Islam and Bicycling in NYC



B

BicycleMan

Guest
"Nawaz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Dear Readers
>
> I am sure that the part 1 of this topic give's a food for your brain
> to think, that why today a self claimed followers of Islam are'nt
> producing the results which are a definite reaction of abiding the
> laws of Allah Almighty, if not then it mean's they are'nt practiceing
> the Bonfide Laws of Islam which are only found in the Quran. Well,
> what might be the reasons for that are as follows;
>
>
> Four Questions About Islam ?
> ============================
> The foregoing gives rise to four questions, namely:-
>
> 1) What was it which created in that particular period a body of
> people whose healthy deeds gave such a momentum to the operation of
> divine laws?
>
> (2) Why did that thing not prove lasting?
>
> (3) If the thing disappeared, why did the divine truth escape man's
> mind as it had developed at the time?
>
> (4) What proof is there that the divine' laws resumed their normal
> speed and Continue to operate at that speed? That is, does the stream
> of divine laws continue to flow and has not turned into a standing
> pool deprived of all chances of resuming its flow?
>
>
> First Question :
> ===============
>
> Muhammed (peace be upon him) Training -
> =====================
>
> As regards the first question, the programme which. in the words of
> the Holy Quran, Rasoolullah followed, was "To recite His verses to
> them, to help their development and to teach them the Book and the why
> thereof', (62/2). the programme was threefold. Firstly, Rasoolullah
> presented to his listeners the Holy Quran, pure and simple, without
> allowing any mingling with it of man's own thoughts, concepts,
> theories or beliefs. He offered them pure what he received by
> Revelation. His appeal was based on reason. "1 call to God with sure
> knowledge.
>
> I and whoever follows me", (12/108). The presentation of the Quranic
> message was rational and based on true knowledge; there was no
> compulsion there, neither mental through miracles, nor physical by
> the, sword. Secondly, those who accepted the message after due thought
> and conviction and without mental reservation, were initiated into
> mastering it as best as they could. Rasoolullah explained to them the
> provisions of divine laws together with the purpose underlying them.
> lie taught them how they should, in the light of the inviolable
> principles of Al-Islam, think out a solution of the problems which
> might confront them. Thirdly, all atmosphere of true freedom was
> created in which personality could grow and man's inborn capacities of
> head and heart could develop. The shackles of man-made restrictions
> and conventions gripping them broke one by one and they felt that they
> were neither another man's dependent nor his slave. True freedom
> prevailing n the Quranic Social Order provides the base for the
> development of human Personality.
>
> This was the simple and straight-forward programme which enabled
> Rasoolullah to create a community of people whose healthy deeds gave a
> miraculous acceleration to the pace of divine laws and established a
> social order in no time to bear witness to, the glorious achievements
> of Islam.
>
>
> Difference in Training -
> ============
>
> The people who embraced Islam in the lifetime of Rasoolullah,
> technically called companions, did not all of them have equal
> opportunity of benefiting from his training. There were the Bedouins
> who became converts towards the end of Rasoolullah's life, after
> seeing the Rising power and prowess of the Islamic State. About them
> the Holy Quran says, "The Bedouins say, we believe', Say you do not
> believe, rather say, 'we surrender (to the Islamic State); for belief
> has not yet entered your hearts." (4911 4). Then there were the
> Qureish who joined the Islamic fold after the armistice of Hodaibiyya
> or the fill of Mecca. About them the Holy Quran says, "No! equal is he
> among you who spent and fought before the victory: 1/lose are mightier
> in rank than they who Spent and fought afterward'; although God has
> promised all of them the good that follows from Islam" (57/10).
>
> The 'mightier in rank are the 'true believers" say the Holy Quran,
> "and those who believed and have emigrated and struggled in the way of
> God, those who have given refuge (to the emigrants) and help (the
> establishment of the new order) those are the true believers, for them
> there is protection against impairment and respectful provision"
> (8/74). And the ones "who spent and fought afterwards" have been
> described as "they belong to you" (8/75). The former are pioneers who
> have been called as "those who are with Muhammad, the messenger of
> God", (48/29), and whose astounding effort in establishing the Islamic
> Social Order has been praised in the verse so lavishly. The foregoing
> is not a negation of the great worth of the believers who, though
> rather late in the day, joined the pioneers all the same. The Holy
> Quran says about them "God will be well-pleased with them and they are
> well-pleased with Him." (9/100)
>
> Real Conversion -
> =========
>
> The foregoing would show clearly that among the later adherents of
> Islam there were people whose conversion differed from that of the
> first pioneers and who had lesser opportunity of receiving training
> from Rasoolullah. His first converts joined Rasoolullah after long and
> serious thought and after appreciating his message fully', at a time
> when conversion meant planting oneself against the concerted
> opposition of whole society and offering one to their unlimited
> torture and tyranny. Later on when the Islamic state got well
> established and extended its control far and wide, conversion became
> an easy affair and meant, to use the Quranic expression. just
> surrendering to the state. Besides this difference in the urge for
> conversion the later adherents were also handicapped in the matter of
> receiving training directly from Rasoolullah - Muhammed peace be upon
> him.
>
>
>
> Second Question : Messenger Muhammad (peace be upon him) Personality -
> ======================================================================
>
> The second question is why was the programme adopted by Rasoolullah
> not pursued? An oft-repeated explanation is that it was the unique
> personality of Rasoolullah who brought about with his great
> "Spiritual" power the tremendous revolution and it was not within the
> competence of ordinary mortals to carry on the great work he had
> initiated.
>
> The explanation is based on a misunderstanding which it is very
> necessary to remove. While it might provide an answer to the question,
> its logical and inescapable conclusion is that howsoever we might wish
> it we cannot revive Islamic way of life. The answer leads to complete
> and continuous frustration leaving little hope for regeneration. The
> idea of a mujaddid coming after every century or of a mehdi appearing
> in the end of so many nabees cropping up one after another, is the
> direct product of the frustration. The conception that a revival is
> impossible without the guidance of a nabee is unwarranted and must be
> removed. There is no mention in the Holy Quran of any promised one
> coming after Rasoolullah - Muhammed peace be upon him.
>
>
> What Muhammad (peace be upon him) did could be repeated -
> =======================
>
> Rasoolullah was the recipient of Revelation from God and in this
> respect he was unique among men. Revelation gave him a super­natural
> position. On the foundation of revealed guidance he raised the
> super-structure of Islamic Social Order, not with the help of any
> supernatural power but as a man. The Holy Quran makes no secret of the
> fact that apart from the Book he was not given any miracle. After his
> passing away the process of Revelation stopped, but what he did as a
> mortal to give practical shape to the revealed message, was carried on
> as before through the institution of Khilafat or succession, the sole
> purpose of which was to prepetuate his programme of advancing and
> extending the Islamic Social Order. Says the Quran, "Muhammad is not
> but only a messenger: messengers have passed away before him. Why, if
> he should die or is slain, will you turn about on your heels (thinking
> that the message was for his life-time only)? (3/143).
>
> The programme did not end with his demise; it had to continue inspite
> of his demise and could be carried on without him. When he said (1
> 2/108) "1 call to God with sure knowledge" he added "1 do so and so
> also those who follow me". The Holy Quran says. "He (Rasoolullah)
> enforces the recognized (lawful), and forbids the unrecognized
> (unlawful)' - and the same duty has been assigned to his followers
> where it says "you are a dynamic society brought forth for the good of
> humanity. You enforce the recognized (lawful) and forbid the
> unrecognized (unlawful)", (3/109). Hence it is wrong to assume that
> the three fold programme of Rasoolullah of "rcciling God's verses to
> the people, helping their development and teaching them the Book and
> the why thereof" was confined to him and was not to be pursued after
> him. It was, as a matter fact pursued and the fruits which the Islamic
> social Order had begun to bear in the life-time of Rasoolullah,
> continued to be harvested. Then after a time the programme halted due
> to various reasons.
>
>
> Why the Programme halted -
> =========================
>
> Rasoolullah began propagating his message among the Meccans and those
> who inquire about it and subsequently among the people of Madina and
> its surroundings. Due to direct contact with Rasoolullah, his
> immediate listeners understood and appreciated the divine message and
> Islamic conceptions gripped them and went deep into their heart and
> soul. Later on, when the whole of Arabia embraced Islam the fresh
> converts, to quote the Holy Quran, merely 'surrendered' to the Islamic
> State, without being subjected to any mental or moral change. The
> earlier Muslims were real converts, the later ones merely in name. The
> latter had little share of Rasoolullah's personal contact and
> training, because they were scattered far and wide, their number was
> very large, and Rasoolullah's early demise had cut short the
> opportunity.
>
> After his passing away, 'during the time of Hazrat Abu Bakr and Hazrat
> Omar, the Islamic State extended far and wide and covered an area of
> almost two and a half million square miles, embracing practically the
> whole of the Persian Empire and the greater part of the Roman Empire.
> The people inhabiting these vast areas could stick to their religion
> by making treaties with the Islamic State, but they preferred to
> become Muslims. As converts to a new social order they were even in a
> less fortunate position than the Arabian converts just referred to.
> The Arabian converts had the advantage of seeing Muslims round about
> them and of hearing about Islamic concepts and principles. The new
> converts had none of this facility. Their number was legion, the area
> which they inhabited was immense, and means of communication were
> extremely limited. All these factors made it well-nigh impossible that
> their education and training in the new dispensation could be on lines
> approaching those on which the earliest adherents of Islam were
> brought up.
>
> The problem greatly worried Hazrat Omar and he gave continued and very
> serious thought to it throughout. The situation answered very well the
> description in the Holy Quran, "When the help of God and victory come
> and you see men joining His social order in throngs", let not
> complacency overcome you that your purpose has been achieved and your
> programme is over, but instead you should get determined to prosecute
> the programme with greater vigor and "then proclaim the praises of
> your Nourisher (by executing His programme more vigorously) and seek
> His protection for He turns to men (and brings them means of
> development,)" (110/1-3). It was this feeling which, according to
> Ibn-e-Hazm, made Hazrat Omar distribute a hundred thousand copies of
> the Holy Quran throughout the length and breadth of the State. He had
> thought out further plans for the training of the new converts, but
> before he could execute them he was assassinated unexpectedly, leaving
> the ummat as well as mankind at large so much poorer and the new
> converts a heap of uncouth mass of humanity.
>
> A mass conversion of the type that had occurred could be no more than
> political surrender to the new State, without any mental change
> affecting old beliefs and conceptions. Education an training alone can
> bring about real change. Social influence might change their outside,
> but superficial change alone is a dangerous thing. The surrender of
> the masses was calm and quiet but it cut to the quick the wielders of
> authority and the intelligentsia. They were sore at a defeat by the
> Arabs, whom they never took for more than wild brutes, which broke to
> pieces their extensive empire and destroyed their ancient culture and
> civilization. The defeat made them surrender no doubt to the Islamic
> State, but they were never reconciled to it and feelings of revenge
> against the conquering Arabs raged furiously in their hearts. They
> took revenge not on the battle-field but through political intrigue
> and religious disruption. They realised that the secret of the
> over-whelming power of the Arabs lay in their adoption of the Islamic
> principles. When the Persian governor and military commander, Harmuzan
> was brought in chains before Hazrat Omar he asked him how is it that
> the Arabs who until recently dare not come near the Persian frontiers
> were now inflicting heavy defeat on them on all fronts? The answer
> Harmuzan gave was "Before it was force pitched against force, of which
> we had more. Then God was neither with you nor with us. Now in our
> encounters there is God with you and no God with us". The answer
> repeats in other words what the Holy Quran has said, "That is because
> God is the protector of the believers and that the unbelievers have no
> protector" (47/11).
>
> The thinkers among the conquered knew full well that it is the eternal
> principles of God whose adoption has brought such a tremendous change
> among the Arabs and therefore they based their scheme of revenge on a
> plan designed to wean them from those principles. The plan consisted
> in introducing gradually in the body politic of Islam of un-Islamic
> beliefs and concepts under an Islamic covering so that in the end the
> eternal divine principles lost place to man­made laws and concepts.
> What we have now of Islam is composed mostly of the replacing stuff
> introduced by the Ajami (alien) scheme of revenge. The Egyptian
> historian Muhammad Husain Haikal has described the situation aptly in
> his book " The Great Omar ". He has first quoted from the Historians'
> History of the World and then made his own comments. The quotation
> is:­
>
> "The reaction went still further, and the principles of political
> theology which had ruled ancient Persia returned to affirm their
> empire almost the day after the national ruin. According to Persian
> theory the power belonged to the King, the son of God, invested with
> divine glory by his super-terrestrian origin. Owing to political
> revolutions Persia united on the head of Muhammad's (peace be upon
> him) legitimate successor, the Arabian Ali, who had been excluded from
> the caliphate, all the splendor and sanctity of the old national
> royalty. The one she had once called in her protocols "the divine King
> son of heaven", and in her sacred books the "lord and guide" -- lord
 
Ken [NY) <[email protected]> wrote:
>On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 16:55:28 -0500, "BicycleMan" <[email protected]>
>claims:
>
>>> Four Questions About Islam ?

>
> As someone else said, I found out all I needed to know about Islam
>on September 11, 2001.


Congratulations. That's the exact mindless hatred the
terrorists were hoping to provoke.

--
Steven O'Neill [email protected]
followups will be redirected to the bit bucket
 
On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 17:47:48 GMT, "Ken [NY)" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 16:55:28 -0500, "BicycleMan" <[email protected]>
>claims:
>
>>> Four Questions About Islam ?

>
> As someone else said, I found out all I needed to know about Islam
>on September 11, 2001.
>
>Here's a question about Islam: why to muslims cut heads off
>westerners?
>

....

Ken, did you ever read the Project For A New American Century website?
That is the thinktank of Cheney, Wolfowitz, Pearl, and Rumsfeld. They
created it when they were out of power. The title tells you what you
really need to know about it. They want America to run the world.

Their first step was to take over Iraq, for the strategic location as
well as the oil. Nothing about freeing the poor Iraqi people, nothing
about WMD, nothing about terrorism. PNAC was developed over ten years
ago.

Please, Ken, all of you Bush supporters. Understand that they used
9/11 to put into motion a plan they had long desired. Not that the
American people desire, just a bunch of ultra-right wingers. That is
why the reason kept changing. The drumbeat was for war while they
couldn't explain the reason.

Not freedom. Not terrorism. Not WMD.

9/11 was blowback for our Reagan actions in Afghanistan. You want to
know who supports terrorism? Who organized, armed, trained, and funded
Islamic militants? You need look no further.

The blowback for Iraq will be incredible. It may directly trigger a
mid-east wide war, once Iraq explodes into civil war, with Israel,
Syria, Turkey, and Iran all backing factions. Just great.

But, hey, someone does profit. That would be the Carlyle group and the
other war profiteers. Oh my, that is Cheney and Bush and their
friends. What a surprise.

Just keep waving those flags boys. Keep telling everyone what great
patriots you are.
 
=v= What does *any* of this thread have to do with bicycling?
<_Jym_>
 
>> =v= What does *any* of this thread have to do with bicycling?
> Who said it did?


=v= The "Newsgroups:" header comes to mind.
<_Jym_>
 
On 26 Sep 2004 11:54:33 -0700, Jym Dyer <[email protected]> wrote:

>>> =v= What does *any* of this thread have to do with bicycling?

>> Who said it did?

>
>=v= The "Newsgroups:" header comes to mind.
> <_Jym_>


The guy's a republican troll. The RNC is paying people to post the
retarded republican party line so consequently the newsgroups are full
of stupid people making stupid posts. Ken is notorious for his
idiocy.
 
On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 19:55:18 GMT, soinie <[email protected]> wrote
in message <[email protected]>:

>The guy's a republican troll. The RNC is paying people to post the
>retarded republican party line so consequently the newsgroups are full
>of stupid people making stupid posts. Ken is notorious for his
>idiocy.


No, Ken is not an idiot. If you want True Believer republican idiocy
you need Ed Dolan on alt.rec.bicycles.recumbents.

A moratorium on political sniping during the Leftpondian election
woudl be good, though. Fact is, either way you'll probably get the
best President money can buy ;-)

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University
 
"Just zis Guy, you know?" wrote:
>
> On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 19:55:18 GMT, soinie <[email protected]> wrote
> in message <[email protected]>:
>
> >The guy's a republican troll. The RNC is paying people to post the
> >retarded republican party line so consequently the newsgroups are full
> >of stupid people making stupid posts. Ken is notorious for his
> >idiocy.

>
> No, Ken is not an idiot. If you want True Believer republican idiocy
> you need Ed Dolan on alt.rec.bicycles.recumbents.
>
> A moratorium on political sniping during the Leftpondian election
> woudl be good, though. Fact is, either way you'll probably get the
> best President money can buy ;-)



You are either WITH THE STATE or against the State.
Those who are NOT WITH THE STATE on all policies will
be deemed ENEMIES OF THE STATE and will be dealt with.



--

http://www.bushflash.com/thanks.html
"Bubba got a BJ, BU$H screwed us all!" - Slim
http://www.worldmessenger.20m.com/weapons.html#wms
George "The AWOL President" Bush: http://www.awolbush.com/
WHY IRAQ?: http://www.angelfire.com/creep/gwbush/remindus.html
http://www.toostupidtobepresident.com/shockwave/chickenhawks.htm


VOTE HIM OUT! November 2, 2004
 
In article <[email protected]>,
Ken [NY) <[email protected]> wrote:
>On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 15:38:42 -0400, dgk
> You never answered my question: why do muslims cut heads off
>westerners such as the Americans, Italians, Frenchmen, etc.? What is
>is about that gutter religion that requires thousands of innocent
>people to be slaughtered in order to satisfy their leaders?



"Ex-deputy pleads guilty to child rape"
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local...=WA Deputy Rape&searchdiff=8&searchpagefrom=1

Ken, answer this first, why do cops rape 13 year old girls?

Can you tell if someone has committed a crime just by their religion, or do
you need to know the color of their skin too?
 
> Can you tell if someone has committed a crime just by their
> religion, or do you need to know the color of their skin too?


=v= Good question. I don't recall him going off about white
guys after Timothy McVeigh's actions, so it seems like very
selective religious stereotyping instead of racial stereotyping.
Not that there's anything right with that.
<_Jym_>
 
On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 01:45:49 GMT, slim <pickin'[email protected]> wrote in
message <[email protected]>:

>You are either WITH THE STATE or against the State.
>Those who are NOT WITH THE STATE on all policies will
>be deemed ENEMIES OF THE STATE and will be dealt with.


Exactly. The Founding Fathers would be so proud.

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University
 
Trent Piepho wrote:
>
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Ken [NY) <[email protected]> wrote:
> >On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 15:38:42 -0400, dgk
> > You never answered my question: why do muslims cut heads off
> >westerners such as the Americans, Italians, Frenchmen, etc.? What is
> >is about that gutter religion that requires thousands of innocent
> >people to be slaughtered in order to satisfy their leaders?

>
> "Ex-deputy pleads guilty to child rape"
> http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local...=WA Deputy Rape&searchdiff=8&searchpagefrom=1
>
> Ken, answer this first, why do cops rape 13 year old girls?
>
> Can you tell if someone has committed a crime just by their religion, or do
> you need to know the color of their skin too?


KKKen KKKonrad drove a desk for the SSuffolk Cops.

--

http://www.bushflash.com/thanks.html
"Bubba got a BJ, BU$H screwed us all!" - Slim
http://www.worldmessenger.20m.com/weapons.html#wms
George "The AWOL President" Bush: http://www.awolbush.com/
WHY IRAQ?: http://www.angelfire.com/creep/gwbush/remindus.html
http://www.toostupidtobepresident.com/shockwave/chickenhawks.htm


VOTE HIM OUT! November 2, 2004
 
On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 18:14:56 +0000, Steven M. O'Neill wrote:

> Congratulations. That's the exact mindless hatred the
> terrorists were hoping to provoke.



Well they succeeded. think they are still overjoyed about it?

If they wanted to provoke our hatred, I see no reason not to oblige them
and see every reason to put them on the scrap heap of history allong with
all the other murderous and genocidal dogmas used to repress civilization
in the previous 4000 years.

Ruben
 
"Ken [NY)" wrote:
>>


>It's not a coincidence that all nineteen hijackers on 9/11 were
> also middle eastern males committed to islam, it is a pattern.


They were SAUDIS.

Financed by SAUDIS.

Why haven't we invaded SAUDI ARABIA?

--

http://www.bushflash.com/thanks.html
"Bubba got a BJ, BU$H screwed us all!" - Slim
http://www.worldmessenger.20m.com/weapons.html#wms
George "The AWOL President" Bush: http://www.awolbush.com/
WHY IRAQ?: http://www.angelfire.com/creep/gwbush/remindus.html
http://www.toostupidtobepresident.com/shockwave/chickenhawks.htm


VOTE HIM OUT! November 2, 2004
 
On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 15:38:42 -0400, dgk wrote:

> They want America to run the world.


This is probibly not a bad idea at this point. Would you prefer the UN?

Ruben
 
On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 06:33:28 -0700, Jym Dyer wrote:

>
> =v= Good question. I don't recall him going off about white
> guys after Timothy McVeigh's actions, so it seems like very
> selective religious stereotyping instead of racial stereotyping.
> Not that there's anything right with that.
> <_Jym_>



Your better off asking why cops rape 13 year old girls

It is more relavant to the decussion of muslim fascism

Ruben
 
Ken [NY) wrote:

> On 26 Sep 2004 23:43:50 -0700, [email protected] (Trent
> Piepho) claims:
>
>
>>In article <[email protected]>,
>>Ken [NY) <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 15:38:42 -0400, dgk
>>> You never answered my question: why do muslims cut heads off
>>>westerners such as the Americans, Italians, Frenchmen, etc.? What is
>>>is about that gutter religion that requires thousands of innocent
>>>people to be slaughtered in order to satisfy their leaders?

>>
>>
>>"Ex-deputy pleads guilty to child rape"
>>http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local...=WA Deputy Rape&searchdiff=8&searchpagefrom=1
>>
>>Ken, answer this first, why do cops rape 13 year old girls?
>>
>>Can you tell if someone has committed a crime just by their religion, or do
>>you need to know the color of their skin too?

>
>
> One bad guy, no race given, vs. a whole mass of people who
> have been videotaped hacking heads off of people of other religions,
> or who celebrate such horrors in the streets. Have you ever heard of a
> group of muslims who have repudiated such murders committed by fellow
> muslims?
> Has any muslim religous group yet condemned 9/11 or the
> slaughter of children and their mothers in Russia the other week? Have
> any muslim religous groups or leaders condemned the blowing up of
> civilian buses in Israel? Have any muslim groups condemned the
> bombings in Spain, Turkey, Russia and Bali? No, not one.


Yes, a great number of times on local radio and TV programs. There
have been plenty of Islam representatives who have vehemently denounced
and repudiated such acts. If you really think none have done so then
it seems to me you must be deliberately ignoring the numerous statements
that have been made. Here's an article describing that very phenomenom:
http://www.kansas.com/mld/kansas/news/editorial/9767350.htm

You might also be interested in the petition circulated by CAIR
(Council for American-Islamic Relations) titled "Not in the Name of
Islam":
" “We, the undersigned Muslims, wish to state clearly that those who
commit acts of terror, murder and cruelty in the name of Islam are not
only destroying innocent lives, but are also betraying the values of the
faith they claim to represent. No injustice done to Muslims can ever
justify the massacre of innocent people, and no act of terror will ever
serve the cause of Islam. We repudiate and dissociate ourselves from any
Muslim group or individual who commits such brutal and un-Islamic acts.
We refuse to allow our faith to be held hostage by the criminal actions
of a tiny minority acting outside the teachings of both the Quran and
the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him.

“As it states in the Quran: ‘Oh you who believe, stand up firmly for
justice, as witnesses to God, even if it be against yourselves, or your
parents, or your kin, and whether it be against rich or poor; for God
can best protect both. Do not follow any passion, lest you not be just.
And if you distort or decline to do justice, verily God is
well-acquainted with all that you do.’” (Quran 4:135)"
 
On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 16:09:27 -0400, Ruben Safir <[email protected]>
wrote in message <[email protected]>:

>> They want America to run the world.

>This is probibly not a bad idea at this point. Would you prefer the UN?


Let me see. UN method: relatively peaceful regime change in South
Africa followed by the Truth and Reconciliation Commission. US
method: fund the bad guys, change your mind, bomb the **** out of them
and spend the next n years involved in a bloody guerilla war, as seen
in the Balkans and Iraq.

Tough call :-/

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University
 
On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 22:23:34 +0100, Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:

> Let me see. UN method: relatively peaceful regime change in South
> Africa followed by the Truth and Reconciliation Commission. US
> method: fund the bad guys, change your mind, bomb the **** out of them
> and spend the next n years involved in a bloody guerilla war, as seen
> in the Balkans and Iraq.


This junxposition of unrelated subjects is most interesting. I can play
this game as well, but without lying as you do (US funds badguys my ass)


Lets try this game

Muslim fascist commit genocide in Sudan, and the UN uses it's peaceful
methodology and watches all the Black Africans in Sudan starve and die

US sees a terrible despot with aims for Nuclear weapons and removes the
genocial dictator from Power.



--- OH THIS IS SO MUCH FUN!!

LETS TRY ANOTHER ONE

The UN determins Zionism == Racism and supports refugee camps for 50
years, preventing a serious reconciation of the 6 day way and promotes, in
advertantly terrorist

US intercedes determines that Iran, N Korea, and Iraq an Axis of Evil,
which it is, and does something about it.

Yeah the UN is ****en great. It's the only institution ever created which
gives a democratic citezenship to known genocidal murderers as a matter of
course, and who make up over 98% of the General Assembly. It's a den of vice.

Ruben
 
On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 22:23:34 +0100, Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:

> UN method: relatively peaceful regime change in South
> Africa followed by the Truth and Reconciliation Commission.



BTW - the UN had ZERO todo with the change of genermnent (no regimn
change) in South Africa. They sat on there ****en hands for decades while
millions died (you revisionist pig skulled shitbrain).


Ruben