Argon, Calfee, Madone or orbea Orca?



L

LTK

Guest
Shopping for a ne carbon frame. I'm a new racer, 179 lbs, a pedal-masher
and I like the bike to jump when I hit the pedals. Don't mind quick
steering. Riding an LS Ultimate now. Any opinions on which is the best?
 
teamk-<< Riding an LS Ultimate now. Any opinions on which is the best?
>><BR><BR>

The one that fits you the best. I am partial to Calfee.

Great price, titanium dropouts and other bits, $2000.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
 
> The one that fits you the best. I am partial to Calfee.
>
> Great price, titanium dropouts and other bits, $2000.

Peter: It took you over three hours to follow my response. I thought about
typing one in for you! (The good news is that it means you must be having a
pretty decent day...)

--Mike--
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com

"Qui si parla Campagnolo " <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> teamk-<< Riding an LS Ultimate now. Any opinions on which is the best?
> >><BR><BR>
>
> The one that fits you the best. I am partial to Calfee.
>
> Great price, titanium dropouts and other bits, $2000.
>
> Peter Chisholm
> Vecchio's Bicicletteria
> 1833 Pearl St.
> Boulder, CO, 80302
> (303)440-3535
> http://www.vecchios.com
> "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
 
The waiting list is long because its already out of production.

The Madone is a marketing fiasco -- you are buying a bike that Lance doesn't
like.

--


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"Mike Jacoubowsky" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> > Shopping for a ne carbon frame. I'm a new racer, 179 lbs, a
pedal-masher
> > and I like the bike to jump when I hit the pedals. Don't mind quick
> > steering. Riding an LS Ultimate now. Any opinions on which is the best?
>
> As a highly-biased person who sells them for a living, I've been eyeing
the
> Madone with more than a small amount of lust. I don't *need* one... my
5900
> is everything I've ever wanted in a bike. But still, there's something
> about the Madone that calls to me... too bad the waiting list is so long.
> Can't justify getting one when my customers can't. Hate that!
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
>
>


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MikeJ-<< Peter: It took you over three hours to follow my response. I thought
about
typing one in for you! (The good news is that it means you must be having a
pretty decent day...) >><BR><BR>

I ramble around on these NG each morning over a cup o jo...then onto the bike
and to work. Love my new Mewrckx, BTW..it ain't tin or carpet fiber or beer can
stuff, but i sure like it!!

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
 
> I ramble around on these NG each morning over a cup o jo...then onto the
bike
> and to work. Love my new Mewrckx, BTW..it ain't tin or carpet fiber or
beer can
> stuff, but i sure like it!!

Oh dang, what did you go out and get a new bike for? That's *not* helping
me any. My bike's not even four years old yet; I really don't *need* a
Madone...

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
 
Does that mean thge 5900 is the best option from Trek?

Anyone know how the '04 5900 compaes ridewise to the '03 version? Specs say
its 1000 grams, which is same as the Orca, which I'm hearing may be a little
too light.

My one problem w/ Calfee is I want to give thebusiness to my LBS. They're
great guys and I'm loyal. Problem is they only have Trek, Orbea and Felt.
Any other thoughts?

Thanks.


"JayofMontreal" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:i_Jbc.240$%[email protected]...
> The waiting list is long because its already out of production.
>
> The Madone is a marketing fiasco -- you are buying a bike that Lance
doesn't
> like.
>
> --
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> FIGHT BACK AGAINST SPAM!
> Download Spam Inspector, the Award Winning Anti-Spam Filter
> http://mail.giantcompany.com
>
>
> "Mike Jacoubowsky" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > > Shopping for a ne carbon frame. I'm a new racer, 179 lbs, a
> pedal-masher
> > > and I like the bike to jump when I hit the pedals. Don't mind quick
> > > steering. Riding an LS Ultimate now. Any opinions on which is the
best?
> >
> > As a highly-biased person who sells them for a living, I've been eyeing
> the
> > Madone with more than a small amount of lust. I don't *need* one... my
> 5900
> > is everything I've ever wanted in a bike. But still, there's something
> > about the Madone that calls to me... too bad the waiting list is so
long.
> > Can't justify getting one when my customers can't. Hate that!
> >
> > --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> > http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
> >
> >
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.642 / Virus Database: 410 - Release Date: 3/24/2004
>
>
 
LTK wrote:

> My one problem w/ Calfee is I want to give thebusiness to my LBS. They're
> great guys and I'm loyal. Problem is they only have Trek, Orbea and Felt.
> Any other thoughts?

Talk your LBS into becoming a Calfee dealer?
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/
 
I'm going to ask.


"Terry Morse" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> LTK wrote:
>
> > My one problem w/ Calfee is I want to give thebusiness to my LBS.
They're
> > great guys and I'm loyal. Problem is they only have Trek, Orbea and
Felt.
> > Any other thoughts?
>
> Talk your LBS into becoming a Calfee dealer?
> --
> terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/
 
> Does that mean thge 5900 is the best option from Trek?
>
> Anyone know how the '04 5900 compaes ridewise to the '03 version? Specs
say
> its 1000 grams, which is same as the Orca, which I'm hearing may be a
little
> too light.

The new 5900 is only slightly-lighter than the '03 (mine is an '01 which is
basically unchanged from the '03). The main advantage to the '04 is that it
uses a conventional fork & headset arrangement, so you can use a Chris King
headset if you wish. No more pressed-in lower bearing race.

The 5900 is about as "proven" a bike as you can find; I wouldn't worry about
durability, unless you intend to smash it or have someone run into your
chainstay (but such impacts would probably wreck just about any frame, and
the TDF showed that it was possible to push 700 watts through a single
chainstay... which was *way* more than anyone thought could be done).

Most high-end bike frames have a very short sales lifespan before they
become yesterday's news and get tossed in favor of some other "new &
exciting" design. By contrast, the 5900 is the result of continuous
refinement over the past 13 years. The bugs were worked out many years ago!

> My one problem w/ Calfee is I want to give thebusiness to my LBS. They're
> great guys and I'm loyal. Problem is they only have Trek, Orbea and Felt.
> Any other thoughts?

One of the reasons shops don't carry every line in the world is that they're
comfortable with how a particular brand handles problems & warranties. TREK
is known to be one of the very best in that regard, and that's a very
comforting thing when selling high-end bikes. That's not to say that
Calfee isn't excellent as well, but I have no direct experience with them.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
 
Got my '04 5900 two months ago. Already have done a double on it and it's,
like Barbara would say, like butter! Love it, love it, love it...

"LTK" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Does that mean thge 5900 is the best option from Trek?
>
> Anyone know how the '04 5900 compaes ridewise to the '03 version? Specs
say
> its 1000 grams, which is same as the Orca, which I'm hearing may be a
little
> too light.
>
> My one problem w/ Calfee is I want to give thebusiness to my LBS. They're
> great guys and I'm loyal. Problem is they only have Trek, Orbea and Felt.
> Any other thoughts?
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> "JayofMontreal" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:i_Jbc.240$%[email protected]...
> > The waiting list is long because its already out of production.
> >
> > The Madone is a marketing fiasco -- you are buying a bike that Lance
> doesn't
> > like.
> >
> > --
> >
> >
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > FIGHT BACK AGAINST SPAM!
> > Download Spam Inspector, the Award Winning Anti-Spam Filter
> > http://mail.giantcompany.com
> >
> >
> > "Mike Jacoubowsky" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > > Shopping for a ne carbon frame. I'm a new racer, 179 lbs, a
> > pedal-masher
> > > > and I like the bike to jump when I hit the pedals. Don't mind quick
> > > > steering. Riding an LS Ultimate now. Any opinions on which is the
> best?
> > >
> > > As a highly-biased person who sells them for a living, I've been
eyeing
> > the
> > > Madone with more than a small amount of lust. I don't *need* one...
my
> > 5900
> > > is everything I've ever wanted in a bike. But still, there's
something
> > > about the Madone that calls to me... too bad the waiting list is so
> long.
> > > Can't justify getting one when my customers can't. Hate that!
> > >
> > > --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> > > http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ---
> > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> > Version: 6.0.642 / Virus Database: 410 - Release Date: 3/24/2004
> >
> >
>
>
 
MikeJ-<< My bike's not even four years old yet; I really don't *need* a
Madone.. >><BR><BR>


Was the Madone redesigned with a more like 5900 seat tube?? At Lance's
request... or not??

Urban legend?? Done for Cheryl?

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
 
> Was the Madone redesigned with a more like 5900 seat tube?? At Lance's
> request... or not??
>
> Urban legend?? Done for Cheryl?

Lance & Cheryl are the stuff of urban legend, but a bike???

Lance, weight-weenie that he is, likes the idea of a Madone "SL" without the
aero bit at the back of the seat tube. The rest of the team gets the
standard Madone, but... well, what Lance wants, Lance gets. It makes a
little bit of sense, given that Lance isn't usually out there in the wind on
his own (unless it's a steep climb, in which case aerodynamics isn't such a
huge issue). The rest of the team is out working at the front, and needs
all the aero help they can get.

Anybody who doesn't realize the extent to which Lance has affected product
development at TREK over the past few years has been living in a hole
someplace. But what makes things different at TREK is that, whatever they
design for Lance becomes a stock production bike, because the costs of a new
model are all up-front... so, whatever Lance wants, Lance gets, and we get
the exact same thing too. It's going to get confusing next year...

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
 
"LTK" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:p[email protected]...
> Shopping for a ne carbon frame. I'm a new racer, 179 lbs, a
pedal-masher
> and I like the bike to jump when I hit the pedals. Don't mind
quick
> steering. Riding an LS Ultimate now. Any opinions on which is
the best?

How tall are you, and what is the problem with your LS Ultimate?
I broke an old Cannondale and was in the market for a new frame
(until I was told that I could have a new frame free), and was
told by the local Trek shop that I should forget about the OCLVs.
I am slightly under 6'4," and the advice from the shop proved
accurate. If you are in the range of people who can fit an OCLV,
however, I would buy one for the warranty and dealer network. I
would not bother with an overpriced Madone -- or any other
tippity-top end bike unless it were given to me by a sponsor (not
likely being that I am an old, retired racer -- although I may
make a comeback just to prevent Lance from taking 6). At your
weight, I doubt you are KOM and think you should concentrate on
something durable and stiff as opposed to ultra-light and
sketchy. I think you should get a reasonably light Trek and then
dump the money on the components, which you could (if you must)
trade to a different frame at the end of the Cat 4 or 5 season
(because you may need one -- along with skin grafts). You could
then sell the Trek on e-Bay as "slightly used." -- Jay Beattie.
 
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:

> Lance, weight-weenie that he is, likes the idea of a Madone "SL"
> without the aero bit at the back of the seat tube. The rest of the
> team gets the standard Madone, but... well, what Lance wants, Lance
> gets. It makes a little bit of sense, given that Lance isn't usually
> out there in the wind on his own (unless it's a steep climb, in which
> case aerodynamics isn't such a huge issue). The rest of the team is
> out working at the front, and needs all the aero help they can get.

Maybe aero-kitsch bikes offend Lance's aesthetic sensibilities -- as they do
many other people's.

> Anybody who doesn't realize the extent to which Lance has affected
> product development at TREK over the past few years has been living
> in a hole someplace. But what makes things different at TREK is
> that, whatever they design for Lance becomes a stock production bike,
> because the costs of a new model are all up-front... so, whatever
> Lance wants, Lance gets, and we get the exact same thing too. It's
> going to get confusing next year...

It's my impression that Trek is doing very, very well, compared to other bike
companies. Maybe they ought to keep listening to Lance.

Matt O.
 
MikeJ-<< Anybody who doesn't realize the extent to which Lance has affected
product
development at TREK over the past few years has been living in a hole
someplace. >><BR><BR>

How far away is the new 'Armstrong' frameset, made by Trek...

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
 
If you're talking about the Madone 5.9, it's already here.
I was going to write a review on this bike, but want to ride it for a month
to put it to the test. I've also had the Trek 5900 Ultralight, so I could
compare them pretty close. In short, the Madone rides nothing like the
5900. Two different bikes. If you're looking for a pure climber's bike,
then I would go with the 5900, or the Giant Once Carbon. Every rider is
different and enjoys certain features on a bike. The Madone is a very
comfortable bike which is also fast and great on the climbs. I would ride
them all before making a decision.
Here's one of reviews I've read on the Modone:
http://www.velonews.com/tour2003/tech/articles/4353.0.html
There are more current review done on this bike.
-tom

"Qui si parla Campagnolo " <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> MikeJ-<< Anybody who doesn't realize the extent to which Lance has
affected
> product
> development at TREK over the past few years has been living in a hole
> someplace. >><BR><BR>
>
> How far away is the new 'Armstrong' frameset, made by Trek...
>
> Peter Chisholm
> Vecchio's Bicicletteria
> 1833 Pearl St.
> Boulder, CO, 80302
> (303)440-3535
> http://www.vecchios.com
> "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"
 
Qui si parla Campagnolo wrote:
> tom-<< If you're talking about the Madone 5.9, it's already here.
> >><BR><BR>
>
>
> Nope, I'm talking about a Armstrong labeled frameset, ala the Lemond,
> after Lance has retired(shortly after 2004 TdF) and after he rides
> into the sunset in the Republic of Texas, in a pickup truck, Cheryl
> at his side, back filled with cases of Budweiser.

You paint a nice fairy-tale picture, Peter...and it might come true!

So what would be the "distinguishing characteristics"* of an Amstrong? Any
particular geometry traits? I'm built exactly like him (if you squashed and
widened him and then fed him gallons of ice cream, that is), so I might be
interested :)

Bill "ideal cookie cutter candidate" S.

*other than a cracked chainstay, of course
 
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