Garmin Vector Press release



swampy1970

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Feb 3, 2008
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Originally Posted by alienator .

Who knows, maybe Steve Hogg will be able to use R/L power reading to validate his "theory" about the scourge that charity bands are.
Those and Oakley sunglasses ;)

But you don't need to have a PM that shows left/right power for that. If you're that much out of whack then power in general will suffer.
 

alienator

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Jun 10, 2004
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Originally Posted by swampy1970 .




Those and Oakley sunglasses ;)

But you don't need to have a PM that shows left/right power for that. If you're that much out of whack then power in general will suffer.

Well, no one needs to have a power meter for any training. A power meter w/ R/L readings can potentially help by more specifically identifying the source/a source of the problem. Such a power meter does put the imbalance in terms that may be more relevant to a cyclist.
 

Alex Simmons

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Mar 12, 2006
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Originally Posted by alienator .

Well, no one needs to have a power meter for any training. A power meter w/ R/L readings can potentially help by more specifically identifying the source/a source of the problem. Such a power meter does put the imbalance in terms that may be more relevant to a cyclist.
Well I already know I likely have a sizeable L-R difference, I just don't know the magnitude, nor whether there's any point worrying about it. But sure, it would be interesting to know, track and perhaps see if any changes I make have an overall positive impact.
 

Koolstof

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Oct 19, 2011
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I really like the idea of pedal based power meters, you can use any wheel you like and still have power, and the opportunity to measure individual pedal forces is a bonus. Oh, and surely it'll be lighter than say PowerTap and SRM etc.

That said, it does mean that you can only have power on one bike at a time, so its the same as any crank based system out there, plus I would say that the Garmin system looks a little... rustic, and Polar is not ANT+ compatible. From my observations, the Polar system is a lot more 'polished' than Garmins, and although ANT+ is important to many, I personally would be happy sticking to Polars head unit and GPS solutions. I was also very dissapointed with the price tags for both systems however, I hoped a cheaper RRP would help drive power costs down across the board, but it seems both Ploar and Garmin have gone for the middle ground between PowerTap and SRM.

Personally speaking, here at Koolstof we have just gotten hold of the 2012 PowerTap systems and I have to say that I am pretty impressed. Although real world riding will need to back it up, it appears they have addressed a number of previous challenges around weight and performance at the top end, and serviceability, durability and costs at the entry level.

We put together a bit of an article looking at the 2012 PowerTap developments http://www.koolstof.co.uk/index.php?route=information/news&news_id=7 which goes into a bit more detail.

I am looking forward to getting hold of a Garmin system and will let you know.
 

Alex Simmons

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Mar 12, 2006
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I use Campag Profit pedals and am not changing any time soon.

Neither pedal unit permits user to validate calibration, aside from running in unison with another calibrated power meter.
 

alienator

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Jun 10, 2004
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Originally Posted by Alex Simmons .

I use Campag Profit pedals and am not changing any time soon.

Neither pedal unit permits user to validate calibration, aside from running in unison with another calibrated power meter.
It may not be necessary for the user to calibrate these given that at least one set uses piezoelectric strain gauges. Piezoelectrics have a really high modulus of elasticity compared to aluminum foil strain gauges, meaning that for a given stress, the strain (whether elongation or compression) is very small. It's also known that piezoelectrics have exceedingly long fatigue lives, so long that it's not clear how long that life is. It will be dependent of course on the particular make-up of a given piezoelectric component, which is proprietary in more than a few cases.

I have done calibration work on a piezoelectric optical linear encoder (a device that measures displacement) that had a resolution of 12 picometers (roughly 1/10 the diameter of a Hydrogen atom), but the calibration was necessary as part of the scientific process of validating a new measurement technique. The user can certainly calibrate measurements with the pedal based systems. Any measurement system can be calibrated. Maybe the companies don't provide a step-by-step process for doing it, but it won't take much creativity to come up with one. In fact, right off the bat I can think of several ways of doing that.

Given the stability of piezoelectrics, it's reasonable to assume that any drift in measurement be small. That is the nature of piezoelectrics and one of the big reasons why they're becoming so popular in not only industry for precise and accurate measurement applications, but also in science. With that said, given their new emergence in cycling and healthy skepticism ( a good thing), it's not surprising at all for people to wonder about the calibration aspect, as well as other aspects. Using other power measurement systems is certainly one way to calibrate, and someone or maybe more than someone will offer that service.

Since companies, some at least, are sensitive to such questions and doubts, I wouldn't be surprised to see the companies respond with calibration procedures.

I'm not ready to reject pedal based systems out of hand because no one, except for the companies, has any extensive measurement data. The cycling community has a long history with SRM, PT, and now even Quarq (and I guess Ergomo, and soon Power2Max) so the community's inertia is certainly in favor of those products (the first three, anyway). Hopefully, the well versed people in the industry, such as yourself, will put the pedal based systems to the test by differential measurement with SRMs, PTs, and Quarqs. Certainly without more power measurement product variations on the market, companies like SRM and Quarq will see zero reason to bring their prices down. Look/Polar and Garmin can be forgiven a bit for introducing at higher prices since the market is already a niche market, and they have to be sure to cover their investments. Let's hope both systems work well and that more people buy power measurement systems. That is what will bring prices down, and I think we all want that.
 

alienator

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Jun 10, 2004
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The Vector is now delayed until this summer some time: http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/garmin-vector-power-meter-release-delayed-again-33191 Sure, it be nice to have it on the market now and to see how it performs against other power meters, but it's better for everyone to have the kinks worked out now rather than after release. Yes, Garmin has taken a pasting a time or two for seemingly releasing their computers too soon, i.e. before the all the bugs are exorcised. More power meter news.....according to DC Rainmaker, there may be something resembling a "recall" of Look/Polar pedals: http://www.dcrainmaker.com/2012/02/friday-tidbits-velodromes-10ks-polar.html .