Bike and AMericans

[Red Cloud]

To talk about the topic of Bicycle to Americans, it's like asking a
question
to aliens. Aliens from out of space would not ride a bike like
americans would.
Bicycle is like a sort of unnecessarily and unfriendly item to most
American.
And is not part of American lives. Americans don't much care about
bike
when they are addicted to clean their automobile.

For American, bike is just a recreational sport not as a
transportation machine. That all that is. Most Probably only 2% or 3%
American riding a bike everyday. Most of them are poor underclass who
can't afford car.

I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
how could find your bike)

 

[psycholist]

"Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> To talk about the topic of Bicycle to Americans, it's like asking a
> question
> to aliens. Aliens from out of space would not ride a bike like
> americans would.
> Bicycle is like a sort of unnecessarily and unfriendly item to most
> American.
> And is not part of American lives. Americans don't much care about
> bike
> when they are addicted to clean their automobile.
>
> For American, bike is just a recreational sport not as a
> transportation machine. That all that is. Most Probably only 2% or 3%
> American riding a bike everyday. Most of them are poor underclass who
> can't afford car.
>
> I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> how could find your bike)

Red Cloud,

From your other post on this newsgroup, you obviously live in California.
Taking California as representative of all of America is like taking
television programming as representative of real life.

I wish cycling were more popular here, but it's not as unpopular as you make
it out to be. The love affair with the car stems in part from the fact that
we have land here. We're not piled on top of each other like in some
European countries. And we're allowed to own land here ... unlike in some
countries. The distances between our places are more vast. Maybe not where
you are in California, but it's true in many other places. We have longer
distances to travel and we have a good road system to facilitate it.

But some of the largest and most successful bicycle companies are here and
we're an important export market for European and Asian bicycle companies.
Some of those bikes gather dust in people's garages. Some actually get used
.... regularly.

I attended a cycling event yesterday in a remote town called Clark's Hill,
SC. I don't know what the population is there, but it's VERY small. The
event drew from miles around, though and hundreds of people showed up --
hundreds of mostly very fit and healthy Americans who love to ride their
bikes.

Don't judge America by California. Don't call the USA "America," either ...
Canadians and Mexicans and others get offended 'cuz they're American's, too.

I heard a good one the other day ... how many Frenchmen does it take to
defend Paris? Nobody knows ... it's never been done. I guess all Frenchmen
are cowards, eh?

Bob C.

 

[Q.]

"Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

<snip a buncha junk about how Amerikanskis suck>

--------------------------
/| /| | |
||__|| | Please don't |
/ O O\__ feed |
/ \ the trolls |
/ \ \ |
/ _ \ \ ----------------------
/ |\____\ \ ||
/ | | | |\____/ ||
/ \|_|_|/ | __||
/ / \ |____| ||
/ | | /| | --|
| | |// |____ --|
* _ | |_|_|_| | \-/
*-- _--\ _ \ // |
/ _ \\ _ // | /
* / \_ /- | - | |
* ___ c_c_c_C/ \C_c_c_c____________


Thank you!
C.Q.C.

 

[AustinMN]

Red Cloud <[email protected]>

> I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> how could find your bike)

Note how he suggest he in US. In other thread he call himself American.
Note how Yahoo address is .UK.

How troll continues because we feed him!

Austin

 

[SniffinVinyl]

Good post, unfortunately this guy looks like a troll. Most of his
observations are likely true, but he displays no understanding of why there
are differences with Europe, and yet in the same breath is making an implied
judgement.

Also, an observation from a Canadian, most of us do not think of ourselves
as Americans, perhaps we are better described as North Americans. I think
that for most of the rest of the world including Canada the term 'American'
applies to the USA.


Sniffinvinyl



"psycholist" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > To talk about the topic of Bicycle to Americans, it's like asking a
> > question
> > to aliens. Aliens from out of space would not ride a bike like
> > americans would.
> > Bicycle is like a sort of unnecessarily and unfriendly item to most
> > American.
> > And is not part of American lives. Americans don't much care about
> > bike
> > when they are addicted to clean their automobile.
> >
> > For American, bike is just a recreational sport not as a
> > transportation machine. That all that is. Most Probably only 2% or 3%
> > American riding a bike everyday. Most of them are poor underclass who
> > can't afford car.
> >
> > I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> > bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> > the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> > less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> > of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> > how could find your bike)
>
> Red Cloud,
>
> From your other post on this newsgroup, you obviously live in California.
> Taking California as representative of all of America is like taking
> television programming as representative of real life.
>
> I wish cycling were more popular here, but it's not as unpopular as you
make
> it out to be. The love affair with the car stems in part from the fact
that
> we have land here. We're not piled on top of each other like in some
> European countries. And we're allowed to own land here ... unlike in some
> countries. The distances between our places are more vast. Maybe not
where
> you are in California, but it's true in many other places. We have longer
> distances to travel and we have a good road system to facilitate it.
>
> But some of the largest and most successful bicycle companies are here and
> we're an important export market for European and Asian bicycle companies.
> Some of those bikes gather dust in people's garages. Some actually get
used
> ... regularly.
>
> I attended a cycling event yesterday in a remote town called Clark's Hill,
> SC. I don't know what the population is there, but it's VERY small. The
> event drew from miles around, though and hundreds of people showed up --
> hundreds of mostly very fit and healthy Americans who love to ride their
> bikes.
>
> Don't judge America by California. Don't call the USA "America," either
....
> Canadians and Mexicans and others get offended 'cuz they're American's,
too.
>
> I heard a good one the other day ... how many Frenchmen does it take to
> defend Paris? Nobody knows ... it's never been done. I guess all
Frenchmen
> are cowards, eh?
>
> Bob C.
>
>
>

 

[dirtylitterboxofferingstospammers]

>I think
>that for most of the rest of the world including Canada the term 'American'
>applies to the USA.

Certianly this Brit doesn't think of Canadians or Canada as "American"
Similarly I don't think of Mexico or Mexicans as "Americans". Certainly do
think the residents of the USA are Americans and that the USA is referred to as
America.

Cheers, helen s



--This is an invalid email address to avoid spam--
to get correct one remove fame & fortune
h*$el*$$e*nd**$o$ts**i*$*$m*m$o*n*s@$*a$o*l.c**$om$

--Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off--

 

[GaryG]

"Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> To talk about the topic of Bicycle to Americans, it's like asking a
> question
> to aliens. Aliens from out of space would not ride a bike like
> americans would.
> Bicycle is like a sort of unnecessarily and unfriendly item to most
> American.
> And is not part of American lives. Americans don't much care about
> bike
> when they are addicted to clean their automobile.
>
> For American, bike is just a recreational sport not as a
> transportation machine. That all that is. Most Probably only 2% or 3%
> American riding a bike everyday. Most of them are poor underclass who
> can't afford car.
>
> I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> how could find your bike)

Try visiting the campus of the University of California, at Davis. Finding
a parking place for your bike is difficult at times. They provide secure
parking facilities for bikes, have special traffic signals just for bikes,
and even have a student-funded on campus bike repair facility on campus.

--
~_-*
....G/ \G
http://www.CycliStats.com
CycliStats - Software for Cyclists

 

[di]

"Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> To talk about the topic of Bicycle to Americans, it's like asking a
> question
> to aliens. Aliens from out of space would not ride a bike like
> americans would.
> Bicycle is like a sort of unnecessarily and unfriendly item to most
> American.
> And is not part of American lives. Americans don't much care about
> bike
> when they are addicted to clean their automobile.
>
> For American, bike is just a recreational sport not as a
> transportation machine. That all that is. Most Probably only 2% or 3%
> American riding a bike everyday. Most of them are poor underclass who
> can't afford car.
>
> I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> how could find your bike)

Before becoming very critical of American society, you might try to improve
your English, it would make your position more credible.

 

[Terry Morse]

Red Cloud wrote:

> I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> how could find your bike)

Maybe yours is an urban campus that's not as "bike friendly".

Different USA campuses are different. Visit Stanford or UC Davis in
California, and you would be shocked by the number of cyclists. At
Stanford, the 10-minute period between classes is pure bedlam as the
cyclists ride from one classroom to another. It would be difficult
to get between distant classrooms in time without a bike, and using
a car is out of the question.
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

 

[Red Cloud]

"psycholist" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> "Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > To talk about the topic of Bicycle to Americans, it's like asking a
> > question
> > to aliens. Aliens from out of space would not ride a bike like
> > americans would.
> > Bicycle is like a sort of unnecessarily and unfriendly item to most
> > American.
> > And is not part of American lives. Americans don't much care about
> > bike
> > when they are addicted to clean their automobile.
> >
> > For American, bike is just a recreational sport not as a
> > transportation machine. That all that is. Most Probably only 2% or 3%
> > American riding a bike everyday. Most of them are poor underclass who
> > can't afford car.
> >
> > I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> > bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> > the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> > less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> > of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> > how could find your bike)
>
> Red Cloud,
>
> From your other post on this newsgroup, you obviously live in California.
> Taking California as representative of all of America is like taking
> television programming as representative of real life.
>
> I wish cycling were more popular here, but it's not as unpopular as you make
> it out to be. The love affair with the car stems in part from the fact that
> we have land here. We're not piled on top of each other like in some
> European countries. And we're allowed to own land here ... unlike in some
> countries. The distances between our places are more vast. Maybe not where
> you are in California, but it's true in many other places. We have longer
> distances to travel and we have a good road system to facilitate it.
>
> But some of the largest and most successful bicycle companies are here and
> we're an important export market for European and Asian bicycle companies.
> Some of those bikes gather dust in people's garages. Some actually get used
> ... regularly.
>
> I attended a cycling event yesterday in a remote town called Clark's Hill,
> SC. I don't know what the population is there, but it's VERY small. The
> event drew from miles around, though and hundreds of people showed up --
> hundreds of mostly very fit and healthy Americans who love to ride their
> bikes.
>
> Don't judge America by California. Don't call the USA "America," either ...
> Canadians and Mexicans and others get offended 'cuz they're American's, too.
>
> I heard a good one the other day ... how many Frenchmen does it take to
> defend Paris? Nobody knows ... it's never been done. I guess all Frenchmen
> are cowards, eh?
>
> Bob C.

How about comparing European city with American city (OK use America not USA)
regarding the popularity of bicycle?

Clark's HIll SC bike gathering is just a political show which is very popular
in America. It's just political show using bicycle. Probably those only rides
a bike on that show probably never ride a bike as a transporation.

So your writing is worthless. It's even stupid naive and arrogant which is
normal to being Americans.

 

[Red Cloud]

"AustinMN" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Red Cloud <[email protected]>
>
> > I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> > bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> > the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> > less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> > of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> > how could find your bike)
>
> Note how he suggest he in US. In other thread he call himself American.
> Note how Yahoo address is .UK.
>
> How troll continues because we feed him!
>
> Austin


YOu are right that I'm in aMerica not UK but you are wrong about trolling.
I'm here to make a point not trolling. I don't even watch TV OK!
YOu watch American TV, you are feeding to all the trolling TV program.
That's why I never watch propaganda American TV. I rather watch BBC.

 

[Red Cloud]

"SniffinVinyl" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Good post, unfortunately this guy looks like a troll. Most of his
> observations are likely true, but he displays no understanding of why there
> are differences with Europe, and yet in the same breath is making an implied
> judgement.
>

I feel sad you think I'm trolling. I'm making a point regardign the
most
important aspect of bicycle. How could that be trolling?



> Also, an observation from a Canadian, most of us do not think of ourselves
> as Americans, perhaps we are better described as North Americans. I think
> that for most of the rest of the world including Canada the term 'American'
> applies to the USA.
>

I myself quite surprise Canadian perception regarding their
relathionship
with American. It seems to me Canadian, if not the most
anti-American, is very
anti-american. Is not true that Canadian try to get close to EU's
socialism than Bush-American neo-nazism?



> Sniffinvinyl
>





>
>
> "psycholist" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > "Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > To talk about the topic of Bicycle to Americans, it's like asking a
> > > question
> > > to aliens. Aliens from out of space would not ride a bike like
> > > americans would.
> > > Bicycle is like a sort of unnecessarily and unfriendly item to most
> > > American.
> > > And is not part of American lives. Americans don't much care about
> > > bike
> > > when they are addicted to clean their automobile.
> > >
> > > For American, bike is just a recreational sport not as a
> > > transportation machine. That all that is. Most Probably only 2% or 3%
> > > American riding a bike everyday. Most of them are poor underclass who
> > > can't afford car.
> > >
> > > I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> > > bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> > > the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> > > less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> > > of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> > > how could find your bike)
> >
> > Red Cloud,
> >
> > From your other post on this newsgroup, you obviously live in California.
> > Taking California as representative of all of America is like taking
> > television programming as representative of real life.
> >
> > I wish cycling were more popular here, but it's not as unpopular as you
> make
> > it out to be. The love affair with the car stems in part from the fact
> that
> > we have land here. We're not piled on top of each other like in some
> > European countries. And we're allowed to own land here ... unlike in some
> > countries. The distances between our places are more vast. Maybe not
> where
> > you are in California, but it's true in many other places. We have longer
> > distances to travel and we have a good road system to facilitate it.
> >
> > But some of the largest and most successful bicycle companies are here and
> > we're an important export market for European and Asian bicycle companies.
> > Some of those bikes gather dust in people's garages. Some actually get
> used
> > ... regularly.
> >
> > I attended a cycling event yesterday in a remote town called Clark's Hill,
> > SC. I don't know what the population is there, but it's VERY small. The
> > event drew from miles around, though and hundreds of people showed up --
> > hundreds of mostly very fit and healthy Americans who love to ride their
> > bikes.
> >
> > Don't judge America by California. Don't call the USA "America," either
> ...
> > Canadians and Mexicans and others get offended 'cuz they're American's,
> too.
> >
> > I heard a good one the other day ... how many Frenchmen does it take to
> > defend Paris? Nobody knows ... it's never been done. I guess all
> Frenchmen
> > are cowards, eh?
> >
> > Bob C.
> >
> >
> >

 

[Red Cloud]

"GaryG" <garyg@shasta_SPAMBEGONE_software.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> "Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > To talk about the topic of Bicycle to Americans, it's like asking a
> > question
> > to aliens. Aliens from out of space would not ride a bike like
> > americans would.
> > Bicycle is like a sort of unnecessarily and unfriendly item to most
> > American.
> > And is not part of American lives. Americans don't much care about
> > bike
> > when they are addicted to clean their automobile.
> >
> > For American, bike is just a recreational sport not as a
> > transportation machine. That all that is. Most Probably only 2% or 3%
> > American riding a bike everyday. Most of them are poor underclass who
> > can't afford car.
> >
> > I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> > bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> > the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> > less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> > of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> > how could find your bike)
>
> Try visiting the campus of the University of California, at Davis. Finding
> a parking place for your bike is difficult at times. They provide secure
> parking facilities for bikes, have special traffic signals just for bikes,
> and even have a student-funded on campus bike repair facility on campus.


HOw many bike you see in Northern CA CSU Davis CAmpus? I don't see
much bike in CSU Los angeles?

 

[GaryG]

"Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "GaryG" <garyg@shasta_SPAMBEGONE_software.com> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > "Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > To talk about the topic of Bicycle to Americans, it's like asking a
> > > question
> > > to aliens. Aliens from out of space would not ride a bike like
> > > americans would.
> > > Bicycle is like a sort of unnecessarily and unfriendly item to most
> > > American.
> > > And is not part of American lives. Americans don't much care about
> > > bike
> > > when they are addicted to clean their automobile.
> > >
> > > For American, bike is just a recreational sport not as a
> > > transportation machine. That all that is. Most Probably only 2% or 3%
> > > American riding a bike everyday. Most of them are poor underclass who
> > > can't afford car.
> > >
> > > I go to any American college and count how many bike I see parked in
> > > bike-rack? One or two. Here in my city in a local college, to count
> > > the number of bikes inside of campus, the number is less than 20 or
> > > less. I will never see here in American campus the tremendous number
> > > of bikes parked in English campus like Cambridge or Oxford (I wonder
> > > how could find your bike)
> >
> > Try visiting the campus of the University of California, at Davis.
Finding
> > a parking place for your bike is difficult at times. They provide
secure
> > parking facilities for bikes, have special traffic signals just for
bikes,
> > and even have a student-funded on campus bike repair facility on campus.
>
>
> HOw many bike you see in Northern CA CSU Davis CAmpus? I don't see
> much bike in CSU Los angeles?

I don't know about LA, but UC Davis has THOUSANDS of bikes on campus every
day. So does CSU Chico.

GG

 

[Curtis L. Russell]

On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 23:19:13 -0700, "GaryG"
<garyg@shasta_SPAMBEGONE_software.com> wrote:

>I don't know about LA, but UC Davis has THOUSANDS of bikes on campus every
>day. So does CSU Chico.
>
>GG

He has trouble seeing them from that .UK address that someone else
mentioned.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

 

[Bob]

> HOw many bike you see in Northern CA CSU Davis CAmpus? I don't see
> much bike in CSU Los angeles?

Do you see much grammar at CSULA?

 

[Matt O'Toole]

Bob wrote:

>> HOw many bike you see in Northern CA CSU Davis CAmpus? I don't see
>> much bike in CSU Los angeles?
>
> Do you see much grammar at CSULA?

He would in my friend Ivan's class (ESL) -- a popular one at CSULA.

Matt O.

 

[Terry Morse]

Red Cloud wrote:

> HOw many bike you see in Northern CA CSU Davis CAmpus? I don't see
> much bike in CSU Los angeles?

The City of Davis is reported to have about 50,000 bicycles, roughly
one bicycle per person. Some 20% of trips in Davis are made by
bicycle.
http://www.bikeleague.org/mediacenter/medprs22.htm

And here's my town, not quite as impressive, but still pretty good:

"In Palo Alto, remarkable 4.4% of all trips are by bicycle. Palo
Alto encourages city employees to bike to work by offering them a
$20 monthly stipend. The city supports a Bikestation, a staffed bike
parking facility that serves some 50 cyclists per day, and provides
bike lockers at transit hubs and in its business district. Palo Alto
schools have a part-time coordinator who teaches a bicycle
curriculum to children in the third, fifth and sixth grades. Younger
children are introduced to traffic and helmet safety in a Safe Moves
program."
http://www.bikeleague.org/mediacenter/medprs051503.htm

Los Angeles is the worst example of American car culture. But Los
Angeles does not equal California, and it really does not equal the
USA.
--
terry morse Palo Alto, CA http://bike.terrymorse.com/

 

[Red Cloud]

"GaryG" <garyg@shasta_SPAMBEGONE_software.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> "Red Cloud" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...

> bikes,
> > > and even have a student-funded on campus bike repair facility on campus.
> >
> >
> > HOw many bike you see in Northern CA CSU Davis CAmpus? I don't see
> > much bike in CSU Los angeles?
>
> I don't know about LA, but UC Davis has THOUSANDS of bikes on campus every
> day. So does CSU Chico.
>
> GG


Hardly believe UC David has a thousand bike, but CSULA, CSULB, CSUF,
CSU Domingze Hill has no much biker. I saw more skateboard rider than
Bike rider.
Defintely bike is not popular around here.

 

[Matt O'Toole]

Terry Morse wrote:

> Red Cloud wrote:
>
>> HOw many bike you see in Northern CA CSU Davis CAmpus? I don't see
>> much bike in CSU Los angeles?
>
> The City of Davis is reported to have about 50,000 bicycles, roughly
> one bicycle per person. Some 20% of trips in Davis are made by
> bicycle.
> http://www.bikeleague.org/mediacenter/medprs22.htm
>
> And here's my town, not quite as impressive, but still pretty good:
>
> "In Palo Alto, remarkable 4.4% of all trips are by bicycle. Palo
> Alto encourages city employees to bike to work by offering them a
> $20 monthly stipend.

This is terrific, but I can't imagine $20 makes a difference to anyone who can
afford to live in Palo Alto! However, many people, including myself, view being
able to bike to work, etc., as a luxury. Real estate prices for villagey towns
like Palo Alto suggest that many people feel this way, and are willing to pay
for it. It's the less-well-off and the suckered who must put up with
car-dependence.

> Los Angeles is the worst example of American car culture. But Los
> Angeles does not equal California, and it really does not equal the
> USA.

Despite stereotypes, Los Angeles is *far* from being the worst example of
American car culture. It isn't even close to being the worst in CA. Nearby
Orange and Riverside counties are far worse, as is the sprawl extending eastward
and southward from the Bay Area. LA has distinct neighborhoods with everything
close by, public transportation that works better than spoiled upper middle
class white people give it credit for, plus the city is far more bikeable than
one might imagine. The sub-cities of Santa Monica, Pasadena, Glendale, and Long
Beach are all highly centralized, walkable, and bikeable. Long Beach even has a
Bikestation.

And again, despite stereotypes, CA has nowhere near the worst sprawl in the
country. Newer areas of the Southeast are far worse. If you want to see
sprawl-hell, go to Washington or Atlanta! Charlotte, Greensboro-High Point, and
Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill aren't far behind. Notice the hyphens! What does
that tell you? Hyphenless Charlotte has a lovely downtown, with great,
affordable neighborhoods, but most Charlotteans live on the outskirts where they
can enjoy their love affairs with ride-on mowers.

And then there's Texas...

Matt O.