our observations.
What a concept. What's interesting, though, is that we both seem to
have seen the same results: Equipment that lasts a long time. And,
this has happened by doing things both your way and mine. What does
this mean?

Certainly with TVs. I'm old enough to remember when TVs weren't
particularly reliable, and the repairman would be a semi-regular
visitor, or we'd pull all the tubes and go to the store and run them
through the tube tester. These days, I still have the 19in TV I bought
in 1981 when I got my first real job, still works.

VCRs are more problematic, they have more moving parts and of course
are subject to wear on the heads. Of course, these days VCRs and DVD
players are essentially disposable items, it's not worth it to fix them.

Brian

--
If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
won't shut up.
-- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com)

"notbob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

~patches~ said:

A lot of posters are presenting some very interesting points and

I agree. But, the rising thread count is very revealing. If I see:

lines
8
10
11
47

....I know someone has added a substantial, possibly worthwhile,
contribution. But, more typically, its like:

40
42
46
50
52
55
64
etc...

Besides, as long as I've been on rfc, I pretty much know who's who and
most likely adding stuff like, "Oh, that's so cute ...tee hee" and
"so's yer momma, jerk...", etc, and who has something interesting to
say. I also may hit every post, regardless, in threads of extra
interest or those I originated. I don't killfile anyone, as I can
filter faster visually than waiting for my score file to do it's
thing. The "40+" rule is just a rule of thumb, not etched in stone.
I use it to save time, not exclude anyone.

nb

You MUST be a programmer. 🙂

Doug Kanter said:

You MUST be a programmer. 🙂

Naw! ....just lazy.

nb

In article <[email hidden]>,

jake said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

jake said:

>>Is this heresy? I would leave all the baking/oven stuff out, event he
>>toaster. But then I'm from a culture where breakfast is sandwiches.
>
>
>same here. sammiches, frenchfries, corned beef. leftovers are far, far
>better than breakfasts, imho.
>
>Lena

I really meant just sandwiches! Nothing hot! Or cooked (other than
occasional boiled eggs, typically on Sundays). No porridge, no dinner
types of foods.

Classics: bread with PB, or jam, or cheese, or chocolate sprinkles, or
cold cuts. End of story.

Oh gee that sounds healthy!

Not...

Why do you find it unhealthy?

Sorry, it's not even worth my time.....
If you don't know, do some googling on basic nutrition.

Might be ok as a treat from time to time, but DAILY?????
--
Peace, Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Lena B Katz said:

... for the love of god. fine. i'll post the link
http://www.housing.cmu.edu/buildings/cathedral/
the efficiencies do not have ovens, and at least one didn't have a
functioning stove.

Lena

if you want, i can pull indie apt. listings...

When I was in college, I paid $179.00 per month for a no bedroom
efficincy. There was a walk in closet, 1 large living area that doubled
as a bedroom, a bathroom and a kitchen that was separated from the
livingroom by a breakfast bar. Not big but I did not spend much time
there.

They have their nerve calling those mansions. No oven?????????

Wierd.
--
Peace, Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

ms_peacock said:

So you're somehow operating under the impression "the poor" have computers
and are reading usenet?

You'd be amazed. ;-)

I know a lot of folks on minimum wage that even own cell phones. I make
4 times minimum wage and still don't own one.

I need to learn from them how to budget. <G>

Of course, a lot of them have 3 generations of family living under one
roof too.
--
Peace, Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Doug Kanter said:

"notbob" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Doug Kanter said:

I can make pancakes over a campfire.......

Ooooh, ...sorry... wrong answer. Go to jail without passing go
for not trimming a jillion lines of useless txt.

So sad. And you were doing so well. 🙁

nb

CTRL-END is your friend. Go back to one of the long posts and try it. On
other other hand, I *do* know what you mean. How's that for balance? :-)

Um, I can make pancakes over a campfire too... using a CI skillet.

Why is that a bad thing? <confused look>
--
Peace, Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

Doug Kanter said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Doug Kanter said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> In article <[email hidden]>,
> "Doug Kanter" <[email hidden]> wrote:
>
>> Oh please....what adult can't make friggin pancakes? If you don't spot
>> your
>> mistakes after the first three tries, and either fix them, or consult
>> a
>> book
>> and THEN fix them, you're an idiot.
>
> Pancakes ain't rocket science...
>
> but neither are hard boiled eggs.
>
> How many threads about hard boiled eggs have appeared on this list just
> in the past 2 years??????
> --
> Peace, Om.

You know my policy on failure to consult resources available to everyone.
No
further comment is necessary.

Except that if everyone looked up the resources, the cooking discussion
list would not exsist. ;-)
--
Peace, Om.

Sure it would.

<lol> yeah, so you could tell everyone that asked a question to go to
google or the rfc archives???
--
Peace, Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson