mtn bike clinic report: White Ranch, CO

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Monique Y. Mudama

Guest
Tonya Laffey, pro racer, taught this clinic. Read more about her and
her team here: http://www.mtbchick.com/

I heard about the clinic from the Singletrack Sistahs group. More info
here: http://www.singletracksistahs.com/

This was ostensibly a four-hour beginner's clinic, from 9 to 1. I'd
never been to white ranch park before; I thought I'd left myself plenty
of time, but got to the Western parking lot at 9 on the dot. Two other
students were there; Tonya never teaches more than five at a time by
herself.

What can I say? It was a really good clinic. Tonya's husband and
mechanic, Troy, tuned up our bikes as we talked about our experience
levels. Tonya strongly encouraged me to switch to my clipless pedals,
so I did ...

This experience was really good. While I don't think anything she told
me was news, it really helped to have an expert standing there,
watching, encouraging me. I always feel guilty when my friends have to
wait for me because I'm trying something; this way, all of us students
were in the same boat, and we knew that Tonya was there for us. There
just wasn't any pressure to hurry up and move on.

So, let's see. I got some actual air beneath my wheels during bunny
hops -- 5-6", which, while not exactly airborne, is much more than I
have in the past. I even cleared some little waterbars with bunnyhops,
implying that I might have developed a sense of timing.

I cleared a series of four uphill waterbars; the trick was to go all the
way to the outside for each of them, so you go far right, then left,
right, and then left again, hitting the shallow edge every time. Took
me four tries and an upshift, but I finally got it.

The only major trauma was this one downhill waterbar. It was at a 45
degree angle to the trail, right after a series of roots and rocks that
made things rather difficult. I still had Tonya's "go perpendicular to
the water bar" mantra in my head, so I tried to achieve that ... and
ended up in a rather awkward lump on the ground. My leg was pretty
bruised; my arm was too muddy to tell, but something was probably
bleeding. Up, I go again, and down I go again. Sigh. Several tries
later, though, I cleared the damn thing.

I won't bother to tell you about all the spots I *didn't* clear =P

After getting back to the parking lot, Troy cleaned up the cut on my arm
as best he could. He gave me something squooshy to grab while he poured
alcohol. ARRRGH! Then he spent over an hour addressing a complaint I
had about my brakes while Tonya went off riding. What an awesome guy.
He showed me everything he was doing, and while I can say with
confidence that I couldn't demonstrate what he did, I think I learned
something about the whole process.

After we were all done there, I called Eric, but the reception wasn't so
great. So I pretty much just told him to buy some gauze and hydrogen
peroxide and that I'd be home in an hour. Then I drove home as quickly
as I could.

Well, it turns out that Eric was a bit freaked, given that I hadn't said
I was okay. (I had figured that, if something were really wrong,
someone else would have had to call him -- so by definition, if I
called, I was okay. Apparently not.) He bought the supplies, though.
I burbled on happily about the clinic while devouring a cheeseburger,
then showered and let him at the cut.

Hydrogen peroxide hurts worse than alcohol.

Anyway, the plan is still for me to play hockey tonight, and I have a
private hockey lesson tomorrow, so hopefully I can deal with the pain.

As for clipless, hrmph. I do like them for some purposes, but when the
going gets technical, I'm always out of them. I've ordered Zilla's
suggestion, the shimano multi-release cleats, so we'll see if those help
matters. Certainly, parts of the trail we did at white ranch were much
more difficult than the stuff I normally do.

Oh, and, after seeing how easy it was for Troy to get at my bike using a
stand, I'm pretty sure I'm gonna buy one. He uses one made by Ultimate;
I think it's this one:

<http://www.beyondbikes.com/bb/ba/asp/ic.AC-TOO-brs-80r/ab/Itemdesc.htm?link=bestwb>

Can't really afford it this second, but it's on my list.

--
monique
 
On Sun, 9 May 2004 23:09:29 -0000, Monique Y. Mudama wrote:

> What can I say? It was a really good clinic. Tonya's husband and
> mechanic, Troy, tuned up our bikes as we talked about our experience
> levels. Tonya strongly encouraged me to switch to my clipless pedals,
> so I did ...


Huh...I wouldn't be asking anyone to switch to clipless on a very
technical ride unless they're already very comfortable with them on just
slightly less-technical rides rides.

> This experience was really good. While I don't think anything she told
> me was news, it really helped to have an expert standing there,
> watching, encouraging me. I always feel guilty when my friends have to
> wait for me because I'm trying something; this way, all of us students
> were in the same boat, and we knew that Tonya was there for us. There
> just wasn't any pressure to hurry up and move on.


Nice!

> The only major trauma was this one downhill waterbar. It was at a 45
> degree angle to the trail, right after a series of roots and rocks that
> made things rather difficult. I still had Tonya's "go perpendicular to
> the water bar" mantra in my head, so I tried to achieve that ... and
> ended up in a rather awkward lump on the ground. My leg was pretty
> bruised; my arm was too muddy to tell, but something was probably
> bleeding. Up, I go again, and down I go again. Sigh. Several tries
> later, though, I cleared the damn thing.


Roots & things at a diagonal angle are always tough...worse going uphill
I think.

> Hydrogen peroxide hurts worse than alcohol.


I don't recall much of anything hurting worse than alcohol!

> Anyway, the plan is still for me to play hockey tonight, and I have a
> private hockey lesson tomorrow, so hopefully I can deal with the pain.


Good luck!

--
-BB-
To reply to me, drop the attitude (from my e-mail address, at least)
 
On Sun, 09 May 2004 23:09:29 +0000, Monique Y. Mudama wrote:

> As for clipless, hrmph. I do like them for some purposes, but when the
> going gets technical, I'm always out of them. I've ordered Zilla's
> suggestion, the shimano multi-release cleats, so we'll see if those help
> matters. Certainly, parts of the trail we did at white ranch were much
> more difficult than the stuff I normally do.


I can't remember if you were using plain platforms or cages? I tried
clipless once. Scared the **** out of me. (I have cages.)

Glad you enjoyed the camp. I can't make it to any of them this
summer--they've either been canceled or I have something else to do that
weekend.

gabrielle
 
"Monique Y. Mudama" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Tonya Laffey, pro racer, taught this clinic. Read more about her and
> her team here: http://www.mtbchick.com/
>
> I heard about the clinic from the Singletrack Sistahs group. More info
> here: http://www.singletracksistahs.com/
>
> This was ostensibly a four-hour beginner's clinic, from 9 to 1. I'd
> never been to white ranch park before; I thought I'd left myself plenty
> of time, but got to the Western parking lot at 9 on the dot. Two other
> students were there; Tonya never teaches more than five at a time by
> herself.
>
> What can I say? It was a really good clinic. Tonya's husband and
> mechanic, Troy, tuned up our bikes as we talked about our experience
> levels. Tonya strongly encouraged me to switch to my clipless pedals,
> so I did ...
>


Back in 1993 I had my first ride with clipless pedals on White Ranch. That
was back before CamelBaks were popular and I was carrying a banana in my
***** pack (it was 92'). Anyhow by the end of the ride the banana had turned
to a pudding consistancy (spent some time on my butt)... Not sure if I would
recommend WR as a place to break in clipless pedals but stay with them, they
make a world of difference. Be sure to get a good pair some of the cheaper
one's don't release as well when wet or dirty/muddy. Sometimes a teflon
spray before each ride on the pedals can help especially for Front Range
riding conditions.

I'm sure the person who put the clinic on informed you to go to a grassy
park and practice clipping in and out of your pedals until you no longer had
to think about how to get in and out of them... and not to put a stiff arm
out to catch you falls...

> This experience was really good. While I don't think anything she told
> me was news, it really helped to have an expert standing there,
> watching, encouraging me. I always feel guilty when my friends have to
> wait for me because I'm trying something; this way, all of us students
> were in the same boat, and we knew that Tonya was there for us. There
> just wasn't any pressure to hurry up and move on.
>
> So, let's see. I got some actual air beneath my wheels during bunny
> hops -- 5-6", which, while not exactly airborne, is much more than I
> have in the past. I even cleared some little waterbars with bunnyhops,
> implying that I might have developed a sense of timing.
>
> I cleared a series of four uphill waterbars; the trick was to go all the
> way to the outside for each of them, so you go far right, then left,
> right, and then left again, hitting the shallow edge every time. Took
> me four tries and an upshift, but I finally got it.
>
> The only major trauma was this one downhill waterbar. It was at a 45
> degree angle to the trail, right after a series of roots and rocks that
> made things rather difficult. I still had Tonya's "go perpendicular to
> the water bar" mantra in my head, so I tried to achieve that ... and
> ended up in a rather awkward lump on the ground. My leg was pretty
> bruised; my arm was too muddy to tell, but something was probably
> bleeding. Up, I go again, and down I go again. Sigh. Several tries
> later, though, I cleared the damn thing.
>
> I won't bother to tell you about all the spots I *didn't* clear =P
>
> After getting back to the parking lot, Troy cleaned up the cut on my arm
> as best he could. He gave me something squooshy to grab while he poured
> alcohol. ARRRGH! Then he spent over an hour addressing a complaint I
> had about my brakes while Tonya went off riding. What an awesome guy.
> He showed me everything he was doing, and while I can say with
> confidence that I couldn't demonstrate what he did, I think I learned
> something about the whole process.


Some of the LBS have free clinics on bike maintence... Plug for one of our
sponsor's (Green Mountain Sports) is they even put on a women's only bike
maintence clinic... There last one women's only was last Wednesday. Good
stuff to know! Beats pushing your bike back to the vechicle.

>
> After we were all done there, I called Eric, but the reception wasn't so
> great. So I pretty much just told him to buy some gauze and hydrogen
> peroxide and that I'd be home in an hour. Then I drove home as quickly
> as I could.
>


Wait till your significant other gets a call from the hospital... my wife
loves those...

> Well, it turns out that Eric was a bit freaked, given that I hadn't said
> I was okay. (I had figured that, if something were really wrong,
> someone else would have had to call him -- so by definition, if I
> called, I was okay. Apparently not.) He bought the supplies, though.
> I burbled on happily about the clinic while devouring a cheeseburger,
> then showered and let him at the cut.
>
> Hydrogen peroxide hurts worse than alcohol.
>
> Anyway, the plan is still for me to play hockey tonight, and I have a
> private hockey lesson tomorrow, so hopefully I can deal with the pain.
>
> As for clipless, hrmph. I do like them for some purposes, but when the
> going gets technical, I'm always out of them. I've ordered Zilla's
> suggestion, the shimano multi-release cleats, so we'll see if those help
> matters. Certainly, parts of the trail we did at white ranch were much
> more difficult than the stuff I normally do.
>


Look at Green Mt., Bear Creek, Deer Creek as easy rides somewhat more
technical and maybe closer would be Walker Ranch (one of my favorite is
Super Walker - start at Einstien's Bagles ride to Walker and do two loops
counter clockwise (start down the hill) and back down), I have heard Hall
Ranch is in the mid technical but I have never ridden Hall Ranch. When you
are really feeling spry try Dakota Ridge...

BTW White Ranch is my favorite... start a Hwy 93 and climb climb climb to
the top of Belcher Hill many trails up there. Myself and a friend tried to
ride them all in a day without backtracking (no more than we had to) and
ended up getting close to 28 miles... We are so lucky to live on the front
range when it comes to riding...

> Oh, and, after seeing how easy it was for Troy to get at my bike using a
> stand, I'm pretty sure I'm gonna buy one. He uses one made by Ultimate;
> I think it's this one:


The Ultimate stands rock! Go to Performance in Boulder (I think that is
where you are loacated???) I bought mine the Ultimate Pro for around 160.00
on sale. They were cheaper than any others even Excel Sports...

>
>

<http://www.beyondbikes.com/bb/ba/asp/ic.AC-TOO-brs-80r/ab/Itemdesc.htm?link
=bestwb>
>
> Can't really afford it this second, but it's on my list.
>
> --
> monique


Good luck, sound like you are on the right single track...

-p
 
On 2004-05-10, BB penned:
>
> Huh...I wouldn't be asking anyone to switch to clipless on a very
> technical ride unless they're already very comfortable with them on
> just slightly less-technical rides rides.


I think she wanted them specifically for the bunny hop practice. Yes, I
know that plenty of people bunny hop without benefit of attachment
mechanism, but I think the idea was to get us to feel progress quickly.
Also, the traction pins on my platforms make me really nervous about
trying a bunny hop, just in case I slide off the pedals.

> Roots & things at a diagonal angle are always tough...worse going
> uphill I think.


Probably. My particular mishap was on a downhill.

It's always interesting to see what scares people. I certainly have had
my share of slow downhill descents, but I literally can't remember ever
having walked my bike downhill. At least, not more than a couple of
paces. Whereas it turns out that some people really get freaked out by
downhill, especially when there are obstacles involved. It's just
interesting.

>> Hydrogen peroxide hurts worse than alcohol.

> I don't recall much of anything hurting worse than alcohol!


Well, it definitely didn't hurt less! In both cases, there was lots of
barely-supressed screaming, foot stomping, and tight grip on random
nearby objects.


--
monique
 
On 2004-05-10, gabrielle penned:
>
> I can't remember if you were using plain platforms or cages? I tried
> clipless once. Scared the **** out of me. (I have cages.)


Platforms with traction pins, which are really just screw ends sticking
out of the metal.

Cages scare the **** out of me, without ever having tried them. Can't
say that I can explain it.

There was a woman using cages at the clinic. She found it really hard
to do the rear-wheel portion of the bunny hop. We tried tightening them
down, but then she just had trouble getting into them when starting. If
I understand proper, non-clipless-reliant bunny hops, you want to angle
your feet in order to get good contact ... just one more thing to think
about, and pretty frustrating thing for her, it seemed.

> Glad you enjoyed the camp. I can't make it to any of them this
> summer--they've either been canceled or I have something else to do
> that weekend.


Doh =/ Well, this was my first, but I'm pretty sure it won't be my
last!

--
monique
 
On 2004-05-10, Pippen penned:

[misc. snippage]

> Back in 1993 I had my first ride with clipless pedals on White Ranch.
> That was back before CamelBaks were popular and I was carrying a
> banana in my ***** pack (it was 92'). Anyhow by the end of the ride
> the banana had turned to a pudding consistancy (spent some time on my
> butt)... Not sure if I would recommend WR as a place to break in
> clipless pedals but stay with them, they make a world of difference.


I was kind of surprised to see that we were at White Ranch at all for a
beginner class. Most of what we did were parking lot drills and fire
roads, but the one real trail was killer ... and I'm sure it was one of
the easier ones out there, to hear people talk!

> I'm sure the person who put the clinic on informed you to go to a
> grassy park and practice clipping in and out of your pedals until you
> no longer had to think about how to get in and out of them... and not
> to put a stiff arm out to catch you falls...


It wasn't the first time I'd used clipless. I had them on my bike from
the get-go, then got frustrated and switched to platforms after a couple
of months. Not so much because I was falling, but because I would spend
all of my time on uphills and before obstacles dithering about whether
I should be in or out of my pedals, screwing up my focus enough that I
always biffed whatever I was trying to do.

It was definitely gratifying to see that my balance has improved. It's
a lot easier to use clipless when you can stay upright for a fraction of
a second than it is when you have no stability whatsoever.

> Some of the LBS have free clinics on bike maintence... Plug for one of
> our sponsor's (Green Mountain Sports) is they even put on a women's
> only bike maintence clinic... There last one women's only was last
> Wednesday. Good stuff to know! Beats pushing your bike back to the
> vechicle.


I happened to notice today that our local YMCA has a maintenance class
in a week or so -- free to members. I'll have to check it out. If I
don't make it to that one, or if I'm not satisfied, I'll give GMS a
ring.

> Wait till your significant other gets a call from the hospital... my
> wife loves those...


No doubt ... kind of like I loved it when I saw Eric go down during a
hockey game and not get back up ...

This is the first time I've gone riding without Eric. In general, we
have fun riding together, so I think we're most likely to find out about
gruesome injuries first hand.

> Look at Green Mt., Bear Creek, Deer Creek as easy rides somewhat more
> technical and maybe closer would be Walker Ranch (one of my favorite
> is Super Walker - start at Einstien's Bagles ride to Walker and do two
> loops counter clockwise (start down the hill) and back down), I have
> heard Hall Ranch is in the mid technical but I have never ridden Hall
> Ranch. When you are really feeling spry try Dakota Ridge...


Do you know how they compare to Heil, Betasso, and Rabbit Mountain?
Those are the ones I've frequented so far, and they're nice and close --
Heil being a ten minute drive from our house in Longmont.

A friend whom I ride with, and who is much better both in terms of skill
and fitness, found Hall a chore. So I may wait on that one =) Thanks
for the tips, though. It's always good to hear about new places.

> BTW White Ranch is my favorite... start a Hwy 93 and climb climb climb
> to the top of Belcher Hill many trails up there. Myself and a friend
> tried to ride them all in a day without backtracking (no more than we
> had to) and ended up getting close to 28 miles... We are so lucky to
> live on the front range when it comes to riding...


Nice!

This setup started from the top (west entrance), so that we could play
on the fireroads a bit and get our confidence up.

> The Ultimate stands rock! Go to Performance in Boulder (I think that
> is where you are loacated???) I bought mine the Ultimate Pro for
> around 160.00 on sale. They were cheaper than any others even Excel
> Sports...


I'll have to check them out. Do you endorse them as a decent bike shop?
I've been having some pressure issues with my saddle, and Tonya said to
insist on getting gear from a shop that will let you try before you buy.
I guess it hadn't even occured to me that some stores would let you do
that ...

> Good luck, sound like you are on the right single track...


Working on it =)

--
monique
 
Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
> Tonya Laffey, pro racer, taught this clinic. Read more about her and
> her team here: http://www.mtbchick.com/
>
> I heard about the clinic from the Singletrack Sistahs group. More
> info here: http://www.singletracksistahs.com/
>
> This was ostensibly a four-hour beginner's clinic, from 9 to 1. I'd
> never been to white ranch park before; I thought I'd left myself
> plenty of time, but got to the Western parking lot at 9 on the dot.
> Two other students were there; Tonya never teaches more than five at
> a time by herself.
>
> What can I say? It was a really good clinic. Tonya's husband and
> mechanic, Troy, tuned up our bikes as we talked about our experience
> levels. Tonya strongly encouraged me to switch to my clipless pedals,
> so I did ...
>
> This experience was really good. While I don't think anything she
> told me was news, it really helped to have an expert standing there,
> watching, encouraging me. I always feel guilty when my friends have
> to wait for me because I'm trying something; this way, all of us
> students were in the same boat, and we knew that Tonya was there for
> us. There just wasn't any pressure to hurry up and move on.

<SNIP>

This is great stuff. My riding club does beginner clinics every month.
It's a great help to everyone and an easy way to introduce new people into
MTB.

> As for clipless, hrmph. I do like them for some purposes, but when
> the going gets technical, I'm always out of them. I've ordered
> Zilla's suggestion, the shimano multi-release cleats, so we'll see if
> those help matters. Certainly, parts of the trail we did at white
> ranch were much more difficult than the stuff I normally do.


I LOVE multirelease! They saved my limbs many times! Eventually though
you'll end up making the adjustments so tight you'll move to single release.

BTW, How was Vail?

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws
 
Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
> On 2004-05-10, BB penned:
>>

<SNIP>

> It's always interesting to see what scares people. I certainly have
> had my share of slow downhill descents, but I literally can't
> remember ever having walked my bike downhill. At least, not more
> than a couple of paces. Whereas it turns out that some people really
> get freaked out by downhill, especially when there are obstacles
> involved. It's just interesting.
>


Cliffside DH scares the S*** out of me. I have to get over my fear of
heights.
 
On 2004-05-10, Ride-A-Lot penned:
>
>
>
> This is great stuff. My riding club does beginner clinics every
> month. It's a great help to everyone and an easy way to introduce new
> people into MTB.


It was definitely fun, and at $50 for 4 hours of riding, plus bike
tune-ups on the side, I don't think Tonya and Troy are in it for the
money. They probably spent a good chunk of that on the snacks they
brought along for us =P Damn generous of them to spend their "spare"
time this way.

> I LOVE multirelease! They saved my limbs many times! Eventually
> though you'll end up making the adjustments so tight you'll move to
> single release.


It's always possible. Let's see if I can even hack multi, first =P

> BTW, How was Vail?


Warm and sticky. Eric had a blast; I was less enthused. Some of the
back bowls were tons of fun, but skiing down the bottom half of the
front was not recommended, and the one time I did so, I had a completely
miserable time of it. Seventy degree weather just doesn't put me in the
mood to ski.

It was nice just to have some dedicated time together, though.

--
monique
 
On Mon, 10 May 2004 05:46:59 +0000, Monique Y. Mudama wrote:

> Cages scare the **** out of me, without ever having tried them. Can't
> say that I can explain it.


I started using them 14 years ago (OMG...it really has been that long)
because I had a little episode hitting a bump. I lost 3 of my 5 points of
contact with the bike, and when my butt landed on my seat my feet didn't
hit the pedals in the proper way. I'll show you the scars some day. ;)

Currently I am wear-testing some shoes that have velcro straps. I love
the way the shoes fit, but the velcro has hung up on my cage straps on
more than one occasion...scaaaarrrrry! One of the chicks I ride with is
trying to convince me to try clipless. I think she has the multi-release
ones you were talking about. They don't seem too bad. I may make her a
deal that if she starts riding the narrow bridges over the creeks here,
I'll try the clip-ins. :)

> If
> I understand proper, non-clipless-reliant bunny hops, you want to angle
> your feet in order to get good contact ... just one more thing to think
> about, and pretty frustrating thing for her, it seemed.


Yeah, my bike courier buddies tried to teach that to me ages ago. Never
quite got the hang of it. :)

> Doh =/ Well, this was my first, but I'm pretty sure it won't be my
> last!

It's a good way to make biking buddies too.

gabrielle
 
On Mon, 10 May 2004 05:39:30 -0000, Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
> On 2004-05-10, BB penned:


> I think she wanted them specifically for the bunny hop practice.


Ah, makes sense...

> Also, the traction pins on my platforms make me really nervous about
> trying a bunny hop, just in case I slide off the pedals.


No doubt. Many of the scars on my shins are from those days.

>> Roots & things at a diagonal angle are always tough...worse going
>> uphill I think.

>
> Probably. My particular mishap was on a downhill.


Guess I'm not following her logic about going perpendicular - I don't
recall it ever being much of an issue on a downhill (unless its a real
monster drop).

> It's always interesting to see what scares people. I certainly have had
> my share of slow downhill descents, but I literally can't remember ever
> having walked my bike downhill. At least, not more than a couple of
> paces. Whereas it turns out that some people really get freaked out by
> downhill, especially when there are obstacles involved. It's just
> interesting.


Depends on the downhill. Really sharp switchbacks that slope off to a
huge dropoff scare the **** out of me, but being near a cliff scares the
**** out of me anyway. And after going over the bars countless times, I
have to admit that I'm finding steep dowhills with obstacles less and less
attractive now that I'm older and healing takes longer. Sometimes slow is
not an option!

--
-BB-
To reply to me, drop the attitude (from my e-mail address, at least)
 
Ride-A-Lot <[email protected]> wrote:
> Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
>> Tonya Laffey, pro racer, taught this clinic. Read more about her and
>> her team here: http://www.mtbchick.com/
>>
>> I heard about the clinic from the Singletrack Sistahs group. More
>> info here: http://www.singletracksistahs.com/
>>
>> This was ostensibly a four-hour beginner's clinic, from 9 to 1. I'd
>> never been to white ranch park before; I thought I'd left myself
>> plenty of time, but got to the Western parking lot at 9 on the dot.
>> Two other students were there; Tonya never teaches more than five at
>> a time by herself.
>>
>> What can I say? It was a really good clinic. Tonya's husband and
>> mechanic, Troy, tuned up our bikes as we talked about our experience
>> levels. Tonya strongly encouraged me to switch to my clipless
>> pedals, so I did ...
>>
>> This experience was really good. While I don't think anything she
>> told me was news, it really helped to have an expert standing there,
>> watching, encouraging me. I always feel guilty when my friends have
>> to wait for me because I'm trying something; this way, all of us
>> students were in the same boat, and we knew that Tonya was there for
>> us. There just wasn't any pressure to hurry up and move on.

> <SNIP>
>
> This is great stuff. My riding club does beginner clinics every
> month. It's a great help to everyone and an easy way to introduce new
> people into MTB.
>
>> As for clipless, hrmph. I do like them for some purposes, but when
>> the going gets technical, I'm always out of them. I've ordered
>> Zilla's suggestion, the shimano multi-release cleats, so we'll see if
>> those help matters. Certainly, parts of the trail we did at white
>> ranch were much more difficult than the stuff I normally do.

>
> I LOVE multirelease! They saved my limbs many times! Eventually
> though you'll end up making the adjustments so tight you'll move to
> single release.
>
> BTW, How was Vail?
>
> --
> o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
> www.schnauzers.ws


I still have my SH-55 cleats, and yes my M520 pedals are getting tighter.

--
- Zilla
Cary, NC
(Remove XSPAM)
 
On 2004-05-10, Ride-A-Lot penned:
>
>
> Cliffside DH scares the S*** out of me. I have to get over my fear of
> heights.
>


Excuse my slowness ... do you have a picture? My first mental image is
literally riding down a cliff face, but I don't think that's what you
mean.

--
monique
 
On 2004-05-11, BB penned:
> On Mon, 10 May 2004 05:39:30 -0000, Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
>>
>> Probably. My particular mishap was on a downhill.

>
> Guess I'm not following her logic about going perpendicular - I don't
> recall it ever being much of an issue on a downhill (unless its a real
> monster drop).


You know, thinking about it, I don't recall if she originally said it
while going uphill or what. You're probably right, and I probably just
latched on to "waterbar perpendicular" and, well, there you have it.

Any errors are most assuredly my errors in memory, not her errors in
teaching =)

> Depends on the downhill. Really sharp switchbacks that slope off to a
> huge dropoff scare the **** out of me, but being near a cliff scares
> the **** out of me anyway. And after going over the bars countless
> times, I have to admit that I'm finding steep dowhills with obstacles
> less and less attractive now that I'm older and healing takes longer.
> Sometimes slow is not an option!


I don't know that I've had to deal with sharp switchbacks combined with
serious dropoffs before -- and that's probably the only reason I'm not
yet terrified of them =)

I've been really lucky so far in the going-over-the-bars category -- the
only time I've come close was this clinic Sunday, and I honestly don't
recall the details except I think that I was trying something while
Tonya watched from the side of the trail, and I was going slow enough
that she managed to stop me as I was about to flip over. But that seems
really unbelievable. But it's what I remember.

I'm sure that my definition of "steep downhills with obstacles" is quite
a bit different than yours, but the idea of losing control in such a
situation is pretty ugly to me, too. Still, it's so much fun riding
down something that's just barely within my ability levels ...

--
monique
 
On 2004-05-11, Zilla penned:
>
> I still have my SH-55 cleats, and yes my M520 pedals are getting
> tighter.
>


I just checked, and my pedals are M515, which is on the list of
acceptables for the 55s. (Always good to be sure.) I don't see the
M515 listed on shimano's site, but I assume that they're appropriate for
me. (I seem to recall Troy, Tonya's husband/mechanic, saying something
about how the M models tend to be more grippy (than what, I don't know;
I assume M stands for mountain).)

Hrm, come to think about it, I don't recall the process of introducing
cleats to my shoes. Is there an obvious way that they fit in
one-size-fits-all fashion, or is there a fitting process for angles or
some such? Can I try to eyeball them to match the existing setup? How
do I know if they're not set up properly?

--
monique
 
On 2004-05-10, gabrielle penned:
> On Mon, 10 May 2004 05:46:59 +0000, Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
>
>> Cages scare the **** out of me, without ever having tried them.
>> Can't say that I can explain it.

>
> I started using them 14 years ago (OMG...it really has been that long)
> because I had a little episode hitting a bump. I lost 3 of my 5
> points of contact with the bike, and when my butt landed on my seat my
> feet didn't hit the pedals in the proper way. I'll show you the scars
> some day. ;)


Scars are good =) Er, I mean, that's awful!

It's amazing what we put up with for the sheer joy of riding our bikes
....

> Currently I am wear-testing some shoes that have velcro straps. I
> love the way the shoes fit, but the velcro has hung up on my cage
> straps on more than one occasion...scaaaarrrrry! One of the chicks I
> ride with is trying to convince me to try clipless. I think she has
> the multi-release ones you were talking about. They don't seem too
> bad. I may make her a deal that if she starts riding the narrow
> bridges over the creeks here, I'll try the clip-ins. :)


Ugh. Getting stuck in your straps sounds much worse than clipless.

One thing -- clipless seem a lot less scary to me now that I've had a
year to get used to balancing my bike. Okay, not quite a year, and
minus the winter months, but anyway, better balance = less scary. With
as much experience as you have, I'd imagine they'd be a lot less scary
to you, because you can probably keep your balance at a standstill much
longer than my newbie self can. The scary thing is when you stop,
realize that you haven't clipped out, and realize that you have
absolutely no ability to balance whatsoever.

Troy said that, when he was learning clipless, he got next to a
telephone pole and held onto the pole while clipping in and out for an
hour. Eric has suggested finding some grass to ride in and braking to a
complete stop, then unclipping. Both sound like good suggestions, but I
haven't tried them thus far.


--
monique
 
Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
> On 2004-05-11, Zilla penned:
>>
>> I still have my SH-55 cleats, and yes my M520 pedals are getting
>> tighter.
>>

>
> I just checked, and my pedals are M515, which is on the list of
> acceptables for the 55s. (Always good to be sure.) I don't see the
> M515 listed on shimano's site, but I assume that they're appropriate
> for me. (I seem to recall Troy, Tonya's husband/mechanic, saying
> something about how the M models tend to be more grippy (than what, I
> don't know; I assume M stands for mountain).)
>
> Hrm, come to think about it, I don't recall the process of introducing
> cleats to my shoes. Is there an obvious way that they fit in
> one-size-fits-all fashion, or is there a fitting process for angles or
> some such? Can I try to eyeball them to match the existing setup?
> How do I know if they're not set up properly?


I use M520 on one bike and M959 on another. Both accept the multirelease.
Some say that the proper adjustment of the cleat on your shoe is science. I
say it's comfort. After my third pair of shoes, I am able to find the sweet
spot easily. I like to ride with my foot a little more forward than other
people, probably because I am flat footed and it makes my arch feel better.
Start in the middle and move the cleat a little until it feels right for
you. You may have to adjust them again after a long ride if you find it a
little painful.

If you want to do it the science way, go to your LBS who'll put it near the
ball of your foot (which is painful for me) or you can try it yourself:

Fore/aft
The cleat should be positioned so that the balls of your feet rest over the
centers of the pedals (the axles) when you're pedaling. Sight from the top
when you're on the bike to check this (hold your feet level). The balls of
your feet form protrusions on the insides of the shoes and these should rest
right over the axles. If not, adjust the cleats as needed.
Angular
Ideally, your cleat position allows resting your feet in a natural position
on the pedals. Otherwise, you could injure your knees. Usually, aligning the
cleats with an imaginary line that bisects the soles provides a safe
starting position. But, go for some very easy rides to check the position
and ensure it's right for your knees. If you feel any stress or strain,
change the angle slightly to eliminate discomfort.

Notes


a.. When you've found an ideal cleat position, trace lines around the cleats
so you can easily replace a worn cleat and reposition a loose one.


--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws
 
"Monique Y. Mudama" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2004-05-11, Zilla penned:
> >
> > I still have my SH-55 cleats, and yes my M520 pedals are getting
> > tighter.
> >

>
> I just checked, and my pedals are M515, which is on the list of
> acceptables for the 55s. (Always good to be sure.) I don't see the
> M515 listed on shimano's site, but I assume that they're appropriate for
> me. (I seem to recall Troy, Tonya's husband/mechanic, saying something
> about how the M models tend to be more grippy (than what, I don't know;
> I assume M stands for mountain).)
>
> Hrm, come to think about it, I don't recall the process of introducing
> cleats to my shoes. Is there an obvious way that they fit in
> one-size-fits-all fashion, or is there a fitting process for angles or
> some such? Can I try to eyeball them to match the existing setup? How
> do I know if they're not set up properly?
>
> --
> monique


According to "Bike Chick" of Bicycling Mag., the "unofficial" way to fit
cleats is to lie on your stomach on your bed with your feet dangling off
the bed. This gives them their "natural" angle. You should then mount
your cleats so you mimic this angle when your clipped to the bike. I just
kept messing with the angle until it felt right for me. And yes SH-55 cleats
are compatible with M515s, which is what I have on my roadie.

--
- Zilla
Cary, NC
(Remove XSPAM)
 
Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
> On 2004-05-11, BB penned:
>
>>On Mon, 10 May 2004 05:39:30 -0000, Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
>>
>>>Probably. My particular mishap was on a downhill.

>>
>>Guess I'm not following her logic about going perpendicular - I don't
>>recall it ever being much of an issue on a downhill (unless its a real
>>monster drop).

>
>
> You know, thinking about it, I don't recall if she originally said it
> while going uphill or what. You're probably right, and I probably just
> latched on to "waterbar perpendicular" and, well, there you have it.
>
> Any errors are most assuredly my errors in memory, not her errors in
> teaching =)
>
>
>>Depends on the downhill. Really sharp switchbacks that slope off to a
>>huge dropoff scare the **** out of me, but being near a cliff scares
>>the **** out of me anyway. And after going over the bars countless
>>times, I have to admit that I'm finding steep dowhills with obstacles
>>less and less attractive now that I'm older and healing takes longer.
>>Sometimes slow is not an option!

>
>
> I don't know that I've had to deal with sharp switchbacks combined with
> serious dropoffs before -- and that's probably the only reason I'm not
> yet terrified of them =)


To avoid the terror part, but learn switchbacks, go to Apex park (if you
haven't yet).
http://www.co.jefferson.co.us/ext/dpt/comm_res/openspac/apex.htm
Lots of switchbacks, no cliffs.

Cheers,
Shawn