Preventing flats



D

Daniel Crispin

Guest
Well tonight I got my first flat with my new bike... worst possible place
and time too (don't we just love Murphy? ;)

Anyhow, tomorrow I will have to go to the bike shop, I plan on installing a
kevlar tire to reduce the risk.

I also heard of a product that can be installed inside the tire to prevent
flats... anyone ever used it? Is it
worth it?
 
yes, i have some kind of green strip thingys that go between the tube &
tire. havent had a flat since i installed them but wonder there is any
effect on efficiency.


"Daniel Crispin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Well tonight I got my first flat with my new bike... worst possible place
> and time too (don't we just love Murphy? ;)
>
> Anyhow, tomorrow I will have to go to the bike shop, I plan on installing
a
> kevlar tire to reduce the risk.
>
> I also heard of a product that can be installed inside the tire to prevent
> flats... anyone ever used it? Is it
> worth it?
>
>
 
"dreaded" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:
> yes, i have some kind of green strip thingys that go between the tube &
> tire. havent had a flat since i installed them but wonder there is any
> effect on efficiency.

Doesn't work as well as a kevlar belted tire. Also, some people report that
the inserts flats themselves through friction or rough edges.
 
"Daniel Crispin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Well tonight I got my first flat with my new bike... worst possible place
> and time too (don't we just love Murphy? ;)

Do you know for certain what caused the flat?
>
> Anyhow, tomorrow I will have to go to the bike shop, I plan on installing
a
> kevlar tire to reduce the risk.

Kevlar-belted tires can help against some kinds of punctures. Not much use
against pinch-flats or flats caused by rim problems or rim tape issues.

Be sure you know what actually caused your flat before you panic.
>
> I also heard of a product that can be installed inside the tire to prevent
> flats... anyone ever used it? Is it
> worth it?

Mr Tuffy and similar strips add a layer of kevlar or similar material, for
additional protection from punctures. On a bike with wide tires and heavy
wheels you probably won't notice their presence. On a bike built for speed
they will slow you down a bit.

RichC
 
On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 22:19:07 -0400, Daniel Crispin wrote:

> Well tonight I got my first flat with my new bike... worst possible place
> and time too (don't we just love Murphy? ;)
>
> Anyhow, tomorrow I will have to go to the bike shop, I plan on installing a
> kevlar tire to reduce the risk.
>
> I also heard of a product that can be installed inside the tire to prevent
> flats... anyone ever used it? Is it
> worth it?

One other procedure that might be useful: Check your tires periodically
for little bits of embedded glass or metal that haven't yet worked their
way in deep enough to puncture the tube. Often, little shards will stick
in the surface layer of the tire, then gradually be forced in deeper and
deeper as you ride. When they eventually penetrate the tube, pffffft...

If you do a careful inspection now and then (especially if you ride
through much broken glass, or in other industrial-wasteland-type
environments), you will probably find a couple of small, sharp objects
embedded in your tires, which you can then remove (carefully, of course,
lest you inflict a puncture yourself), possibly averting a flat before it
occurs. An ounce of prevention...

Now that I mention it, I'd better go and check my tires...

AMG
 
Daniel Crispin wrote:
> Well tonight I got my first flat with my new bike... worst possible place
> and time too (don't we just love Murphy? ;)
>
> Anyhow, tomorrow I will have to go to the bike shop, I plan on installing a
> kevlar tire to reduce the risk.
>
> I also heard of a product that can be installed inside the tire to prevent
> flats... anyone ever used it? Is it
> worth it?

We talked about this on a club ride yesterday.

I tried kevlar-belted tires for a year or more. I noticed the increased
rolling resistance more than I noticed a reduction in flats. The guy on
the ride who was using them (they came on his brand new touring bike)
seemed to agree. And Mr. Tuffy tire liners got the same review.
Several people had tried them, then given them up.

I don't doubt these things can help somewhat, but they're certainly not
cures. Far more effective is to watch the road surface and avoid the
glass and trash. In particular, stay in the area that the car's right
tires sweep clean, at least as much as you possibly can.

--
--------------------+
Frank Krygowski [To reply, remove rodent and vegetable dot com,
replace with cc.ysu dot edu]
 
On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 02:48:03 +0000, Ken wrote:

>
> "dreaded" <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>> yes, i have some kind of green strip thingys that go between the tube &
>> tire. havent had a flat since i installed them but wonder there is any
>> effect on efficiency.
>
> Doesn't work as well as a kevlar belted tire. Also, some people report
> that the inserts flats themselves through friction or rough edges.

They can indeed have an effect on handling and efficiency since the tire
will effectively be stiffened slightly, losing suppleness. I just think
they feel "weird" but that's pretty subjective. Worth a shot I guess, I've
heard folks rave about them, so they can't be totally dismissed either. :D

A Kevlar belted tire's a good bet. They aren't foolproof, if you get a
piece of glass stuck in the tread, it will work it's way in slowly, so
it's worth having a quick gander at your tires after every ride.

Do carry a patch kit and inflation device/pump and learn to use
it--consider flats part of the challenge of cycling, just like a pit stop
for auto racers--it's par for the course. I can personally get back on the
road in 5 minutes or so with my road bike. I don't even remove the wheel,
just open the tire on one side, slip out the tube, patch, inflate and
ride. Never had a patch fail in over twenty years of riding either.

Proper inflation is crucial, and think about tire style. Are you on a
super racy bike, or a mtb, or hybrid? It might be worth looking for a
little heavier rubber in addition to the kevlar. I run 70x25s while most
other folks around here use 21s and 23s on their sport bikes--I find just
that added bit of width helps enormously. If I had a cyclocross bike or
touring ride that could handle the width, I'd probably go for some 32mm
wide touring tires since I ride solo and worry more about long distance
comfort.

In my experience, if you get more than one flat per thousand miles on a
regular basis, there's something amiss. Between my city and sport bikes, I
average a flat every 1000 -2000 miles, the sportier ride getting perhaps
50% more flats due to the thinner rubber.

As always, YMMV.

:D
 
On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 22:48:33 -0400, Rich Clark wrote:

> Kevlar-belted tires can help against some kinds of punctures. Not much use
> against pinch-flats or flats caused by rim problems or rim tape issues.
>
> Be sure you know what actually caused your flat before you panic.

well said--check your rims for rough spots on the inside, with particular
attention to the valve hole. sometimes you have to smooth it with a round
file--though I'm a lazy ******* and often "soften" the edges with
electrical tape.
 
Daniel Crispin wrote:
> Well tonight I got my first flat with my new bike... worst possible
> place and time too (don't we just love Murphy? ;)
>
> Anyhow, tomorrow I will have to go to the bike shop, I plan on
> installing a kevlar tire to reduce the risk.
>
> I also heard of a product that can be installed inside the tire to
> prevent flats... anyone ever used it? Is it
> worth it?

Carry one or two spare tubes and a pump. Learn to replace a tube in less
than ten minutes and then you wont bother worrying about flats anymore.

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.
 
Ken wrote:

> "dreaded" <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:
>
>>yes, i have some kind of green strip thingys that go between the tube &
>>tire. havent had a flat since i installed them but wonder there is any
>>effect on efficiency.

I concur. I have some Mr. Tuffys I've used for over ten years and never
had a flat with them. They increase rolling resistence a little - it's
barely noticeable.
>
>
> Doesn't work as well as a kevlar belted tire. Also, some people report that
> the inserts flats themselves through friction or rough edges.

I disagree. I think the quality of the tire is a more important factor.
My on-sale kevlars a full of holes and I got plenty of flats. I
re-instlled the Mr. Tuffys and haven't had a flat since.

Installation is important. A folded Mr. Tuffy WILL abrade your tube and
give you flats. Of course, the little bump every tire revolution will
annoy you first.
 
> I also heard of a product that can be installed inside
> the tire to prevent flats... anyone ever used it?

I've been using two such items for years: the Mr. Tuffy liner, which
goes between tube and tyre, and the Slime sealant that goes inside the tube.

> Is it worth it?

It is to me, because I use my bike to commute to work on ugly urban
streets littered with broken glass and construction debris, and I'd
rather not be patching punctures or changing tubes on my way to work in
the morning, or on my way home in the evening. The liners and the
sealant add some additional weight (few hundred grams) and rolling
resistance (few watts), but who's counting?

--
Robots don't kill people -- people kill people.
http://www.irobotmovie.com/
 
maxo wrote in part:

<< In my experience, if you get more than one flat per thousand miles on a
regular basis, there's something amiss. >>

I totally agree. I flat about once every 400 miles and something is definitely
amiss. I think it's the thorns.

Robert
 
On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 02:48:03 +0000, Ken <[email protected]> wrote:

> "dreaded" <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>> yes, i have some kind of green strip thingys that go between the tube &
>> tire. havent had a flat since i installed them but wonder there is any
>> effect on efficiency.
>
> Doesn't work as well as a kevlar belted tire. Also, some people report
> that
> the inserts flats themselves through friction or rough edges.

I've only had that happen once, out of the many miles I've used them.
They help a lot (and better than my previous kevlar-belted tire). I have
had flats, though. One flat was caused by a small nail that must've been
perfectly upright, as it went through everything.

--
Bob in CT
Remove ".x" to reply
 
> I also heard of a product that can be installed inside the tire to prevent
> flats... anyone ever used it? Is it
> worth it?

I've been commuting for about 8 years now. After a number of
"learning experiences", I've settled on the following setup:

1. Slime in my tubes: worth every penny, in my experience -- I love
the stuff. In most cases, if a tire gets low I'll find something in
the tire. As soon as I remove it, the slime takes over and I can just
pump it back up. I can always change the tube when I get where I'm
going.

2. Tire liners: seem to work well on thorns, sticks and small bits of
glass.

3. Spare tube: easier and faster than a patch, especially in the dark
or rain.

4. High-quality pump - I keep mine in a plastic bag in a pannier or
knapsack and not on the frame.

Some of this might seem like overkill, but I expect to commute in all
kinds of conditions. The last thing I'd want on a cold, rainy night
is a flat and only a patch kit and a finicky pump to get me home.
 
On Mon, 12 Jul 2004 16:03:25 GMT, Bob in CT <[email protected]>
wrote:

>
>I've only had that happen once, out of the many miles I've used them.
>They help a lot (and better than my previous kevlar-belted tire). I have
>had flats, though. One flat was caused by a small nail that must've been
>perfectly upright, as it went through everything.

I'm just hoping my uh, competitors on the bike trail don't pick up on
this - you know the militant dog walkers...nuff said.

-B
 
I use a Mr Tuffy liner on my rear 23x700c rear tire only. It has
worked very well for me. I've picked out more than six pieces of
glass from the tire rubber on my last rear tire and I think only liner
prevented the glass from penetrating into the tube. The tire was full
of cut holes when I finally discarded it after it wore thin.
But I had to to cover the seam edge on the liner to avoid wearing hole
in the tube.
 
Well I think patches are a pain... I will start carring a spare tube
instead, they only cost 5$ anyhow so it's not really expensive.

As for the tires, I went to my LBS and he completelly refused to sell me Mr
Tuffy (or what ever it is called) ;) He said that
after a while the corners start to lift and puncture the tube. He suggested
I use better tires instead. Showed me one made by
specialized that is kevlar belted and has a central band much thicker than
the rest of the tire, so there is more space between the body of the tire
and the road. Only 33$ per tire. I will have both tire replaced this
Thursday.

My tires are 700 but I am not sure of the with... I think it's 32 but I
could be wrong ... it's an Hybrid with standard size hybrid
tires (if there is such a thing).

I think the new tires can also take higher pressure (100 pounds compared to
85 pounds for my current tires)... that should make
for a smoother ride.



"maxo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:p[email protected]...
> On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 02:48:03 +0000, Ken wrote:
>
> >
> > "dreaded" <[email protected]> wrote in
> > news:[email protected]:
> >> yes, i have some kind of green strip thingys that go between the tube &
> >> tire. havent had a flat since i installed them but wonder there is any
> >> effect on efficiency.
> >
> > Doesn't work as well as a kevlar belted tire. Also, some people report
> > that the inserts flats themselves through friction or rough edges.
>
> They can indeed have an effect on handling and efficiency since the tire
> will effectively be stiffened slightly, losing suppleness. I just think
> they feel "weird" but that's pretty subjective. Worth a shot I guess, I've
> heard folks rave about them, so they can't be totally dismissed either. :D
>
> A Kevlar belted tire's a good bet. They aren't foolproof, if you get a
> piece of glass stuck in the tread, it will work it's way in slowly, so
> it's worth having a quick gander at your tires after every ride.
>
> Do carry a patch kit and inflation device/pump and learn to use
> it--consider flats part of the challenge of cycling, just like a pit stop
> for auto racers--it's par for the course. I can personally get back on the
> road in 5 minutes or so with my road bike. I don't even remove the wheel,
> just open the tire on one side, slip out the tube, patch, inflate and
> ride. Never had a patch fail in over twenty years of riding either.
>
> Proper inflation is crucial, and think about tire style. Are you on a
> super racy bike, or a mtb, or hybrid? It might be worth looking for a
> little heavier rubber in addition to the kevlar. I run 70x25s while most
> other folks around here use 21s and 23s on their sport bikes--I find just
> that added bit of width helps enormously. If I had a cyclocross bike or
> touring ride that could handle the width, I'd probably go for some 32mm
> wide touring tires since I ride solo and worry more about long distance
> comfort.
>
> In my experience, if you get more than one flat per thousand miles on a
> regular basis, there's something amiss. Between my city and sport bikes, I
> average a flat every 1000 -2000 miles, the sportier ride getting perhaps
> 50% more flats due to the thinner rubber.
>
> As always, YMMV.
>
> :D
>
 
Exactly what I am planing to do ;)

I am also thinking about changing to the other type of valve... can't
remember the name... from what I ear it doesn't leak
air like a regular valve do.


"Per Elmsäter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Daniel Crispin wrote:
> > Well tonight I got my first flat with my new bike... worst possible
> > place and time too (don't we just love Murphy? ;)
> >
> > Anyhow, tomorrow I will have to go to the bike shop, I plan on
> > installing a kevlar tire to reduce the risk.
> >
> > I also heard of a product that can be installed inside the tire to
> > prevent flats... anyone ever used it? Is it
> > worth it?
>
> Carry one or two spare tubes and a pump. Learn to replace a tube in less
> than ten minutes and then you wont bother worrying about flats anymore.
>
> --
> Perre
>
> You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.
>
>
 
After all this talk about mr tuffy i went to inspect my commuter tires
(23's). i think the tuffy has prevented flats because the tire was really
shot with a couple of spots where small chunks of tire were missing and wire
coming out, and there was some debris inside.

"flatline" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I use a Mr Tuffy liner on my rear 23x700c rear tire only. It has
> worked very well for me. I've picked out more than six pieces of
> glass from the tire rubber on my last rear tire and I think only liner
> prevented the glass from penetrating into the tube. The tire was full
> of cut holes when I finally discarded it after it wore thin.
> But I had to to cover the seam edge on the liner to avoid wearing hole
> in the tube.
 
On Mon, 12 Jul 2004 20:05:23 -0400, "Daniel Crispin"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Well I think patches are a pain... I will start carring a spare tube
>instead, they only cost 5$ anyhow so it's not really expensive.
>
>As for the tires, I went to my LBS and he completelly refused to sell me Mr
>Tuffy (or what ever it is called) ;) He said that
>after a while the corners start to lift and puncture the tube. He suggested
>I use better tires instead. Showed me one made by
>specialized that is kevlar belted and has a central band much thicker than
>the rest of the tire, so there is more space between the body of the tire
>and the road. Only 33$ per tire. I will have both tire replaced this
>Thursday.
>
>My tires are 700 but I am not sure of the with... I think it's 32 but I
>could be wrong ... it's an Hybrid with standard size hybrid
>tires (if there is such a thing).
>
>I think the new tires can also take higher pressure (100 pounds compared to
>85 pounds for my current tires)... that should make
>for a smoother ride.
>
>

Hi, a spare tube is a good idea, but not "instead" of a patch kit. You
could have more than one flat, or as recently happened to me. My brand
new spare tube had a hole in it. I had to patch the tube, before I
could use it.

Life is Good!
Jeff
 
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