Cycle lanes under London

"Nick King" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I remember seeing a press report years ago about using old train \ tube
lines for a cycle network in and around London. Apparently, there are a
number of derelict tube tunnels under the city that were going to be
tarmaced & lit so as to give cyclists an easier passage in and out of
London.

Does anybody else remember this being reported? I think it might have

been

Quoted message said:

Red Ken's idea (if not, I want copyright!!).

It is possible I dreamt it of course!

The main practical difficult with that for actual tubes presumably
would be how to get the cyclists and bikes between tube and ground
level in the central area. If that is what was being proposed at least.
Presumably using the emergency spiral staircases would be out, so there
would need to be lifts at strategically placed intervals along the route.
However as even London Underground, with millions of fare paying passengers
and millions in subsidies can't even manage to keep their existing
fairly modern lifts in operation.......

Another scheme facing severe practical difficulties is OYbikes
which is being trialled in Hammersmith and Fulham.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/3856535.stm

Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most famous modern
attempt probably being the Dutch white bikes of the 60's , and
new ones are always being trialled in the States.

http://www.arcata.com/greenbikes/surveys/freebikesurvey.jpg

However they all eventually peter out for all too obvious, and less
obvious reasons. i.e given enough time either one or two bike thieves
will eventually steal all the available free bikes or new bike thieves
will emerge to complete the task. The triumph of hope over experience
writ large in other words.

In this case the bikes are locked. And are charged for at approx £1
an hour. Quite how many bikes the schemes proponents imagine
will be left in one piece - the sight of a yuppie trying to
ride away on a bike with two flat tyres being too hard to resist
for many I'd imagine - after the local social deviants become fully
cognisant with the scheme - is hard to imagine.

And yet the organisers were sufficiently savvy to get the BBC
interested and so generate some free publicity for their doomed
scheme. Although hopefuly only among their potential customers
and not the salivating local deviants.

Then there's the question of h*l*ets. On the TV report the reporter
was shown donning a h*lm*t in a really artistic close-up zooming
shot - at one point the h*lm*t filled the entire screen, but without
saying the actual word. And without explaining how users of the scheme
are supposed to make provision for themselves in that respect So are
they supposed to carry one around with them on the off-chance ?
The off-chance being that there's an unvandalised bike available
exactly when and where they neeed one.

Who's to know?

Curious

Nick King said:

I remember seeing a press report years ago about using old train \ tube
lines for a cycle network in and around London. Apparently, there are a
number of derelict tube tunnels under the city that were going to be
tarmaced & lit so as to give cyclists an easier passage in and out of
London.

Maybe the report was on April 1st????
Old surface rail lines are used - I went on the one near Alexandra Palace
recently, which is a hoot.

in message <[email hidden]>, Dr Curious

(') said:

Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most famous modern
attempt probably being the Dutch white bikes of the 60's , and
new ones are always being trialled in the States.

Chris Hill (who later founded Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op) tried this in
Edinburgh in 1972. The bikes were pretty quickly all vandalised or
permanently lost.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

' ' <------- this blank intentionally spaced left

"Nick King" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I remember seeing a press report years ago about using old train \ tube
lines for a cycle network in and around London. Apparently, there are a
number of derelict tube tunnels under the city that were going to be
tarmaced & lit so as to give cyclists an easier passage in and out of
London.

It sounds like it would be a muggers paradise!

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Dr Curious

(') said:

Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most famous modern
attempt probably being the Dutch white bikes of the 60's , and
new ones are always being trialled in the States.

Chris Hill (who later founded Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op) tried this in
Edinburgh in 1972. The bikes were pretty quickly all vandalised or
permanently lost.

Cambridge's attempt had all the bikes gone within the first morning.
Mind you they did have a system that didn't lock up the bikes but
trusted people to not steal them.

Tony

"Nick King" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I remember seeing a press report years ago about using old train \

tube

Quoted message said:

lines for a cycle network in and around London.

I seem to recall that Thames Water used to use bikes to ride through
their Ring Main tunnel before they filled it up with water. I don't
think it was ever in a fit state to allow riding a bike all the way
round it, though.

Would a recumbent fit in the Post Office tunnels?

Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing overhead
tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent) on stilts over the
Thames, to make a bike path. I suggested putting a few fans in it,
to blow people along. (an idea not original with me)

Jeremy Parker

On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 15:47:40 +0100 someone who may be "Jeremy
Parker" <[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing overhead
tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent) on stilts over the
Thames, to make a bike path.

Something like 130 years ago an elevated railway surrounded by glass
was suggested as a means of linking railway stations in London.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E
I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government
prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.

"Jeremy Parker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing overhead
tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent) on stilts over the
Thames, to make a bike path. I suggested putting a few fans in it,
to blow people along. (an idea not original with me)

That would be two tubes then. Perhaps they could be hitched to the
sides of the very big flatish tube carrying the eight lane M25E
(Equatorial) motorway and Victoria and Albert Embankments, Millbank,
Southbank etc etc could be grassed over.

M

"Nick King" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I remember seeing a press report years ago about using old train \ tube
lines for a cycle network in and around London. Apparently, there are a
number of derelict tube tunnels under the city

there is Holborn-Aldwych, King William St-London Bridge and Green Park
to Charing Cross, hardly much of a network and all deep underground
(and even under buildings). There is a network of tunnels used by the
PO/MOD (NOT the PO railway), but no way you would be allowed down
them.

Dream on ;-)

Tony Raven <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Dr Curious

(') said:

Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most famous modern
attempt probably being the Dutch white bikes of the 60's , and
new ones are always being trialled in the States.

Chris Hill (who later founded Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op) tried this in
Edinburgh in 1972. The bikes were pretty quickly all vandalised or
permanently lost.

Cambridge's attempt had all the bikes gone within the first morning.
Mind you they did have a system that didn't lock up the bikes but
trusted people to not steal them.

In Copenhagen they have loads of fairly uniquely coloured bikes on
stands like shopping trollies, 20 Kroner in the slot deposit, you
can't take them outside the central area, seems to work well.

"MartinM" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Tony Raven <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Simon Brooke wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Dr Curious
([email hidden]'😉 wrote:

>Free community bike schems are nothing new, the most famous modern
>attempt probably being the Dutch white bikes of the 60's , and
>new ones are always being trialled in the States.

Chris Hill (who later founded Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op) tried this in
Edinburgh in 1972. The bikes were pretty quickly all vandalised or
permanently lost.

Cambridge's attempt had all the bikes gone within the first morning.
Mind you they did have a system that didn't lock up the bikes but
trusted people to not steal them.

In Copenhagen they have loads of fairly uniquely coloured bikes on
stands like shopping trollies, 20 Kroner in the slot deposit, you
can't take them outside the central area, seems to work well.

Yup, and there are details including pictures on here.

http://www.members.aol.com/humorme81/citybike.htm

And in case there was any suspicion that its success is due to
solely to the rigid social conformity of Danish Goody-Two-Shoes
types

<quote>

As mentioned earlier, bicycle theft is a big problem in Denmark.
In the 1981-1991 period alone, an average of about 90,000 bikes
a year were reported stolen.

</quote>

Curious

"Jeremy Parker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing overhead
tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent) on stilts over the
Thames, to make a bike path. I suggested putting a few fans in it,
to blow people along. (an idea not original with me)

<http://www.biketrans.com>

--
Dave...

I was thrown out of there during my freshman year, for cheating on my
metaphysics final. You know, I looked within the soul of the boy
sitting next to me. — Woody Allen

"Dave Kahn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing overhead
tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent) on stilts over the
Thames, to make a bike path. I suggested putting a few fans in it,
to blow people along. (an idea not original with me)

<http://www.biketrans.com>

How does it handle hills?

"Tony W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Dave Kahn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing overhead
tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent) on stilts over the
Thames, to make a bike path. I suggested putting a few fans in it,
to blow people along. (an idea not original with me)

<http://www.biketrans.com>

How does it handle hills?

Doesn't say, does it? I imagine it simply goes up and down them.
However, it's still easier to cycle uphill with a tailwind than
without one. Having said that though, riding with a following wind can
occasionally produce a complete absence of apparent wind. Toiling
uphill you can get very sweaty very quickly this way as you lose any
cooling effect of the breeze.

--
Dave...

I was thrown out of there during my freshman year, for cheating on my
metaphysics final. You know, I looked within the soul of the boy
sitting next to me. — Woody Allen

"Dr Curious" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

And in case there was any suspicion that its success is due to
solely to the rigid social conformity of Danish Goody-Two-Shoes
types

<quote>

As mentioned earlier, bicycle theft is a big problem in Denmark.
In the 1981-1991 period alone, an average of about 90,000 bikes
a year were reported stolen.

They are also the only other EU member who have not embraced the EU
number plates (but so far have not gone around covering them up with
free Danish flag stickers provided by their extreme right wing press)

Tony W said:

"Dave Kahn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Last year I was at a meeting where somebody was proposing overhead
tunnels for cyclists - a long tube (transparent) on stilts over the
Thames, to make a bike path. I suggested putting a few fans in it,
to blow people along. (an idea not original with me)

<http://www.biketrans.com>

How does it handle hills?

I'm sure I've read of a similar proposed system that would use moving
handrails to allow cyclists to take a tow up hills.

--
Andy Morris

AndyAtJinkasDotFreeserve.Co.UK

Love this:
Put an end to Outlook Express's messy quotes
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

In news:[email hidden],
MartinM <[email hidden]> typed:

Quoted message said:

"Dr Curious" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

And in case there was any suspicion that its success is due to
solely to the rigid social conformity of Danish Goody-Two-Shoes
types

<quote>

As mentioned earlier, bicycle theft is a big problem in Denmark.
In the 1981-1991 period alone, an average of about 90,000 bikes
a year were reported stolen.

They are also the only other EU member who have not embraced the EU
number plates (but so far have not gone around covering them up with
free Danish flag stickers provided by their extreme right wing press)

And, along with Sweden, the only other ones who'll be staying out of the
Euro (the new 10 have to join as soon as they meet the criteria and, I
guess, have to meet the criteria as soon as possible.)

A

"Dave Kahn" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

<http://www.biketrans.com>

How does it handle hills?

Doesn't say, does it? I imagine it simply goes up and down them.
However, it's still easier to cycle uphill with a tailwind than
without one. Having said that though, riding with a following wind can
occasionally produce a complete absence of apparent wind. Toiling
uphill you can get very sweaty very quickly this way as you lose any
cooling effect of the breeze.

I assume this is a 'concept' rather than reality. Of course most cities are
reasonably flat and 'minor' hills would not be a problem to 'real'
cyclists -- but one cannot see this working too well in San Francisco or
Sheffield.

T

AndyMorris said:

I'm sure I've read of a similar proposed system that would use moving
handrails to allow cyclists to take a tow up hills.

There already is one such system, somewhere in Norway.

--

Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
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