"Bacchetta" seat vs. M5 seat???

Discussion in 'Recumbent bicycles' started by Zonker, Jun 4, 2003.

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  1. Zonker

    Zonker Guest

    OK,

    I'm confused. The Bacchetta website says the Aero and Corsa are equipped with the M5 Carbon seat. On
    Hostel Shoppe's website the "Bacchetta seat" sells for 395.00 dollars and the M5 Carbon sells for
    255.00. What am I missing here? Assuming a logical answer, what am I getting for $140 more?

    Quizzical Giro owner
     
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  2. Cletus Lee

    Cletus Lee Guest

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > OK,
    >
    > I'm confused. The Bacchetta website says the Aero and Corsa are equipped with the M5 Carbon
    > seat. On Hostel Shoppe's website the "Bacchetta seat" sells for 395.00 dollars and the M5 Carbon
    > sells for
    > 255.00. What am I missing here? Assuming a logical answer, what am I getting for $140 more?

    The seats are different. They have a different purpose.

    I have a P-38 which can be had for $2600. and a Giro which is ~$1500 Did I get anything more for
    $1100? I don't think you are missing anything. If you want to put a lighter M5 CF seat on your Giro,
    you can for another $255. If I want to put a M5 seat on my P-38 I can for $255 and a lot of
    jury-rigging to adapt it.
    --

    Cletus D. Lee Bacchetta Giro Lightning Voyager http://www.clee.org
    - Bellaire, TX USA -
     
  3. [email protected] (Zonker) wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > OK,
    >
    > I'm confused. The Bacchetta website says the Aero and Corsa are equipped with the M5 Carbon
    > seat. On Hostel Shoppe's website the "Bacchetta seat" sells for 395.00 dollars and the M5 Carbon
    > sells for
    > 255.00. What am I missing here? Assuming a logical answer, what am I getting for $140 more?
    >
    > Quizzical Giro owner

    The M5 seat is just the blank seat shell (available in either fiberglass or carbon fiber) - it
    requires you to drill holes and engineer mounting hardware to fit your bike.

    Conversely, the Bacchetta Carbon seat is a direct bolt-on upgrade for Bacchetta owners that
    currently have bikes with mesh-backed or fiberglass seats. It includes seat foam and is pre-drilled
    and equipped with mounting hardware.

    Hope this helps,

    Erich Hartman Hostel Shoppe Recumbents http://www.hostelshoppe.com [email protected]
     
  4. Don

    Don Guest

    Zonker, You are confused :) The Bacchetta site lists the Corsa with the M5 Fiberglass seat and the
    Aero with M5 Carbon.

    My guess (just a guess) is on the Hostel Shoppe site the Bacchetta seat is sold complete with pad
    and hardware while the M5 seat is just the shell without pad and hardware. Just a guess. They could
    improve the detail a little. If they are not selling the pads then what good is the seat?

    That said, I am bummed because my local dealer has nothing for me to ride (nothing fits me) to try
    the M5 seat. I have a small Giro frameset on order and can still probably swap for an M5 seat but I
    have not been able to test the M5. The Giro seat on the medium I tested felt very comfortable for
    the short test ride but I am going to build this bike hot and fast and would like to shave some
    pounds from
    it.

    The frame is coming naked so I get to pick a hot color. A local car painter is going to do a
    paint-n-bake for me. I have already decided on Velocity Thracian wheels with Conti GP tires. Many
    other goodies will be on the bike but those are the two that will affect performance the most. Those
    and the 150-155mm Thorn cranks.

    Open to component suggestions. Still not sure what to do with the seat. So I am confused and
    conflicted. Don

    [email protected] (Zonker) wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > OK,
    >
    > I'm confused. The Bacchetta website says the Aero and Corsa are equipped with the M5 Carbon
    > seat. On Hostel Shoppe's website the "Bacchetta seat" sells for 395.00 dollars and the M5 Carbon
    > sells for
    > 255.00. What am I missing here? Assuming a logical answer, what am I getting for $140 more?
    >
    > Quizzical Giro owner
     
  5. Don

    Don Guest

    I forgot to mention the other big reason I would like an M5 fiberglass or carbon seat. It is not
    just a silly gram thing. Yes, it is a silly gram thing but not JUST a silly gram thing.

    The M5 seats are supposed to put the rider 1.5-2" lower (if I remember the numbers from Rich Pinto
    correctly). I could use the lower altitude thing. It would also increase the seat to BB elevation.
    The Giro elevation difference is somewhat mild so that may be an improvement (maybe not). I just
    know the "big boys" (Corsa, etc) have higher relative BBs and are alleged to climb well. So does the
    P38. I am concerned that if I have the seat too far forward (and therefore higher)I will not have
    enough elevation difference between seat and BB and it will be too similar to my Haluzak.

    Short cranks should keep me from being too high at the top of the stroke. That may be a not
    previously acknowledged contributor to short cranks giving suprisingly good performance. Maybe
    with high BBs the top of the stroke (I mean crank arms perpindicular to the ground) is just too
    darn high. I am already aware of knee compression when the crank arms are parallel to the ground.
    I will be borrowing a 150 TA crank to try out. That will let me know if that is the correct size
    or if I have to go slightly one way or the other. It will also let me make a better choice of
    chain ring sizes.
     
  6. Baronn1

    Baronn1 Guest

    The Giro climbs great (even) with the mesh back seat! I've owned a BikeE AT, a Haluzak hybrid race,
    and a RANS V2. The Giro outclimbs them all for me, YRMV. I'm sure you will love your Giro,
    especially all tricked out like you describe. ENJOY!

    "Don" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > I forgot to mention the other big reason I would like an M5 fiberglass or carbon seat. It is not
    > just a silly gram thing. Yes, it is a silly gram thing but not JUST a silly gram thing.
    >
    > The M5 seats are supposed to put the rider 1.5-2" lower (if I remember the numbers from Rich Pinto
    > correctly). I could use the lower altitude thing. It would also increase the seat to BB elevation.
    > The Giro elevation difference is somewhat mild so that may be an improvement (maybe not). I just
    > know the "big boys" (Corsa, etc) have higher relative BBs and are alleged to climb well. So does
    > the P38. I am concerned that if I have the seat too far forward (and therefore higher)I will not
    > have enough elevation difference between seat and BB and it will be too similar to my Haluzak.
    >
    > Short cranks should keep me from being too high at the top of the stroke. That may be a not
    > previously acknowledged contributor to short cranks giving suprisingly good performance. Maybe
    > with high BBs the top of the stroke (I mean crank arms perpindicular to the ground) is just too
    > darn high. I am already aware of knee compression when the crank arms are parallel to the ground.
    > I will be borrowing a 150 TA crank to try out. That will let me know if that is the correct size
    > or if I have to go slightly one way or the other. It will also let me make a better choice of
    > chain ring sizes.
     
  7. Don, You are correct the. The m5 seat will lower you about 1.5 inches. This is with the 2" open
    celled foam pad. I have a female customer who has my demo CF seat on her GIRO, her new FG seat is in
    the shop awaiting her arrival. The M5 seat took her from tip toe to flat footed. The M5 CF or FG
    seat is available as a blank or with Bacchetta hardware. The Bacchetta hardware don't come cheap.
    Although available the seats are going fast. The few I have are sold or dedicated to bikes in
    progress or planed. I am currently planning to offer a STRADA with an M5 seat. These are planned to
    be done in Mirror Black powdercoat. No two will be equipped exactly the same. I may well do a bright
    red GIRO with Thraicain wheelset and M5 seat in the future. However, In keeping with my deal with
    Bacchetta these will be shop only available, with some limited delivery by yours truly in the
    mid-atlantic.

    --
    Jude....///Bacchetta AERO St. Michaels and Tilghman Island.. Maryland Wheel Doctor Cycle and Sports,
    Inc 1-800-586-6645 "Don" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > I forgot to mention the other big reason I would like an M5 fiberglass or carbon seat. It is not
    > just a silly gram thing. Yes, it is a silly gram thing but not JUST a silly gram thing.
    >
    > The M5 seats are supposed to put the rider 1.5-2" lower (if I remember the numbers from Rich Pinto
    > correctly). I could use the lower altitude thing. It would also increase the seat to BB elevation.
    > The Giro elevation difference is somewhat mild so that may be an improvement (maybe not). I just
    > know the "big boys" (Corsa, etc) have higher relative BBs and are alleged to climb well. So does
    > the P38. I am concerned that if I have the seat too far forward (and therefore higher)I will not
    > have enough elevation difference between seat and BB and it will be too similar to my Haluzak.
    >
    > Short cranks should keep me from being too high at the top of the stroke. That may be a not
    > previously acknowledged contributor to short cranks giving suprisingly good performance. Maybe
    > with high BBs the top of the stroke (I mean crank arms perpindicular to the ground) is just too
    > darn high. I am already aware of knee compression when the crank arms are parallel to the ground.
    > I will be borrowing a 150 TA crank to try out. That will let me know if that is the correct size
    > or if I have to go slightly one way or the other. It will also let me make a better choice of
    > chain ring sizes.
     
  8. Zonker

    Zonker Guest

    [email protected] (Erich Hartman) wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > [email protected] (Zonker) wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    > > OK,
    > >
    > > I'm confused. The Bacchetta website says the Aero and Corsa are equipped with the M5 Carbon
    > > seat. On Hostel Shoppe's website the "Bacchetta seat" sells for 395.00 dollars and the M5 Carbon
    > > sells for
    > > 255.00. What am I missing here? Assuming a logical answer, what am I getting for $140 more?
    > >
    > > Quizzical Giro owner
    >
    > The M5 seat is just the blank seat shell (available in either fiberglass or carbon fiber) - it
    > requires you to drill holes and engineer mounting hardware to fit your bike.
    >
    > Conversely, the Bacchetta Carbon seat is a direct bolt-on upgrade for Bacchetta owners that
    > currently have bikes with mesh-backed or fiberglass seats. It includes seat foam and is
    > pre-drilled and equipped with mounting hardware.
    >
    > Hope this helps,
    >
    > Erich Hartman Hostel Shoppe Recumbents http://www.hostelshoppe.com [email protected]

    Erich,

    That helps a great deal. Thanks for the clarification!
     
  9. Don

    Don Guest

    Jude, Did you do a tire swap also? Switching from 1.5s to 1.0s lowers the entire bike by a heavy
    half inch. Those are the rough numbers from measuring a stock Giro compared to my Conti GP 26x1.0.
    Can you swap to narrow tires on a Giro or does it require a rim change?

    Going to shorter cranks also allows the seat to move back and DOWN a little. I am using every trick
    I know except for the M5 seat. I did not like the feel of it when I sat on a too tall Corsa. Of
    Corsa I was just trying to keep from a falling over (said with a poor accent and much hand waving).
    I would love to try one while actually riding.
     
  10. Don, The tires on the small GIRO with the M5 are the Stelvos. They do lower the seat about 3/4 inch
    compared to the stock KWESTS. The small GIRO has a 165mm CS stock. It also has the Velocity Thraican
    Wheelset. Doesn't lower the seat any but looks cool. No rim/wheel change is necessary to use thinner
    tires like the Stelvos the stock Alex DA-16's will work fine.
    --
    Jude....///Bacchetta AERO St. Michaels and Tilghman Island.. Maryland Wheel Doctor Cycle and Sports,
    Inc 1-800-586-6645 "Don" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > Jude, Did you do a tire swap also? Switching from 1.5s to 1.0s lowers the entire bike by a heavy
    > half inch. Those are the rough numbers from measuring a stock Giro compared to my Conti GP 26x1.0.
    > Can you swap to narrow tires on a Giro or does it require a rim change?
    >
    > Going to shorter cranks also allows the seat to move back and DOWN a little. I am using every
    > trick I know except for the M5 seat. I did not like the feel of it when I sat on a too tall Corsa.
    > Of Corsa I was just trying to keep from a falling over (said with a poor accent and much hand
    > waving). I would love to try one while actually riding.
     
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