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Looking forward to 2004

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
16 January 2004
Last activity
26 January 2004
Original author
Dave Brown
Posts
337
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  1. In article <[email hidden]>, Paul Saunders <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:
    Bernard Hill said:

    That's fine. But man comes along and says "spring starts on March 21st". Sort of spoils it, eh?

    I think what happened was this;

    1. Once upon a time, our ancestors in this part of the world (Celts?) observed regular changes in
    weather and vegetation over time, and thus invented the concept of seasons. This was a faily
    local concept, limited to western central Europe. Thus they invented a calendar (primarily moon
    based) that followed the seasons reasonably accurately.

    You've forgotten to mention day length. Very important for rural peoples
    - not linked to weather or vegetation directly.

    Quoted message said:


    2. The world got bigger and it was discovered that weather, vegetation, climate etc. were wildly
    different all over the world and the simple seasonal system that worked so well locally made no
    sense worldwide.

    Quoted message said:


    3. Astronomers came along and defined the seasons to precisely fit the equinoxes and solstices all
    over the world, totally irrespective of weather and vegetation. The the seasons were
    standardised for worldwide use, but they no longer match weather and vegetation cycles any
    more, although they come fairly close in some places in the world.

    ... day length is a great astronomical fixed point.

    Quoted message said:


    Merry Christmas Bernard!

    And to you :-)

    Bernard Hill Selkirk, Scotland

  2. In article <[email hidden]>, Paul Rooney <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:
    Bernard Hill said:
    Quoted message said:

    But *no-one* would describe September as part of summer! It's clearly autumn when the leaves are
    falling!

    Don't do much leaf-observing, I take it?

    Quoted message said:


    Conversely June is clearly summertime... not Spring!

    Your definition is *not* reasonable.

    It's the astronomical definition, not mine - the one you were keen on, iirc.

    OK, I do have to confess my astonishment at the definitions you found in the dictionary which claim
    to be astronomical.

    They go against all sense in an astronomical context. Ask the people who live north of the Arctic
    Circle where Summer starts and ends! It will be symmetrical around Jun 21(ish) I bet!

    Bernard Hill Selkirk, Scotland

  3. In article <[email hidden]>, Paul Saunders <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:
    Bernard Hill said:
    Quoted message said:

    Nothing ridiculous about it, it's the modern definition. Well known too.

    Says who?

    Astronomers.

    Quoted message said:

    I remember more snowfalls in November than in March here in the Scottish Borders.

    Must have a different climate up there then.

    Quoted message said:

    However the seasons as you say are quite irrelevant to the definition of the start of summer.
    It's an astronomical term.

    Indeed.

    While we're on the subject, rather than arguing about what the seasons are, what do you think they
    should be? Purely a weather and vegetation definition, varying from year to year and place to
    place, therefore never any real agreement about what season it currently is, or a precise
    definition of your choosing?

    A precise definition of my choosing. Rather like your diagram on the sacredfire web site.
    Symmetrical around the solstice and equinox points.

    I've *always* regarded them as such and to find people who disagree has actually astonished me.

    Bernard Hill Selkirk, Scotland

  4. In article <[email hidden]>, Gordon <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:

    This supports my view that the seasons can only be defined by weather and plant growth.

    Hence the phrase -"Seasonal vegetables". A by-product of this concept would be to tell the seasons
    by the relative prices of vegetables in the shops. The more expensive the more "out" of season etc.
    --
    Bill Grey billboy.co.ukbillboy.co.uk

  5. Stuart said:

    The beginning of my year starts tommorow. at 07:08 on the 22nd December 2003 .....***WINTER***
    officialy begins

    A bit late for me to grab a few more autumn photographs then... :-(

    Paul
    --
    wildwales.fsnet.co.ukoctober.html
    wilderness-wales.co.ukwilderness-wales.co.uk
    photosig.comuserphotos

  6. Pierre Lavaurs said:
    Dave Brown said:

    May I wish all members of this group all the very best for Christmas


    & the

    Quoted message said:

    coming year.

    Quoted message said:


    Best wishes from France to everybody there for Christmas and New Year.


    And best wishes from California.

    Katherine

  7. Quoted message said:

    The beginning of my year starts tommorow. at 07:08 on the 22nd December 2003 .....***WINTER***
    officialy begins

    Err hang on. Surely 22nd December is the Winter Solstice and therefore MID winter?

  8. Phil Cook said:
    Dave Brown said:

    May I wish all members of this group all the very best for Christmas & the coming year.

    I'll jump in here and send my greeting to all.

    p-t-cook.freeserve.co.ukchristmas2003a.jpg

    Very nice!

    --
    Paul

    My Lake District walking site (updated 29th September 2003): paulrooney.netfirms.compaulrooney.netfirms.com

  9. Following up to Phil Cook

    Quoted message said:

    I'll jump in here and send my greeting to all.

    p-t-cook.freeserve.co.ukchristmas2003a.jpg
    --


    me too (having wasted half an hour playing with photoshop, the programme that can do anything in 10
    seconds once you spend an hour finding out how!) "fellwalk.co.ukwmd.htm"
    --
    Mike Reid "Art is the lie that reveals the truth" P.Picasso Walking-food-photos, Wasdale, Thames,
    London etc "fellwalk.co.ukfellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site and same for Spain at "fell-fell-
    walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap

  10. The message <[email hidden]>
    from Bernard Hill <[email hidden]> contains these words:

    Quoted message said:

    For conventions, see "midsummer" in the SOED. It says it means "the middle of summer, specifically
    the period around the solstice".

    The Concise Oxford says something similar but that doesn't stop it defining summer as: "Warmest
    season of the year, in N. hemisphere June-August (Astron., from summer solstice to autumnal
    equinox)..."

    It also has Indian Summer as: "period of dry calm hazy weather in late autumn in northern US and
    elsewhere..."

    --
    Roger Displaced and Looking North to the Water Tower, South to the Tower on The Naze and East to the
    Roughs Tower.

  11. [email hidden] said...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>, Liz Lemal <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:

    Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to everyone else too.

    A very merry Christmas and Happy New year to everyone. I must get out more in 2004.

    Ditto the wishes to everyone and ditto the sentiment in the second sentence an' all.

    Quoted message said:

    Liz - lurk less and write more - thanks for the greetings.

    Hear, hear! (Or is it here, here?)
    --
    Fran If you need my email address please ask.

  12. "Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Stuart said:

    The beginning of my year starts tommorow. at 07:08 on the 22nd December 2003 .....***WINTER***
    officialy begins


    Must be true, I woke up to a good dusting this morning!!

    Dave..

  13. Following up to Paul Rooney

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    p-t-cook.freeserve.co.ukchristmas2003a.jpg

    thank you!
    --
    Mike Reid "Art is the lie that reveals the truth" P.Picasso Walking-food-photos, Wasdale, Thames,
    London etc "fellwalk.co.ukfellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site and same for Spain at "fell-fell-
    walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap

  14. On Tue, 23 Dec 2003 10:48:07 +0000, Reid <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:

    Following up to Phil Cook

    Quoted message said:

    I'll jump in here and send my greeting to all.

    p-t-cook.freeserve.co.ukchristmas2003a.jpg
    --


    me too (having wasted half an hour playing with photoshop, the programme that can do anything in 10
    seconds once you spend an hour finding out how!) "fellwalk.co.ukwmd.htm"

    That's cool. I've robbed* it and sent it to my mates. Why wmd?

    *That's dialect for standard English 'stolen', for the ignorami among you.

    --
    Paul

    My Lake District walking site (updated 29th September 2003): paulrooney.netfirms.compaulrooney.netfirms.com

  15. Reid said:

    Following up to Phil Cook

    Quoted message said:

    I'll jump in here and send my greeting to all.

    p-t-cook.freeserve.co.ukchristmas2003a.jpg
    --


    me too (having wasted half an hour playing with photoshop, the programme that can do anything in
    10 seconds once you spend an hour finding out how!) "fellwalk.co.ukwmd.htm"

    BRRRRRRRR!! V-v-v-very n-n-n-nice. Katherine

  16. "Bernard Hill" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>, Stuart <[email hidden]> writes

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    The beginning of my year starts tommorow. at 07:08 on the 22nd December


    2003

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    .....***WINTER*** officialy begins

    How do you make that out? It was **midwinter's day** yesterday (21st) so winter began about 6.5
    weeks ago.

    Bernard Hill Selkirk, Scotland

    So, November 6th is the begining of winter.........a date evryone knows

    Tell me Bernard, were you cast into this group by Mike Newall ?

  17. Roger Chapman said:

    It also has Indian Summer as: "period of dry calm hazy weather in late autumn in northern US and
    elsewhere..."

    Oh yes, I forgot to mention that Bernard. Hot weather in September isn't an Indian Summer. An Indian
    Summer comes much later, after the first frosts.

    Paul
    --
    wildwales.fsnet.co.ukoctober.html
    wilderness-wales.co.ukwilderness-wales.co.uk
    photosig.comuserphotos

  18. Reid said:

    Following up to Phil Cook

    Quoted message said:

    I'll jump in here and send my greeting to all.

    p-t-cook.freeserve.co.ukchristmas2003a.jpg

    Quoted message said:

    me too (having wasted half an hour playing with photoshop, the programme that can do anything in
    10 seconds once you spend an hour finding out how!) fellwalk.co.ukwmd.htm

    Well since we're all at it, here's my season's greets to hill walkers everywhere,
    especially Bernard.

    wildwales.fsnet.co.uksolstice.jpg

    Paul
    --
    wildwales.fsnet.co.ukoctober.html
    wilderness-wales.co.ukwilderness-wales.co.uk
    photosig.comuserphotos

  19. Joe Bloggs said:


    "Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Stuart said:

    The beginning of my year starts tommorow. at 07:08 on the 22nd December 2003 .....***WINTER***
    officialy begins


    Must be true, I woke up to a good dusting this morning!!

    Your missus getting the cleaning done before yoyu wre awake eh?
    --
    Phil Cook looking north over the park to the "Westminster Gasworks"

  20. Following up to Paul Rooney

    Quoted message said:

    That's cool. I've robbed* it and sent it to my mates. Why wmd?

    I set up a WMD weapons of mass distraction page with the Easyjet ad on it (Fran saw it) it was
    convenient to just overwrite it, especially as I dont want pornbots classifying my sight as over
    18.
    --
    Mike Reid "Art is the lie that reveals the truth" P.Picasso Walking-food-photos, Wasdale, Thames,
    London etc "fellwalk.co.ukfellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site and same for Spain at "fell-fell-
    walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap

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