2001 Brodie Brat?

Discussion in 'Mountain Bikes' started by Jimmy, Apr 16, 2003.

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  1. Jimmy

    Jimmy Guest

    I'm thinking of buying a 2001 model Brodie Brat instead of this years model because it will save me
    a few hundred bucks (CAD), but would like to know what the difference is between the 2001 and 2003
    models besides paint colour. Brodie's website doesn't list the specs for 2001 models, just 2002 and
    2003. I do see that the frames are the same 7005 aluminium though. I was thinking of getting a Giant
    Iguana Disk model too but I see it uses 6061 aluminium which is not as strong as 7005. What do you
    guys think of the difference in the two types aluminium used on todays bikes? I know 7005 is harder
    to work with for the manufacturer but it is stronger by about 20% so I think that is a better way to
    go if you are looking for a more durable frame.
     
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  2. Bomba

    Bomba Guest

    Jimmy wrote:
    > I'm thinking of buying a 2001 model Brodie Brat instead of this years model because it will
    > save me a few hundred bucks (CAD), but would like to know what the difference is between the
    > 2001 and 2003 models besides paint colour. Brodie's website doesn't list the specs for 2001
    > models, just 2002 and 2003. I do see that the frames are the same 7005 aluminium though. I was
    > thinking of getting a Giant Iguana Disk model too but I see it uses 6061 aluminium which is not
    > as strong as 7005.
    >
    > What do you guys think of the difference in the two types aluminium used on todays bikes? I know
    > 7005 is harder to work with for the manufacturer but it is stronger by about 20% so I think that
    > is a better way to go if you are looking for a more durable frame.

    Strictly speaking 7005 has a higher tensile and yield strength than 6061. However, 6061 is much
    easier to work with, so you're more likely to have better welds, better tubing features (eg, butting
    and tapering) and therefore a stronger frame. I don't have figures to back it up, but my experiences
    suggest that most failures on alu bikes are at the weld. 6061-T6 would give you a great combo of the
    two, with a strength similar to 7005, but with the advantages of 6061, but it will cost.

    If you're looking for strength and durability, cro-mo would be my choice.

    --
    a.m-b FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/ambfaq.htm

    b.bmx FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/bmx_faq.htm
     
  3. Andy Chequer

    Andy Chequer Guest

    > 6061-T6 would give you a great combo of the two, with a strength similar to 7005, but with the
    > advantages of 6061, but it will cost.

    But it's worth it.

    Andy Chequer
     
  4. David

    David Guest

    "Jimmy" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    >... I do see that the frames are the same 7005 aluminium though. I was thinking of getting a Giant
    >Iguana Disk model too but I see it uses 6061 aluminium which is not as strong as 7005.

    7005 is a little stiffer. Which strength numbers are you talking about when you claim it's 20%
    stronger? Are you comparing 6061-T6 vs 7005, or vs 7005-T6?

    > What do you guys think of the difference in the two types aluminium used on todays bikes? I know
    > 7005 is harder to work with for the manufacturer but it is stronger by about 20% so I think that
    > is a better way to go if you are looking for a more durable frame.

    IMO the manufacturer is more important than the material.

    David
     
  5. David

    David Guest

    "bomba" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...

    > 6061-T6 would give you a great combo of the two, with a strength similar to 7005, but with the
    > advantages of 6061, but it will cost.

    AFAIK, all 6061 bikes frames are tempered, and usually T6. None are plain 6061.
     
  6. Jimmy

    Jimmy Guest

    On Wed, 16 Apr 2003 18:48:00 +0200, bomba <[email protected]> reckoned:

    >Strictly speaking 7005 has a higher tensile and yield strength than 6061. However, 6061 is much
    >easier to work with, so you're more likely to have better welds, better tubing features (eg,
    >butting and tapering) and therefore a stronger frame. I don't have figures to back it up, but my
    >experiences suggest that most failures on alu bikes are at the weld. 6061-T6 would give you a
    >great combo of the two, with a strength similar to 7005, but with the advantages of 6061, but it
    >will cost.
    >
    >If you're looking for strength and durability, cro-mo would be my choice.

    Yea, but who makes a good cro-molly these days? I can't find any.
     
  7. Jimmy

    Jimmy Guest

    On Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:13:43 -0700, "David" <[email protected]> reckoned:

    >7005 is a little stiffer. Which strength numbers are you talking about when you claim it's 20%
    >stronger? Are you comparing 6061-T6 vs 7005, or vs 7005-T6?

    I'll post the spec sheet I found last night later today, I have it bookmarked in XP and I'm in Win98
    right now.

    >IMO the manufacturer is more important than the material.

    True, and I believe Brodie does well in that area.
     
  8. Bomba

    Bomba Guest

    Jimmy wrote:

    >>If you're looking for strength and durability, cro-mo would be my choice.
    >
    >
    > Yea, but who makes a good cro-molly these days? I can't find any.

    You didn't look very hard, did you?

    www.marinbikes.com www.konaworld.com www.rocky-mountain.com www.salsacycles.com
    www.orangebikes.co.uk www.on-one.co.uk www.covebike.com www.jerichobicycles.com

    They're the ones that spring to mind, anyway...
     
  9. Jack

    Jack Guest

    It comes down to your size and weight. The Giant is a good bike. If you are a big Lad (or lass) into
    giant hucks then frame strength should be a primary concern. If not, look for the best all-around
    bike that suits your needs. Both the brat and the Ig are good.
     
  10. Jimmy

    Jimmy Guest

    On Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:13:43 -0700, "David" <[email protected]> reckoned:

    >7005 is a little stiffer. Which strength numbers are you talking about when you claim it's 20%
    >stronger? Are you comparing 6061-T6 vs 7005, or vs 7005-T6?

    Here's the numbers. And my "guesstimate" of % is based on the tensile strength and not yield
    strength. It's actually a bit less than 20% if you do the math.

    http://www.brucescycleworks.com/tips/tip18.html

    Both 7005 and 6061 used for bikes is T6 so that part doesn't come into the equation as far as my
    question is concerned. I ended up getting a Brodie Fury as it has the better Marzocchi Bomber shocks
    compared to the shocks on the Giant Iguana and Brodie Brat.
     
  11. Jimmy

    Jimmy Guest

    On Wed, 16 Apr 2003 21:23:14 +0200, bomba <[email protected]> reckoned:

    >You didn't look very hard, did you?
    >
    >www.marinbikes.com www.konaworld.com www.rocky-mountain.com www.salsacycles.com
    >www.orangebikes.co.uk www.on-one.co.uk www.covebike.com www.jerichobicycles.com
    >
    >They're the ones that spring to mind, anyway...

    I did look actually, but not too hard I admit. I was told that very few bikes made now are steel and
    especially not higher quality ones. Where I live there are only two bike shops to choose from. The
    one that carries Rocky Mountain had none that were cro-molly and I did ask them about cro-molly
    frames being available too. My choices were Rocky Mountain, Brodie, Specialized or Giant. Oh, I
    could have gotten a steely from Canadian Tire for a couple of hundred Canuck bucks but they weigh
    about the same as an M1 Abrams. I ended up buying a Brodie Fury using the 7005-T6 aluminium.
     
  12. David

    David Guest

    "Jimmy" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Both 7005 and 6061 used for bikes is T6 so that part doesn't come into the equation as far as my
    > question is concerned.

    There are a lot of frames made from non-tempered 7005. In fact I thought only the

    one.

    David
     
  13. Bomba

    Bomba Guest

    Jimmy wrote:

    >>You didn't look very hard, did you?
    >>
    >>www.marinbikes.com www.konaworld.com www.rocky-mountain.com www.salsacycles.com
    >>www.orangebikes.co.uk www.on-one.co.uk www.covebike.com www.jerichobicycles.com
    >>
    >>They're the ones that spring to mind, anyway...
    >
    >
    > I did look actually, but not too hard I admit. I was told that very few bikes made now are steel
    > and especially not higher quality ones.

    You're confusing hi-ten with cro-mo. 1020 hi-ten steel is the sort of steel that's used for cheap
    bikes and makes them feel and weigh like a farmer's gate. Cro-mo, on the other hand, is of much
    higher quality and actually tends to work out more expensive than equivalent level alu frames (hence
    the relatively low number of frames). You'll find the 'steel' offerings from the likes of Jericho,
    Salsa and de Kerf (are they still around?) are anything but cheap and low quality.

    > Where I live there are only two bike shops to choose from. The one that carries Rocky Mountain had
    > none that were cro-molly and I did ask them about cro-molly frames being available too. My choices
    > were Rocky Mountain, Brodie, Specialized or Giant. Oh, I could have gotten a steely from Canadian
    > Tire for a couple of hundred Canuck bucks but they weigh about the same as an M1 Abrams. I ended
    > up buying a Brodie Fury using the 7005-T6 aluminium.

    Excellent, enjoy your ride :)

    --
    a.m-b FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/ambfaq.htm

    b.bmx FAQ: http://www.t-online.de/~jharris/bmx_faq.htm
     
  14. Jimmy

    Jimmy Guest

    On Wed, 16 Apr 2003 22:04:43 -0700, "David" <[email protected]> reckoned:

    >There are a lot of frames made from non-tempered 7005. In fact I thought only the

    >one.
    >
    >David
    >

    Hmm. According to the link I posted the author gave me the impression that aluminum bikes use either
    6061 or 7005 and both are tempered.
     
  15. Jimmy

    Jimmy Guest

    On Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:14:57 +0200, bomba <[email protected]> reckoned:

    >You're confusing hi-ten with cro-mo.

    No I'm not. I've owned a number of cro-molly bikes in my day. I was told there are very few made
    now by the bike shop owner and there was not one to be found in either of the two stores I had
    access to.
     
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