Espirit de corps

"Helen Deborah Vecht" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Mark Thompson" <[email hidden] (change warm for

hot)>typed

Quoted message said:

If you wheel your bike past a red light, you *are* breaking the law...

Weell, it depends how you do it. If you get off before the stop line, lift it onto the pavement,
pass the stop line on the pavement, put it back on the road after passing the stop line and then
cross as a pedestrian you're not.

Rich

"David Hansen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Thu, 4 Dec 2003 20:36:59 +0000 someone who may be Trevor Barton <[email hidden]>
wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Motorists don't deliberately target cyclists, irrespective of the stories that are often
told here

news.bbc.co.uk2725329.stmOpen ↗

That's one of the most blatant distorting snips I've ever seen. What the OP actually wrote was:

Quoted message said:

Motorists don't deliberately target cyclists, irrespective of the stories that are often told here
- those same stupid motorists who star in anecdotes in here will be acting just as aggressively

towards all other road users.
___
Michael MacClancy

"Vincent Wilcox" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Trevor Barton wrote:

<extreme snipping>

Quoted message said:

Motorists don't deliberately target cyclists, irrespective

of the stories that are often told here - those same stupid

Quoted message said:

motorists who star in anecdotes in here will be acting just as

aggressively towards all other road users.

Quoted message said:

Don't believe it.

Is that a command or a statement?

Anyway if you honestly believe that "those same stupid motorists who star in anecdotes in here will
be acting just as aggressively towards all other road users" is untrue you must be so paranoid that
a visit to the quack is in order.
___
Michael MacClancy

"Vincent Wilcox" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Trevor Barton wrote:

<extreme snipping>

Quoted message said:

Motorists don't deliberately target cyclists, irrespective

of the stories that are often told here - those same stupid

Quoted message said:

motorists who star in anecdotes in here will be acting just as

aggressively towards all other road users.

Quoted message said:

Don't believe it.

Is that a command or a statement?

Anyway if you honestly believe that "those same stupid motorists who star in anecdotes in here will
be acting just as aggressively towards all other road users" is untrue you must be so paranoid that
a visit to the quack is in order.
___
Michael MacClancy

Clive George said:

If you're used to doing this like I am in sunny Yorkshire, then carry on doing so in Cambridge
when down for a visit, you get roundly ignored...

Never quite understand this. I never wave to all the other drivers when I'm driving, not even
drivers of the same make of car as I'm driving (although I can remember by Dad doing so when I was
young and the RAC man always used to salute then). I never wave to all the other pedestrians when
I'm walking. So why would I wave to all the other bike riders when I'm cycling?

Tony

Clive George said:

If you're used to doing this like I am in sunny Yorkshire, then carry on doing so in Cambridge
when down for a visit, you get roundly ignored...

Never quite understand this. I never wave to all the other drivers when I'm driving, not even
drivers of the same make of car as I'm driving (although I can remember by Dad doing so when I was
young and the RAC man always used to salute then). I never wave to all the other pedestrians when
I'm walking. So why would I wave to all the other bike riders when I'm cycling?

Tony

"Vincent Wilcox" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Trevor Barton wrote:

<extreme snipping>

Quoted message said:

Motorists don't deliberately target cyclists, irrespective

of the stories that are often told here - those same stupid

Quoted message said:

motorists who star in anecdotes in here will be acting just as

aggressively towards all other road users.

Quoted message said:

Don't believe it.

Is that a command or a statement?

Anyway if you honestly believe that "those same stupid motorists who star in anecdotes in here will
be acting just as aggressively towards all other road users" is untrue you must be so paranoid that
a visit to the quack is in order.
___
Michael MacClancy

Pete Barrett said:

I ride assertively. You ride aggressively. He (she or it) rides like a complete w*nker.

You've been watching too many episodes of Yes Minister.

James

--
"Sorry mate, I didn't see you" is not a satisfactory excuse.

Clive George said:

If you're used to doing this like I am in sunny Yorkshire, then carry on doing so in Cambridge
when down for a visit, you get roundly ignored...

Never quite understand this. I never wave to all the other drivers when I'm driving, not even
drivers of the same make of car as I'm driving (although I can remember by Dad doing so when I was
young and the RAC man always used to salute then). I never wave to all the other pedestrians when
I'm walking. So why would I wave to all the other bike riders when I'm cycling?

Tony

Pete Barrett said:

I ride assertively. You ride aggressively. He (she or it) rides like a complete w*nker.

You've been watching too many episodes of Yes Minister.

James

--
"Sorry mate, I didn't see you" is not a satisfactory excuse.

Just zis Guy said:

"Trevor Barton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

IMHO there is an unjustifiable "us and them" attitude in this group and it's (probably) similar
in uk.tosspot

Seen the TRL report posted earlier?

trl.co.ukTRL549.pdfOpen ↗

The attitude exists for real on the roads.

Thats a very interesting report

--
The Reply & From email addresses are checked rarely. mseries.freeserve.co.ukmseries.freeserve.co.ukOpen ↗

Just zis Guy said:

"Trevor Barton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

IMHO there is an unjustifiable "us and them" attitude in this group and it's (probably) similar
in uk.tosspot

Seen the TRL report posted earlier?

trl.co.ukTRL549.pdfOpen ↗

The attitude exists for real on the roads.

Thats a very interesting report

--
The Reply & From email addresses are checked rarely. mseries.freeserve.co.ukmseries.freeserve.co.ukOpen ↗

Pete Barrett said:

I ride assertively. You ride aggressively. He (she or it) rides like a complete w*nker.

You've been watching too many episodes of Yes Minister.

James

--
"Sorry mate, I didn't see you" is not a satisfactory excuse.

Just zis Guy said:

"Trevor Barton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

IMHO there is an unjustifiable "us and them" attitude in this group and it's (probably) similar
in uk.tosspot

Seen the TRL report posted earlier?

trl.co.ukTRL549.pdfOpen ↗

The attitude exists for real on the roads.

Thats a very interesting report

--
The Reply & From email addresses are checked rarely. mseries.freeserve.co.ukmseries.freeserve.co.ukOpen ↗

Nick Kew said:

In article <[email hidden]>, one of infinite monkeys at the keyboard of

Trevor Barton said:

IMHO there is an unjustifiable "us and them" attitude in this group and it's (probably) similar
in uk.tosspot, in which in this group (drivers == bad) and (cyclists == good)

The evidence seems to be against you, especially on the second part of that statement. Look at the
blanket-intolerance on this group of cycling misdemeanours - even occasionally jumping to
unjustified anti-cyclist conclusions (pavement cycling isn't necessarily bad or illegal - just
usually).

What blanket intolerance?

Some months ago i posted about two instances of cyclist putting me in danger (one pavement cyclist
who all but hit me travelling at speed and another who almost hit my daughter on a pelican crossing)
there were numerous posts in defence of the pavement cyclist and a good few in mitigation for the
pelican guy.

I'm with Trevor: an unjustifiable "us and them" attitude in this group. "Two unmotorised wheels
good: everything else bad!"

pk

Just zis Guy said:

"Trevor Barton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

IMHO there is an unjustifiable "us and them" attitude in this group and it's (probably) similar
in uk.tosspot

Seen the TRL report posted earlier?

trl.co.ukTRL549.pdfOpen ↗

The attitude exists for real on the roads.

Just as the attitude of cyclists ignoring pelican crossings, and pedestrians crossing on traffic
lights exists for real on the roads. And cyclists acting aggressively and dangerously to other
cyclists and walkers exists off road.

pk

Nick Kew said:

In article <[email hidden]>, one of infinite monkeys at the keyboard of

Trevor Barton said:

IMHO there is an unjustifiable "us and them" attitude in this group and it's (probably) similar
in uk.tosspot, in which in this group (drivers == bad) and (cyclists == good)

The evidence seems to be against you, especially on the second part of that statement. Look at the
blanket-intolerance on this group of cycling misdemeanours - even occasionally jumping to
unjustified anti-cyclist conclusions (pavement cycling isn't necessarily bad or illegal - just
usually).

What blanket intolerance?

Some months ago i posted about two instances of cyclist putting me in danger (one pavement cyclist
who all but hit me travelling at speed and another who almost hit my daughter on a pelican crossing)
there were numerous posts in defence of the pavement cyclist and a good few in mitigation for the
pelican guy.

I'm with Trevor: an unjustifiable "us and them" attitude in this group. "Two unmotorised wheels
good: everything else bad!"

pk

Just zis Guy said:

"Trevor Barton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

IMHO there is an unjustifiable "us and them" attitude in this group and it's (probably) similar
in uk.tosspot

Seen the TRL report posted earlier?

trl.co.ukTRL549.pdfOpen ↗

The attitude exists for real on the roads.

Just as the attitude of cyclists ignoring pelican crossings, and pedestrians crossing on traffic
lights exists for real on the roads. And cyclists acting aggressively and dangerously to other
cyclists and walkers exists off road.

pk

you know? said:

Seen the TRL report posted earlier?

trl.co.ukTRL549.pdfOpen ↗

Those graphs roughly two thirds through the report are quite interseting. They seem to suggest that
a cyclist, riding confidently near the kerb, is treated most kindly by motorists. I would have
preferred cyclists riding in an assertive manner to be treated more kindly, but so be it.

I also found it curious that "commercial drivers" or whatever the phrase used was are the most
anti-cyclist when they are, IME and that of others in this NG, AFAIK, think that HGVers, and the
like, are some of the better drivers around.

James

--
"Sorry mate, I didn't see you" is not a satisfactory excuse.

you know? said:

Seen the TRL report posted earlier?

trl.co.ukTRL549.pdfOpen ↗

Those graphs roughly two thirds through the report are quite interseting. They seem to suggest that
a cyclist, riding confidently near the kerb, is treated most kindly by motorists. I would have
preferred cyclists riding in an assertive manner to be treated more kindly, but so be it.

I also found it curious that "commercial drivers" or whatever the phrase used was are the most
anti-cyclist when they are, IME and that of others in this NG, AFAIK, think that HGVers, and the
like, are some of the better drivers around.

James

--
"Sorry mate, I didn't see you" is not a satisfactory excuse.