Bomb Proof Touring Wheelset

[coolworx]

Hoping one of you "cycos" can help me pick my next wheelset - weight is NOT a major issue. I don't want rims made out of depleted uranium, but my gig is loaded tours, and right now I'm averaging a broken spoke every 200 miles on a 36 spoke (14gauge I think?) 700c Mavic's (sorry, can't think of the exact model #)

Should I be looking at tandem wheels? How about the strongest spoke gauge? Maybe 40 instead of 36?

Thanks in advance - This is a great bunch of posters.

 

[daveornee]

Hoping one of you "cycos" can help me pick my next wheelset - weight is NOT a major issue. I don't want rims made out of depleted uranium, but my gig is loaded tours, and right now I'm averaging a broken spoke every 200 miles on a 36 spoke (14gauge I think?) 700c Mavic's (sorry, can't think of the exact model #)

Should I be looking at tandem wheels? How about the strongest spoke gauge? Maybe 40 instead of 36?

Thanks in advance - This is a great bunch of posters.

36 spokes should do the job.
I suggest DT Competition 14/15 double butted spokes and/or DT Alpine III 13/15/14 spokes.
The hub type and hub interface are important. Phil Wood is the greatest, but Shimano hubs are a very good value.
Rims can be T217/T519/T520/A719 (T217/T519/T520 all now discontinued)from Mavic or Velocity Dyad.
I use Bontrager Fairlane rims, but they are no longer made. The advantage of the Bontrager Fairlane is they were available with an Offset Spoke Bed (OSB) to help even up the spoke support angle in the rear wheel.
Tandem 40 -48 spoke wheels provide significant redundancy, but unless they are propery built, you might have more broken spokes because there are more spokes.

The quality of the build makes a considerable difference. Spoke tension balancing, stress relief, alignment, and proper tensioning make the biggest difference. Once you have started breaking spokes in a wheel it usually continues. I suggest you find a very good local wheel builder and at least start with all new DT double butted spokes. The wheel builder can examine your existing hub and rim for suitability.

 

[RC2]

Yep, Mavic OP with a thicker spoke set and shimano ultegra/DA hubs shouldn't be too expensive, and should be pretty 'bomb proof'. Also be sure to opt for 3x interlacing.

 

[coolworx]

Thanks guys... I'm off to googleland.

 

[daveornee]

Yep, Mavic OP with a thicker spoke set and shimano ultegra/DA hubs shouldn't be too expensive, and should be pretty 'bomb proof'. Also be sure to opt for 3x interlacing.

Thicker spokes make the wheel stiffer, but less durable.
Open Pro rims are very nice, but not the most appropriate to loaded touring.

"Double-butted spokes do more than save weight. The thick ends make them as strong in the highly-stressed areas as straight-gauge spokes of the same thickness, but the thinner middle sections make the spokes effectively more elastic. This allows them to stretch (temporarily) more than thicker spokes.

As a result, when the wheel is subjected to sharp localized stresses, the most heavily stressed spokes can elongate enough to shift some of the stress to adjoining spokes. This is particularly desirable when the limiting factor is how much stress the rim can withstand without cracking around the spoke hole.


Triple-butted spokes, such as the DT Alpine III, are the best choice when durability and reliability is the primary aim, as with tandems and bicycles for loaded touring. They share the advantages of single-butted and double-butted spokes. The DT Alpine III, for instance, is 2.34mm (13 gauge) at the head, 1.8mm (15 gauge) in the middle, and 2.0mm (14 gauge) at the threaded end.
Single- and triple-butted spokes solve one of the great problems of wheel design: Since spokes use rolled, not cut threads, the outside diameter of the threads is larger than the base diameter of the spoke wire. Since the holes in the hub flanges must be large enough to fit the threads through, the holes, in turn are larger than the wire requires. This is undesirable, because a tight match between the spoke diameter at the elbow and the diameter of the flange hole is crucial to resisting fatigue-related breakage.

Since single- and triple-butted spokes are thicker at the head end than at the thread end, they may be used with hubs that have holes just large enough to pass the thick wire at the head end."

Quoted from Sheldon Brown's website URL:

<http://www.sheldonbrown.com/wheelbuild.html#spokes>

Harris Cyclery, where Sheldon is Service Manager, may be a good place to go for your wheel remedy:
Harris Cyclery
1353 Washington Street
West Newton, Massachusetts 02465

 

[nutbag]

I've never ridden on wider touring rims, but they sound like they might be an option. However, of the road rims available, any of the 30mm deep offerings would be pretty much bomb proof. I've have Rigida DP18s, Mavic CXP30s, and the 30mm Velocity, and they are all totally bomb proof compared to Mavic CD4s, Mavic Open Pros, and Mavic CXP33s, all of which I have.

 

[daveornee]

I've never ridden on wider touring rims, but they sound like they might be an option. However, of the road rims available, any of the 30mm deep offerings would be pretty much bomb proof. I've have Rigida DP18s, Mavic CXP30s, and the 30mm Velocity, and they are all totally bomb proof compared to Mavic CD4s, Mavic Open Pros, and Mavic CXP33s, all of which I have.

The rims I previously listed are appropriate for touring with tires from 28 to 37 mm; which are the typical sizes of tires used in loaded touring on paved roads. You can use narrower rims with wider tires, but wide tire on a narrow rim, you risk sidewall or rim failure. This combination causes very sloppy handling at low speeds.
Of course the other side of the coin is that very wide rims don't work well with very narrow tires. Therefore, the touring/trekking rims I listed previously should not be used with tires 25 mm wide or less.

 

[cachehiker]

...
I use Bontrager Fairlane rims, but they are no longer made.
...

I believe the Fairlane's were replaced by the 700c, 36 spoke, Bontrager Mavericks. They're one of the rims that Rivendell recommends for touring. They're also what I'm looking to set up a Soma Double-Cross with for a winter project.

http://www.bontrager.com/mountainrims/detail.asp?id=90&pt=6
http://www.bontrager.com/mountainrims/detail.asp?id=110&pt=6

 

[daveornee]

I believe the Fairlane's were replaced by the 700c, 36 spoke, Bontrager Mavericks. They're one of the rims that Rivendell recommends for touring. They're also what I'm looking to set up a Soma Double-Cross with for a winter project.

http://www.bontrager.com/mountainrims/detail.asp?id=90&pt=6
http://www.bontrager.com/mountainrims/detail.asp?id=110&pt=6

Thank you for the update on the 700C OSB Maverick rims. I see they are listed in 32 and .... at the bottom of Bontrager's page that you gave the link for... in 36 hole.
I have heard, through internal channels, that Rivendell is also getting some Velocity Synergy OCR rims in 700C.... maybe you can find the container between Australia and the USA... and get an early sample... I know I would like one or two.

I use the 32 H Bontrager Maverick OSB rim on the rear of my 26" wheeled touring bicycle. I like it. However, I think I would like to try the Velocity Synergy in 36 hole OSB for my 700C touring bicycle.

The Bontrager Fairlane doesn't have a refined finish, on the inside weld and spoke holes. However, after a little Dremel too work, I have had very satisfactory results with it in fully loaded touring.

 

[geoffs]

Try http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/index.html. He specialises in tandem and touring wheels and gives a lifetime warrantee against spoke breakage. If the spokes on your wheel are breaking every 200km, the spoke tension is to low. Use 36hole Mavic T520's or Velocity Dyads.
If you are going touring, carry some spare spokes and learn how to true your wheels.
We were touring on the tandem last year in New Zealands South Island, when we had the derailleur jockey wheel fall out and the derailleur went into the spokes and broke 4 spokes on both sides of the wheel. The nearest town was about 30kms away. Took about an hour to repair the wheel and get the rear derailleur striaght enough to work.
Try the touring list ( [email protected] ) for more info.
Be careful about the Alpine III's, the early spokes had a flaw and they break at the nipple end. 14/15/14 are plenty strong enough. Don't use 40 hole as if you need a new rim at any stage due to misadventure, they are harder to get whereas every lbs has 36h.