Cateye Double Shot as main headlamp?

Quoted message said:

I already have a Blackburn Quadrant as an LED headlamp with various
steady and flashing modes but it's not bright enough for dark roads or
off road at night. I need another light and am tending towards a Cateye
Double Shot. Can anyone say if this combination is good enough to go
off road or on dark country roads safely. I'm happy to use it as a
helmet light if that's the best position. Wish I could afford the Pro
model, but that'll have to stay a Christmas wish.

I believe that the optics in the Double Shot are similar to the
HL-EL510/520/530, and from experience I can say that the 510 and the
530 provide barely enough light for on-road lighting for in-town night
recreational and commuting rides; at speeds over 12 to 15mph, or for
off-road use, they're inadequate in my estimation. Twice the light
would take them to "barely adequate" for 15 - 16mph on streets IMO,
and "maybe adequate" for level-trail off-road use where neither high
speeds nor hazardous terrain is involved. In combination with
something else, the double-shot might be enough. For all of that,
they're some of the best lights for the price that I've come
across...but to get lots of light, it still costs lots of money.
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Werehatrack said:

On 10 Nov 2006 00:52:37 -0800, [email hidden] wrote:

....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I need another light and am tending towards a Cateye
Double Shot. Can anyone say if this combination is good enough to go
off road or on dark country roads safely. I'm happy to use it as a
helmet light if that's the best position. Wish I could afford the Pro
model, but that'll have to stay a Christmas wish.

Here's a round up of lights that includes the Double Shot:

http://gearreview.com/2006_led_lights.php

Quoted message said:

I believe that the optics in the Double Shot are similar to the
HL-EL510/520/530, and from experience I can say that the 510 and the
530 provide barely enough light for on-road lighting for in-town night
recreational and commuting rides; at speeds over 12 to 15mph, or for
off-road use, they're inadequate in my estimation. Twice the light
would take them to "barely adequate" for 15 - 16mph on streets IMO,
and "maybe adequate" for level-trail off-road use where neither high
speeds nor hazardous terrain is involved.

But the Double Shot isn't just twice the light of the 510/520/530 series
of 1 watt Luxeons. The Double Shot is two 3 watt Luxeon III lamps, plus
I believe it has current regulation for more consistent output, unlike
the 510/520/530.

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Victor Kan said:

Werehatrack said:

On 10 Nov 2006 00:52:37 -0800, [email hidden] wrote:

...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I need another light and am tending towards a Cateye
Double Shot. Can anyone say if this combination is good enough to go
off road or on dark country roads safely. I'm happy to use it as a
helmet light if that's the best position. Wish I could afford the Pro
model, but that'll have to stay a Christmas wish.

Here's a round up of lights that includes the Double Shot:

http://gearreview.com/2006_led_lights.php

I saw this review which is why I'm considering these lights. The
pictures don't really give a comparison though as from that image the
Double Shot only looks a bit brighter then my Quadrant.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I believe that the optics in the Double Shot are similar to the
HL-EL510/520/530, and from experience I can say that the 510 and the
530 provide barely enough light for on-road lighting for in-town night
recreational and commuting rides; at speeds over 12 to 15mph, or for
off-road use, they're inadequate in my estimation. Twice the light
would take them to "barely adequate" for 15 - 16mph on streets IMO,
and "maybe adequate" for level-trail off-road use where neither high
speeds nor hazardous terrain is involved.

But the Double Shot isn't just twice the light of the 510/520/530 series
of 1 watt Luxeons. The Double Shot is two 3 watt Luxeon III lamps, plus
I believe it has current regulation for more consistent output, unlike
the 510/520/530.

That's what I figured. They should five to six times brighter with
better optics and longer battery life.

I'm thinking of getting the Double Shot now and handlebar mounting it,
if it provides enough light. Then next year, if I'm getting seriously
into off-road biking, moving it to my helmet and get another light for
the bars, either a HID or LED like the Triple Shot Pro. Perhaps
there'll be a better selection of LED lights then too like the new
Topeak WhiteLite HP 5W. My bars are a weird shape so the current
DiNotte's would likely not point in the right direction (no horizontal
rotation adjustment), and the battery for the Blackburn X3 and X6 is
horrible and difficult to mount in the bike. There'll be snow on the
ground here soon anyway and I expect a smaller light like this will do
fine in the whiter conditions.

Quoted message said:

I already have a Blackburn Quadrant as an LED headlamp with various
steady and flashing modes but it's not bright enough for dark roads or
off road at night. I need another light and am tending towards a Cateye
Double Shot. Can anyone say if this combination is good enough to go
off road or on dark country roads safely. I'm happy to use it as a
helmet light if that's the best position. Wish I could afford the Pro
model, but that'll have to stay a Christmas wish.

Have a look at the Niterider Minewt as well.

Robin

Werehatrack said:

Quoted message said:

I already have a Blackburn Quadrant as an LED headlamp with various
steady and flashing modes but it's not bright enough for dark roads or
off road at night. I need another light and am tending towards a Cateye
Double Shot. Can anyone say if this combination is good enough to go off
road or on dark country roads safely. I'm happy to use it as a helmet
light if that's the best position. Wish I could afford the Pro model,
but that'll have to stay a Christmas wish.

I believe that the optics in the Double Shot are similar to the
HL-EL510/520/530, and from experience I can say that the 510 and the 530
provide barely enough light for on-road lighting for in-town night
recreational and commuting rides; at speeds over 12 to 15mph, or for
off-road use, they're inadequate in my estimation. Twice the light
would take them to "barely adequate" for 15 - 16mph on streets IMO, and
"maybe adequate" for level-trail off-road use where neither high speeds
nor hazardous terrain is involved. In combination with something else,
the double-shot might be enough. For all of that, they're some of the
best lights for the price that I've come across...but to get lots of
light, it still costs lots of money.

I don't know about the Doubleshot, but I agree about the 510/520/530 being
practically useless, with their tiny dot of light. The older HL-500 II
Micro Halogen is far superior.

Strangely, the cheaper EL400 is actually pretty nice. I wouldn't say it's
suitable for high speed use either, but for town or emergency trail use it
works well.

Here's a review of several lights, including the Doubleshot:

http://www.gearreview.com/2006_led_lights.php

To me it looks like the Doubleshot might have too narrow a beam for my
taste, but the Tripleshot might be pretty nice. However, there are plenty
of other lights at least this good for a lot less money.

For trail riding (singletrack) you definitely want a wider beam. My
favorite trail light is a 15W Turbocat helmet lamp with a semi-flood beam.
A combination bar and helmet lamp setup is best for off road, but forced
to choose I'd take the helmet lamp.

Newer systems that impress me the most are the Dinotte 5W, and the L&M
Solo Logic Mv, which has a focusable beam for versatility. L&M also make
their own reflectors, which produce a more even beam than the commodity MR
lamps used by everyone else.

Matt O.

Robin Hubert said:

Have a look at the Niterider Minewt as well.

I wouldn't expect the Minewt to have better/higher output than the
Doubleshot and it does not have a helmet mount option. But it does seem
like a nice little light.

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Matt O'Toole said:

I don't know about the Doubleshot, but I agree about the 510/520/530 being
practically useless, with their tiny dot of light. The older HL-500 II
Micro Halogen is far superior.

I haven't seen the 510 and 520 lights, but I own an EL-500 and an
EL-530. I thought the EL-500 put out a nicely shaped beam, though a
little bit narrow, and not quite enough overall output (though decent
when combined with an EL-300 for in-fill on familiar roads). The EL-530
does throw farther, but as you say, it has an even smaller spot of light
(albeit a bright one) than the EL-500.

I wish Cateye put their improvement efforts in making the EL-500 have
higher output, but the same beam shape rather than making the EL-530
with its big shiny bowl of a reflector, tiny spot output and too-bright
outer ring of light (I guess they did that for side visility?).

Quoted message said:

Strangely, the cheaper EL400 is actually pretty nice. I wouldn't say it's
suitable for high speed use either, but for town or emergency trail use it
works well.

I hear a lot of praise of the EL-400, including as a good infill light
for generator light users, but I don't get it. I have an EL-400 and
while it may be fine as a be-seen light, I just cannot see how it can be
used for seeing at *any* speed. I guess I should eat more carrots.

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legitimate replies.

If it's anything like the Cygo Dualcross, which I have (dual 3W Luxeons),
then it's certainly bright enough for riding on unlit sealed roads. I think
the beam is a bit narrow for off-road - I also have a Cateye Stadium 3 for
comparison and that is much better off-road due to the much wider beam.

Nick

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I already have a Blackburn Quadrant as an LED headlamp with various
steady and flashing modes but it's not bright enough for dark roads or
off road at night. I need another light and am tending towards a Cateye
Double Shot. Can anyone say if this combination is good enough to go
off road or on dark country roads safely. I'm happy to use it as a
helmet light if that's the best position. Wish I could afford the Pro
model, but that'll have to stay a Christmas wish.

Victor Kan said:

I haven't seen the 510 and 520 lights, but I own an EL-500 and an
EL-530. I thought the EL-500 put out a nicely shaped beam, though a
little bit narrow, and not quite enough overall output (though decent
when combined with an EL-300 for in-fill on familiar roads). The EL-530
does throw farther, but as you say, it has an even smaller spot of light
(albeit a bright one) than the EL-500.

I wish Cateye put their improvement efforts in making the EL-500 have
higher output, but the same beam shape rather than making the EL-530
with its big shiny bowl of a reflector, tiny spot output and

All of these are quite bright, but the spot is just too small. Cateye is
playing games with lumen ratings, focusing less overall light into a
smaller spot so they can say it's brighter. But there's simply no way to
get as much light from a 1W LED as from a 2.4W halogen like the old Micro
has. LED's may be more efficient but nowhere near that much. A 1W LED
may give more light than a 1W halogen, but there's no way it's going to
beat a 2.4W one. The 30 hour runtime claim is a sham -- you get the same
2-3 hours of "useful" light, after which it's just a dim glow.

I borrowed a EL-5xx to ride home from a friend's house awhile ago, which
was a scary experience. It lit just a 2' patch of road, with no spillover
whatsoever, so I couldn't see curves in the road or parked cars. My Micro
has enough spillover to see this stuff.

Quoted message said:

too-bright
outer ring of light (I guess they did that for side visility?).

Probably. This is important for safety.

Quoted message said:

I hear a lot of praise of the EL-400, including as a good infill light
for generator light users, but I don't get it. I have an EL-400 and
while it may be fine as a be-seen light, I just cannot see how it can be
used for seeing at *any* speed. I guess I should eat more carrots.

It's not very bright, but it has a very wide, even beam pattern,
which vaguely illuminates the edges of the road, parked cars, signs, etc.
So it's fine for riding carefully at low speeds around town, through the
dark spots between streetlamps, or as an emergency light for mountain
biking at dusk.

I was caught out mountain biking after dark a couple of weeks ago. I got
home in one piece only because my trailmate had one of these lights. It
actually worked pretty well on a dark singletrack trail. No way is it a
good primary light for full speed riding though.

It has other downsides too. It uses three AAA batteries. Batteries often
can't be purchased or charged in multiples of three, and AAA's are more
expensive in watt-hours per dollar than AA's. Cateye's new ratcheting
strap mount won't stay put, and is more cumbersome to use than their older
quick release mount. I'm sure this change was made for cost savings, not
function. I wonder if the people who make this stuff even ride bikes!

So I'm really disappointed in Cateye lately. They've always had very well
designed products. Parts were always available, etc. But their latest
batch of stuff is [censored].

The Tripleshot looks like a pretty good light, but for $250? Sheesh! You
could do at least as well for less than half that much.

Matt O.