Cost of petrol / Gasoline

[swampy1970]

I am sorry swampy... a copy and paste of a Google search is lame.... even if your only 14. If you're actually (and that post really makes me wonder) an adult.... why not read the searches and some of the links involved, Not in an attempt to reinforce some sort of predetermined point of view... but actually learn something. Believe it or not... they even still make books. Words evolve... that is true. Some people DO have a self interest to pose the idea that the term fossil fuel was ever used to mean something other than coal. That's silly.... I am older that that myself.... I KNOW BETTER. And... so does NASA. You can post Google search results till the cows come home. But the truth is Al Gore is the leader of your movement... not you. Al Gore is grouping environmentalism with religion... not me.

Not really lame because it's: A. Factual B. not as lame as saying that fossil fuels need to have actual fossils in them - which of course natural gas cannot despite being a fossil fuel. C. Is more than you deserve but feeding the troll (ie you) passes the time when I'm on the phone. What you need to do next is decouple from the fact that looking after the environment isn't a religious thing... You should also double check the meanings for environmentalism and enivormentalist again.

 

[danfoz]

Originally Posted by swampy1970 .


looking after the environment isn't a religious thing...

Yes.

 

[Dave Cutter]

Originally Posted by swampy1970 .


Not really lame because it's:
A. Factual
B. not as lame as saying that fossil fuels need to have actual fossils in them - which of course natural gas cannot despite being a fossil fuel.
C. Is more than you deserve but feeding the troll (ie you) passes the time when I'm on the phone.
What you need to do next is decouple from the fact that looking after the environment isn't a religious thing...
You should also double check the meanings for environmentalism and enivormentalist again.

Yes... targeted Google searches are so factual. Generally people that provide Google searches as "fact".... sooner or later show their "facts" that aliens from outer space put mankind here on Earth to mine gold for them. No. Sorry but a Google search result.... is ONLY a Google search result.

B... you need to get your reader to re-read that for you.... it isn't what I said.

Pea sized brain.... cool. I'll mention that at my next Mensa meeting/event. You do the same. What is it you're doing to "look after" the environment? I thought I was the one conserving! I thought you are the one "preaching" about the environment (be sure to search for the defination of the word preach). You may THINK you're Al Gore.... but I don't think you really are.

You're sounding very much like you've run out of anything reasonable... and are no longer even reading and/or addressing the thread. You just spewing!

 

[jhuskey]

Al use to live just down the road. He is probably not the great humanitarian you think he is. He does worship.... money.

 

[AlanG]

Originally Posted by ambal .

When do you guys think the high cost of petrol / Gasoline will start having an impact on the number of drivers on the city roads? I'm thinking if people are paying upward of $100 for a tank of fuel, they may start to look for alternatives like public transport or commuting to work by bike.

In the 3 months since you posted this, gas prices have come down quite a bit with lower prices likely. (Oil was $77 a barrel today.) So I guess that prices alone won't be much of an incentive to conserve or commute by bike. The cost of a gallon of gas is apparently not much of a factor.

No offense to any of you but the Secretary of Energy, lives across the street from me. So I think I have a good source for information about energy and policies should I need it.

 

[Dave Cutter]

Originally Posted by jhuskey .

Al use to live just down the road. He is probably not the great humanitarian you think he is. He does worship.... money.

Yes... I know where Al got much of his money too... since we're posting about Google. Al is a kook... and I mean that in a kind way. But love him, fear him, hate him.... none of that matters. He is without any question the global front man of the religious left wing environmental movement. And as the global leader of the movement is is doing what he can to promote it as the religion that it has morphed into.

I guess I can understand the frustration of the people that believe in the movement [as a science it was once considered to be].... and don't like the direction.... which Al is taking the movement. But it is, what it is.

 

[Dave Cutter]

Originally Posted by AlanG .

....... So I guess that prices alone won't be much of an incentive to conserve or commute by bike. The cost of a gallon of gas is apparently not much of a factor.

For more than a hundred years lovers of the bicycle [in all its configurations] have thought that the bicycle might somehow change the world.

Interestingly.... I think those with the highest hopes for the bicycle miss... seeing the forest for all the trees. There are more than a billion bicycles in the world. And from what I've read many of those are the simple push-bike [being used as a two wheeled cart, to haul firewood, or containers of drinking water, or goods to market]. The poorer the population the more appreciated the bicycle. But everywhere.... all people want more! More convenience and less effort, more wealth and less poverty. No one wants to spend one of every 3 working days merely hauling jugs of drinking water by push bike.

The fact that the simple bicycle has aided so many countless millions... maybe even billions of humans as they toil their way through the worst of conditions... speaks well of the bicycle. The idea that some of the people in some of the wealthiest nations still choose the bicycle for sport and recreation as well as some practical uses, also speaks highly for the cyclists as well. I myself am proud to be cyclist.

I know many people have always dreamed and wished for simpler times and lifestyles.... [people wished for that, even back in the days when the simpler lifestyles were what we had]. But we can't go back. Fuels, energy, technology, complexity will forever be with us... that cannot be changed. Poverty can make our lives harder... but poverty doesn't [can't] make life simpler.

 

[alienator]

Dave, I did read the NASA link you posted. It's timely, considering the Curiosity rover (aka Mars Science Lab) is due to land on 5 Aug. It should provide alot more information about whether biological processes have played a role on Mars. I look forward to reading more.....NASA missions tend to get alot of front-page coverage in the local news for some reason. But I don't see any thing sinester or threatening in what the MSL finds, or anything that could affect the need to protect and conserve our scarce resources on Earth. Can you explain why it's so significant to you that the methane on Mars (and other planets) was apparently created via geological processes (as well as some small portion of the methane on Earth)? And what's not polically correct about acknowledging this fact? I've got no problem with it at all, and I've already said I'm an environmentalist. Are you saying that since inorganic processes can create methane, there is no need to conserve it? Or that there is a virtually unlimited supply of methane on other planets, so that all we need to do is find a way to go get it? Note, I'm not interested in changing your thinking, just curious about what it is. Just can't understand why it would be so important to know how the oil and natural gas we consume was created all those eons ago. Perhaps you think there is some kind of conspriracy by "big oil" to make it appear that the world's supply of oil will run out in 43 years (or 100 years, pick your own number).

Speaking of MSL, you should check out this video from JPL called "Challenges of Getting to Mars: Curiosity's Seven Minutes of Terror": [video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzqdoXwLBT8[/video] I can't wait until August to watch the landing (or rather watch the data flow and the mission controllers as the landing happens). Spirit's and Opportunity's landings were nail biters but ended up nearly perfect. Phoenix's landing was even more exciting and was perfect. MSL's landing will be a veritable blockbuster. Given what was learned on all previous Mars missions and the testing that's happened with MSL, I'm betting this blockbuster will be of the JJ Abrahams/Steven Spielberg sort and hopeful not the Michael Bay warm turd sort. Completely off-topic: it's too bad NASA can't advertise, 'cuz the above video would be a great trailer in movie theaters. NASA could certainly benefit from advertising because the public knows only about a very small percentage of the work at NASA, and there is very cool work going on. Congress should allow NASA to get the message out and publicize. What gets done at NASA is even more amazing when you consider the pittance that the public spends on NASA.

 

[dhk2]

Interesting video from JPL, thanks for posting. The current issue of Scientific American has an informative article as well, entitled "Reading the Red Planet". Exciting stuff, wish the exploration and instrument missions drew more attention and funding support.

 

[dominikk85]

where does the OP have the price data from? 5.5 dollars for a gallon in germany? I did a calculation and the price per gallon here is currently 7.80 dollars. It was well over 8 a month ago.

Isn't a gallon 3.79 liters (I know there are 100 different gallons)?

 

[alienator]

where does the OP have the price data from? 5.5 dollars for a gallon in germany? I did a calculation and the price per gallon here is currently 7.80 dollars. It was well over 8 a month ago. Isn't a gallon 3.79 liters (I know there are 100 different gallons)?

Yes, that is the approximate conversion factor needed to convert from imperial gallons to liters. Don't forget the OP started the thread almost 8 months ago, so changing prices could account for some of the difference you've found. Of course, the data presented could also have been wrong.

 

[limerickman]

We're paying €1.56 per litre of petrol.
€1.50 per litre of diesel.

These prices have dropped over here from €1.70 and €1.63 respectively per litre in more recent times.

 

[alienator]

I paid about € 0.86 per liter for gas at my most recent tank filling. That price compared to what people are paying in Europe puts American whining about gas prices in perspective.

 

[limerickman]

Originally Posted by alienator .

I paid about € 0.86 per liter for gas at my most recent tank filling. That price compared to what people are paying in Europe puts American whining about gas prices in perspective.

Over here our government load excise and duty fees on automobile fuel.

70% of the cost of a litre of fuel is government tax : 23% is value added tax (transaction tax), 30% is import duty, 15% is excise tax.
/img/vbsmilies/smilies/nonono2.gif

 

[alienator]

Tax on gas varies with the state in which the gas is purchased. There is an 18.4 cent federal excise tax. All tolled taxes on a gallon of gas are about 40-60 cents, which works out to be about 11-16 cents per liter......or around 0.1 or so Euros per liter.

 

[limerickman]

Originally Posted by alienator .

Tax on gas varies with the state in which the gas is purchased. There is an 18.4 cent federal excise tax. All tolled taxes on a gallon of gas are about 40-60 cents, which works out to be about 11-16 cents per liter......or around 0.1 or so Euros per liter.

Thanks for this insight.

 

[dominikk85]

Originally Posted by alienator .

Tax on gas varies with the state in which the gas is purchased. There is an 18.4 cent federal excise tax. All tolled taxes on a gallon of gas are about 40-60 cents, which works out to be about 11-16 cents per liter......or around 0.1 or so Euros per liter.

thanks. so taxes are basically not a factor in your gas prices (mostly the oil price). unfortunately in germany that is different. per liter we have a tax part of more than one dollar (I think like 1.15 converted from euros). that is more than 4 dollars per gallon. you guys are lucky (yes I understand that your driving distances are bigger but still that difference is huge).

 

[jpr95]

Originally Posted by dominikk85 .

thanks. so taxes are basically not a factor in your gas prices (mostly the oil price). unfortunately in germany that is different. per liter we have a tax part of more than one dollar (I think like 1.15 converted from euros). that is more than 4 dollars per gallon. you guys are lucky (yes I understand that your driving distances are bigger but still that difference is huge).

Not a factor? At 40-60 cents per gallon, that works out to about 11-17%.

Those of us who think gas prices are too high are not simply "whining" about them, either. Those that are trying to turn the energy industry upside down are also throwing the country under the bus in the process. We (the U.S.) have large expanses of some of the most fertile farmland in the world--which requires large driving/hauling distances to access it, especially when those agriculture products are to be shipped overseas. That farmland is about as far as one can get from the ocean (and thus, shipping) in the Western Hemisphere. We also have many small towns that once had thriving local economies based on local produce that have turned into simple bedroom communities devoid of small business as mega stores moved into the nearby cities. There are also many, many medium-sized cities that really can't afford public transit because of low population density. The public transit systems that do exist are pretty much all heavily subsidized (even in the large cities where they are used extensively). What it boils down to is that the U.S. is laid out on inexpensive petroleum energy. A paradigm shift would be incredibly costly and possibly not survivable. I, and many others, believe it to not be necessary, as the green energy movement looks each day more like a fraud at its core and just another version of corporate crony welfare.

 

[alienator]

 thanks. so taxes are basically not a factor in your gas prices (mostly the oil price). unfortunately in germany that is different. per liter we have a tax part of more than one dollar (I think like 1.15 converted from euros). that is more than 4 dollars per gallon. you guys are lucky (yes I understand that your driving distances are bigger but still that difference is huge).

I think higher gas taxes would be a benefit here, especially to pay for things like infrastructure repair as well as an incentive to drive less. Again it's seemingly an American belief that the US is entitled to cheap gasoline. There's never ending whine about gas prices.

 

[dominikk85]

Originally Posted by alienator .


I think higher gas taxes would be a benefit here, especially to pay for things like infrastructure repair as well as an incentive to drive less. Again it's seemingly an American belief that the US is entitled to cheap gasoline. There's never ending whine about gas prices.

well to me of course it sounds like whining when I have to pay so much but the poster above you made a good arguement too. of course the positive thing about the higher prizes is that americans now start to dump their huge pick-ups, SUVs, muscle cars or whatever (those 15+ liters per 100K cars) and drive modern energy optimized cars like the prius or also smaller american cars who are catching up to the fuel save technology.

but on the other hand there is not just private transportation but also cargo and the US do have other circumstances than we have in europe. Of course we have better infrastructure, railroads and other transportation outside of the big cities but on the other hand they just have more space between cities. so building infrastructure in those huge lands is an almost impossible task because you have so much no mans land. this increases the need for cheap energy. Of course the USA also have a lot of not so energy intensive industry like the silicon valley computer industry and micro engeneering but they also still have a lot of large stuff engeneering and agriculture which needs a lot of energy.