"Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:in message <[email hidden]>, Paul
Murphy (') said:"Erik Sandblom" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Paul
Murphy p [email hidden] den 06-05-23 19.37:> If you want to make a like for like
> comparison based on price, this misses the point that electric bikes
> have additional functionality which needs to be paid forI'm suprised you're still saying this after we have discussed it so
much. You are conceding that an electric bike is heavier and more
expensive, but at the same time trying to deny that the same money
could be put toward a very light and efficient unpowered bike. The
extra functionality in the light unpowered bike is that it's so light
and efficient.But it still wont go up steep hills as effortlessly (the motor power
more than makes up for its added weight with lots to spare)Try it just once, on a really good road bike - one costing as much as
your electric assist - and then say that. You will be very surprised.
So which good quality electric bike (with a powerplant designed to transfer
its power through the geared drivetrain) have you tried this with?
Quoted message said:Quoted message said:Shall I use the example of central locking in cars then? You still get
advantages which aren't really "performance" related but which people
still go for in their droves for "other" reasons. Can we both agree
that there are things people pay for on cars, bikes, whatever which
aren't performance related.I think the real comparison is urban 4x4s. People buy them because they
think they're 'safer' than conventional cars (they aren't, on the
contrary, but people think they are), or because they think that they
may one day make journeys which would need the extra off-road capability
(but they never do). The 4x4s are more expensive, less nimble in
traffic, less fuel efficient, have more parts to service and maintain,
require more expensive tyres than conventional hatchbacks - the list of
disadvantages goes on and on. And yet people go on buying them. It's a
triumph of marketing over common sense.
I wouldn't make that comparison at all and feel THAT would be irrelevant.
Can we agree on my above point (I forgot a ? on the end)?
Quoted message said:Just like electric assist bikes, really.
Incorrect.
Quoted message said:Quoted message said:If you're saying that the power assistance
on electric bikes can solely be considered a performance issue, I
disagree, its also a convenience, flexibility and a style/image issue
(things which a similarly priced unpowered bike wont offer to the same
extent) in my situation flexibility is the main benefit.But you have less flexibility, not more. On longer rides, once the range
of the battery is exhausted, you have a substantially heavier and less
efficient vehicle. So you effectively can't do longer rides, or at least
you need another bike.
See my other posts re a spare battery (they are interchangeable after all).
As it happens I don't use my bike on long enough trips to generally run out
of juice and plan to avoid this. I have on a few occasions had this happen
(most recently on my first trip up the hills between Knighton and Presteigne
near the top the hill). On the very few occasions where the battery has died
on me, its simply a case of keeping going under my own power in a lower gear
at a slower speed until I can get to charge it, easy enough really). In the
above case I failed to plan for the extent of hills in that area.
Quoted message said:Same goes for hillier rides. Instead of a vehicle
you can lift with one finger,
You must have a very strong finger then. On the above example I had both my
panniers full with my weekend supplies/gear in touring mode, even on a racer
(if it was capable of holding all this) that would be quite a feat!
Quoted message said:you have something which is awkward or impossible to manhandle up a flight
of steps. So you can't easily take it on a journey involving a rail
connection, for > example, or take it indoors when visiting a friend's
flat. And so on.
You would be incorrect to assume the above isn't physically easy to do with
a quality electric bike. Technically electric bikes are currently restricted
from the trains I travel on - I've not heard of anyone with a modern bike
without lead acid batteries having this enforced but I wouldn't want to
encourage people to break the rules :-) Maybe those not capable of much
exertion such as some very old and frail people may have some difficulties
but they would likely do so with conventional bikes as well.
Quoted message said:As for 'style/image', I really am not going to comment.
Personally I like the style of my Giant Twist - its much nicer than the new
successor they're introducing and much nicer than many of the mountain bikes
in use on the roads. I've had many positive comments from people young and
old about its looks. There wont be many people who don't like the style of
the yellow dream previously referred to. There are well styled electric
bikes and some that aren't, so it does vary - just like conventional bikes.
Paul