why is just armstrong accused of doping?

[Weisse Luft]

In spirit, taking some XYZ substance which isn't on the banned list might seem illegal. But as long as the list only states specific agents, their classes and actions, its legal. Ginseng, ginger and guarana extract are legal, to a limit.

The accusation of Lance using EPO is pure fantasy. EPO does only one thing and that is to increase hematocrit and evidence of its use is patently clear when the testing protocols are followed unless the cyclist has been living at Mt. Everest base camp for a month.

The Europeans who spew this rumor need to have the Allied victory over Nazi Germany reversed, just for their world.

 

[MGM]

"Chock full of drugs"? Pure fabrication. There is NO WAY for ANY drug use save EPO/blood doping to escape detection. No way.

While the semi-technical here know the sensivity of HPLC and GC-MS in detection of urine metabolites, there are other, more sensitive techniques which include ELISA based tests. But just like the aforementioned methods, a test can only look for known dopants. But I am waiting on the detractors here to identify what unknown and undectable dopants are in use. Please inform instead of speculating.

Who's to say lance (or any other rider) isn't using some sort of new doping substance, that is not tested for???

 

[MGM]

Who's to say lance (or any other rider) isn't using some sort of new doping substance, that is not tested for???

Just also wanted to mention, in the past 5 tours, the idea of lance doping has never crossed my mind. However, this year, I have really thought about it hard, and I think there are some compelling signs (to me) for and against his doping.

For 1, a thing that really stuck out to me is that lance ALWAYS had much more energy than any of his rivals at the end of the mountain stages. It was pretty shocking how he had the energy to be able to pull back Kloden.

However, I think to myself, and there is so much contradicting that. Lance has an amazing team, so he saves energy there, and also, his training prepares him very well for that situation.

So what gives?

 

[antoineg]

"Chock full of drugs"? Pure fabrication. There is NO WAY for ANY drug use save EPO/blood doping to escape detection. No way.

You are full of BS. David Millar admits to doping with EPO, yet (to my knowledge) has never tested positive. If you are so sure that there is NO WAY (to use your big capital letters) for EPO users to escape detection, then how does that happen?

Raimondas Rumsas' wife Edita was detained in 2002.

A police spokesman in Lyon said “an enormous amount of products” were seized from her car, including the injectable form of the performance enhancing substance EPO. Use of EPO is banned in sports.

Rumsas did not test positive until 2003. Can you believe that Rumsas was NOT taking EPO in 2002? If so, how did he evade the tests for a whole year (or more)?

 

[antoineg]

LOL -- In my haste I didn't read your message for the double negative. You are apparently saying that EPO users CAN evade doping tests.

So we are on the same page here.

 

[MGM]

LOL -- In my haste I didn't read your message for the double negative. You are apparently saying that EPO users CAN evade doping tests.

So we are on the same page here.

no he didnt say that

 

[antoineg]

no he didnt say that

I believe he did: (emphasis added by me)

There is NO WAY for ANY drug use save EPO/blood doping to escape detection.

So he's saying he believes that EPO and blood doping users can escape detection.

 

[Weisse Luft]

I believe he did: (emphasis added by me)



So he's saying he believes that EPO and blood doping users can escape detection.

To a LIMITED extent. The effects of EPO are IDENTICAL to high altitude training or simulants like hypobaric chambers, both total or partial pressure modifications. One can achieve a dangerous hematocrit from these permitted methods which is one reason it is tested.

 

[limerickman]

In spirit, taking some XYZ substance which isn't on the banned list might seem illegal. But as long as the list only states specific agents, their classes and actions, its legal. Ginseng, ginger and guarana extract are legal, to a limit.

.

Performance enhancing drug THG, was not on any proscribed IOC, USADA,
WADA list - yet the use of the drug is being used to prosecute those cheats who used it.

 

[wheresullrich?]

Anybody who thinks Lance and the rest of the Tour peloton is "clean" (as oppossed to "clear") is showing just how naive they are. Just because you are American I understand you want to believe that Lance is clean. Same applies for Aussies with McGee, the French with Virenque and Voecklar, the Brits with Millar... oops, I guess that one's been proven already...

In direct reply to the question "Why is only Armstrong accused of doping?", actually he is not. If you did a search on many of the rider's backgrounds you would find that many of them have been tainted with the doping brush... eg Ullrich was implicated in the Giro affair of 2002, we all know about Virenque, Brochard and the rest of the Festina gang, and so the list goes on...

My opinion is that the UCI does sweet FA in preventing, and I stress PREVENTING, doping from going on. Life ban I say.

One last thing, I wish the 'LA Confidential' book was available in English. I'd buy it for sure. It'd be great reading. Some truths revealed///...:::///

I meant that how come Armstrong is mass accused whereas other riders aren't.

Ullrich has had bad occasions yet they last nowhere near as long as lance's. And basso I may be wrong but i've heard nothing but how promising he is. No drugs mentioned just talent.

Armstrong is tormented by accusations whereas a lot of other riders appear to be unnoticed by the critics.

Why is this?

 

[Miguel_garcia83]

I meant that how come Armstrong is mass accused whereas other riders aren't.

Ullrich has had bad occasions yet they last nowhere near as long as lance's. And basso I may be wrong but i've heard nothing but how promising he is. No drugs mentioned just talent.

Armstrong is tormented by accusations whereas a lot of other riders appear to be unnoticed by the critics.

Why is this?

dont get me wrong, you dont seem to be very into cycling. basso was one of the best amateur riders i europe when he was amateur, was amateur world champion, plus...
tour of france 2002: 11th, best young rider
tour of france 2003: 7th
ullrich has an attitudes that lance didnt, well he does now, jan was the best time trialer in the world nowadays, in the last 8 years, well not counting armstrong that he didnt know what a time trial was until 1998

 

[RedSky]

I meant that how come Armstrong is mass accused whereas other riders aren't.

Ullrich has had bad occasions yet they last nowhere near as long as lance's. And basso I may be wrong but i've heard nothing but how promising he is. No drugs mentioned just talent.

Armstrong is tormented by accusations whereas a lot of other riders appear to be unnoticed by the critics.

Why is this?

I can give you six reasons.

 

[HuckFinn]

Ullrich doping?

There are two reasons I do not think so.

First - there is a random control system organized by Telekom, the sponsor. Telekom is very anti-doping. Every rider is tested randomly in the year, by independent organisations, without any connection to races, at least 8 times a year. One rider (Heppner) was randomly tested while on vacation in Australia. This was the reason Ullrich was tested positive for exstacy while being in a rehabilitation clinic far from any cycling.

Second - Ullrich does not live for cycling. He cycles for living. He isn't embarrased by being the 4th this year. Money flows in anyway. It would make no sense for him to dope, risk everything, when he could achieve similar improvings by just training earlier and better.

 

[wheresullrich?]

dont get me wrong, you dont seem to be very into cycling. basso was one of the best amateur riders i europe when he was amateur, was amateur world champion, plus...
tour of france 2002: 11th, best young rider
tour of france 2003: 7th
ullrich has an attitudes that lance didnt, well he does now, jan was the best time trialer in the world nowadays, in the last 8 years, well not counting armstrong that he didnt know what a time trial was until 1998

Excuse me not into cycling! I wouldn't be on here if i wasnt into cycling would i?
I'm well aware that Basso won the best youg rider in 2002 and came 2nd last year and so on. Lets remember lance armstrong was also world champion in his at the age of 21 in 1993 - obviously according to you this is not a big achievement.
so does the fact that Basso has done well before mean he's not doping- NO!
how does that work-it doesn't

Just because Ullrich is a good time trial rider, second behind lance that doesn't mean he's not doping either.
He's tested positive before
This year in the run up to the tour after he won the swiss tour I didnt hear one thing about him doping lance wins something and hes doping so why isn't ullrich?

 

[wheresullrich?]

Ullrich doping?

Second - Ullrich does not live for cycling. He cycles for living. He isn't embarrased by being the 4th this year. Money flows in anyway. It would make no sense for him to dope, risk everything, when he could achieve similar improvings by just training earlier and better.

I would be embarrassed after telling everyone all year I was gonna kick Lance's butt but then nobody even noticed I was in the race.

He's been disapointed with second for so long, he muct be disapointed with 4th

and maybe if he wants to live he should live for cycling but afterall he's not going to feel the same way as lance he's not been on the verge of death

 

[eleven24]

we are not as developed in spain as you are in usa, you are more into the latest doping advances( i said doping and not antidoping ), maybe caused of that development
when lance will die of a heart attack in few years while slepping, everybody will wonder what caused his death, well i wont, and maybe limerickman doesnt wonder either

And when Lance doesn't mysteriously die in his sleep? Will you be 90 years old telling everyone "You just wait, he's going to take a tumble and break a hip. THEN you'll all see".

 

[HuckFinn]

I would be embarrassed after telling everyone all year I was gonna kick Lance's butt but then nobody even noticed I was in the race.

He's been disapointed with second for so long, he muct be disapointed with 4th

and maybe if he wants to live he should live for cycling but afterall he's not going to feel the same way as lance he's not been on the verge of death

He didn't tell he would kick some ass.

Anyway. He is not very determined to win, and he has the body most gifted for cycling in the past 50 years (maybe except Eddie). No need to dope. Only a risk.

 

[Miguel_garcia83]

Excuse me not into cycling! I wouldn't be on here if i wasnt into cycling would i?
I'm well aware that Basso won the best youg rider in 2002 and came 2nd last year and so on. Lets remember lance armstrong was also world champion in his at the age of 21 in 1993 - obviously according to you this is not a big achievement.
so does the fact that Basso has done well before mean he's not doping- NO!
how does that work-it doesn't

Just because Ullrich is a good time trial rider, second behind lance that doesn't mean he's not doping either.
He's tested positive before
This year in the run up to the tour after he won the swiss tour I didnt hear one thing about him doping lance wins something and hes doping so why isn't ullrich?

ok right, you are into cycling, but you dont remember past facts
the world championship has nothing to do with the tour, oscar freire has won twice the world championship, was 2nd in another one and 3rd in another, he should win 36 tours then
ullrich has conditions, and always had, to win the tour of france, armstrong didnt until 1999

 

[meehs]

everybody knows east german sports system, do we know american system? is the system of kelly white, tim montgomery, marion jones, lance armstrong??
as i have said many times, there is no clean rider, but armstrong is the dirtiest

Hahaha!!! In your opinion he's the dirtiest Miguel. Unless you're in possession of evidence that has thus far eluded the rest of the world.

 

[Miguel_garcia83]

ok right, you are into cycling, but you dont remember past facts
the world championship has nothing to do with the tour, oscar freire has won twice the world championship, was 2nd in another one and 3rd in another, he should win 36 tours then
ullrich has conditions, and always had, to win the tour of france, armstrong didnt until 1999

bassos progression...
2002: 11th
2003: 7th
2004: 3rd

there is a normal progression, do you want a table with lances pregression?
he didnt time trial before 1999, he didnt climb before 1999, and all of a sudden he turnt into the best time trialer and the best climber