Knees Hurt since went Clipless

[jacquisun]

I sure hope I can get some good input here:

For years I have ridden with Cages/(clips as I'm told)--back in August I got "clipless pedals". Well, before the clippless--no knee problems ever. Since clipless, knees hurt all the time.

I"ve been in for several fittings--each time beyond a minor tweeking, I'm told I'm in exactly the right position as they had it before. IN the meantime I usually found I"d put the seat up and back a bit--but I was told I was up to high--back too far and riding with my toes too much.

So seat is back down, etc. And I'm working on keeping my heals down--but my knees still hurt. I'm worried I"m going to have permanent damage if I dont' figure this out soon!!!!!!!! I dont' want to go back to cages--but I"m getting frustrated and worried

One thing I keep feeling like is that my feet are too far back on the pedal--in other words, I want to push my toes forward (but of course I cant) I was told in the cages that I did ride with my toes pretty far forward--but heck, my knees never hurt, so I"m darned close to pushing the cleats back on the shoe . . .

Any life experience--anecdotes? Oh, these are Mt. bike clips--but I'm road biking. It was the most affordable way to get into clippless and I was told it'd be fine for the kind of riding I do (usually 20-30 mile 2 hour rides 2-3 times a week tops)--they have them so they allow the most rotation side to side (I think)

HELP!

 

[Aussie Steve]

Cadence. That is your pedal speed in RPM. Are you pushing a too hard gear? you need to pedal 80-90 rpm for efficiency, if you pedal below about 70 rpm this could be the cause.
How to determine your cadence? have a computer with cadence function. If not, try riding with a buddy who has one, and pedal at the identical pedal speed, ask him/her what the cadence is. get them to vary their cadence, match theirs and ask them the pedal RPM. Get a feel for the pedal speed so when you are riding on your own, you will be able to judge 80-90 rpm.
The best thing is to fit a computer with cadence function, I have one, and find it essential. Cateye is a brilliant brand, go for them.

 

[Duckling]

Although you've had many adjustments, check the obvious, are the cleats under the balls of your feet. Hopefully there is some fore and aft adjustment of them. I have SPD cleats and am grateful for this but I have also had the knee problem so had taken to making minor twist adjustments myself. Your knees will tell you when it's set right.
Also, as the other respondee added, don't pedal too high a gear, spin and your knee will love you again.

 

[jacquisun]

Although you've had many adjustments, check the obvious, are the cleats under the balls of your feet. Hopefully there is some fore and aft adjustment of them. I have SPD cleats and am grateful for this but I have also had the knee problem so had taken to making minor twist adjustments myself. Your knees will tell you when it's set right.
Also, as the other respondee added, don't pedal too high a gear, spin and your knee will love you again.

Thank you, I will try both things--already working on the spinning, but knees still hurt after 2 weekends on that (I'll give it more time!) I will try moving the cleats back a bit, I think perhaps my feet pull back a bit in my shoes when I pedal--so where the balls of feet are when I'm standing may be a bad indicator. I had to go with shoes that err'd on big because next size down my toes hit. Anyway, thank you--

 

[Robert Gardner]

I had a simular problem with my knees when I first went clipless. The trouble was that I was unclipping when the crank was at the top of the stroke and my leg was fully bent. My LBS diagnosed the problem right away and I have no problem now that I am unclipping at the bottom of the stroke with my leg fully extended.

 

[Ny Cykel]

15 years ago I went to the doc with knee issues.

He told me to ride a bike.
The only times my knees hurt now is form over tourquing, like the poster said about under speeding. Severe hill climbing is not good for my knees.
I use regular old BMX pedals, If I don't ride, my knees hurt.
I am only posting my stuff in hopes it helps you.

 

[FloydLandis]

Maybe you should check seat height. You may have just lost enough space between the od pedals and the new pedals. Seat height may change that distance even if it is only slight.

 

[matagi]

One thing you might want to look at is the degree of "float" (I think that's the correct term) your pedals allow. With your cages, you would have still been able to rotate your foot slightly when pedalling. It could be your new pedals are holding your foot too rigidly and in a slightly different position from the one you had with the cages. It could be a matter of only a fraction of an inch, but it may be enough for your knees to know the difference.

Also, as has already been mentioned, check the cleats are positioned on the balls of the feet and check your seat height.

 

[daveryanwyoming]

A lot of good suggestions here. One more, do you by any chance pronate or supinate noticably with either foot. Quickest way to find out is to look at the soles of your favorite shoes if you've had them a while and look for wear towards the inner or outer edges. Clips and straps allow a bit of float but more importantly allow you to roll your ankles in or out quite a bit. Clipless pedals, even the floating variety don't allow you to roll your ankles to compensate for pronation or supination. Lemond makes a line of wedge shaped cleat shims that you screw between your cleats and shoes to compensate for pronation or supination, they give you back a more natural knee tracking if your feet don't naturally fall flat.

Just one more thing to check out. Personally the pain behind the knee sounds like a saddle height issue and saddle height often changes with new pedal/cleat combos.

Good luck,
Dave

 

[dannyfrankszzz]

I made the migration to clipless pedals a few years back.

I basically agree with what Matagi wrote.

I used to use Shimano SPDs which were good but there was a limit to the amount of lateral float which resulted in some pains to my knees. Due to the fact I have 'knock-knees' I was concerned about my susceptibility to knee injuries. I now use Crank Bros SPDs which of all the clipless pedals on the market offer the greatest lateral float I believe; this means that there is more scope for my knee to twist during the pedal stroke. Since I've used them I've had no knee pains

 

[Hookyrider]

I think Matagi hit it - FLOAT! What type of system are you using, and does it allow for float, if so how much? Your old straps held your feet securely, but they allowed little twisting motions to occur.

During your peddle stroke you foot will naturally want to "toe in, toe out, aka float" a little bit through normal operation. Once your foot is bound securely to your peddle this floating action is eliminated, and the knee is where it all comes together. Incorrect cleat position, pushing heavy gears (high torque) only tend to aggravate the issue. Generally if all is well you should be able to spin at a very high cadence, (low torque) without an issue, or you’ll end up with the same pains you were having with high torque peddling.

HR