Love of cars puts brakes on bike culture

[Stuart Lamble]

On 2005-08-24, Euan <[email protected]> wrote:
> Is Rent A Bomb cheaper than Budget? Twelve dollars a day I've seen
> advertised but I'm sure there's huge conditions on that.

Rent a Bomb charges $57/day for a "new" car; older cars are around
$35/day for a manual without aircon.

The $12/day is a gimmick; there are other costs to bring it up to
$23/day for a one week rental. Also, the area of use excludes the areas
I'd like to be able to dive (for example), whilst I can get away with it
with Budget, simply by stating that I'm keeping the car in Victoria, but
not local (within 50 km of the pickup location.)

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[Bleve]

EuanB wrote:
> Bleve Wrote:
> >
> > Makes perfect sense. China's standard of living is going
> > up, they can afford cars. Cars are status symbols (and
> > useful, you can carry lots more in a car than on a bike,
> > usually ). Life is one big pissing contest after all.
> I'd argue there's a difference between something being understandable
> and making sense
>
> A modicum of research in to traffic problems associated with
> unrestrained car use would have shown the way for China, that would
> make sense. It's understandable that China sees itself `catching up'
> with the western world and wants to emulate the trappings of that
> success.
>
> As for pissing contests, well that's one view of the world and one I'd
> rather not subscribe to

Alas, 'tis true. I don't have the link anywhere handy
but study after study shows that we don't care about how
well off we are, we care about if we're better off than our
neighbours. By "we" I mean humans in general, of course

Thus, pissing contest. Check why you do things sometime,
and see if you can catch yourself out. It's a good way to
save cash sometimes Someone earning minimum wage in
Oz is so much better off than most European aristocrats of 200 years
ago it's not funny (choice of foods, medical care etc), but
do they think they're well off? It's all relative.









>
>
> --
> EuanB

 

[Bleve]

Stuart Lamble wrote:
> On 2005-08-24, Bleve <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Makes perfect sense. China's standard of living is going
> > up, they can afford cars. Cars are status symbols (and
> > useful, you can carry lots more in a car than on a bike,
> > usually ). Life is one big pissing contest after all.
>
> The funny thing is, I'm in the middle (well, ok, at the start) of
> evaluating a lifestyle without a car. In other words: I own a car. For
> six weeks, I shall try to live without it. At the end of that time,
> depending on how I go, I may well sell my car and live my life with just
> my bike, my feet, and public transportation.

I haven't owned a car since I think 1999, and that was a rallycar that
didn't get driven for anything except sport.

To be fair, along the way many girlfriends have had cars that
I have made significant use of though (which is cheating ...)
but now, no g/f as such, and no car and living in Vermont, I'm
doing ok. I have to use the motorbike to get to client sites a fair
bit (I do IT support/consulting stuff to pay the bills), and I hitch
lifts with
friends to get to bike races (I usually pay for their petrol etc).

It can be done, even in Deep Suburbia.

 

[suzyj]

Stuart Lamble wrote:

> Rent a Bomb charges $57/day for a "new" car; older cars are around
> $35/day for a manual without aircon.

There's a lot to be said for the little local outfits. We hire mainly from a place just down the road from us, called Aero Auto Rentals. A ~5 year old Excel costs $45 or so for a single day. The advantage with them is that they're within easy walking distance, and they don't charge the earth like the "franchise" places (Budget, Thrifty, etc). Ya can probably get a better deal, but once you take into account the cost of getting there to pick up the car, then it becomes a lot less attractive.

Regards,

Suzy

 

[cfsmtb]

I haven't owned a car since I think 1999, and that was a rallycar that
didn't get driven for anything except sport.

To be fair, along the way many girlfriends have had cars that
I have made significant use of though (which is cheating ...)
but now, no g/f as such, and no car and living in Vermont, I'm
doing ok. I have to use the motorbike to get to client sites a fair
bit (I do IT support/consulting stuff to pay the bills), and I hitch
lifts with
friends to get to bike races (I usually pay for their petrol etc).

It can be done, even in Deep Suburbia.

Well, I've never had a license or owned a car. My brother offered me a Vdub for $200 in 1985. If I'll bought it, there's a chance I'll still be driving it! Anyway to be truly be 'car-free', is being a passenger in my partners car a cop out?

 

[Stuart Lamble]

On 2005-08-25, suzyj <[email protected]> wrote:
[car rentals]
> There's a lot to be said for the little local outfits. We hire mainly
> from a place just down the road from us, called Aero Auto Rentals. A
> ~5 year old Excel costs $45 or so for a single day.

That's pretty decent. I have no objection to slightly older cars -- they
get the job done well enough. I suspect a part of the Budget et al cost
is in paying the depreciation on a relatively now vehicle. (Probably a
very large part, what's more.)

> The advantage with
> them is that they're within easy walking distance, and they don't charge
> the earth like the "franchise" places (Budget, Thrifty, etc). Ya can
> probably get a better deal, but once you take into account the cost of
> getting there to pick up the car, then it becomes a lot less
> attractive.

Depends on where the mob is. I picked Budget for an initial costing
because it is a reasonable upper bound on the cost, not necessarily
because I *will* go with them. If/when (most likely when) the time
comes, I intend to check the local Yellow Pages for local car hire
places, and see what they can do for me, before resorting to the big
names.

This doesn't alter the fact that I still think 24 hires a year is way
more than I really need.

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[suzyj]

cfsmtb wrote:

> Well, I've never had a license or owned a car.

Same with my partner. Perry (my partner) has never owned or driven a car, and nor have his parents. He's much more anti-car than I am. It's a bit of a bugger, actually, as the main times we drive are long trips, to the Alpine Classic for example. Then I get to drive the whole way there, and the whole way back, while he keeps me fuelled up on sour gummy worms and reads interesting bits from the paper to me.

If it weren't for Perry, I'd probably have a car, but whenever I raise the possibility of buying one, he comes up with a million reasons why we shouldn't.

I'm currently talking up a Prius or Civic hybrid, as that appeals to his (and my) greenie side, not to mention being tre cool as an engineering toy.

Regards,

Suzy

 

[flyingdutch]

but now, no g/f as such...

Oooh. Let's play 'MatchMaker' for Bleve

"Female Wanted. GSOH, non-smoker, must like blue-and-yellow, must have own car, preferably wagon. Send photos of wagon"

F"cheeky"Dutch

 

[PiledHigher]

Oooh. Let's play 'MatchMaker' for Bleve

"Female Wanted. GSOH, non-smoker, must like blue-and-yellow, must have own car, preferably wagon. Send photos of wagon"

F"cheeky"Dutch

I think we need to focus harder on talking up TimC, I think Bleve can look after himself!

 

[Graeme Dods]

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:08:48 +1000, suzyj wrote:


> There's a lot to be said for the little local outfits.

Definitely. When we went back home (Edinburgh) a couple of times last year,
my wife spent some time phoning around the car rental companies. As both
trips were fairly quiet times of the year for rental companies, she played
one off against the other. We ended up with a small local company getting
us a much better car than Avis/Budget/etc. could provide at about 60-70% of
the cost, plus they picked us up from where we were staying (so we could go
to their office and complete the paperwork) and then dropped us off again
when we'd finished with the car a few weeks later.

Graeme

 

[Graeme Dods]

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:24:48 +1000, suzyj wrote:

> I'm currently talking up a Prius or Civic hybrid, as that appeals to
> his (and my) greenie side, not to mention being tre cool as an
> engineering toy.

Why not get a small diesel, fire up the chemistry set in the shed and run
it off bio-diesel? That would be a lot greener (a Prius is only about 30%
more fuel efficient than a modern diesel anway) and the semi-DIY fuel would
definitely count as an engineering toy.

Graeme

 

[Stuart Lamble]

On 2005-08-25, Graeme Dods <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:24:48 +1000, suzyj wrote:
>
>> I'm currently talking up a Prius or Civic hybrid, as that appeals to
>> his (and my) greenie side, not to mention being tre cool as an
>> engineering toy.
>
> Why not get a small diesel, fire up the chemistry set in the shed and run
> it off bio-diesel? That would be a lot greener (a Prius is only about 30%
> more fuel efficient than a modern diesel anway) and the semi-DIY fuel would
> definitely count as an engineering toy.

ISTR that with bio-diesel, you need to run it off regular diesel for the
first and last five minutes of the trip. Plus there's the warranty
issues of doing this, although that's less of a concern for second hand
vehicles.

All off the top of my head, so take with the appropriate chunk of salt.

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[Bleve]

flyingdutch wrote:
> Bleve Wrote:
> >
> >
> > but now, no g/f as such...
> >
> >
>
>
> Oooh. Let's play 'MatchMaker' for Bleve

No thanks, that's not appropriate. I appreciate the
humour, but at the moment, let's just say it's a sensitive
issue and leave it alone, please. I shouldn't have brought it
up. Mea Culpa.

 

[Graeme Dods]

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 06:15:37 GMT, Stuart Lamble wrote:

> ISTR that with bio-diesel, you need to run it off regular diesel for the
> first and last five minutes of the trip. Plus there's the warranty
> issues of doing this, although that's less of a concern for second hand
> vehicles.

That's only if you're using SVO (straight vegetable oil) which requires
heating and/or a warm engine to thin the oil. Biodiesel is SVO (or
reclaimed then filtered waste vegetable oil) that has undergone
transesterification.

Have a read of this for more info.
<http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#3biod>

I've been considering using it in my vehicle, but I must admit that it
would probably take more time to set up and run than I have at the moment.
Yet again, the convenience/laziness factor plays a big part in people's
green ideals :-/

Graeme

 

[Stuart Lamble]

On 2005-08-25, Graeme Dods <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 06:15:37 GMT, Stuart Lamble wrote:
>> ISTR that with bio-diesel, you need to run it off regular diesel for the
>> first and last five minutes of the trip. Plus there's the warranty
>> issues of doing this, although that's less of a concern for second hand
>> vehicles.
>
> That's only if you're using SVO (straight vegetable oil) which requires
> heating and/or a warm engine to thin the oil. Biodiesel is SVO (or
> reclaimed then filtered waste vegetable oil) that has undergone
> transesterification.

Ahhh. I stand corrected. Thanks.

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[Shane Stanley]

In article <[email protected]>,
suzyj <[email protected]> wrote:

> If it weren't for Perry, I'd probably have a car, but whenever I raise
> the possibility of buying one, he comes up with a million reasons why
> we shouldn't.

Surely you, of all people, would build your own ;-)

--
Shane Stanley

 

[suzyj]

Graeme Dods wrote:

> Why not get a small diesel, fire up the chemistry set in the shed
> and run it off bio-diesel? That would be a lot greener (a Prius is
> only about 30% more fuel efficient than a modern diesel anway)
> and the semi-DIY fuel would definitely count as an engineering toy.

My perfect car would be a small hybrid diesel/electric van, with extra batteries and a charger so most trips could be made without starting the engine. On extended trips, it could then run on biodiesel.

Apparently Citroen are developing a hybrid diesel/electric version of the Berlingo, which sounds absolutely perfect.

There are a bunch of people modding Priuses (priui?) so that they can run in pure EV mode for short trips, and then adding batteries - they claim really impressive fuel efficiency. Of course you've gotta plug it in overnight, but that's no big drama. The Civic won't work in an EV only mode, so it's no good for modding.

Oh, and before people chime in with the "household electricity is just as dirty as petrol" bit, we pay the extra bit already for green power, so allegedly, any power we use is provided for from renewable sources.

But the Berlingo would be just perfect. Plenty of room for extra batteries (not to mention room for bikes and fishtanks), and it's diesel, so even when the motor is running it's more friendly than petrol.

Of course the only downside is that they've been "developing" the hybrid version for ages, and you can just bet when (if) they release one, it will be for Europe only, as we're not allowed to have environmentally sensible cars in Aust.

Cheers,

Suzy

 

[Terry Collins]

Graeme Dods wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 15:24:48 +1000, suzyj wrote:
>
>
>>I'm currently talking up a Prius or Civic hybrid, as that appeals to
>>his (and my) greenie side, not to mention being tre cool as an
>>engineering toy.
>
>
> Why not get a small diesel, fire up the chemistry set in the shed and run
> it off bio-diesel?

The only catch is that I haven't worked out how to get the 44 gallon
drums of used cooking oil home from the chippie.

> That would be a lot greener (a Prius is only about 30%
> more fuel efficient than a modern diesel anway) and the semi-DIY fuel would
> definitely count as an engineering toy.

These Prius and stuff are just gimmicks in my books. I'm looking at an
electric car, but with minimal batteries and bio-diesel gennie.

 

[Terry Collins]

Stuart Lamble wrote:

> ISTR that with bio-diesel, you need to run it off regular diesel for the
> first and last five minutes of the trip.

That sounds a bit like the old LPG requirement.
But, might relate to fuel consistency. I understood that some recipes
have a high consistency and you really need to pre-heat the fuel, but
then I might be confused as well, (wot with thinking about methane
digesters, etc)


> All off the top of my head, so take with the appropriate chunk of salt.
AOL! {.

 

[Graeme Dods]

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 17:11:03 +1000, suzyj wrote:

> Oh, and before people chime in with the "household electricity is just
> as dirty as petrol" bit, we pay the extra bit already for green power,
> so allegedly, any power we use is provided for from renewable sources.

I've never been too sure about this "green electricity". You are, after
all, just paying an energy broker who buys from a pool of available power,
with an obvious preference for buying from "green" suppliers first (or at
least that's how it seems to work in other countries). However, the uptake
in some places has been of such a level that buying power for all your
customers means that they end up buying from more traditional power
generators. The green energy brokers also seem to have little influence on
increases in renewable power generation, so it seems to me that they're
just in it for the money rather than any environmental ideals.

> But the Berlingo would be just perfect. Plenty of room for extra
> batteries (not to mention room for bikes and fishtanks)

Who needs a fish tank, just weld the doors shut, whack a sheet of glass
behind you, add some plastic sheeting, mastic and water and you've got a
wonderful mobile fish tank! Won't do much for your fuel consumption though


Graeme