another custom Wheel question

[alfeng]

Any significant difference between Ultegra and 105?

Are they just cosmetics? Or do the differences extend beyond skin deep ?

AFAIK, the cups are "diamond polished" on the Ultegra & Dura Ace hubs beginning with the so-called 9-speed hubs (i.e., 6500 & 7700) ...

Supposedly, a better bearing grade in the Ultegra & DA hubs than the 105/etc. hubs ...

The locking nuts on the Ultegra & DA is chrome plated vs. "painted" steel -- that's probably more an issue for a race mechanic since they would be slightly easier to clean ... for the average rider, they would be less likely to rust. Whether that is considered a cosmetic issue is up to the end user.

I don't think there is a difference in the alloy used in the hubshell, so THAT aspect is cosmetic.

Dura Ace hubs are available in various hole drillings. I don't know what the current status is with the Ultegra hubs. I think the 105-and-below are probably only available drilled for 32h & 36h wheels.

 

[alfeng]

Small points but Veloce/Mirage were the cart bearing, steel axled models. Record/Chorus/Centaur were the nice, oversized aluminum axled type that were made from 1999 thru 2006 but are no more(alas). Centaur hubs survived(same cart bearing as Veloce, steel axle) thru 2007 but are gone now as well.

THANKS for the correction ... the last MIRAGE hub I bought was probably made about a half dozen years ago ... and, I believe the parts could be used to rebuild an older Record hub that I have.

32h Record is the only hub Campagnolo is offering and I think that's a huge mistake considering the general poor design and construction of so many wheelsouttaboxes out there now.

FWIW. Yes, that is a curious decision on their part ...

Perhaps, not so much the lack of a 36h hub, but one would think that a 28h hub/-set would still be available as a special order.

Didn't Coppi have 28h wheels -- at least, on the front? How many sets of 28h hubs did Campagnolo sell in the 50s & 60s OR were they all special drillings?

 

[alfeng]

Yes. Cup and cone, 1/4 inch balls in the rear, 3/16 in the front. Well made, polished cones, very nice. Add grease and adjust well and they will last a long time. Also they retain the freehub body bolted onto the hub body design, not the 'free floating' freehub body of 7800 series or 7900.

FWIW. I think that it is the cups that are polished on the Utegra & DA hubs ... I don't recall actually noticing any difference in the cones.

shimano makes some great hubs, well made, servicable, inexpensive. For a gent that has shimano/sram stuff, my first choice for wheelbuilding.

I concur that Shimano makes great hubs ... it's one of the reason's that I 'love' Shimano.

 

[catlike]

For the kind of riding you are describing, there is probably nothing wrong with the wheels you have ...

While Shimano's Dura Ace & Ultegra hubs supposedly have better bearings + polished cups, the 105-and-below are pretty much the same EXCEPT for how carefully they are adjusted when the come out of the factory.

I will echo a suggestion you may have read elsewhere -- getting some lighter tubes + better tyres is a great way to improve your ride for a relatively small amount of money.

Well, the rims of my curent wreels are worn and cones and freehub body of rear wheel needs replacement (maybe it is servicable- i don't know). So i decide to make new wheels- ALEX DA16 rims can't be bought at my LBS anyway.

My LBS stores only MTB version of 340. After good thinks said about Shimano hubs i cant find reason not to go with Ultegra hubs (would go with 105 but those are not avilable in 28h version).

I allready have light (relative to wheels) tyres- Conti GP4000S.

What about rims? I am still unsure which one would be better for me- 20mm or 30mm profile. I can get Mavic (Open Pro or CXP33), or DT Swiss (rr1.1 or rr1.2). RR 1.2 looks heavy compared to CXP33 and are more expensive.
Any suggestions on rims choice?

 

[parawolf]

Well, the rims of my curent wreels are worn and cones and freehub body of rear wheel needs replacement (maybe it is servicable- i don't know). So i decide to make new wheels- ALEX DA16 rims can't be bought at my LBS anyway.

My LBS stores only MTB version of 340. After good thinks said about Shimano hubs i cant find reason not to go with Ultegra hubs (would go with 105 but those are not avilable in 28h version).

I allready have light (relative to wheels) tyres- Conti GP4000S.

What about rims? I am still unsure which one would be better for me- 20mm or 30mm profile. I can get Mavic (Open Pro or CXP33), or DT Swiss (rr1.1 or rr1.2). RR 1.2 looks heavy compared to CXP33 and are more expensive.
Any suggestions on rims choice?

Mavic Open Pro - ignore the Ceramic braking surface ones. Only the black is available in 28H.

 

[531Aussie]

Yes. Cup and cone, 1/4 inch balls in the rear, 3/16 in the front. Well made, polished cones, very nice. Add grease and adjust well and they will last a long time. Also they retain the freehub body bolted onto the hub body design, not the 'free floating' freehub body of 7800 series or 7900.

shimano makes some great hubs, well made, servicable, inexpensive. For a gent that has shimano/sram stuff, my first choice for wheelbuilding.

Thanks. Same axle diameter?

I've got plenty of old 8 and 9sp hubs that are still going fine

 

[Bob Ross]

The wheelbuilder where i am considering build wheels doesn't know nothink about Road wheels. He is building wheels for BMX, DH and some MTB. I give him service my curent wheels, he is doing fine job, but confessed that he does't have an idea what road rims/hubs should i consider.

Okay class, what's wrong with this picture?

 

[Meek One]

well i had a suspicions that DA would be overkill, but then again, a lot of people drive BMW ) And no, i am not made of money.
Thanks for advice about Ultegra. Seems like i have to slow down and decide between Ultegra and 105. Are there any main disantvatges of 105 against Ultegra?

C'mon, eBay Deutschland is your best friend. My German isn't perfect but I can get some nic eshit there. I got a BMW with low miles for next to nothing when I was over there. Stop being a 'gotta have new' guy and get some nice used stuff for half price. Most european LBSs are worse than US ones..., cool guys but obscene prices.

 

[Peter@vecchios]

Well, the rims of my curent wreels are worn and cones and freehub body of rear wheel needs replacement (maybe it is servicable- i don't know). So i decide to make new wheels- ALEX DA16 rims can't be bought at my LBS anyway.

My LBS stores only MTB version of 340. After good thinks said about Shimano hubs i cant find reason not to go with Ultegra hubs (would go with 105 but those are not avilable in 28h version).

I allready have light (relative to wheels) tyres- Conti GP4000S.

What about rims? I am still unsure which one would be better for me- 20mm or 30mm profile. I can get Mavic (Open Pro or CXP33), or DT Swiss (rr1.1 or rr1.2). RR 1.2 looks heavy compared to CXP33 and are more expensive.
Any suggestions on rims choice?

CXP-33 are far better rims than OpenPro rims. DT 1.1 are tremendous but 32h are the only double eyelet ones. You can get 28h but single eyelet. OK but you have to be carefiul to not exceed 100 kgf in tenson. 1.2 are great also but really heavy(almost 600 grams). Dt 1.1 in 32h or CXP-33 would be my choices. Here CXP-33 in black and DT are the same price.

 

[531Aussie]

DT 1.2 are great also but really heavy(almost 600 grams)..

Hey!! They're only 580 to 585! I've built 8 of them and weighed each one

 

[biker jk]

CXP-33 are far better rims than OpenPro rims. DT 1.1 are tremendous but 32h are the only double eyelet ones. You can get 28h but single eyelet. OK but you have to be carefiul to not exceed 100 kgf in tenson. 1.2 are great also but really heavy(almost 600 grams). Dt 1.1 in 32h or CXP-33 would be my choices. Here CXP-33 in black and DT are the same price.

Hi Peter. Could you explain why the CXP-33 is a better rim than the OpenPro? Isn't the CXP-33 single eyelet versus double for the OpenPro?

 

[alienator]

Hi Peter. Could you explain why the CXP-33 is a better rim than the OpenPro? Isn't the CXP-33 single eyelet versus double for the OpenPro?

Eyelets aren't necessarily a sign of quality. There a tons of rims that don't use eyelets. Velocity makes damned fine rims, and they've got no eyelets. Kinlin doesn't. Some designs don't allow the option of eyelets.

 

[biker jk]

Eyelets aren't necessarily a sign of quality. There a tons of rims that don't use eyelets. Velocity makes damned fine rims, and they've got no eyelets. Kinlin doesn't. Some designs don't allow the option of eyelets.

Thanks but I'd still like to know why Peter prefers the CXP-33 to the OpenPro.

 

[531Aussie]

anecdote: of the 30 to 35 rims I've owned over the last 20+ years, a CXP33 is the only one I've cracked through normal use.

 

[Peter@vecchios]

Hi Peter. Could you explain why the CXP-33 is a better rim than the OpenPro? Isn't the CXP-33 single eyelet versus double for the OpenPro?

Cracking/pulling out eyelets on OpenPro plus the seemingly impossible task for mavic to fix the noisy wedge issue. CXP-33 weigh the same as OpenPro, have a really nice design of the 'eyelets'(essentially inserts for the 'aero' shape rim). Have none of the problems of OpenPros, are stronger by the triangular shaped design, cost about the same...what's not to like?

 

[catlike]

C'mon, eBay Deutschland is your best friend. My German isn't perfect but I can get some nic eshit there. I got a BMW with low miles for next to nothing when I was over there. Stop being a 'gotta have new' guy and get some nice used stuff for half price. Most european LBSs are worse than US ones..., cool guys but obscene prices.

I have to check latest offerings, but a year ago i had an impresion that for some reason German sellers do afraid Paypal more than Soviet Army. And shipping costs were weired. Maybe (hope) the things has changed.

 

[Tonto]

Hi,
I've been procrastinating for some time about a new set of handbuilts. Originally I had decided on a set of DT Swiss R1.1's with Record hubs, but a growing sense of unease about my job security forced a rethink in the name of financial expediency.
So, I've ordered a pair of Ambrosio Excellight rims with Ambrosio hubs, 32H, ACI spokes, 2x on the front, 3x on the rear.
I'd have preferred the Record hubs but couldn't justify the extra 130euro when the Ambrosio hubs have an excellent reputation and were strongly recommended by the wheelbuilder.
Anyway, I just thought I'd share that while I wait impatiently for the wheelbuilder to work his magic.

All the best
Tonto

 

[Ainsie]

I was originally going for some DT 1.1's 28h rims with 240 hubs.

As Peter has advised they only make single eyelet versions in 28h. Could have got some white 28h 1.1's in double eyelet but wanted the black wheels.

Now doing a total about face and getting some Kinlin XR-300's laced to 240's 20F/24R radial front.

The Kinlins seem to be a popular build and as am only 135-140lbs low spoke count won't be an issue.

Would like to hear Peter's experience and opinion of these rims.

Also any opinions on the Edge 46mm clincher rims?

 

[Peter@vecchios]

anecdote: of the 30 to 35 rims I've owned over the last 20+ years, a CXP33 is the only one I've cracked through normal use.

Another...of the perhaps 700-800 OpenPros and CXP-33s I have built(along with lots of Velocity, DT, some Sun a few Alex) in the last few years, the only rim that consistently pulls eyelets out is the OpenPro...not trying to argue with the OP or anything like that but I think mavic has a production 'issue'...along with their annoying click at the seam.

 

[Peter@vecchios]

I was originally going for some DT 1.1's 28h rims with 240 hubs.

As Peter has advised they only make single eyelet versions in 28h. Could have got some white 28h 1.1's in double eyelet but wanted the black wheels.

Now doing a total about face and getting some Kinlin XR-300's laced to 240's 20F/24R radial front.

The Kinlins seem to be a popular build and as am only 135-140lbs low spoke count won't be an issue.

Would like to hear Peter's experience and opinion of these rims.

Also any opinions on the Edge 46mm clincher rims?

Kinlin are not available thru any distributor so I have never built with them.

Good hubs and hopefully the build is a good one. For you at 140 pounds, they should be a nice set of wheels.