Why are expensive bikes better than cheap ones?

[Peter Clinch]

Ian Smith wrote:

> Lower maintenance. My disk-equipped road-going bike requires about 3
> hands fewer to adjust, and 4 hands fewer to change, the brake pads.
> Even were I equipped with that many hands, the disks would still be
> easier to change and adjust pads.

That's not intrinsic to discs though. To change the pads on HS 33s you
unplug the old one and plug in a new one. To adjust them you twirl the
adjustment wheel on the lever.

Other points quite true though.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email protected] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

 

[Ian Smith]

On Thu, 09 Nov 2006, Peter Clinch <[email protected]> wrote:
> Ian Smith wrote:
>
> > Lower maintenance. My disk-equipped road-going bike requires about 3
> > hands fewer to adjust, and 4 hands fewer to change, the brake pads.
> > Even were I equipped with that many hands, the disks would still be
> > easier to change and adjust pads.
>
> That's not intrinsic to discs though. To change the pads on HS 33s you
> unplug the old one and plug in a new one. To adjust them you twirl the
> adjustment wheel on the lever.

I've never met a rim brake as easy to fit pads and adjust as my disks.
I'll agree I've never used 'HS 33s' (whatever they might be), but they
sound to be the exception rather than a norm.

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|

 

[Peter Clinch]

Ian Smith wrote:

> I've never met a rim brake as easy to fit pads and adjust as my disks.
> I'll agree I've never used 'HS 33s' (whatever they might be)

Magura hydraulic rim brakes.

> but they
> sound to be the exception rather than a norm.

They are, but they demonstrate that easy pad changing and adjustment is
not necessarily impossible for rim brakes.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email protected] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

 

[Clive George]

"Ian Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> I've never met a rim brake as easy to fit pads and adjust as my disks.
> I'll agree I've never used 'HS 33s' (whatever they might be), but they
> sound to be the exception rather than a norm.

Magura hydraulic rim brakes (for that is what an HS33 is) are somewhat
different to cable brakes...

cheers,
clive

 

[Dane Buson]

Simon Brooke <[email protected]> wrote:
> in message <[email protected]>, The Blue Frog
> ('[email protected]') wrote:
>
>> Aheadset bearings are secured 'square on' (not screwed down) and take
>> modern sprung forks--if you look at bikes in a park the really cheap ones
>> don't
>> have aheadset. (Maybe racer type bikes don't?) Aheadset & V-Brakes were
>> an improvement--now disc brakes (another reason to get aheadset) which if
>> hydraulic are brilliant.
>
> While hydraulic brakes are indeed better, disk brakes are no benefit at all
> on a road bike and actually weaken the wheels.

Well, they do add dishing on a front wheel thus weakening it. However,
on a rear wheel, they reduce the dish thus actually increasing strength
IIRC.

http://tinyurl.com/y6o9sc
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.tech/browse_frm/thread/
348e0970750c20c4/12a757c297e9f11f?lnk=st&q=chalo+colina+disc+wheel
+dish&rnum=3#12a757c297e9f11f

--
Dane Buson - [email protected]
'You know all those spasticated-looking hip-hop gestures involving
extended fingers and wrists cocked at odd angles which are intended to
have a meaning to the effect of "Kinoath!" or "You have spoken wisely,
my friend."? I'm making one in your direction now...' Marko in aus.moto

 

[daren]

On Nov 8, 10:11 am, Mark McNeill <[email protected]> wrote:
> Response to John Hearns:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Maybe not a good comparison, but think about shopping for a television.
> > You go down to your local department store to look at the range on offer,
> > all wired in to showing programmes or maybe a DVD movie.
> > You Ooh and Ahh over the top-of-the-range huge flatscreen Sony,
> > because it has a stunning picture quality and the sound as those
> > X-fighters flash by makes the ground shake.
> > But the price tag makes you think twice.
> > You look at the flatscreens by companies like LG etc., and they look quite
> > nice and the size is in reality a bit better for your living room.
> > You look at the conventional televisions, widescreen with flat front
> > tubes.
> > Finally in the corner you spot really cheap portable models, from
> > manufacturers you've never heard of. They use wire loop aerials, can be
> > run off batteries in a caravan and have tubes which look like a fishbowl.
> > But they're dead cheap.
>
> > I'd hazard a guess that you won't carry home a cheap portable set (unless
> > you live in a caravan).Ar. We're shopping for a new shower cubicle ATM, and the first one we
> saw at the builders' merchants was a Special Limited Offer, and very
> tempting; until we saw the decent-quality one at twice the price round
> the corner. At that point I was reminded of the cheap-bike threads
> here, and remembered that in all the fields I know something about, if
> you want an easy life the one thing you /don't/ do is buy a no-name
> product which is half the price of all the others.
>
> As Royce [or was it Rolls?] said, quality is remembered long after the
> price is forgotten.

Where knowledge is lacking, I apply the generic solution, buy the
second cheapest in the highest quality range. Cars tend to be excluded
from this, but the rule works well for domestic appliances, TVs, etc...

The cheapest is normally built down to a price to get the name or
feature-crippled. the next one up is where the value lies.

D.

 

[Pyromancer]

Upon the miasma of midnight, a darkling spirit identified as Peter
Clinch <[email protected]> gently breathed:
>Ken Aston wrote:

>> To come down to the point, assuming the same weight, the same type of
>> tyres and amount of gears, why can I go faster with a high quality
>> bike?

>Not a smart set of assumption though. Some of the money goes on
>lowering weight, so you can't reasonably assume it's the same weight.
>Some of the money goes on better tyres, with lower rolling resistance.
>It's not just the number of gears, it's the ratios, how well suited
>they are to the riding in hand and how well they operate: you're not
>going that fast if you've just thrown the chain on a big change.
>
>"High quality" means that the things you've assumed are the same
>generally won't be. And that's part of how you can go faster.

It's not just weight - my current, expensive bike is probably heavier
than the cheap MTB it replaced, but the advantage is in the sheer
quality of absolutely every part of the bike. It rolls like a dream,
every gear change is faultless, the tyres hold air so well I only need
to pump a little more in every other month, all the controls are
*exactly* where my hands expect them to be, and the brakes feel like
they'd happily stop a fully loaded freight train going downhill at 90+.
Ok, slight exaggeration, but only slight! I've never had a bike before
where I can be so confident it will stop where and when I want, every
time, and without madly hanging on the levers and praying.

In short, it's an absolute joy to ride. I'd certainly never willingly
buy a cheap bike again, you really do get what you pay for.

I look at the 79 quid full-suspension "mountain bikes" in ASDA (Walmart
for leftpondians) and wonder just exactly how long one would last if I
tried to commute on it. About a week, I suspect...

--
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Broadband, Dialup, Domains = <http://www.wytches.net> = The UK's Pagan ISP!
<http://www.inkubus-sukkubus.co.uk> <http://www.revival.stormshadow.com>

 

[David Wood]

I think you've hit the nail on the head. The 'feel' of a bike is what makes
it a pleasure to ride whether riding to work or on off-road tracks. A cheap
bike feels like a dead piece of machinery, the only comfort is how much
money you are saving (or are you really?).
Regarding brakes I thought I was being extravagant upgrading to disk brakes
but worth every penny, great power but real sensitivity and almost
maintenance free!! V-brakes were also a great improvement incredibly
simple-why didn't I think of it first? Aheadset - again a very simple
design - maybe one disadvantage that it's not as easy to adjust bar height.


"Pyromancer" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news[email protected]...
> Upon the miasma of midnight, a darkling spirit identified as Peter
> Clinch <[email protected]> gently breathed:
>>Ken Aston wrote:
>
>>> To come down to the point, assuming the same weight, the same type of
>>> tyres and amount of gears, why can I go faster with a high quality
>>> bike?
>
>>Not a smart set of assumption though. Some of the money goes on
>>lowering weight, so you can't reasonably assume it's the same weight.
>>Some of the money goes on better tyres, with lower rolling resistance.
>>It's not just the number of gears, it's the ratios, how well suited
>>they are to the riding in hand and how well they operate: you're not
>>going that fast if you've just thrown the chain on a big change.
>>
>>"High quality" means that the things you've assumed are the same
>>generally won't be. And that's part of how you can go faster.
>
> It's not just weight - my current, expensive bike is probably heavier
> than the cheap MTB it replaced, but the advantage is in the sheer
> quality of absolutely every part of the bike. It rolls like a dream,
> every gear change is faultless, the tyres hold air so well I only need
> to pump a little more in every other month, all the controls are
> *exactly* where my hands expect them to be, and the brakes feel like
> they'd happily stop a fully loaded freight train going downhill at 90+.
> Ok, slight exaggeration, but only slight! I've never had a bike before
> where I can be so confident it will stop where and when I want, every
> time, and without madly hanging on the levers and praying.
>
> In short, it's an absolute joy to ride. I'd certainly never willingly
> buy a cheap bike again, you really do get what you pay for.
>
> I look at the 79 quid full-suspension "mountain bikes" in ASDA (Walmart
> for leftpondians) and wonder just exactly how long one would last if I
> tried to commute on it. About a week, I suspect...
>
> --
> - DJ Pyromancer, The Sunday Goth Social, Leeds. <http://www.sheepish.net>
>
> Broadband, Dialup, Domains = <http://www.wytches.net> = The UK's Pagan
> ISP!
> <http://www.inkubus-sukkubus.co.uk>
> <http://www.revival.stormshadow.com>