Need advise on a Serotta purchase

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

I assume there was a reason you chose to drop $ 4900 on this bike, so
only you could decide whether or not to spend more. Of course, the
deciding factor should always be, buy the red one.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

So what happens if you really get addicted to riding?

Other than having a:
let's_do_50_fast_ones_on_Saturday_morning_with_the_boys... You've got
a $5000 unit that does nothing else well. You can't ride in winter...
skinny high pressure tires suck on cold pavement. You can't ride in
the rain, well you can, but getting road dirt out of that $2500 drive
train is annoying. Super-light fenders would help but hey...they don't
fit. You can't ride at night... you might hit a chuck-hole and ding
something that costs a grand to fix.

You know where that Serotta looks really good? In a picture on Ebay.
With the rest of them. Great selection there... Triple mint condition
too <g>.

Will said:

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

So what happens if you really get addicted to riding?

Other than having a:
let's_do_50_fast_ones_on_Saturday_morning_with_the_boys... You've got
a $5000 unit that does nothing else well. You can't ride in winter...
skinny high pressure tires suck on cold pavement. You can't ride in
the rain, well you can, but getting road dirt out of that $2500 drive
train is annoying. Super-light fenders would help but hey...they don't
fit. You can't ride at night... you might hit a chuck-hole and ding
something that costs a grand to fix.

You know where that Serotta looks really good? In a picture on Ebay.
With the rest of them. Great selection there... Triple mint condition
too <g>.

This is a bit over the top. There are lots of
"50_fast_ones_on_Saturday_morning_with_the_boys" bikes out there that
get ridden on lots of those rides. You may not want to do that, but
lots of us do. There are reasons to not only have a transportation
bike, or, more likely, to get a "50-fast..." bike in addition to a
transportation bike. Trying to do those 50 fast ones on a bike with fat
tires, serious fenders, and whatnot might not be fun, since you wouldn't
be as fast.

And my skinny high-pressure tires get lots of winter miles, just not
when it is too icy. That's when I ride on my mountain bike with studded
tires. But I don't think that my skinny-tired bike was a waste of money.

Any bike that sits in the basement, never ridden, is a waste of money.
Any bike that gets you away from the computer and out on the roads is
the right bike.

As to whether it's wise to spend $5000 on a bike, well, that is beyond
me. I had enough trouble spending $700 on a frame. Lots of people
think it's a good investment of their money to spend on a bike they
like. It is their money, after all.

To the OP, you'd have to decide whether that bike is worth it to you.
Myself, I'd go with something more moderate, say the $2000 level, with
midrange Campy components --- something a lot like my Habanero, which is
why I put it together the way I did. Will you be faster spending twice
as much? No. Will you ride more? That is the question. If so, then
you would be faster on that bike. As a college kid I might have been
more committed to racing had I bought the Masi I really lusted after,
but that was $50 more than my Frejus, and I just couldn't justify
spending the money. Maybe I coulda been a contender, had I gotten the
Masi. Maybe.

If 20 people answer you, you'll get at least that many opinions. Your
decision. Oh, BTW, titanium is nice. But then I like it since it will
not rust and needs no paint, so scratches are not a problem. Rides
nicely, too.

--

David L. Johnson

"It doesn't get any easier, you just go faster." --Greg LeMond

On Feb 6, 3:37 pm, "David L. Johnson" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

This is a bit over the top.

Of course it was. It's freaking -10 F here, there's ice out and I
can't ride. But my intentions were pure <g>.

For 5 large you can get get a wicked fast, very light bike with room
in the frame for some variety. But not on a Serotta...

Will said:

On Feb 6, 3:37 pm, "David L. Johnson" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

This is a bit over the top.

Of course it was. It's freaking -10 F here, there's ice out and I
can't ride. But my intentions were pure <g>.

For 5 large you can get get a wicked fast, very light bike with room
in the frame for some variety. But not on a Serotta...

For 5 big ones, you can get an Ultegra go fast sunny day bike, a
fendered rain bike, a Nexus hubbed beer fetcher, and a unicycle.

Or if you find a frame you like, get an Ultegra bike with nice
traditional American Classic wheels from bikesdirect.com for $1500,
flog the frame and fork on Craigslist for $300, and end up with a
$1200 build kit.

Don't see the point in the Serotta, except to empty your wallet. If
you've got a fat wallet and like it, then by all means, enjoy.

Quoted message said:

I assume there was a reason you chose to drop $ 4900 on this bike, so
only you could decide whether or not to spend more. Of course, the
deciding factor should always be, buy the red one.

Curtis L. Russell

Everybody knows that yellow bikes are faster!

Will said:

So what happens if you really get addicted to riding?

Other than having a:
let's_do_50_fast_ones_on_Saturday_morning_with_the_boys... You've got
a $5000 unit that does nothing else well. You can't ride in winter...
skinny high pressure tires suck on cold pavement. You can't ride in
the rain, well you can, but getting road dirt out of that $2500 drive
train is annoying. Super-light fenders would help but hey...they don't
fit. You can't ride at night... you might hit a chuck-hole and ding
something that costs a grand to fix.

All true, but a bit over the top.

What are the odds that a $5000 bike will be your ONLY bike?

Pat said:

Quoted message said:

I assume there was a reason you chose to drop $ 4900 on this bike, so
only you could decide whether or not to spend more. Of course, the
deciding factor should always be, buy the red one.

Curtis L. Russell

Everybody knows that yellow bikes are faster!

Perhaps, but white is the fastest color. It never runs.

--
jeverett3<AT>sbcglobal<DOT>net (John V. Everett)

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

Few riders really need a bike that expensive. Without knowing your
abilities, I'll reserve judgement. But beyond the "new bike phenomena"
that lasts a few weeks, I don't think the new bike will improve your
speed or distance ability a great deal. A bike half this price should
give you about 99 percent of the performance and motivation. Fit and
appropriateness to the kind of riding you do are the main factors to
consider. As with most products, there is a sweet spot in the
performance vs. price curve. Beyond that, improvements are very subtle
and costly.

Art Harris

Art Harris said:

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

Few riders really need a bike that expensive. Without knowing your
abilities, I'll reserve judgement. But beyond the "new bike phenomena"
that lasts a few weeks, I don't think the new bike will improve your
speed or distance ability a great deal. A bike half this price should
give you about 99 percent of the performance and motivation. Fit and
appropriateness to the kind of riding you do are the main factors to
consider. As with most products, there is a sweet spot in the
performance vs. price curve. Beyond that, improvements are very subtle
and costly.

Art Harris

Proof of the pudding is at the Serotta site. Check out the annual
gathering shots.
About 3 guys have legs, the rest have wallets.

Art Harris said:

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

Few riders really need a bike that expensive. Without knowing your
abilities, I'll reserve judgement. But beyond the "new bike phenomena"
that lasts a few weeks, I don't think the new bike will improve your
speed or distance ability a great deal. A bike half this price should
give you about 99 percent of the performance and motivation. Fit and
appropriateness to the kind of riding you do are the main factors to
consider. As with most products, there is a sweet spot in the
performance vs. price curve. Beyond that, improvements are very subtle
and costly.

Art Harris

Art,

Thank you for your very sound advise. I'm an upper middle age guy and
the only excersise I get is riding - 100 miles a week weather
permitting. Being tall and realizing I probably won't be buying too
many more bikes the idea of having a frame custom built so that it is
optimized to my physique and riding style is appealling, thus the
Serotta. Not be up on the road bike scene I was surprised to find that
a completely built up bike would cost nearly three times the price of
the frame. I guess my real question is where is my sweet spot? Are the
components going into this bike over kill and would a bike costing,
say $500 less provide the same benefit? If the component group is
indeed that critical and important than perhaps it would also be wise
to upgrade to a better frame. Of course, the dealers motovations are
different from mine and his advise will reflect that perspective.

Lou

Quoted message said:

Art Harris said:

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

Quoted message said:

Few riders really need a bike that expensive. Without knowing your
abilities, I'll reserve judgement. But beyond the "new bike phenomena"
that lasts a few weeks, I don't think the new bike will improve your
speed or distance ability a great deal. A bike half this price should
give you about 99 percent of the performance and motivation. Fit and
appropriateness to the kind of riding you do are the main factors to
consider. As with most products, there is a sweet spot in the
performance vs. price curve. Beyond that, improvements are very subtle
and costly.

Quoted message said:

Art Harris

Art,

Thank you for your very sound advise. I'm an upper middle age guy and
the only excersise I get is riding - 100 miles a week weather
permitting. Being tall and realizing I probably won't be buying too
many more bikes the idea of having a frame custom built so that it is
optimized to my physique and riding style is appealling, thus the
Serotta.

There are plenty of builders in the States that can build you custom
without the Serotta up charge. But then, do you need a custom frame?
Are you proportioned properly so that a normal factory frame could be
dialed in with proper sized stem, post, bars, etc? A custom frame is a
fine thing, but you might not *need* one.

Quoted message said:

Not be up on the road bike scene I was surprised to find that
a completely built up bike would cost nearly three times the price of
the frame. I guess my real question is where is my sweet spot? Are the
components going into this bike over kill and would a bike costing,
say $500 less provide the same benefit?

For one thing, your shop is wanting to spec you wheels that cost twice
what a pair of nice hand built traditional wheels would run you. The
hand builts wouldn't weigh more, and would likely be more reliable and
strong. This has been discussed ad nauseum around here. If your shop
doesn't build wheels, find one with a good reputation that does.

Quoted message said:

If the component group is
indeed that critical and important than perhaps it would also be wise
to upgrade to a better frame. Of course, the dealers motovations are
different from mine and his advise will reflect that perspective.

You can get Shimano Dura Ace or Ultegra and enjoy their long warranty--
or you can spend quite a bit less and get Campagnolo Veloce and have a
groupset that you can service and buy small parts for. If you want to
ride Shimano, 105 is as good as any recreational rider needs.
Remember, you can always get the expensive DA or Ultegra brifters to
shift 105 kit with.

If what you've mentioned is what the shop wants to sell you, then I
suspect their motivation is making a payment on a bass boat, not
getting you what would be most practical.

landotter said:

There are plenty of builders in the States that can build you custom
without the Serotta up charge. But then, do you need a custom frame?
Are you proportioned properly so that a normal factory frame could be
dialed in with proper sized stem, post, bars, etc? A custom frame is a
fine thing, but you might not *need* one.

True, that.

I spent a pile o' dough on a Moots road bike ... for a host of reasons
that did NOT include just having too much discretionary money.

You can't really justify a $5,000+ Serotta (or its many
equivalents)--because so many bikes will do everything you want them to
do ... virtually as well--, but then ... you don't really have to
justify it.

That said, I did the math, AND had it done for me, and had absolutely no
need for custom sizing. I'm not particularly oddly proportioned--just
generally funny looking ;-)

Serotta's got a great reputation. So do lots of other manufacturers of
high-end frames. Try to ride as many as you can--frames AND component
groups--and buy what feels and fits the best.

Have fun!

Quoted message said:

Thank you for your very sound advise. I'm an upper middle age guy and
the only excersise I get is riding - 100 miles a week weather
permitting. Being tall and realizing I probably won't be buying too
many more bikes the idea of having a frame custom built so that it is
optimized to my physique and riding style is appealling, thus the
Serotta. Not be up on the road bike scene I was surprised to find that
a completely built up bike would cost nearly three times the price of
the frame. I guess my real question is where is my sweet spot? Are the
components going into this bike over kill and would a bike costing,
say $500 less provide the same benefit? If the component group is
indeed that critical and important than perhaps it would also be wise
to upgrade to a better frame. Of course, the dealers motovations are
different from mine and his advise will reflect that perspective.

I think a good starting point would be to verbalize what you don't
like about your old Cannondale. What do you want it to do that it
can't.

For your kind of riding (as with mine), reliability, comfort, fit,
smooth shifting, appropriate gearing, good braking, and reasonable
weight are probably your main objectives. How does your Cannondale
stack up in those categories?

In most cases, you should be able to find a stock bike that (with
proper adjustment) will fit you fine. I'm 6'3" and never had a problem
getting a stock bike to fit. It might be more prudent to spend $100 or
so for a good fitting (that takes into account your riding style and
preferences) than to buy a custom frame that you can't test ride until
it's built.

Modern components from Campagnolo or Shimano all work very well, even
at the low end. There's little reason to buy the top of the line
components.

There's nothing wrong with conventional handbuilt wheels, aluminum
seat posts, etc. Fancy looking stuff is often just marketing. You may
find that a $1200-1500 bike will provide everything you want.

Art Harris

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

I would look elsewhere rather than a Serotta dealer of any type.

Put the biggest percentage of the $ in the frame, not the components
and certainly not those wheels. Seen lots of those wheels break
spokes. Also a carbon but end does absolutely nothing. Look at
Waterford for a truely well made steel frame w/o the hype.

Quoted message said:

Art Harris said:

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

Quoted message said:

Few riders really need a bike that expensive. Without knowing your
abilities, I'll reserve judgement. But beyond the "new bike phenomena"
that lasts a few weeks, I don't think the new bike will improve your
speed or distance ability a great deal. A bike half this price should
give you about 99 percent of the performance and motivation. Fit and
appropriateness to the kind of riding you do are the main factors to
consider. As with most products, there is a sweet spot in the
performance vs. price curve. Beyond that, improvements are very subtle
and costly.

Quoted message said:

Art Harris

Art,

Thank you for your very sound advise. I'm an upper middle age guy and
the only excersise I get is riding - 100 miles a week weather
permitting. Being tall and realizing I probably won't be buying too
many more bikes the idea of having a frame custom built so that it is
optimized to my physique and riding style is appealling, thus the
Serotta. Not be up on the road bike scene I was surprised to find that
a completely built up bike would cost nearly three times the price of
the frame. I guess my real question is where is my sweet spot? Are the
components going into this bike over kill and would a bike costing,
say $500 less provide the same benefit? If the component group is
indeed that critical and important than perhaps it would also be wise
to upgrade to a better frame. Of course, the dealers motovations are
different from mine and his advise will reflect that perspective.

Lou

Waterford R-13 series, carbon fork, Ultegra group..handbuilt wheels,
Ritchey componets..about $3000 here..Custom frame, many free color
choices..no hype, BS or typical Serotta bloviation.

On Feb 8, 7:49 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

I would look elsewhere rather than a Serotta dealer of any type.

Put the biggest percentage of the $ in the frame, not the components
and certainly not those wheels. Seen lots of those wheels break
spokes. Also a carbon but end does absolutely nothing. Look at
Waterford for a truely well made steel frame w/o the hype.

Waterford frames cost twice as much as other similar hand built frames
with the same materials. Around here, Waterford frames are sold in the
same shops that do Serotta, don't build wheels, and try to blow all
sorts of smoke up your rectum. There's plenty of hype around them as
well. Why not a Heron for 1200 less? Or fly to the UK for the
difference and get a Mercian custom fitted.

$900 Strada Speciale frame
$800 Round trip ticket to the UK
-------
$1700, Which leaves you $800 to spend on pints at the pub and a small
room to retire to.

landotter said:

On Feb 8, 7:49 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

On Feb 6, 11:08 am, [email hidden] wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
$4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

Quoted message said:

I would look elsewhere rather than a Serotta dealer of any type.

Quoted message said:

Put the biggest percentage of the $ in the frame, not the components
and certainly not those wheels. Seen lots of those wheels break
spokes. Also a carbon but end does absolutely nothing. Look at
Waterford for a truely well made steel frame w/o the hype.

Waterford frames cost twice as much as other similar hand built frames
with the same materials. Around here, Waterford frames are sold in the
same shops that do Serotta, don't build wheels, and try to blow all
sorts of smoke up your rectum. There's plenty of hype around them as
well. Why not a Heron for 1200 less? Or fly to the UK for the
difference and get a Mercian custom fitted.

$900 Strada Speciale frame
$800 Round trip ticket to the UK
-------
$1700, Which leaves you $800 to spend on pints at the pub and a small
room to retire to.

No doubt..a Heron is $1200 less than a waterford with Ultegra?..$1800
for an Ultegra bike, with the frame built in the US IS amazing. Not
saying 'offshore' frames aren't made well but a Waterford at $1300 is
not twice as much as similarly made frames with the same materials. NO
frame made in the US of TrueTemper Platinum OS with 100's of color
choices is $650. Nice to buy the frame in the UK but don't forget the
exchange rate and also gotta use that extra $ to build the bike, not
just buy a frame.

The guy was looking at an overpriced, much hype added with carbon ass
end, Serotta..another US custom made frame that is cheaper and better
made w/o the hype is Waterford.

Personally, I would rather stand on the corner with a piece of
carboard than ever sell Serotta.

On Feb 8, 9:10 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

landotter said:

On Feb 8, 7:49 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo" <[email hidden]>
wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

On Feb 6, 11:08 am, [email hidden] wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> I'm considering purchasing a Serrota CDA. The dealer is quoting over
> $4900 for the Coeur d'Acier with carbon seat stays, standard paint
> with custom name option, Serotta F3, Ultegra 10sp Double Group,
> Easton Orion II wheels and eveything else needed to complete the
> package. I'm upgrading from a $800 Cannondale so I'm having a hard
> time accepting that you can put that much on top of an $1800 frame! If
> indeed this is what it takes to get a really good bike should I take
> the next step and move up to the La Corsa titanium frame?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I would look elsewhere rather than a Serotta dealer of any type.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Put the biggest percentage of the $ in the frame, not the components
and certainly not those wheels. Seen lots of those wheels break
spokes. Also a carbon but end does absolutely nothing. Look at
Waterford for a truely well made steel frame w/o the hype.

Quoted message said:

Waterford frames cost twice as much as other similar hand built frames
with the same materials. Around here, Waterford frames are sold in the
same shops that do Serotta, don't build wheels, and try to blow all
sorts of smoke up your rectum. There's plenty of hype around them as
well. Why not a Heron for 1200 less? Or fly to the UK for the
difference and get a Mercian custom fitted.

Quoted message said:

$900 Strada Speciale frame
$800 Round trip ticket to the UK
-------
$1700, Which leaves you $800 to spend on pints at the pub and a small
room to retire to.

No doubt..a Heron is $1200 less than a waterford with Ultegra?..$1800
for an Ultegra bike, with the frame built in the US IS amazing. Not
saying 'offshore' frames aren't made well but a Waterford at $1300 is
not twice as much as similarly made frames with the same materials.

For some reason, I thought the tag on the last Waterford I saw said,
"$2500". My bad.