Whither Goest Carl Fogel?

[John Dacey]

Oh! young Forgulous had come out of the West.
Of RBT authors, his screed was the best.
And save his good grammar, he weapons had none;
From home in the suburbs, he wrote all alone.
His bons mots were perfect and never would cuss,
There never was poster like young Forgulous.

Regaling with gusto his Roadmaster's feats,
Extolling the virtues of Vivaldi's bleats,
No trifle too small for an extended thread,
He'd cheerily whip any horse long since dead.
In fact, any topic you'd care to discuss,
Would scarce go unnoted by young Forgulous.

He took on all comers, no matter how grand:
The brahmans and moguls of RBT land.
At his poems however, one might look askance-
Too willingly putting ass in assonance.
Rules of rhyme or meter could never nonplus
Our poet of merit, the young Forgulous.

But now he's gone missing, a real knight errant;
Let's wish he's not come to some end abhorrent.
Or to let himself by some bully be bowed
Into exile from cycling's online abode.
Whatever the matter, whatever the fuss,
I hope we've not seen last of young Forgulous.

**************************************
With the usual apologies to the original:
http://www.bartleby.com/41/442.html
Lochinvar, Sir Walter Scott
**************************************

-------------------------------
John Dacey
Business Cycles, Miami, Florida
Since 1983
Comprehensive catalogue of track equipment: online since 1996
http://www.businesscycles.com
-------------------------------

 

[dvt]

John Dacey wrote:
> Oh! young Forgulous had come out of the West.
> Of RBT authors, his screed was the best.

Great work, John. I thought a screed was a leveling device, but I see it
has another meaning:

"An harangue; a long tirade on any subject. [1913 Webster]"

You couldn't have picked a more appropriate word.

--
Dave
dvt at psu dot edu

 

[Dan]

I asked Carl and he says he is ok but gone from here - it sounds like he
does not plan to return.

 

[JJ]

"John Dacey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Oh! young Forgulous had come out of the West.
> Of RBT authors, his screed was the best.
> And save his good grammar, he weapons had none;
> From home in the suburbs, he wrote all alone.
> His bons mots were perfect and never would cuss,
> There never was poster like young Forgulous.
>
> Regaling with gusto his Roadmaster's feats,
> Extolling the virtues of Vivaldi's bleats,
> No trifle too small for an extended thread,
> He'd cheerily whip any horse long since dead.
> In fact, any topic you'd care to discuss,
> Would scarce go unnoted by young Forgulous.
>
> He took on all comers, no matter how grand:
> The brahmans and moguls of RBT land.
> At his poems however, one might look askance-
> Too willingly putting ass in assonance.
> Rules of rhyme or meter could never nonplus
> Our poet of merit, the young Forgulous.
>
> But now he's gone missing, a real knight errant;
> Let's wish he's not come to some end abhorrent.
> Or to let himself by some bully be bowed
> Into exile from cycling's online abode.
> Whatever the matter, whatever the fuss,
> I hope we've not seen last of young Forgulous.
>
> **************************************
> With the usual apologies to the original:
> http://www.bartleby.com/41/442.html
> Lochinvar, Sir Walter Scott
> **************************************
>
> -------------------------------
> John Dacey
> Business Cycles, Miami, Florida
> Since 1983
> Comprehensive catalogue of track equipment: online since 1996
> http://www.businesscycles.com
> -------------------------------

No, ya gotta start it out with: "Dear Reader,"

 

[Werehatrack]

On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 16:37:45 -0400, John Dacey
<[email protected]> wrote:

[ pottery, er, poetry snipped to save bandwidth]

>**************************************
>With the usual apologies to the original:
>http://www.bartleby.com/41/442.html
>Lochinvar, Sir Walter Scott
>**************************************

You, sir, need to go to a filk convention sometime.


--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

 

[Werehatrack]

On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 15:17:14 -0700, "Dan" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>I asked Carl and he says he is ok but gone from here - it sounds like he
>does not plan to return.

Rats.


--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.

 

[Kenny]

I think he let ol' man Jobst get to him.

 

[[email protected]]

Kenny wrote:
> I think he let ol' man Jobst get to him.

I think you are correct.

Not that ol' man Jobst doesn't need somebody to keep his massive ego in
check...

Carl was just the man for the job - always cutting right to the heart
of Jobst's BS.

E.P.

 

[Art Harris]

John Dacey wrote:

> Whither Goest Carl Fogel?

I don't know.

But more importantly, what became of Andrew Muzi? Haven't seen his
insightful posts here in quite a while.

Art Harris

 

[dvt]

Art Harris wrote:
> But more importantly, what became of Andrew Muzi? Haven't seen his
> insightful posts here in quite a while.

I asked Andrew some generator light questions recently, and he said his
shop has been crazy busy. He hasn't had the time to grace us with his
presence.

--
Dave
dvt at psu dot edu

 

[Sheldon Brown]

Dear John, you wrote:

> Oh! young Forgulous had come out of the West.
> Of RBT authors, his screed was the best...

A fine piece of work, but I must take you to task for the grammatical
error in the "Subject:" heading.

"Goest" is the second person singular conjugation of "to go", as in
"whither goest thou?"

I think you really meant "Whither Goeth Carl Fogel."

Sheldon "Pedantry" Brown
+---------------------------------------------------+
| Even if you do learn to speak correct English, |
| whom are you going to speak it to? |
| --Clarence Darrow |
+---------------------------------------------------+
Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts
Phone 617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041
http://harriscyclery.com
Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
http://captainbike.com http://sheldonbrown.com

 

[Cam]

This ought to bring him out.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/SHOWBIZ/books/10/19/shakespeare.ebate.ap/index.html
Who wrote Shakespeare this time?
New book claims plays written by Sir Henry Neville

Wednesday, October 19, 2005; Posted: 11:12 a.m. EDT (15:12 GMT)

A small academic industry has developed to prove that William
Shakespeare, a provincial lad from Stratford-upon-Avon, could not have
written the much-loved plays that bear his name.

The "real" author has been identified by various writers as Christopher
Marlowe, Francis Bacon and the Earl of Oxford, Edward de Vere.

Now, a new book claims that the real Bard was Sir Henry Neville, an
English courtier and distant relative of the Stratford Shakespeare.
Shakespeare himself was simply a front man, claim Brenda James and
William Rubinstein in "The Truth Will Out: Unmasking the Real
Shakespeare." The book was recently published in Great Britain; it has
yet to be released in the United States.

James, an English literature lecturer, said Neville "wanted (the plays)
to go under another name and wanted a poor relation to have a hand up."

James and Rubinstein, a professor of history at the University of
Wales, Aberystwyth, argue that Shakespeare of Stratford, who came from
a modest background and did not attend university, could not have had
enough knowledge of the politics, foreign languages and European cities
described in the plays to have written them.

Neville, in contrast, was well-educated, had traveled to all the
countries used as settings in the plays and had a life that matched up
with what "Shakespeare" was writing about at the time, the book says.

"The more we looked into his life, the more convincing the matchup
became," Rubinstein said.

James said that she began exploring the connection between Shakespeare
and Neville about six years ago when she deciphered what she believes
is a code on the dedication page of Shakespeare's sonnets. The code
revealed the name Henry Neville.

"I thought I must be seeing things; nobody's ever heard of Henry
Neville. To my great surprise, his birth and death dates were almost
the same as Shakespeare's," she said.

Further research turned up more evidence pointing to Neville, who
served for a time as ambassador to France.

The authors say Neville's life helps explain a switch in Shakespeare's
plays, from histories and comedies to tragedies, at the turn of the
17th century. Neville was imprisoned in the Tower of London from 1601
to 1603 for his role in the Essex rebellion (the attempt by the Earl of
Essex and his supporters to overthrow Queen Elizabeth I), which the
authors say accounts for the more tragic tone of "Hamlet," written in
1601 and 1602, and the plays that follow.

'Shakespeare wrote Shakespeare'
Many Shakespeare experts dismiss the theory.

"Like most previous theories that challenge Shakespeare's authorship of
the plays, this claim makes the mistake of assuming his education and
general knowledge of the world were very limited," said Roger Pringle,
director of the Shakespeare Birthplace Trust in Stratford. "There is
plenty of evidence to suggest Shakespeare received a thoroughly good
classical education at the Stratford grammar school and then, for well
over 20 years, was involved in artistic and intellectual circles in
London."

Jonathan Bate, a professor of literary studies at Warwick University
and author of "The Genius of Shakespeare," said, "There's not a shred
of evidence in support of the argument; it's full of errors. There's no
reason to doubt that Shakespeare wrote Shakespeare."

Bate said the authorship question emerged more than 100 years ago "out
of snobbery."

"People began to say, 'How could a middle-class grammar school boy from
the provinces write these plays?' " he said. "It shows how Shakespeare
has become such a cult figure. The moment Shakespeare becomes regarded
as the greatest of all writers, inevitably heresies start emerging."

But Mark Rylance, artistic director of Shakespeare's Globe Theatre in
London, called the book "pioneering."

"As this book rightly suggests, if the plays had not been attributed to
Shakespeare in 1623, he would be the last person you would imagine able
to write such matter," he wrote in the book's foreword.

Rubinstein said he hoped those who were convinced that Shakespeare
wrote his own plays would consider the evidence rationally.

"What they must do is explain all the inconsistencies and inadequacies
of Shakespeare's life as it's known to us and use it to explain the
plays," he said.

Copyright 2005 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.This material
may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.

 

[Jasper Janssen]

On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 15:17:14 -0700, "Dan" <[email protected]> wrote:

>I asked Carl and he says he is ok but gone from here - it sounds like he
>does not plan to return.

Did he say because of what? Or more to the point, who?

Jasper

 

[Jasper Janssen]

On 18 Oct 2005 21:36:23 -0700, "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I think you are correct.
>
>Not that ol' man Jobst doesn't need somebody to keep his massive ego in
>check...
>
>Carl was just the man for the job - always cutting right to the heart
>of Jobst's BS.

And you're trying desperately to fill his shoes, though failing?

Jasper

 

[[email protected]]

Jasper Janssen wrote:
> On 18 Oct 2005 21:36:23 -0700, "[email protected]"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >I think you are correct.
> >
> >Not that ol' man Jobst doesn't need somebody to keep his massive ego in
> >check...
> >
> >Carl was just the man for the job - always cutting right to the heart
> >of Jobst's BS.
>
> And you're trying desperately to fill his shoes, though failing?

Wow, jealousy.

If you want the job, take it. I didn't mean to horn in on your action.

E.P.

 

[Jay S. Hill]

Cam wrote:
> This ought to bring him out.
>
> http://www.cnn.com/2005/SHOWBIZ/books/10/19/shakespeare.ebate.ap/index.html
> Who wrote Shakespeare this time?
> New book claims plays written by Sir Henry Neville
>
What a load of ****. About every ten years someone writes a book with
this kind of premise, hoping to make some noise and a few bucks. And
the putative-writer-in-lieu-of-Shakespeare is always someone from the
upper classes, because we know that a middle-class guy like Will just
couldn't have what it takes. Pfft.

Some critic wrote that Will had "a first-rate mind running at white-hot
speed" (or something close to that). The guy was a genius working his
ass off. Zounds. Give him his props.

 

[Dave]

Good for him, though too bad for us. I noted his absence as well.

 

[John Dacey]

Sheldon "Barbarossa" Brown wrote:

>Dear John, you wrote:
>
>> Oh! young Forgulous had come out of the West.
>> Of RBT authors, his screed was the best...
>
>A fine piece of work, but I must take you to task for the grammatical
>error in the "Subject:" heading.
>
>"Goest" is the second person singular conjugation of "to go", as in
>"whither goest thou?"
>
>I think you really meant "Whither Goeth Carl Fogel."
>
>Sheldon "Pedantry" Brown

I suppose I could try to claim that it was just a typo that omitted
the comma from "Whither Goest, Carl Fogel?", but in fact you got me
dead to rights. I am suitably shamed.

-------------------------------
John Dacey
Business Cycles, Miami, Florida
Since 1983
Comprehensive catalogue of track equipment: online since 1996
http://www.businesscycles.com
-------------------------------

 

[Mark Janeba]

Jay S. Hill wrote:
> Cam wrote:
>
>> This ought to bring him out.
>>
>> http://www.cnn.com/2005/SHOWBIZ/books/10/19/shakespeare.ebate.ap/index.html
>>
>> Who wrote Shakespeare this time?
>> New book claims plays written by Sir Henry Neville
>>
> What a load of ****. About every ten years someone writes a book with
> this kind of premise, hoping to make some noise and a few bucks.

Exactly. Just like every June/July for the last several years, when the
Tour is in the news, we get sportswriters proclaiming that bicycle
racing is "not a sport" or that Armstrong is "not an athlete." As you
say, the writer is just looking for some attention or to sell some copy.

Mark

 

[41]

Jay S. Hill wrote:
> Cam wrote:
> > This ought to bring him out.
> >
> > http://www.cnn.com/2005/SHOWBIZ/books/10/19/shakespeare.ebate.ap/index.html
> > Who wrote Shakespeare this time?
> > New book claims plays written by Sir Henry Neville
> >
> What a load of ****. About every ten years someone writes a book with
> this kind of premise, hoping to make some noise and a few bucks. And
> the putative-writer-in-lieu-of-Shakespeare is always someone from the
> upper classes, because we know that a mid dle-class guy like Will just
> couldn't have what it takes. Pfft.

The question of Shakespeare's authorship has absolutely nothing to do
with his class. The proof of that is that Marlowe, who is the leading
alternate candidate for authorship, was born to a family of exactly the
same station in life as Shakespeare, in the same year, and attended
exactly the same sort of elementary school. Only, while such a school,
and Shakespeare's anonymous record there, is claimed to have sufficed
for the author of Shakespeare's plays, Marlowe instead excelled and
earned a scholarship to Cambridge, where he again excelled, and went on
to both great literary fame and great heroics, in fact saving England
from invasion, working overseas as a spy for Her Majesty's Secret
Service.

Shakespeare's authorship was questioned very early on- not just
starting 100 years ago- and later by for example, Mark Twain and Henry
James. People disbelieve he could be the author not because of his
class, but because of his life and how he led it. For example, not so
long ago PBS had a very good documentary by Michael Wood in support of
Shakespeare's authorship ("In Search of Shakespeare"). Unlike most of
those in favour, he actually tried to prove it by finding out about
Shakespeare's life, going in to dusty archives and so on. One thing he
found was that Shakespeare the actor/businessman was actually a devout
Catholic, i.e. a Papist. This should be shocking to those who believe
he wrote the plays. Being a devout Catholic in Elizabethan England was
no small thing. Yet anyone who has read Shakespeare's plays can
scarcely believe that the man who wrote them could fit such a
description, or that he was anything other than a devout atheist, or at
least agnostic.

Then there is the fact that Shakespeare the author/actor, despite the
fantastic female characters in Shakespeare's plays, somehow thought it
fit to raise two illiterate daughters. Or that, in his detailed and
exhaustive will, he left not one book, not one manuscript, not one
scrap of writing, not one item of any intellectual significance, to
anybody, and gave no indication that he ever posessed any.

One thing that everyone agrees upon is that Shakespeare the author was
a creative, proud genius. What is hard to understand then is why such a
man would plagiarize, casually and without any clue, word for word or
with slight variation, numerous passages from his rival Marlowe. Or why
he would adapt an entire play of Marlowe's- The Jew of Malta- and
recast it as one of his own, The Merchant of Venice. Of course the two
plays are not the same but they have enough in common and the second
clearly owes its theme to the first.

On the other hand, what supports the contention that Shakespeare was
the author? A tradition, which does not really begin contemporaneously;
an industry; and yes, a few, a very few, small items which one can see
paralleled between Shakespeare the actor/businessman's life and the
plays of Shakespeare. The question of authorship is not resolved either
way, yet, but the case for Shakespeare the actor/businessman's
authorship of Shakespeare plays is extraordinarily weak, almost
non-existent, and it's a shame that all the work on this matter has to
be done by amateur sleuthers, and not professional historians. If he is
the author then professionals should do him the dignity of showing it
concretely, and if he isn't, then how about getting it right?

PBS and Frontline have had some great specials on this, on both sides
of the argument:

<http://www.pbs.org/shakespeare/>
<http://www.pbs.org/shakespeare/events/>
<http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shakespeare/>
<http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/muchado/fine/>

Much better, and more serious, than what can be found in any academic
forum (essentially zero), thus far.