booze again

Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave you
the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
Laureen

DisplayName said:

I sure drink a lot.

Quoted message said:

difficulty w/cals
Jimmy
280/265/180

He lost 8 pounds in a month, doesn't look like a problem to me.

In news:[email hidden],
Laureen <[email hidden]> stated
| Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave you
| the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
| there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
| Laureen
|
|
|
| DisplayName wrote:
|| I sure drink a lot.
|
|| difficulty w/cals
|| Jimmy
|| 280/265/180

We both know 8 pounds could have been gone the first week with eating
right. Pure meats and veggies and no booze. He admits he sure drinks a
lot. Excessive alcohol is counter productive. Weighing as much as he
does he should have and could have dumped way more if he hadnt imbibed
so much on the brew. His calories are coming from alcohol. I could eat
salad and drink wine and lose weight but how good would that be for me?
Laureen

FOB said:

He lost 8 pounds in a month, doesn't look like a problem to me.

In news:[email hidden],
Laureen <[email hidden]> stated
| Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave you
| the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
| there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
| Laureen
|
|
|
| DisplayName wrote:
|| I sure drink a lot.
|
|| difficulty w/cals
|| Jimmy
|| 280/265/180

If it's a WOE that he can maintain forever and works for him that's better
than trying a more restrictive approach and falling off the wagon.

In news:[email hidden],
Laureen <[email hidden]> stated
| We both know 8 pounds could have been gone the first week with eating
| right. Pure meats and veggies and no booze. He admits he sure drinks a
| lot. Excessive alcohol is counter productive. Weighing as much as he
| does he should have and could have dumped way more if he hadnt imbibed
| so much on the brew. His calories are coming from alcohol. I could eat
| salad and drink wine and lose weight but how good would that be for
| me? Laureen
|
|
|
|

"Laureen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave you
the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
Laureen

What seems easy to some, may be difficult for others. Don't you agree?

Quoted message said:

DisplayName said:

I sure drink a lot.

Quoted message said:

difficulty w/cals
Jimmy
280/265/180

How the hell do you eat/drink 2400 calories a day? I barely make 1500. Most
days are 1100-1200 range.

"Laureen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

We both know 8 pounds could have been gone the first week with eating
right. Pure meats and veggies and no booze. He admits he sure drinks a
lot. Excessive alcohol is counter productive. Weighing as much as he
does he should have and could have dumped way more if he hadnt imbibed
so much on the brew. His calories are coming from alcohol. I could eat
salad and drink wine and lose weight but how good would that be for me?
Laureen

FOB said:

He lost 8 pounds in a month, doesn't look like a problem to me.

In news:[email hidden],
Laureen <[email hidden]> stated
| Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave you
| the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
| there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
| Laureen
|
|
|
| DisplayName wrote:
|| I sure drink a lot.
|
|| difficulty w/cals
|| Jimmy
|| 280/265/180

I burn most of it lately with a shovel. I have replace 65 feet of sewer pipe
that required a two foot deep trench. I have also been preparing beds for
vegetable gardens by digging up rows in the yard one spade deep to loosen
the soil and get rid of the weeds. I also discovered I could raise the desk
work surface at my job, and I stand up much of the shift. This has really
made a big positive difference for leg circulation and lower back strain. In
short, drunk <OFF> my ass I burn 2400 cals😉

Is it inactivity that limits you to lower intake? I know employment or
disabilities can really govern activity. Are you able to increase your
activity level? I really don't think I could limit myself that low for more
than a day or two. Good luck to you.
Jimmy

<[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

How the hell do you eat/drink 2400 calories a day? I barely make 1500.

Most

Quoted message said:

days are 1100-1200 range.

"Laureen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

We both know 8 pounds could have been gone the first week with eating
right. Pure meats and veggies and no booze. He admits he sure drinks a
lot. Excessive alcohol is counter productive. Weighing as much as he
does he should have and could have dumped way more if he hadnt imbibed
so much on the brew. His calories are coming from alcohol. I could eat
salad and drink wine and lose weight but how good would that be for me?
Laureen

FOB said:

He lost 8 pounds in a month, doesn't look like a problem to me.

In news:[email hidden],
Laureen <[email hidden]> stated
| Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

| the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
| there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
| Laureen
|
|
|
| DisplayName wrote:
|| I sure drink a lot.
|
|| difficulty w/cals
|| Jimmy
|| 280/265/180

FOB said:

He lost 8 pounds in a month, doesn't look like a problem to me.

Excessive alcohol intake in a low carb diet isn't advantageous to the
dieter. This study gives a synopsis as to why:
http://tinyurl.com/nyntz
J Clin Invest. 1988 April; 81(4): 1137-1145.

Ethanol causes acute inhibition of carbohydrate, fat, and protein
oxidation and insulin resistance.

J J Shelmet, G A Reichard, C L Skutches, R D Hoeldtke, O E Owen, and G
Boden
Department of Medicine, Temple University Hospital, Philadelphia,
Pennsylvania 19140.
To study the mechanism of the diabetogenic action of ethanol, ethanol
(0.75 g/kg over 30 min) and then glucose (0.5 g/kg over 5 min) were
infused intravenously into six normal males. During the 4-h study, 21.8
+/- 2.1 g of ethanol was metabolized and oxidized to CO2 and H2O.
Ethanol decreased total body fat oxidation by 79% and protein oxidation
by 39%, and almost completely abolished the 249% rise in carbohydrate
(CHO) oxidation seen in controls after glucose infusion. Ethanol
decreased the basal rate of glucose appearance (GRa) by 30% and the
basal rate of glucose disappearance (GRd) by 38%, potentiated
glucose-stimulated insulin release by 54%, and had no effect on glucose
tolerance. In hyperinsulinemic-euglycemic clamp studies, ethanol caused
a 36% decrease in glucose disposal. We conclude that ethanol was a
preferred fuel preventing fat, and to lesser degrees, CHO and protein,
from being oxidized. It also caused acute insulin resistance which was
compensated for by hypersecretion of insulin.

In brief, your body has to drop pretty much everything else it's doing
to deal with the alcohol. Your pancreas works overtime shoveling out
insulin and you don't burn fat. At 7 calories per gram, alcohol
qualifies as "empty calories", since it isn't in something that has
vitamins and minerals and protein and healthy fats in any significant
quantity accompanying it.

Carmen

Quoted message said:

In news:[email hidden],
Laureen <[email hidden]> stated
| Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave you
| the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
| there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
| Laureen
|
|
|
| DisplayName wrote:
|| I sure drink a lot.
|
|| difficulty w/cals
|| Jimmy
|| 280/265/180

"Tom G" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:N%qhg.251183$WI1.229896@pd7tw2no...

Quoted message said:

"Laureen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave you
the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
Laureen

What seems easy to some, may be difficult for others. Don't you agree?

Laureen had to get her guts cut out to keep from shoveling so much grub in,
so she's not exactly the poster child for moderation.

Carmen said:

FOB said:

He lost 8 pounds in a month, doesn't look like a problem to me.

Excessive alcohol intake in a low carb diet isn't advantageous to the
dieter.

<snip>

I've been waiting for the overt disadvantages to kick in, myself.

260/200/200
4.27.05

Laureen said:

We both know 8 pounds could have been gone the first week with eating
right. Pure meats and veggies and no booze. He admits he sure drinks a
lot. Excessive alcohol is counter productive. Weighing as much as he
does he should have and could have dumped way more if he hadnt imbibed
so much on the brew. His calories are coming from alcohol. I could eat
salad and drink wine and lose weight but how good would that be for me?

So what if he likes to drink? So what if he could lose faster? If
he's content with his loss and his diet, I don't see why you need to
follow him around and [censored] about his drinking.

I'm from a family of alcoholics and drug addicts. The only time anyone
in my family has ever been skinny is when they were on crack. I have
major *issues* around alcohol and drug use and generally don't hang out
with people who use much. That's my choice.

That being said, I don't see why when he posts about his weight loss on
a low-carb newsgroup, we should give him [censored]. It's his life and his
choice. Lots of folks drink and not all of them have a "problem" with
it. And even if he has a "problem," so what? His choice.

I just don't see why he's got to put up with you giving him [censored] every
time he posts, just cause you don't agree with how he's doing it. I
don't agree with how you did it, but I've never felt the need to
follow-up all your posts telling you so. You're happy with your
choices, so who I am to [censored] at you for them being different than my
choices?

Jeez... give the guy a break, he's not saying *you* should drink.

doodah said:

"Tom G" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:N%qhg.251183$WI1.229896@pd7tw2no...

Quoted message said:

"Laureen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave you
the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
Laureen

What seems easy to some, may be difficult for others. Don't you agree?

Laureen had to get her guts cut out to keep from shoveling so much grub in,
so she's not exactly the poster child for moderation.

Barbara why are you so [censored] to Laureen about her WLS decision? It
was her money and her decision. If you thought your happy ass was
anonymous behind that nym you were clearly mistaken my dear. Almost
nobody's life is capable of standing up to close scrutiny, and yours
isn't when it comes to being a "poster child for moderation" either.

Carmen <----- Look Barb, no nym!

Dr. Ernst Primer (again) said:

Carmen said:

FOB said:

He lost 8 pounds in a month, doesn't look like a problem to me.

Excessive alcohol intake in a low carb diet isn't advantageous to the
dieter.

<snip>

I've been waiting for the overt disadvantages to kick in, myself.

260/200/200
4.27.05

You could be a skinny fat person, meaning you have the appearance of a
person of normal weight, but have a higher than healthy percentage of
body fat. Or you could be a freak. <G>

Carmen

There's a difference between saying it isn't advantageous (which he has
heard here before) and telling him he has a problem.

In news:[email hidden],
Carmen <[email hidden]> stated
| FOB wrote:
|| He lost 8 pounds in a month, doesn't look like a problem to me.
|
| Excessive alcohol intake in a low carb diet isn't advantageous to the
| dieter. This study gives a synopsis as to why:
| http://tinyurl.com/nyntz
| J Clin Invest. 1988 April; 81(4): 1137-1145.
|
| Ethanol causes acute inhibition of carbohydrate, fat, and protein
| oxidation and insulin resistance.
|
| J J Shelmet, G A Reichard, C L Skutches, R D Hoeldtke, O E Owen, and G
| Boden
| Department of Medicine, Temple University Hospital, Philadelphia,
| Pennsylvania 19140.
| To study the mechanism of the diabetogenic action of ethanol, ethanol
| (0.75 g/kg over 30 min) and then glucose (0.5 g/kg over 5 min) were
| infused intravenously into six normal males. During the 4-h study,
| 21.8 +/- 2.1 g of ethanol was metabolized and oxidized to CO2 and H2O.
| Ethanol decreased total body fat oxidation by 79% and protein
| oxidation by 39%, and almost completely abolished the 249% rise in
| carbohydrate (CHO) oxidation seen in controls after glucose infusion.
| Ethanol decreased the basal rate of glucose appearance (GRa) by 30%
| and the basal rate of glucose disappearance (GRd) by 38%, potentiated
| glucose-stimulated insulin release by 54%, and had no effect on
| glucose tolerance. In hyperinsulinemic-euglycemic clamp studies,
| ethanol caused a 36% decrease in glucose disposal. We conclude that
| ethanol was a preferred fuel preventing fat, and to lesser degrees,
| CHO and protein, from being oxidized. It also caused acute insulin
| resistance which was compensated for by hypersecretion of insulin.
|
| In brief, your body has to drop pretty much everything else it's doing
| to deal with the alcohol. Your pancreas works overtime shoveling out
| insulin and you don't burn fat. At 7 calories per gram, alcohol
| qualifies as "empty calories", since it isn't in something that has
| vitamins and minerals and protein and healthy fats in any significant
| quantity accompanying it.
|
| Carmen

Or he could have different standards than you.

In news:[email hidden],
Carmen <[email hidden]> stated

| You could be a skinny fat person, meaning you have the appearance of a
| person of normal weight, but have a higher than healthy percentage of
| body fat. Or you could be a freak. <G>
|
| Carmen

Applause!!!

In news:[email hidden],
[email hidden] <[email hidden]> stated

| So what if he likes to drink? So what if he could lose faster? If
| he's content with his loss and his diet, I don't see why you need to
| follow him around and [censored] about his drinking.
|
| I'm from a family of alcoholics and drug addicts. The only time
| anyone in my family has ever been skinny is when they were on crack.
| I have major *issues* around alcohol and drug use and generally don't
| hang out with people who use much. That's my choice.
|
| That being said, I don't see why when he posts about his weight loss
| on a low-carb newsgroup, we should give him [censored]. It's his life and
| his choice. Lots of folks drink and not all of them have a "problem"
| with it. And even if he has a "problem," so what? His choice.
|
| I just don't see why he's got to put up with you giving him [censored] every
| time he posts, just cause you don't agree with how he's doing it. I
| don't agree with how you did it, but I've never felt the need to
| follow-up all your posts telling you so. You're happy with your
| choices, so who I am to [censored] at you for them being different than my
| choices?
|
| Jeez... give the guy a break, he's not saying *you* should drink.

Not everyone has the same degree of appetite suppression.

In news:[email hidden],
[email hidden] <[email hidden]> stated
| How the hell do you eat/drink 2400 calories a day? I barely make
| 1500. Most days are 1100-1200 range.
|

"Carmen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

doodah said:

"Tom G" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:N%qhg.251183$WI1.229896@pd7tw2no...

Quoted message said:

"Laureen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> Ya think? Why do you even bother posting this [censored] anymore? I gave

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> the benefit of the doubt last post but it's plain and simple now...
> there is a problem, you have a problem. ANy idea what it is????
> Laureen

What seems easy to some, may be difficult for others. Don't you

agree?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Laureen had to get her guts cut out to keep from shoveling so much grub

in,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

so she's not exactly the poster child for moderation.

Barbara why are you so [censored] to Laureen about her WLS decision? It
was her money and her decision. If you thought your happy ass was
anonymous behind that nym you were clearly mistaken my dear. Almost
nobody's life is capable of standing up to close scrutiny, and yours
isn't when it comes to being a "poster child for moderation" either.

Carmen <----- Look Barb, no nym!

Settle down Inspector Gadget.

FOB said:

Or he could have different standards than you.

In news:[email hidden],
Carmen <[email hidden]> stated

| You could be a skinny fat person, meaning you have the appearance of a
| person of normal weight, but have a higher than healthy percentage of
| body fat. Or you could be a freak. <G>

He's reached his goal weight, and his post broadly hints that he's done
so using alcohol, and in the context of this discussion it would have
to be somewhat liberally to be meaningful. Based on his being at goal
weight, and the fact that the body must first attend to the disposition
of alcohol before it can do anything else (like burn body fat) the
ketones that he ran on (which eventually came from the alcohol after it
was converted to acetate and some other stuff happened to it) provided
fuel that his body fat could have been providing. Without being burned
the body fat isn't going to go anywhere. It's going to constitute a
disproportionately larger percentage of the smaller goal weight than if
there had not been alcohol fuel to interfere in the process of weight
loss.
Now, with that all laid out do you see how his standards do not enter
into the equation?
A "healthy percentage of body fat" is determined by correlation with
the incidence of diseases and disorders associated with it in a studied
population. My quip about him possibly being "a freak" was just that,
a quip, meant to denote the possibility that all the normal rules of
metabolism do not apply to him. Normally I put a "NOTE TO THE HUMOR
IMPAIRED" disclaimer on such things. I forgot this time. Please
forgive me.

Carmen