walking etiquette

In message <[email hidden]>

George said:

Just back from our annual week in the Lake District.

Occurred to me that there seems to be a "social switch" which determines
whether one greets another walker or not. In the fells, for the most
part, I've found that walkers will make eye contact and greet each
other. This year we found that, as we came closer to centres of
population, the eye contact and greetings diminished until nobody
appeared to acknowledge each other - just like in "normal life".

This phenomenon was especially noted on a walk from Pelter Bridge round
Rydal Water and Grasmere: At the start it was all "Hi, there!", "How
do?" and plenty of smiles and eye contact. As we got closer to Grasmere
(village), the camaraderie diminished until it was just like walking
down the High Street at home.

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is acceptable
to greet a fellow-walker or not? Crowdedness of the path cannot be the
sole factor: Up on Helvellyn there was plenty of greetings; perhaps it
also involves perceived "hardness" of the walk and the consequent
increase in group identity?

Has it occured to you that the people you meet close to centres of
population may be different in character from those that stray further
in to the wilderness i.e. they are not randomly selected samples from
th total population?

Mike
--
o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
<\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
"> || _`\<,_ |__\ \> | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

George said:

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is acceptable
to greet a fellow-walker or not?

It's always acceptable to greet someone else. If they don't wish to
reciprocate is up to them.

Quoted message said:

Crowdedness of the path cannot be the
sole factor: Up on Helvellyn there was plenty of greetings; perhaps it
also involves perceived "hardness" of the walk and the consequent
increase in group identity?

Group identity is to do with it, I think: are you the "same sort" as the
other person is probably the question. And the answer is a potentially
complex one, which can be at the level of "are you outdoors enjoying
yourself too?" or might be some deeply nuanced thing regarding what you
look like, what you're wearing, and if it impacts the other person's
"cool" to acknowledge you (sad, but true).

I'm not sure hardness of the walk has much to do with it. I've had a
good blether with folk on serious scrambling ridges and also just taking
a dander round a community woodland. But it might be to do with some
folks' perceived hardness of themselves relative to you (added to a
perception that there is some importance in the distinction) in some
cases, and how much traffic there'll be is also a factor. In the UK
cyclists also typically greet one another, in NL it's ridiculous as it
would be like flashing your headlamps every time you saw another car
coming, just to say hello! (But fellow recumbent riders would always
give us a freindly nod or a "Hoi!"😉.
And if you're used to walking in busy places primarily you might not
have got into the habit of greeting folk.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

George said:

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is
acceptable to greet a fellow-walker or not?

In Wales I think the rule is that Welsh walkers say hello and English
walkers ignore you! ;-)

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk/

Paul Saunders said:

George said:

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is
acceptable to greet a fellow-walker or not?

In Wales I think the rule is that Welsh walkers say hello and English
walkers ignore you! ;-)

Paul
--http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk/

Here in N Wales we always acknowlege other walkers and are rarely
ignored - though it has to be said we pick times and places that
aren't too busy, it gets a bit tiresome if you're meeting a dozen a
minute. Today on Cnicht was typical, there were 4 shepherds with a
pair of dogs each gathering sheep, we passed close to 2 of them and
had brief chatswith them even though they were busy. Exchanged
greetings with 3 lone walkers - one Welsh and exchanged greetings with
a family of four. They were the only people we saw all day - all told
a great day in the hills.

George said:

Just back from our annual week in the Lake District.

Occurred to me that there seems to be a "social switch" which determines
whether one greets another walker or not. In the fells, for the most
part, I've found that walkers will make eye contact and greet each
other. This year we found that, as we came closer to centres of
population, the eye contact and greetings diminished until nobody
appeared to acknowledge each other - just like in "normal life".

This phenomenon was especially noted on a walk from Pelter Bridge round
Rydal Water and Grasmere: At the start it was all "Hi, there!", "How
do?" and plenty of smiles and eye contact. As we got closer to Grasmere
(village), the camaraderie diminished until it was just like walking
down the High Street at home.

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is acceptable
to greet a fellow-walker or not? Crowdedness of the path cannot be the
sole factor: Up on Helvellyn there was plenty of greetings; perhaps it
also involves perceived "hardness" of the walk and the consequent
increase in group identity?

It's the preponderance of grockles in and near the tourist centres.
They're not familiar with walkers' greetings so don't make them or
respond, and we walkers give up after a few snubs. FWIW one of the
reasons I moved to Kendal was that I saw people stopping and talking
to each other in the street. That never ever happened in Twickenham,
where i was living at the time. There were many other reasons, too,
which I won't bore you with ;-)

John D.
--
John Dawson at home in Kendal, Cumbria.
Lake District Walks Web Pages http://www.lakedistrictwalks.com/
Sicilian Volcanoes at http://www.lakedistrictwalks.com/sicily/
Pyrenees trek at http://www.lakedistrictwalks.com/pyrenees

Paul Saunders <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

George said:

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is
acceptable to greet a fellow-walker or not?

In Wales I think the rule is that Welsh walkers say hello and English
walkers ignore you! ;-)

Paul

Tell us how they say "Hello" in Welsh, then we might recognise it next
time.

8-)
--
Gordon H
(Remove "Invalid" to reply)

John Dawson said:

Quoted message said:

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is acceptable
to greet a fellow-walker or not? Crowdedness of the path cannot be the
sole factor: Up on Helvellyn there was plenty of greetings; perhaps it
also involves perceived "hardness" of the walk and the consequent
increase in group identity?

It's the preponderance of grockles in and near the tourist centres.
They're not familiar with walkers' greetings so don't make them or
respond, and we walkers give up after a few snubs. FWIW one of the
reasons I moved to Kendal was that I saw people stopping and talking
to each other in the street. That never ever happened in Twickenham,
where i was living at the time. There were many other reasons, too,
which I won't bore you with ;-)

John D.

Generally I think John has it right. I find away from the madding crowd
peeps are more friendly. If you don't believe me then try being
friendly on a crowded train on London's Underground! :-)
As for Wales, when walking Offa's Dyke there were more foreigners than
UK residents, so sometimes a nod was all you could reasonably expect.

Mike Clark said:

Has it occured to you that the people you meet close to centres of
population may be different in character from those that stray
further in to the wilderness i.e. they are not randomly selected
samples from th total population?

Quite. In Cumbria it's normal practice to greet strangers in the
street (on the assumption that they are locals you just haven't seen
about much), and non-greeters on the hill tend to be visitors who
don't like the rhythm of their walk disturbed, or who have been
conditioned to avoid eye contact from years of city living.

--
Chris Game

"I've always found [Peter] an excellent source of advice, a guiding
light for the lost, lonely and terminally stupid." T Mighty Lemon

George said:

Just back from our annual week in the Lake District.

Occurred to me that there seems to be a "social switch" which determines
whether one greets another walker or not. In the fells, for the most
part, I've found that walkers will make eye contact and greet each
other. This year we found that, as we came closer to centres of
population, the eye contact and greetings diminished until nobody
appeared to acknowledge each other - just like in "normal life".

This phenomenon was especially noted on a walk from Pelter Bridge round
Rydal Water and Grasmere: At the start it was all "Hi, there!", "How
do?" and plenty of smiles and eye contact. As we got closer to Grasmere
(village), the camaraderie diminished until it was just like walking
down the High Street at home.

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is acceptable
to greet a fellow-walker or not? Crowdedness of the path cannot be the
sole factor: Up on Helvellyn there was plenty of greetings; perhaps it
also involves perceived "hardness" of the walk and the consequent
increase in group identity?

--
George
(Ba - humbug!)

I usually say hello, unless there are hordes of people around.

If there is just the odd person around I tend to start up a
conversation, you can get to talk to some intersting people that way,
e.g. a few months ago I got chatting to an old boy, out for a stroll
from his village, he ended up pointing out the local badger set to me,
plus I learnt far more history about the area than I ever wanted to
know.

Ted

Gordon H said:

Quoted message said:

In Wales I think the rule is that Welsh walkers say hello and English
walkers ignore you! ;-)

Quoted message said:

Tell us how they say "Hello" in Welsh, then we might recognise it next
time.

8-)

It's Sut (pronounded sit) Mae (as in eye) in North Wales and Shwmae (shoo m
"eye"😉 in South Wales.

I wonder how much of it is to do with recognising a fellow countryman?

Seriously though, most solitary walkers are friendly enough, but when there
are more about they're more likely to ignore you in my experience. And I've
noticed those who ignore you (well, me anyway) have strong English accents,
so they're probably townie tourists unfamiliar with hill walker conventions.

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk/

Broadback said:

Quoted message said:

It's the preponderance of grockles in and near the tourist centres.
They're not familiar with walkers' greetings so don't make them or
respond, and we walkers give up after a few snubs. FWIW one of the
reasons I moved to Kendal was that I saw people stopping and talking
to each other in the street. That never ever happened in Twickenham,
where i was living at the time. There were many other reasons, too,
which I won't bore you with ;-)

John D.

Quoted message said:

Generally I think John has it right.

Yep.

Quoted message said:

I find away from the madding
crowd peeps are more friendly. If you don't believe me then try
being friendly on a crowded train on London's Underground! :-)

Done that a few times. I used to enjoy the reactions I got! Talking on the
tube seems to be almost as taboo as cannibalism!

Quoted message said:

As for Wales, when walking Offa's Dyke there were more foreigners than
UK residents, so sometimes a nod was all you could reasonably expect.

Yep. I chatted to a black guy (very rare in the hills for some reason) in
the Black Mountains once and he seemed terribly concerned about my welfare
when I told him I was going to camp wild up there.

I passed some groups of blacks and Asians on the Carneddau once. Very
unusual. They were engrossed with chatting to one another and completely
oblivious to passers by, as were most others there that day. Quantity of
walkers definitely makes a difference.

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk/

In message <[email hidden]>, Paul Saunders
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

George said:

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is
acceptable to greet a fellow-walker or not?

In Wales I think the rule is that Welsh walkers say hello and English
walkers ignore you! ;-)

Paul

Depends1 Many real Welsh walkers will say "Sut Mae" (pronounced "Shood
Mai" just to let the other person know he is in Wales :-)
--
Bill Grey

In message <[email hidden]>, Paul Saunders
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Gordon H said:

Quoted message said:

In Wales I think the rule is that Welsh walkers say hello and English
walkers ignore you! ;-)

Quoted message said:

Tell us how they say "Hello" in Welsh, then we might recognise it next
time.

8-)

It's Sut (pronounded sit) Mae (as in eye) in North Wales and Shwmae (shoo m
"eye"😉 in South Wales.

Nice phonetics for the colloquial Paul

Quoted message said:

I wonder how much of it is to do with recognising a fellow countryman?

I have a friend who always greets someone in Welsh either to consolidate
the Welsh connection or to confuse the non Welsh :-)
--
Bill Grey

In message <[email hidden]>, John Dawson
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

They're not familiar with walkers' greetings so don't make them or
respond, and we walkers give up after a few snubs.

How will I know you if you ever get to South Wales?

Do you have a funny handshake or a funny walk ? Your "we walkers"
attitude will get you snubbed any tie of the day if your not careful:-)
--
Bill Grey

Ted <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

I usually say hello, unless there are hordes of people around.

If there's a crowd I say hello to the first few and then shout "And that
will have to do for the rest of you" in a loud voice.

Usually gets a smile and friendly response.
--
Gordon H
(Remove "Invalid" to reply)

In message <[email hidden]>

Paul Saunders said:

Seriously though, most solitary walkers are friendly enough, but when there
are more about they're more likely to ignore you in my experience. And I've
noticed those who ignore you (well, me anyway) have strong English accents,
so they're probably townie tourists unfamiliar with hill walker conventions.

It's sometimes a good thing if people don't... Meet me on the fells in
the Lake District and likely as not I'll start ranting about footpath
"repairs".

--
Simon Challands

The message <[email hidden]>
from Ted <[email hidden]> contains these words:

Quoted message said:

you can get to talk to some intersting people that way,

Too right! Walking up the track to do Scheihallion not from the book
route, I came on a bint coming the other way, who was able to explain
what Mascelyne had done on the mountain, which no book or other
authority had ever been able to do! Thank-you ma'am! ... and then she
walked on out of my life ...

Richard

"Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Gordon H said:

Quoted message said:

In Wales I think the rule is that Welsh walkers say hello and English
walkers ignore you! ;-)

Quoted message said:

Tell us how they say "Hello" in Welsh, then we might recognise it next
time.

8-)

It's Sut (pronounded sit) Mae (as in eye) in North Wales and Shwmae (shoo
m "eye"😉 in South Wales.

I think it might depend where in Wales you are too. Or possibly the
generation you belong to? I don't think i've ever said Sut Mae in my entire
life as a greeting.

I tend to greet everyone with a Good Morning / afternoon as relevant. "Bore
Da" and "Prynhawn Da". Or just an informal 'Da Chi'n Iawn' ( are you
Ok/alright) as is common in this part of Gwynedd.

This may get a response in Welsh (As it did from the first 3 people i met in
the Carneddau today), or a reply in whatever language the person speaks. I'm
yet to find someone foolhardy enough to tell me to "speak English man!",
or - surprisingly - anyone look blankly and wonder what planet i'm from as
often happens in certain towns in the area.

T Dave R

Following up to George said:

I wonder what the criteria are which determine whether it is acceptable
to greet a fellow-walker or not?

altitude, the hello contour!
--
Mike
Remove clothing to email