"Der Jan ist zurück"

[Robert Chung]

TritonRider wrote:
>
> I was more shocked by Zabel's ride than Jan's. 51st @ 2.39 back. He
> hasn't been tearing things up but this is more of a drop off than I
> expected. I'd guess that this may be the last year for him.

His results in the TT stages of the 2003 TdF:
112th, 149th, 89th

His results in the TT stages of the 2002 TdF:
43rd, 144th, 96th

 

[TritonRider]

>From: "Steven L. Sheffield" [email protected]

>Why should a sprinter give it his all in a long-ish time trial, when he can
>save his legs for the sprints in the following days?
>
>
>--
>Steven L. Sheffield

If that's what he's doing that's cool but he has shown that he could compete
for GC in some of the smaller stage races. I can't find detailed results
quickly, and I'm not up for researching through German sites this morning. Just
seems to me that he's down a lot this year.
Bill C

 

[Richard Adams]

[email protected] (TritonRider) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> >From: "Steven L. Sheffield" [email protected]
>
> >Why should a sprinter give it his all in a long-ish time trial, when he can
> >save his legs for the sprints in the following days?
> >
> >
> >--
> >Steven L. Sheffield
>
> If that's what he's doing that's cool but he has shown that he could compete
> for GC in some of the smaller stage races. I can't find detailed results
> quickly, and I'm not up for researching through German sites this morning. Just
> seems to me that he's down a lot this year.
> Bill C

I wonder if T-mobile will put him in the TdF this year or just go 100% Ullrich.

 

[Sonarrat]

in article [email protected], Richard Adams at
[email protected] wrote on 6/1/04 1:08 PM:

> I wonder if T-mobile will put [Zabel] in the TdF this year or just go 100%
> Ullrich.

It might be useful to refer to history here.

2001 Tour team:

11 Jan Ullrich (Ger)
12 Udo Bölts (Ger)
13 Giuseppe Guerini (Ita)
14 Jens Heppner (Ger)
15 Andreas Klöden (Ger)
16 Kevin Livingston (USA)
17 Alexandre Vinokourov (Kaz)
18 Steffen Wesemann (Ger)
19 Erik Zabel (Ger)

2000 Tour:

61 Jan Ullrich (Ger)
62 Udo Bolts (Ger)
63 Alberto Elli (Ita)
64 Gian Matteo Fagnini (Ita)
65 Giuseppe Guerini (Ita)
66 Jens Heppner (Ger)
67 Alexandre Vinokourov (Kaz)
68 Steffen Wesemann (Ger)
69 Erik Zabel (Ger)

1999 Vuelta:

41 Jan Ullrich (Ger)
42 Rolf Aldag (Ger)
43 Dirk Baldinger (Ger)
44 Ralf Grabsch (Ger)
45 Giuseppe Guerini (Ita)
46 Jörg Jaksche  (Ger)
47 Danilo Hondo (Ger)
48 Andreas Klöden (Ger)
49 Giovanni Lombardi (Ita)

1998 Tour:

1. Jan Ullrich (Ger)
2. Rolf Aldag (Ger)
3. Udo Bölts (Ger)
4. Francesco Frattini (Ita)
5. Christian Henn (Ger)
6. Jens Heppner (Ger)
7. Bjarne Riis (Den)
8. Georg Totschnig (Aut)
9. Erik Zabel (Ger)

1997 Tour:

1. Bjarne Riis (Den)
2. Rolf Aldag (Ger)
3. Udo Bolts (Ger)
4. Christian Henn (Ger)
5. Jens Heppner (Ger)
6. Giovanni Lombardi (Ita)
7. Georg Totschnig (Aut)
8. Jan Ullrich (Ger)
9. Erik Zabel (Ger)

It's not too hard, then, to divine a possible 2004 Tour team:

11. Jan Ullrich (Ger)
12. Alexandre Vinokourov (Kaz)
13. Andreas Klöden (Ger)
14. Rolf Aldag (Ger)
15. Cadel Evans (Aus)
16. Daniele Nardello (Ita)
17. Giuseppe Guerini (Ita)
18. Torsten Hiekmann (Ger)
19. Erik Zabel (Ger)

-I- would choose to leave Santiago Botero out, in other words, and instead
designate him as the team leader for the Vuelta a España, with currently
injured Paolo Savoldelli as a super-lieutenant. Botero would also then be
fresh for the World's in Verona where he could try to repeat his 2002 win in
the ITT, rather than being destroyed by a brutally difficult TdF as he was
last year.

-Sonarrat.

 

[Howard Kveck]

In article <[email protected]>,
"Jeff Jones" <jeff@cyclingnews-punt-com> wrote:

> "Howard Kveck" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > And based on the results he showed in this race, there's most certainly
> > a motor in the back of Jan's Honda...
>
> I thought he drove a Porsche?
>
> [lame I know]

"Hey, try the veal! I'll be here alllll week!!!"

--
tanx,
Howard

"Copper will never be gold"
Shellac

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

 

[Tom Kunich]

"TritonRider" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >From: "Robert Chung" [email protected]
>
> >Rich appears to have had a nearly incredible ride. Big time gaps for the
> >first day. Vinokourov in 10th, +77 to Rich and +52 to Ullrich.
>
> I was more shocked by Zabel's ride than Jan's. 51st @ 2.39 back. He
hasn't
> been tearing things up but this is more of a drop off than I expected. I'd
> guess that this may be the last year for him.

And some donut eater here will make the comment that he should have quit at
the top of his game so that he could have lost a couple of million dollars
and impress the hell out of idiots.

 

[Richard Adams]

Sonarrat wrote:
> in article [email protected], Richard Adams at
> [email protected] wrote on 6/1/04 1:08 PM:
>
>
>>I wonder if T-mobile will put [Zabel] in the TdF this year or just go 100%
>>Ullrich.
>
>
> It might be useful to refer to history here.
>
> 2001 Tour team:
>
> 11 Jan Ullrich (Ger)
> 12 Udo Bölts (Ger)
> 13 Giuseppe Guerini (Ita)
> 14 Jens Heppner (Ger)
> 15 Andreas Klöden (Ger)
> 16 Kevin Livingston (USA)
> 17 Alexandre Vinokourov (Kaz)
> 18 Steffen Wesemann (Ger)
> 19 Erik Zabel (Ger)
>
> 2000 Tour:
>
> 61 Jan Ullrich (Ger)
> 62 Udo Bolts (Ger)
> 63 Alberto Elli (Ita)
> 64 Gian Matteo Fagnini (Ita)
> 65 Giuseppe Guerini (Ita)
> 66 Jens Heppner (Ger)
> 67 Alexandre Vinokourov (Kaz)
> 68 Steffen Wesemann (Ger)
> 69 Erik Zabel (Ger)
>
> 1999 Vuelta:
>
> 41 Jan Ullrich (Ger)
> 42 Rolf Aldag (Ger)
> 43 Dirk Baldinger (Ger)
> 44 Ralf Grabsch (Ger)
> 45 Giuseppe Guerini (Ita)
> 46 Jörg Jaksche (Ger)
> 47 Danilo Hondo (Ger)
> 48 Andreas Klöden (Ger)
> 49 Giovanni Lombardi (Ita)
>
> 1998 Tour:
>
> 1. Jan Ullrich (Ger)
> 2. Rolf Aldag (Ger)
> 3. Udo Bölts (Ger)
> 4. Francesco Frattini (Ita)
> 5. Christian Henn (Ger)
> 6. Jens Heppner (Ger)
> 7. Bjarne Riis (Den)
> 8. Georg Totschnig (Aut)
> 9. Erik Zabel (Ger)
>
> 1997 Tour:
>
> 1. Bjarne Riis (Den)
> 2. Rolf Aldag (Ger)
> 3. Udo Bolts (Ger)
> 4. Christian Henn (Ger)
> 5. Jens Heppner (Ger)
> 6. Giovanni Lombardi (Ita)
> 7. Georg Totschnig (Aut)
> 8. Jan Ullrich (Ger)
> 9. Erik Zabel (Ger)
>
> It's not too hard, then, to divine a possible 2004 Tour team:
>
> 11. Jan Ullrich (Ger)
> 12. Alexandre Vinokourov (Kaz)
> 13. Andreas Klöden (Ger)
> 14. Rolf Aldag (Ger)
> 15. Cadel Evans (Aus)
> 16. Daniele Nardello (Ita)
> 17. Giuseppe Guerini (Ita)
> 18. Torsten Hiekmann (Ger)
> 19. Erik Zabel (Ger)
>
> -I- would choose to leave Santiago Botero out, in other words, and instead
> designate him as the team leader for the Vuelta a España, with currently
> injured Paolo Savoldelli as a super-lieutenant. Botero would also then be
> fresh for the World's in Verona where he could try to repeat his 2002 win in
> the ITT, rather than being destroyed by a brutally difficult TdF as he was
> last year.
>
> -Sonarrat.
>

The point I tried to make (apparently not well enough) was Zabel was the
team leader for 2003 and shot blanks. Think it's wise to include him if
he can't even manage one stage win at the cost of protecting him and
trying to set him up rather than stack the team to support Jan 100% ?

 

[TritonRider]

>From: Richard Adams [email protected]
>Date: 6/2/2004 12:53 AM Eas

>The point I tried to make (apparently not well enough) was Zabel was the
>team leader for 2003 and shot blanks. Think it's wise to include him if
>he can't even manage one stage win at the cost of protecting him and
>trying to set him up rather than stack the team to support Jan 100% ?
>
I agree. If Telekom has any hope of unseating Lance, and Jan's latest showing
at least points that way, they need to focus completely on supporting Jan.
If Erik is willing he could be the best domestique that Germany has every had
in a Jan win. IMHO Udo Bolts is what 90% of the pro peloton should be. He
worked his ass off for his teamates, led them to a lot of wins, and grabbed
races where he could. It'd be great if Zabel at the end of his career could
drag Jan everywhere but the serious climbs in a win.
Bill C

 

[Sonarrat]

in article [email protected], Richard Adams at
[email protected] wrote on 6/1/04 9:53 PM:

> The point I tried to make (apparently not well enough) was Zabel was the
> team leader for 2003 and shot blanks. Think it's wise to include him if
> he can't even manage one stage win at the cost of protecting him and
> trying to set him up rather than stack the team to support Jan 100% ?

It's true that Zabel couldn't get much done last year, but that was partly
because his team wasn't powerful enough last year to chase everyone down.
More than once he won the bunch sprint behind a breakaway. He is still
strong enough to win stages, and at any rate, it would be a crime to leave
him out with the wonderful personality he contributes.

It is certainly not unheard of for a sprinter to win stages in the same team
colors as the GT champ, even if it has been a bit rare lately. A team with
the star-power of a Festina or a Mapei can do it, and T-Mobile certainly has
the star-power of a Festina or a Mapei.

-Sonarrat.

 

[Bob Schwartz]

TritonRider <[email protected]> wrote:
> IMHO Udo Bolts is what 90% of the pro peloton should be. He
> worked his ass off for his teamates, led them to a lot of wins, and grabbed
> races where he could.

http://groups.google.com/groups?&[email protected]

+++
Today, Boelts did it alone. It wasn't only physical help, but also
psychological assistance. On their way back to Virenque and Pantani,
Boelts yelled at Ullrich to "get your act together, you pig."
+++

I love that. 'Psychological assistance'.

One cool thing about TTs in the Tour is the fan reaction as the riders
go by one at a time. Udo's popularity was very evident.

Bob Schwartz
[email protected]

 

[gym gravity]

TritonRider wrote:

>>From: Richard Adams [email protected]
>>Date: 6/2/2004 12:53 AM Eas
>
>
>>The point I tried to make (apparently not well enough) was Zabel was the
>>team leader for 2003 and shot blanks. Think it's wise to include him if
>>he can't even manage one stage win at the cost of protecting him and
>>trying to set him up rather than stack the team to support Jan 100% ?
>>
>
> I agree. If Telekom has any hope of unseating Lance, and Jan's latest showing
> at least points that way, they need to focus completely on supporting Jan.
> If Erik is willing he could be the best domestique that Germany has every had
> in a Jan win. IMHO Udo Bolts is what 90% of the pro peloton should be. He
> worked his ass off for his teamates, led them to a lot of wins, and grabbed
> races where he could. It'd be great if Zabel at the end of his career could
> drag Jan everywhere but the serious climbs in a win.
> Bill C
kind of like Ekimov.