Sundays Age

Discussion in 'Australia and New Zealand' started by HUMBUG, Aug 6, 2005.

  1. HUMBUG

    HUMBUG Guest

    Sundays Age - http://tinyurl.com/72nms - if you're a cyclist it's
    stating the obvious but if you're not......

    Now if only we could the more idiotic cagers to read it, if they can
    read of course.

    --
    Humbug
     
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  2. dave

    dave Guest

    Bob wrote:
    > Revisiting the demerit points debate The Age have got one piece horribly
    > wrong - citing a possible two point penalty for "riding two abreast", and
    > quoting the source as VicRoads website. Is it so hard to decipher: "Ride
    > more than two abreast" as VicRoads states? Maybe "more than" doesn't fit the
    > space requirements. Incredibly lazy journalism.
    >
    > http://www.theage.com.au/media/2005/08/06/1123125945933.html
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > "HUMBUG" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >
    >>Sundays Age - http://tinyurl.com/72nms - if you're a cyclist it's
    >>stating the obvious but if you're not......
    >>
    >>Now if only we could the more idiotic cagers to read it, if they can
    >>read of course.
    >>
    >>--
    >>Humbug

    >
    >
    >

    Its also legal to turn left without signalling
     
  3. alison_b

    alison_b New Member

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    The more of us who actually let The Age know this the more likely a correction will be printed. I for one don't want the added abuse from motorists because I am cycling beside another cyclist.

    (I know, like there isn't enough to do without having to do without having to fix up stoopid mistakes other people make.)

    cheers,
    ali
     
  4. DJ

    DJ Guest

    "HUMBUG" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > Sundays Age - http://tinyurl.com/72nms - if you're a cyclist it's
    > stating the obvious but if you're not......
    >
    > Now if only we could the more idiotic cagers to read it, if they can
    > read of course.
    >
    > --
    > Humbug


    I like that bit in the article about the 'Think Truck"....hhahaha...stated
    that " you wouldn't do that in front of a truck would you".......WTF!!...You
    should see what those tin top wankers do in front of my bus on a daily basis
    in Sydney.....and if ya hit one......you often get "Where'd the hell you
    come from...didn't see ya"!! I'm talking about a 40 foot 10 tonne bus
    here..a blue and white government one...can't miss 'em...or another round of
    abuse you get in "ya shoulda waited till i went around you"!! which means
    chucking a left hander from lane 2, accross lane 1 in front of the bus so
    they can head into the little side street on the left.
    So.....if they have this attitude towards a massive bus like
    vehicle......I'm sorry guys but Cyclists just don't rate.

    DJ
     
  5. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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    When motorists go for their licence, they must at least be made to read AusRoads (in it's entirety? Bwhahahaha!), AusRoads Part 14, and in Victoria, the VicRoads Cycle Notes:
    http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/vrne/vrne5nav.nsf/childdocs/-55E7C4E2B4A5C914CA256FD300241BD4-4CF6F5789A47DED4CA256FD300241BEA-EDAC140AD1FE2CF2CA256FD300241BEC-5932FCD44F312390CA256FE10042BC63?open

    Share the Road? Then learn HOW to do it! http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/vrne/vrne5nav.nsf/alltitle/Vehicles-Bicycles%20%26%20Pedestrians
     
  6. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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    From yesterdays Saturday Age: Out of grief, a campaign of shock tactics

    Use Bug Me Not to register

    (Yeah, good on you Harry, the current system doesn't work, lets simply implement another equally inept fine system)


    Simon Gillett, husband of Amy Gillett, says drivers should be given a jolt to make them more considerate. Simon Gillett, husband of Amy Gillett, says drivers should be given a jolt to make them more considerate.

    In his mind's eye, Simon Gillett can vividly imagine the sort of television advertising campaign he believes is necessary to save cyclists from road carnage� Something shocking, something that will jolt us out of a culture of carelessness, something that draws on the sort of pain he is experiencing himself � and he's preparing to help fund it.

    "I can envisage you having the irate motorist, he's got the kids in the car, he runs a bunch of cyclists off the road, someone's getting hurt. He pulls up, and it's either his wife or his nephew or one of his other kids.

    "He realises what he's done, injured one of his own family."

    But Gillett, 47, a former Olympic rowing coach turned cyclist, believes any campaign needs to focus on cyclists' behaviour, too.

    "You can't expect motorists to respect cyclists if cyclists don't respect the road laws themselves."

    Gillett's plans come as:
    - Victoria Police are extending their hunt for a P-plate hit-run driver who injured cyclists in a serious incident on the Beach Road at Black Rock last Sunday.

    - Bicycle Victoria's general manager, Harry Barber. supports a senior Victorian policeman's call for introduction of demerit points against cyclists' driving licences for bicycle offences.

    In the wake of his wife Amy's death in Germany, no-one would have demurred had Simon Gillett, who attended her memorial service in Adelaide on Friday, retreated into his private grief.

    Yet this has not happened � he is determined to retrieve some meaning from his devastating loss and says he is not "hiding under a stone".

    Gillett has set up the Amy Gillett Safe Cycling Foundation, with more than $100,000 already pledged, which has as one of its goals making Australian roads safer for cyclists.

    The fund is being administered by Cycling Australia, the principal body for competitive Australian cycling and road training, and Gillett believes it will receive plenty of support in a campaign the public will welcome.

    "Drink driving has become socially unacceptable, but it wasn't unacceptable 20 years ago. If we can make running over cyclists or treating cyclists badly unacceptable, then we've won the battle, basically," he says.

    Riding up to 300 kilometres a week out of Ballarat, Gillett thinks he knows plenty about the problems, and the places where things need to be improved.

    In Melbourne, he supports a plan being developed by Beach Road stakeholders, including councils and police, to create a clear cycling lane at the time cyclists most use the road, from 6-10am on Saturdays and Sundays.

    Police and cycling bodies are concerned to solve the problems of Beach Road because it is the logical training track for international competitors in the Commonwealth Games. The time trial will be held between St Kilda and Beaumaris.

    Police appealed last week for any witnesses to a hit-run incident in which a dark maroon or purple 1996-98 sedan clipped a number of cyclists just north of the Black Rock clock tower roundabout at 9am on Sunday.

    The car was displaying a P-plate in the rear window.

    Police are combing Melbourne for the car, which lost its left mirror and was seen to accelerate then skid into a turn off Beach Road and into a side street.

    The cyclists were in a group of 14, riding in pairs in the left lane, when the car hit three of the outside riders. Two were taken to the Alfred Hospital; a Pearcedale man with suspected fractures which turned out to be severe bruising, and the other, Renato Picciani, 38, of Windsor, with a deep gash.
     
  7. flyingdutch

    flyingdutch New Member

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    I felt so damn proud and in awe of the guy for turning his personal tragedy into something that potentially could be so darned good. I doubt i could be capable of that :(

    perhaps we could get in contact with him/the-foundation to see if he would be interested to support WheelsOfJustice (and/or us him).

    He's got the media strongly behind him and people will listen.

    Let's stop whineing to the converted and start putting some positive steps in place here people!

    So, who's on board? REALLY onboard??
     
  8. alison_b

    alison_b New Member

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    I'd like a campaign that actually rewards good driving. Take the number plate of the car whose driver actually contributed to shared road safety, log it, and they get a bumper sticker and a thankyou in the mail. Cyclists could also carry a bunch of stickers, and when safe hand them over with a smile and a thankyou. It would need a catchy slogan... I imagine it could be implemented without great cost... I'd be keen to hear other peoples' suggestions...

    No, I'm not suggesting this is instead of enforcement of laws, I'm not the poster child for the happy cyclist (show me a mobile phone using motorist and I understand how people can murder :D ), and no this isn't going to save the world. But it as much a cultural change needed as legislative (well, i think so anyway!) this could be a small part of that, perhaps?

    oh... and to The Age (one of my daughters is worried that I might squander seconds off my 15 minutes of fame :eek: ):

    What a shame the otherwise balanced and informative articles addressing
    concerns surrounding cycling in Sunday's Age (August 7th, 2005) were
    undermined by careless journalism. Simon Gillett's message of the need
    for motorists' and cyclists' care on the roads, including increased
    consideration of motorists for cyclists, is powerful. It is upsetting to
    have misinformation of the sort The Age claims is from the Vicroads
    website undermining this message. I acknowledge that the vast majority of
    motorists are courteous and responsible drivers. However, I can't help but
    wonder how many of those who fail to measure up to even basic standrards
    of commonsense will just add to their chorus of abuse and intimidation
    when they next see two cyclists LEGALLY riding abreast. Getting the
    points right only required copying them accurately. From the Vicroads
    website:

    http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/VRNE/vrne5nav.nsf/FirstChild/-0FFFDE1079575E47CA256FD300241C36

    "Offenders can be fined more than $50 for the following offences:
    [...]
    - Ride more than two abreast"

    The missing words "more than" are essential for accuracy. Again quoting
    from the website:

    "Riding beside other cyclists

    A cyclist must not ride alongside more than one other rider unless:

    - the rider is overtaking other cyclists who may be cycling beside each
    other; or
    - the rider is taking part in an on-road cycling event that has been
    approved by the Chief Commissioner of Police."

    That is, a cyclist may overtake two other cyclists riding abreast.

    Similarly, a cyclist is not legally bound to signal when turning left or
    stopping:

    "Cyclists are required to indicate their intention to turn right. They are
    not required to indicate their intention to turn left or to stop."

    I hope that The Age can see fit to publish an article correcting the
    misinformation featured in the article. I will be thinking of The Age the
    next time a motorist acts on their mistaken belief that only they are
    allowed to use the roads and am abused for riding alongside another
    cyclist.
     
  9. DaveB

    DaveB Guest

    Before going down the path of fixing the problem, it might be a good
    idea to define what the problem actually is. I think we'd all agree that
    the majority of drivers are ok with cyclists, not perfect but ok (much
    the same as the cycling community). So there's probably not much point
    in directing a campaign at all drivers. At the other end of the scale we
    have the ratbags who are going to be aresholes on the road regardless of
    what anybody says, and not just to cyclists, but to pedestrians and
    other car drivers as well. So who is left, and what exactly do we want
    them to do.

    When we know what we want to achieve then is the time to work out how to
    do it. Handing out bumper stickers to nice drivers is a nice gesture,
    but what is it going to change? I'd say it has about as much impact as
    one of those "Free Tibet" stickers, the Chinese govt must be shaking in
    their boots everytime they see one of those. I'm all for action, but
    there's got to be some logic behind it.

    DaveB
     
  10. Euan

    Euan Guest

    >>>>> "flyingdutch" == flyingdutch <[email protected]> writes:

    flyingdutch> Let's stop whineing to the converted and start putting
    flyingdutch> some positive steps in place here people!

    flyingdutch> So, who's on board? REALLY onboard??

    I'm in.
    --
    Cheers | ~~ [email protected]
    Euan | ~~ _-\<,
    Melbourne, Australia | ~ (*)/ (*)
     
  11. Euan

    Euan Guest

    >>>>> "alison" == alison b <alison_b> writes:

    alison> I'd like a campaign that actually rewards good driving. Take
    alison> the number plate of the car whose driver actually
    alison> contributed to shared road safety, log it, and they get a
    alison> bumper sticker and a thankyou in the mail.

    Nice idea but I'd find it difficult to implement. I've no idea how many
    cars pass me on Nepean each day with adequate clearance, reckon it must
    number in the thousands. I couldn't possibly thank them all :)

    What I'm trying to say is that it's very difficult to reward good
    driving because it really should be the norm. Love it if we could but I
    can't see a practical way of doing it.

    Any suggestions?
    --
    Cheers | ~~ [email protected]
    Euan | ~~ _-\<,
    Melbourne, Australia | ~ (*)/ (*)
     
  12. Euan

    Euan Guest

    >>>>> "DaveB" == DaveB <[email protected]> writes:

    DaveB> When we know what we want to achieve then is the time to work
    DaveB> out how to do it.

    I agree.
    --
    Cheers | ~~ [email protected]
    Euan | ~~ _-\<,
    Melbourne, Australia | ~ (*)/ (*)
     
  13. cfsmtb

    cfsmtb New Member

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    Me too (obviously), and Mr Bikesoiler as well. :)
     
  14. "alison_b" wrote:

    > Again quoting from the website:
    >
    > "Riding beside other cyclists
    >
    > A cyclist must not ride alongside more than one other rider unless:
    >
    > - the rider is overtaking other cyclists who may be cycling beside each
    > other; or
    > - the rider is taking part in an on-road cycling event that has been
    > approved by the Chief Commissioner of Police."
    >
    > That is, a cyclist may overtake two other cyclists riding abreast.
    >

    An additional point - two cyclists, riding two abreast, may legally overtake
    two other cyclists riding two abreast. During this overtaking manoeuvre they
    can be 4 wide, LEGALLY. I had this opinion stated by a police officer at a
    Cycle-On program for teachers.

    The interesting thing is that the Beach Road riders can legally use this to
    ride 4-wide if they are riding a well disciplined pace line, working turns
    and continuously overtaking. Could be the basis for an interesting protest
    ride?

    Cheers
    Peter
     
  15. TimC

    TimC Guest

    On 2005-08-07, Peter Signorini (aka Bruce)
    was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
    > An additional point - two cyclists, riding two abreast, may legally overtake
    > two other cyclists riding two abreast. During this overtaking manoeuvre they
    > can be 4 wide, LEGALLY. I had this opinion stated by a police officer at a
    > Cycle-On program for teachers.
    >
    > The interesting thing is that the Beach Road riders can legally use this to
    > ride 4-wide if they are riding a well disciplined pace line, working turns
    > and continuously overtaking. Could be the basis for an interesting protest
    > ride?


    And is it 4 wide per lane? (I can't imagine we are banned from riding
    2 per lane for an arbitrary amount of lanes).

    So have 3 sets of these pace lines going down a 3 lane highway.

    --
    TimC
    Conclusion to my thesis -- "It is trivial to show that it is
    clearly obvious that this is not woofly."
     
  16. Marx SS

    Marx SS New Member

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    I overheard 2x ladies talking about the prevelance of bikes on Melb roads lately.
    It finished with the comment of: "... with the amount of bicycles paths there are around the place nowadays, you would think those bike riders would use them instead of being on the road."

    Saw another family group on their bikes today, with dad still letting his helmet swing about on the end of the handlebars as he rolled past.....

    I heard there are thoughts of licencing or registating cyclists..... yep, there definately has been a massive amount of progress in cycling awareness recently....
     
  17. ProfTournesol

    ProfTournesol New Member

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    One problem we have is that we are small(er than a car) and invisible: most of us ride singly (Beach Road is an exception) and the impact of the absence of our cars on the road is unnoticed.

    How about a mass weekend drive down Beach Road instead of a cycle? If we picked one weekend, all drove at 40 km/hr with bikes mounted on the car to identify us as cyclists, we could show that:
    we are a large group when acting collectively
    we (mostly) all drive and pay registration fees
    if we chose to drive rather than cycle we would be adding considerably to traffic congestion.

    imagine if even half of the 6000 cyclists a wekend day did this in an organised fashion, (but didn't break any road rules), even Channel 7 would struggle to vilify us.
     
  18. "TimC" wrote:
    >
    > And is it 4 wide per lane? (I can't imagine we are banned from riding
    > 2 per lane for an arbitrary amount of lanes).
    >
    > So have 3 sets of these pace lines going down a 3 lane highway.


    No luck :-{ In this case lanes don't matter. 2 abreast is the limit for any
    road, and 2+2 when overtaking.

    Cheers
    Peter
     
  19. giantbike

    giantbike New Member

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    Now,I like your suggestion.This will surely remind those that claim us,cyclists, should NOT be riding on the road at all,as we never pay any registration fee on our bikes.
     
  20. ProfTournesol

    ProfTournesol New Member

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    imagine if we reversed BV's strategy and organised a Drive to Work Day for cyclists, again with bikes on roof racks/bike beak etc.
     
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