Looking for advice on commuting

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

(') said:

dkahn400 said:

POHB said:

I feel more in control with a flat bar but I've not really given
drops a chance for years. I'd suggest you test ride or borrow a
bike with drops and see how they feel to you.

You may have more precise control with straight bars, but drops will
usually be narrower which is generally a Good Thing (TM) in traffic.
The very wide straight bars that seem to be fashionable at the moment,
while they may be excellent for off-road riding, are not IMV suitable
for riding in traffic.

Actually IME the wheel size make a much bigger difference in traffic
which is why small wheelers like the Brompton are so much better than a
big wheeler.

Argue that for me? I confess I've never really ridden a small-wheel bike,
but that sounds counter-intuitive to me.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; Woz: 'All the best people in life seem to like LINUX.'
;; <URL:http://www.woz.org/woz/cresponses/response03.html>

in message <[email hidden]>,

lifeisgood (') said:

Thanks.

On the point of cadence, I think I have fairly high cadence, but I am
almost certainly wrong. is there an accepted way of measuring cadence
(other than the dubious counting where I will only count when i am
concentrating). ie some clever mechanical or electrical device that
counts my pedal revolutions?

Posh cycle computers usually have a cadence pickup. But 80 rpm (which is
basically a good place to start) is considerably faster than than one
revolution per second, so if you're counting 'one.. two.. three.. four'
you should have done at least five complete revolutions of the cranks in
that time. That's a bit like rubbing your tummy and patting your head at
the same time - you tend to pedal in rhythm with your counting. But if
you find that you have that problem, try counting onetwothreefourfive as
fast as you can...

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; Friends don't send friends HTML formatted emails.

in message <[email hidden]>, Chris Eilbeck

(') said:

Peter Clinch said:

As above, higher gear ratios aren't /necessarily/ a good thing. But
for a lot less than the cost of a new bike you can just fit a bigger
chainwheel... Similarly. nothing to stop you using cleats on an
MTB, many do: just fit "clipless pedals", get some suitable shoes
and off you go.

What sort of distance would I need to be doing for it to be worth
changing to clipless pedals? I'm doing 3 miles or so each way to work
(sometimes stop off at a shop to pick something up on the way etc.)
and I'm riding a rigid mtb with slicks and clips/straps. Would it be
worth the trouble for me?

If you've already got clips and straps, clipless is bound to be an
improvement; but it does boil down to whether you can be bothered to
change shoes at the end of the journey, or else click around in cycling
shoes all day.

Quoted message said:

I'm guessing it's gonna cost me 75-100 quid to try this out. How
better could I spend this money?

For three miles each way, it wouldn't be the top of my priority list. But
it's definitely a big improvement.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; Life would be much easier if I had the source code.

Pete Biggs' p@melonbiggs{remove fruit}.tc said:

Chris Eilbeck said:

What sort of distance would I need to be doing for it to be worth
changing to clipless pedals? I'm doing 3 miles or so each way to work
(sometimes stop off at a shop to pick something up on the way etc.)
and I'm riding a rigid mtb with slicks and clips/straps. Would it be
worth the trouble for me?

Maybe not for the better efficiency for that distance, but worth it for the
better comfort and speed of getting your foot in.

Quoted message said:

I'm guessing it's gonna cost me 75-100 quid to try this out.

52. £22 on pedals (Shimano M520) and 30 quid on shoes.

Quoted message said:

How better could I spend this money?

Perhaps some other cycling clothing or accessories if lacking.

Thanks for the info.

Chris
--
Chris Eilbeck
MARS Flight Crew http://www.mars.org.uk/
UKRA #1108 Level 2 UYB
Tripoli UK Member #9527 LSMR

Quoted message said:

What sort of distance would I need to be doing for it to be worth
changing to clipless pedals? I'm doing 3 miles or so each way to work
(sometimes stop off at a shop to pick something up on the way etc.)
and I'm riding a rigid mtb with slicks and clips/straps. Would it be
worth the trouble for me?

I'm guessing it's gonna cost me 75-100 quid to try this out. How
better could I spend this money?

From the 29th..... <http://www.aldi.co.uk/>
Spd type shoes £20
Spd type pedals £13
Total cost = £33 :-)

If you're using straps then definately give spds a go.

Chris Eilbeck said:

Peter Clinch said:

As above, higher gear ratios aren't /necessarily/ a good thing. But
for a lot less than the cost of a new bike you can just fit a bigger
chainwheel... Similarly. nothing to stop you using cleats on an
MTB, many do: just fit "clipless pedals", get some suitable shoes
and off you go.

What sort of distance would I need to be doing for it to be worth
changing to clipless pedals? I'm doing 3 miles or so each way to work
(sometimes stop off at a shop to pick something up on the way etc.)
and I'm riding a rigid mtb with slicks and clips/straps. Would it be
worth the trouble for me?

I'm guessing it's gonna cost me 75-100 quid to try this out. How
better could I spend this money?

Chris

3 miles is not a ride.. its barely a warm up; at least at my age 🙁
Hell its my daily run.. and I HATE running.

Not advocating walking I mean of course you have to ride it. But as a
firm believer in cycling shoes if thats all you are doing I really
wouldnt bother. Although they are no more hastle than toeclips (less
really) the shoes are annoying to walk in.

Why is that all you are doing?

Dave

Chris Eilbeck said:

Peter Clinch said:

As above, higher gear ratios aren't /necessarily/ a good thing. But
for a lot less than the cost of a new bike you can just fit a bigger
chainwheel... Similarly. nothing to stop you using cleats on an
MTB, many do: just fit "clipless pedals", get some suitable shoes
and off you go.

What sort of distance would I need to be doing for it to be worth
changing to clipless pedals? I'm doing 3 miles or so each way to work
(sometimes stop off at a shop to pick something up on the way etc.)
and I'm riding a rigid mtb with slicks and clips/straps. Would it be
worth the trouble for me?

I'm guessing it's gonna cost me 75-100 quid to try this out. How
better could I spend this money?

If there's an Aldi near you, they're doing clipless pedals for 13 quid
and shoes for 20 from Thursday.

(apologies if someone else mentioned it, I just did a mark-all-as-read)

--
Keith Willoughby http://flat222.org/keith/
Twll Dyn Pob Saes

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

(') said:

dkahn400 said:

POHB wrote:

> I feel more in control with a flat bar but I've not really given
> drops a chance for years. I'd suggest you test ride or borrow a
> bike with drops and see how they feel to you.
You may have more precise control with straight bars, but drops will
usually be narrower which is generally a Good Thing (TM) in traffic.
The very wide straight bars that seem to be fashionable at the moment,
while they may be excellent for off-road riding, are not IMV suitable
for riding in traffic.

Actually IME the wheel size make a much bigger difference in traffic
which is why small wheelers like the Brompton are so much better than a
big wheeler.

Argue that for me? I confess I've never really ridden a small-wheel bike,
but that sounds counter-intuitive to me.

Think of turning a big wheel into the gap between the front of a car and
the back of the car in front and doing the same with a small wheel; the
small wheel will go much easier

--
Tony

"I did make a mistake once - I thought I'd made a mistake but I hadn't"
Anon

Simon Brooke said:

in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven
([email hidden]'😉 wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Actually IME the wheel size make a much bigger difference in traffic
which is why small wheelers like the Brompton are so much better than a
big wheeler.

Quoted message said:

Argue that for me? I confess I've never really ridden a small-wheel bike,
but that sounds counter-intuitive to me.

The smaller wheel gives you (usually) a smaller cycle length and there
is less lateral space required to swing the front wheel hard around for
a tight turn.

It is noticeably easier hopping the Brom through tight, slow turns than
is the case on my MTB, or was the case on my old tourer.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Chris Eilbeck said:

What sort of distance would I need to be doing for it to be worth
changing to clipless pedals? I'm doing 3 miles or so each way to work
(sometimes stop off at a shop to pick something up on the way etc.)
and I'm riding a rigid mtb with slicks and clips/straps. Would it be
worth the trouble for me?

If that's /all/ you ever do, frankly no. But I used to commute 3 miles
with clipless because it was my only bike and I'd also use it for a 40
mile hack at the weekend.

Assuming you could use some extra efficiency for longer hacks then a
first step is a pair of cycling shoes, which will improve your pedalling
with clips and straps anyway because the sole is designed to transfer
power to pedals, not to eat up ground shock. Cycling shoes for MTB type
clipless usually have a removable cutout for a cleat if you subsequently
decide to move on to clipless pedals, so you can get shoes anyway and
pick up pedals later. Also any clipless you get will transfer upwards
to another bike, and though a Look style pedal is better for pure
roadie-ism a SPuD-u-like will still work fine and be better than a
platform unless you have old-style cleats and a seriously tight strap
(which basically nobody does any more...)

Quoted message said:

I'm guessing it's gonna cost me 75-100 quid to try this out. How
better could I spend this money?

Depends what your other kit is. If you haven't got a rack, rack
mounting luggage and mudguards I'd definitely favour those for a 3 mile
commute over clipless pedals and "proper" shoes.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Chris Eilbeck said:

What sort of distance would I need to be doing for it to be worth
changing to clipless pedals? I'm doing 3 miles or so each way to work
(sometimes stop off at a shop to pick something up on the way etc.)
and I'm riding a rigid mtb with slicks and clips/straps. Would it be
worth the trouble for me?

Re the idea that's it's not worth it for short distances: It depends how
busy and how many junctions there are on those few miles. You have to
remove and insert foot into toe clip an awful lot of times during a 3 mile
ride in inner London, for instance. Double-sided SPDs are quicker to get
going with as there's no need to flick anything round. They even work as
ordinary flat pedals for a bit if cleat doesn't engage straight away.

Until recently, I only used clipless pedals (Look) for longer rides and
still used clips for shorter journeys--on another bike, or I would swap
pedals sometimes. I finally got some SPD pedals and shoes and ditched the
clips. Even the 1 to 3 mile trip to the supermarket is now less hassle and
more enjoyable. Shimano MO21 shoes with recessed SPD cleats allow you to
work normally, albeit with the occasional tap or grind as the metal cleats
just contact the ground, depending on type of surface. They're stiffer than
trainers still flexible enough for walking.

So I think it they are worth getting, as long as more basic cycling kit
isn't needed more urgently.

~PB

dave said:

3 miles is not a ride.. its barely a warm up; at least at my age 🙁
Hell its my daily run.. and I HATE running.

I know it's nothing for you guys on here.

Quoted message said:

Not advocating walking I mean of course you have to ride it. But as
a firm believer in cycling shoes if thats all you are doing I really
wouldnt bother. Although they are no more hastle than toeclips
(less really) the shoes are annoying to walk in.

Why is that all you are doing?

Well I suppose cos I don't really have anywhere else to go. It's 3
miles to work, 5 miles back home if I go via either of the
supermarkets. I do the occasional 20 mile trip into Worcester but
that's more of a "it's a nice day and it'd take me as long as it would
on public transport" thing. I don't tend to really go anywhere unless
I have a reason to, such as to see someone or get something from
somewhere.

I'm definitely not up to riding with a club and my two mates who ride
are serious roadies. I can manage 3-4 miles at their speeds but I'm
dead after that.

Chris
--
Chris Eilbeck
MARS Flight Crew http://www.mars.org.uk/
UKRA #1108 Level 2 UYB
Tripoli UK Member #9527 LSMR

Keith Willoughby said:

If there's an Aldi near you, they're doing clipless pedals for 13 quid
and shoes for 20 from Thursday.

(apologies if someone else mentioned it, I just did a mark-all-as-read)

Thanks but there are two problems with that

1. Got big feet, difficult to buy shoes
2. No Aldi within 25 miles.

Chris
--
Chris Eilbeck
MARS Flight Crew http://www.mars.org.uk/
UKRA #1108 Level 2 UYB
Tripoli UK Member #9527 LSMR

Peter Clinch said:

If that's /all/ you ever do, frankly no. But I used to commute 3
miles with clipless because it was my only bike and I'd also use it
for a 40 mile hack at the weekend.

That's all I do regularly, adds up to 40-45 miles a week.

Quoted message said:

Assuming you could use some extra efficiency for longer hacks then a
first step is a pair of cycling shoes, which will improve your
pedalling with clips and straps anyway because the sole is designed
to transfer power to pedals, not to eat up ground shock.

OK. I can see that. How noticeable is this?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm guessing it's gonna cost me 75-100 quid to try this out. How
better could I spend this money?

Depends what your other kit is. If you haven't got a rack, rack
mounting luggage and mudguards I'd definitely favour those for a 3
mile commute over clipless pedals and "proper" shoes.

Don't really need anything else. Got good lights/reflectors and good
mudguards. I'd look ridiculous in lycra gear (fat bloke, innit) and I
don't really go that far so getting wet in the rain then getting a
decent shower and changing when I arrive is no problem. I'm not keen
on using a rack and panniers, much prefer a small rucksack. I had
panniers on an Eddie Merckx road bike when I was a student and I never
really got on well with them.

Chris
--
Chris Eilbeck
MARS Flight Crew http://www.mars.org.uk/
UKRA #1108 Level 2 UYB
Tripoli UK Member #9527 LSMR

Peter Clinch of University of Dundee said:

Chris Eilbeck said:

What sort of distance would I need to be doing for it to be worth
changing to clipless pedals? I'm doing 3 miles or so each way to work
(sometimes stop off at a shop to pick something up on the way etc.)
and I'm riding a rigid mtb with slicks and clips/straps. Would it be
worth the trouble for me?

If that's /all/ you ever do, frankly no. But I used to commute 3 miles
with clipless because it was my only bike and I'd also use it for a 40
mile hack at the weekend.

Heck, I commute in clipless and my commute is an entire kilometer. It's not
my only bike, but having used clipless for a long time I feel wobbly without
them. Keep a pair of shoes to wear during the day under your desk at work
and it's no problem.

But I only do the direct kilometer commute route when it's raining or I'm in
a hurry to get home. Frequently used routes are 3-5 miles, with the
occasional 10-15. Once confused a poor traffic survey person no end by
stating my start point was Didsbury, the end of my journey was Didsbury, my
total journey would be 10 miles and I wans't in Didsbury at the time. Poor
thing didn't have the right boxes to put all that in.
--
On the other hand, you have different fingers. Stephen Wright
Steph Peters, Manchester, England
[email hidden]

Chris Eilbeck wrote:
[shoes]

Quoted message said:

OK. I can see that. How noticeable is this?

On a 40 miler, quite considerably, on a 3 miler, waste of time. My
measure for this is I have dedicated cycling shoes and sandals by the
door, but I don't bother using them for a hack into town on the Brompton
even though they're the sort you can walk in.

Quoted message said:

decent shower and changing when I arrive is no problem. I'm not keen
on using a rack and panniers, much prefer a small rucksack. I had
panniers on an Eddie Merckx road bike when I was a student and I never
really got on well with them.

Well, there's panniers and panniers, of course. A good set are a
pleasure to use because they disappear once they're mounted (mounting
something like Ortliebs consists of putting them on the rack, letting go
of the handle locks them on, picking them up by the handle unlocks
them). Comparing these to a poor pair isn't fair, because a poor pair
might be genuinely 'orrible. Panniers aren't the only bike mounting
luggage, rack packs come with QR fittings too, and if you don't want a
rack then a Seatpost Quick Release bag takes the bag off you and puts it
on the bike with a minimum of extra iron.
Can be a faff if you're on and off into 5 different shops, but in that
case consider a courier bag as an alternative to a rucksack: doesn't sit
on your back, so your back doesn't get sweaty, and it's much easier to
access to put things in and out of when you're in those 5 different shops.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

"Chris Eilbeck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

dave said:

3 miles is not a ride.. its barely a warm up; at least at my age

🙁

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Hell its my daily run.. and I HATE running.

I know it's nothing for you guys on here.

Well,the standard conversion ratio is walking to cycling is 1:4.
Thus metro rail companies often put maps at their stations show the
ten minute walking and cycling distances to that station. That's
half a mile for walking, and two miles for cycling (The maps in
London's tube stations only go out to the 1/2 mile walking distance.

Jeremy Parker