Do Mountain Bikers Have Any Balls?

[Muddy]

I have BALLS!

I mountain bike. And mountain biking IS destructive. Therfore, should be banned.

Carrying a gun around with you in Britain is illegal without a licence. There's nothing wrong with
the gun, or target pratice. Its the destruction caused when used improperly.

Mountain bikes can be used careful, if proper care is taken to ensure like MX bikes, they never
touch our countryside and national parks.

But to me, Mountain biking is a rebelious sport. Its more than just XC, its an extreme sport. Not
to say I tear-**** though the countryside. But just riding the countryside on bridleways should
be banned.

Tell me Mike. Kinderscout, The Downs, Windermere, etc... How many walkers visit these tourist
locations in a year/month/week? And how much devastation would be caused if there were that many
mountain bikes visiting that same location instead?

Mountain bikers forget the amount of destruction we do cause... Why can't anyone see this?

And that is why anyone involed in mountain biking is nothing more than a rebel. Im not saying WE
should stop doing it, but someone SHOULD stop us. Before the sport gets out of hand.

Muddy.

P.S....

> > By the way, I have NEVER heard any mountain biker talk about the issue of overpopulation in
> > their newsgroup. You are just trying to change the subject away from the destruction that
> > mountain biking does.
>
> Yes they have. See <[email protected]>, posted to several of the
> newsgroups you've annoyingly crossposted your latest troll to:
>
> "Why spend so much energy on denying people from having fun, when the real problem this Earth
> faces is overpopulation?"
>
> This proves that Mike Vandemann is a LIAR. He LIES, or else is such a DUM-DUM he can't do a simple
> Google Groups search. DUH!

How does this prove Mike is a liar? It simply proves you'll use any petty excuse to get back at
Mike. Maybe he didn't realise.

I quote "DUM-DUM"

 

[Mike Vandeman]

On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 03:59:35 GMT, "Joshua E. Rodd" <[email protected]> wrote:

.Mike Vandeman wrote: .> By the way, I have NEVER heard any mountain biker talk about the issue of
.> overpopulation in their newsgroup. You are just trying to change the subject .> away from the
destruction that mountain biking does. . .Yes they have. See
<[email protected]>, .posted to several of the newsgroups you've
annoyingly crossposted your .latest troll to: . ."Why spend so much energy on denying people from
having .fun,

Because you are denying willdife and other trail users fun.

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Michael Silver]

"Michael Dart" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> "Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:49:57 GMT, Mike Vandeman <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> >
> <snip load of usual BS>
>
> > . . .=== .I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to .humans ("pure
> > habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8 .years fighting auto dependence and road
> > construction.) . .http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
> >
> > Right on, Mike!
> > ===
> > I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
> > help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
> >
> > http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
>
> You talking to yourself now Mike?

I think this computer stuff is kinda new to him, or perhaps he has two personalities. One that does
all the talking and another that listens.

...Michael...

 

[R.White]

"Michael Dart" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> "Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:49:57 GMT, Mike Vandeman <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> >
> <snip load of usual BS>
>
> > . . .=== .I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to .humans ("pure
> > habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8 .years fighting auto dependence and road
> > construction.) . .http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
> >
> > Right on, Mike!
> > ===
> > I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
> > help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
> >
> > http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
>
> You talking to yourself now Mike?

Who else would listen?

 

[Surgius]

"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 22:32:09 GMT, "Chris McMartin" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> ."Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> .news:[email protected]... .> Good. So keep your bikes on pavement, and
> HIKE in nature. . .I thought you were against hiking? You can't have it both ways.
>
> Do I have to explain EVERYTHING to you idiots? Hiking reduces impacts.

Hiking frightens wildlife. Hiking INCREASES impact over non-use. Therefore hiking is bad for the
environment.

Hey I am getting the hang of Vandelogic!

> ===
> I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
> help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
>
> http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Surgius]

"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:44:27 -0500, Ken B
<[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> . .I'd like to see one shred of proof that mountain biking is destroing .the environment.
>
> That's easy. Just look at any mountain biking trail.

The creation of said trail does more damage to the environment that does damage to the trail.
>
> Ha! I've seen no evidence WHAT SO EVER here,or .anywhere else for that matter, proving that
> statement. None.
>
> Your nose is growing.
>
> .The latest attempt at proof of environmental destruction is:
> .http://www.santabarbarahikes.com/ComparisonTrails/damage.shtml. Nice .try, but no luck there. All
> I see are perfectly normal mountiain .biking trails.
>
> Yeah, with huge ruts and other erosion.

Which a trail crew can repair.

> Who wants to talk with an environmental rapist?

Well nobody, but we still talk with you.

> ===
> I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
> help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
>
> http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Bill Davidson]

"Gary S." wrote:
> Do you have any idea of how much we would have to pay for therapy for Mikey's kids, if he had any?

Probably a lot. His PhD is in psychology. I've never met a psychologist's kid that wasn't completely
screwed up. Come to think of it, all the
psychology majors I knew in college were nuts too.

--Bill Davidson
--
Please remove ".nospam" from my address for email replies.

Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? Pinky: Yes, Brain, but if our knees bent the
other way, how would we ride a bicycle?

 

[Surgius]

"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message

> .The plain and simple fact of the matter is that if ANYTHING is .detructive, it is the hikers.
> They are the ones who leave trash all .along the trails. They are the ones who cut down trees to
> block access .to the trails
>
> Where?
>

On the trails idiot. Learn to read!

>
> ===
> I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
> help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
>
> http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Andy Chequer]

I have plenty of balls.

1/4", 1/8", 3/16", mainly, cos I only ever find that I need new ones when the shops are shut.

Andy Chequer

 

[Andy Chequer]

> I have BALLS!

Talking is not the same as having.

<snipped the bulk of your silliest post so far>

> But to me, Mountain biking is a rebelious sport. Its more than just XC, its an extreme sport.

Aha - that magic word "extreme" - the hallmark of the clueless *******.

<snipped further confused agenda>

>Im not saying WE should stop doing it, but someone SHOULD stop us. Before the sport gets
>out of hand.

You want to be nannyed for the rest of your life? If you've got ethical problems with mountain
biking, don't do it. Otherwise, put a sock in it.

Andy Chequer

 

[Chris McMartin]

"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> .I thought you were against hiking? You can't have it both ways.
>
> Do I have to explain EVERYTHING to you idiots? Hiking reduces impacts.

So we should hike in your "human-free habitat" because it, in your own words, reduces impacts? Your
encouragement is duly noted.

> You are projecting again. T state an OPINION, you have to say so. His was
an
> assertion of fact. DUH!

I'm assuming you're attempting to use "projecting" in a psychological sense. I don't have my old
psychology book in front of me, but a quick definition from dictionary.com:

"To externalize and attribute (an emotion or motive, for example) unconsciously to someone or
something else in order to avoid anxiety."

This doesn't apply to the argument here. I'm not doing what I do unconsciously (though you seem to
be), and I'm not anxious. Plus, I'm not attributing an emotion or motive. I'm telling it like it
is. The original comment said "should," rather than "shall" or "will," and was not substantiated
with facts. Therefore, it's opinion. If you can't figure that out, I can't help you any further in
that respect.

> .Why SHOULD they talk about overpopulation? It's off-topic.
>
> So is talking about ME, but you do that all the time. You couldn't argue
your
> way out of a paper bag.

It doesn't necessarily mean we SHOULD talk about you, but you do represent another viewpoint
regarding mountain bikes so therefore in a sick way you ARE on-topic.

 

[Ken B]

On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 03:43:17 GMT, Mike Vandeman <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:44:27 -0500, Ken B <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>. .I'd like to see one shred of proof that mountain biking is destroing .the environment.
>
>That's easy. Just look at any mountain biking trail.
>
> Ha! I've seen no evidence WHAT SO EVER here,or .anywhere else for that matter, proving that
> statement. None.
>
>Your nose is growing.
>
>.The latest attempt at proof of environmental destruction is:
>.http://www.santabarbarahikes.com/ComparisonTrails/damage.shtml. Nice .try, but no luck there. All
>I see are perfectly normal mountiain .biking trails.
>
>Yeah, with huge ruts and other erosion.

That makes a good biking trail. Your point is?

>
> No vast expanses of deforestation, no depletion of the .ozone layer, no global warming green house
> gas emissions, no carcasses .of endangered animal species (or any species for that matter)
> .littering the side of the trail. All I read in the linked site are .lies and misrepresentations.
> . .The plain and simple fact of the matter is that if ANYTHING is .detructive, it is the hikers.
> They are the ones who leave trash all .along the trails. They are the ones who cut down trees to
> block access .to the trails for those of us who like to ride them. They are the ones .who bring
> their pets along for the walk, disobeying leash laws and not .packing out the animal's waste
> products. Add to that the fact that .hikers are ignorant and rude -- when's the last time a hiker
> said hi,
>
>Who wants to talk with an environmental rapist?

Ha! Litter bug. Don't waste my time with your lies and uneducated misinformation.

>
>.or moved out of the way when you were grunting up a hill past him/her,
>
>Because they have the right of way. Oh, you forgot?

Right of way? Says who? They are IN the way and should get out of it.

>
>.or picked up their trash??? Yeah, right. Keep dreaming. Hikers are a .menace and they should be
>treated as such when met on the trail. . . .On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:49:57 GMT, Mike Vandeman
><[email protected]> .wrote: . .>At 06:37 PM 11/28/02 -0700, Gunther, Jeff wrote: .> .>> Mike, .>
>.>> Just so you know, I am a mountain biker and a mountaineer who cares .>deeply about the
>environment. .> .>Caring is as caring DOES. People who truly care reflect that in their ACTIONS. .>
>.>> I think it is wrong to say that mountain .>bikers are out to harm the environment. .> .>I never
>said it is INTENTIONAL! But it is still destructive. .> .>>Everyone that I ride with is very
>.>conscious of leaving no trace when we are out and we frequently pick up .>after hikers that have
>left wrappers, tissues, etc. on the trail. .> .>Good. So keep your bikes on pavement, and HIKE in
>nature. .> .>> As you know, getting outside and into the mountains is a very .>fulfilling and
>uplifting experience that should not be off limits to someone .>just because they are on a bike. .>
>.>You are LYING. There isn't a single trail in the world closed to mountain .>bikers. It is only
>BIKES that are banned. You CAN walk, can't you? .> .>> If we really want to address the issue of
>wildlife having no place .>to live then we should start talking about the real source of the
>problem; .>overpopulation. .> .>I have a vasectomy and no kids. But that's not enough: the
>remaining people can .>still destroy the environment by their ACTIONS, so ACTIONS need to be
>changed. .> .>> If people would quit having so many damn babies this world .>would be a much better
>place and the balance could begin to be restored but .>no one seems to have the balls to stand up
>and say that. .> .>Actually, a lot of people are saying just that. But very few people have the
>.>balls to say that mountain biking should be banned, partly because mountain .>bikers ********
>anyone who has the guts to speak out against their selfish, .>destructive sport. .> .>By the way, I
>have NEVER heard any mountain biker talk about the issue of .>overpopulation in their newsgroup.
>You are just trying to change the subject .>away from the destruction that mountain biking does. .>
>.>> Peace, .> Jeff .> .> .> .>=== .>I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
>.>humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8 .>years fighting auto dependence
>and road construction.) .> .>http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
>
>===
>I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
>help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
>
>http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Ken B]

On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 03:44:03 GMT, Mike Vandeman <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:44:27 -0500, Ken B <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>. .I'd like to see one shred of proof that mountain biking is destroing .the environment. Ha! I've
>seen no evidence WHAT SO EVER here,or .anywhere else for that matter, proving that statement. None.
>. .The latest attempt at proof of environmental destruction is:
>.http://www.santabarbarahikes.com/ComparisonTrails/damage.shtml. Nice .try, but no luck there. All
>I see are perfectly normal mountiain .biking trails. No vast expanses of deforestation, no
>depletion of the .ozone layer, no global warming green house gas emissions, no carcasses .of
>endangered animal species (or any species for that matter) .littering the side of the trail. All I
>read in the linked site are .lies and misrepresentations. . .The plain and simple fact of the
>matter is that if ANYTHING is .detructive, it is the hikers. They are the ones who leave trash all
>.along the trails. They are the ones who cut down trees to block access .to the trails
>
>Where?

Everywhere, you idiot. I haven't come across a downed (meaning cut) tree yet that wasn't felled by a
hiker. Us mountain bikers don't carry saws as standard equipment. Duh.

>
> for those of us who like to ride them. They are the ones .who bring their pets along for the walk,
> disobeying leash laws and not .packing out the animal's waste products. Add to that the fact that
> .hikers are ignorant and rude -- when's the last time a hiker said hi, .or moved out of the way
> when you were grunting up a hill past him/her, .or picked up their trash??? Yeah, right. Keep
> dreaming. Hikers are a .menace and they should be treated as such when met on the trail. . . .On
> Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:49:57 GMT, Mike Vandeman <[email protected]> .wrote: . .>At 06:37 PM
> 11/28/02 -0700, Gunther, Jeff wrote: .> .>> Mike, .> .>> Just so you know, I am a mountain biker
> and a mountaineer who cares .>deeply about the environment. .> .>Caring is as caring DOES. People
> who truly care reflect that in their ACTIONS. .> .>> I think it is wrong to say that mountain
> .>bikers are out to harm the environment. .> .>I never said it is INTENTIONAL! But it is still
> destructive. .> .>>Everyone that I ride with is very .>conscious of leaving no trace when we are
> out and we frequently pick up .>after hikers that have left wrappers, tissues, etc. on the trail.
> .> .>Good. So keep your bikes on pavement, and HIKE in nature. .> .>> As you know, getting outside
> and into the mountains is a very .>fulfilling and uplifting experience that should not be off
> limits to someone .>just because they are on a bike. .> .>You are LYING. There isn't a single
> trail in the world closed to mountain .>bikers. It is only BIKES that are banned. You CAN walk,
> can't you? .> .>> If we really want to address the issue of wildlife having no place .>to live
> then we should start talking about the real source of the problem; .>overpopulation. .> .>I have a
> vasectomy and no kids. But that's not enough: the remaining people can .>still destroy the
> environment by their ACTIONS, so ACTIONS need to be changed. .> .>> If people would quit having so
> many damn babies this world .>would be a much better place and the balance could begin to be
> restored but .>no one seems to have the balls to stand up and say that. .> .>Actually, a lot of
> people are saying just that. But very few people have the .>balls to say that mountain biking
> should be banned, partly because mountain .>bikers ******** anyone who has the guts to speak out
> against their selfish, .>destructive sport. .> .>By the way, I have NEVER heard any mountain biker
> talk about the issue of .>overpopulation in their newsgroup. You are just trying to change the
> subject .>away from the destruction that mountain biking does. .> .>> Peace, .> Jeff .> .> .>
> .>=== .>I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to .>humans ("pure habitat").
> Want to help? (I spent the previous 8 .>years fighting auto dependence and road construction.) .>
> .>http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
>
>===
>I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
>help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
>
>http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Ken B]

On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 11:32:48 +0000, Guy Chapman <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:44:27 -0500, Ken B <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>The latest attempt at proof of environmental destruction is:
>>http://www.santabarbarahikes.com/ComparisonTrails/damage.shtml. Nice try, but no luck there.
>
>I have seen much more serious damage done by sheep and water on Welsh mountainsides. To say nothing
>of the huge erosion caused by hikers, as you point out.
>
>Ultimately, though, the fact that hikers and bikers use these areas is a major driver for
>conservation work. Over here the National Parks Authority spends large sums of money protecting
>wildlife habitats from the real threats - industrialisation and pollution - and the payback is that
>we get to walk or ride into the areas to see the animals and plants. It's much better to find out
>about nature by observation rather than by looking at pictures in a book.
>
>In any case, Mikey-boy is completely missing the target. The numbers of species threatened by
>small-scale (and it is small-scale) human access to North American wilderness is a spit in the
>bucket compared with the danger posed by rain forest logging, commerical fishing, heavy metals
>extraction and so on.
>
>I think it's likely that those people who experience the natural environment by biking and walking
>are likely to gain an appreciation of natural diversity and become more sympathetic to moves aimed
>at restricting the destruction of the world's habitats, but I'm a known optimist.
>
>Guy

Well said, Guy.

>===
>Now available in both wedgie and bent flavours!
>
>** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. http://www.chapmancentral.com (BT ADSL and
>dynamic DNS permitting) Above email is a spam-sink. Remove maker of Spam from
>[email protected] to reply by mail

 

[Penny S]

since you are new here. and you've already wasted tons of bandwidth replying to you know
who...here's a hint. Don't bother. You'd be much better off either killfiling or ignoring MV
threads. Read Jonathan Harris' AMB FAQ.

"Muddy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I have BALLS!
<snip>

> But to me, Mountain biking is a rebelious sport. Its more than just XC, its an extreme
> sport.<snip>>

oh, brother.

1¢

 

[Mike Vandeman]

On 30 Nov 2002 04:48:21 -0800, [email protected] (Muddy) wrote:

.I have BALLS! . .I mountain bike. And mountain biking IS destructive. .Therfore, should be banned.
. .Carrying a gun around with you in Britain is illegal without a .licence. There's nothing wrong
with the gun, or target pratice. Its .the destruction caused when used improperly. . .Mountain bikes
can be used careful, if proper care is taken to ensure .like MX bikes, they never touch our
countryside and national parks. . .But to me, Mountain biking is a rebelious sport. Its more than
just .XC, its an extreme sport. Not to say I tear-**** though the .countryside. But just riding the
countryside on bridleways should be .banned. . .Tell me Mike. Kinderscout, The Downs, Windermere,
etc... How many .walkers visit these tourist locations in a year/month/week? And how .much
devastation would be caused if there were that many mountain .bikes visiting that same location
instead? . .Mountain bikers forget the amount of destruction we do cause... Why .can't anyone see
this? . .And that is why anyone involed in mountain biking is nothing more than .a rebel. Im not
saying WE should stop doing it, but someone SHOULD .stop us. Before the sport gets out of hand.

It already IS out of hand.

.Muddy. . .P.S.... . .> > By the way, I have NEVER heard any mountain biker talk about the issue of
.> > overpopulation in their newsgroup. You are just trying to change the subject .> > away from the
destruction that mountain biking does. .> .> Yes they have. See
<[email protected]>, .> posted to several of the newsgroups you've
annoyingly crossposted your .> latest troll to: .> .> "Why spend so much energy on denying people
from having .> fun, when the real problem this Earth faces is overpopulation?" .> .> This proves
that Mike Vandemann is a LIAR. He LIES, or else is such .> a DUM-DUM he can't do a simple Google
Groups search. DUH! . .How does this prove Mike is a liar? It simply proves you'll use any .petty
excuse to get back at Mike. Maybe he didn't realise. . .I quote "DUM-DUM"

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Mike Vandeman]

On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 11:32:48 +0000, Guy Chapman <[email protected]> wrote:

.On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:44:27 -0500, Ken B .<[email protected]> wrote: . .>The
latest attempt at proof of environmental destruction is:
.>http://www.santabarbarahikes.com/ComparisonTrails/damage.shtml. Nice .>try, but no luck there. .
.I have seen much more serious damage done by sheep and water on Welsh .mountainsides. To say
nothing of the huge erosion caused by hikers, .as you point out. . .Ultimately, though, the fact
that hikers and bikers use these areas is .a major driver for conservation work. Over here the
National Parks .Authority spends large sums of money protecting wildlife habitats from .the real
threats - industrialisation and pollution - and the payback .is that we get to walk or ride into the
areas to see the animals and .plants. It's much better to find out about nature by observation
.rather than by looking at pictures in a book. . .In any case, Mikey-boy is completely missing the
target. The numbers .of species threatened by small-scale (and it is small-scale) human .access to
North American wilderness is a spit in the bucket compared .with the danger posed by rain forest
logging, commerical fishing, .heavy metals extraction and so on. . .I think it's likely that those
people who experience the natural .environment by biking and walking are likely to gain an
appreciation .of natural diversity and become more sympathetic to moves aimed at .restricting the
destruction of the world's habitats,

BS. The only think mountan bikers ever protest is the closure of trails to bikes.

but I'm a known .optimist. . .Guy .=== .Now available in both wedgie and bent flavours! . .**
WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. .http://www.chapmancentral.com (BT ADSL and
dynamic DNS permitting) .Above email is a spam-sink. Remove maker of Spam from
[email protected] to reply by mail

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Joshua E. Rodd]

Guy Chapman wrote:
> In any case, Mikey-boy is completely missing the target. The numbers of species threatened by
> small-scale (and it is small-scale) human access to North American wilderness is a spit in the
> bucket compared with the danger posed by rain forest logging, commerical fishing, heavy metals
> extraction and so on.

I'm not convinced Mike Vandemann isn't actually secretly working for an evil cabal of
industrial-military interests, whose goal is to completely remove all mountain bikers from parks so
that they can can trash the ecosystem in the parks and not have anyone notice. DUH!

 

[Ken B]

On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 15:46:52 GMT, Mike Vandeman <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 03:59:35 GMT, "Joshua E. Rodd" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>.Mike Vandeman wrote: .> By the way, I have NEVER heard any mountain biker talk about the issue of
>.> overpopulation in their newsgroup. You are just trying to change the subject .> away from the
>destruction that mountain biking does. . .Yes they have. See
><[email protected]>, .posted to several of the newsgroups you've
>annoyingly crossposted your .latest troll to: . ."Why spend so much energy on denying people from
>having .fun,
>
>Because you are denying willdife and other trail users fun.

Ok, I just spent the last 15 minutes laughing at this one. Yes, I'm sure mountain bikers are
preventing the squirrels from having fun. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!! As to the hikers having fun, who
cares. They go out of their way to stop us from having fun. Maybe if they'd spend less time doing
that, then they could enjoy themselves. Duh! Maybe if they'd stop cutting trees and littering,
they'd enjoy themselves. And maybe if you'd stop molesting the animals, they'd enjoy themselves too.

As it stands, hikers are a menace to the people who actually CARE about the condition of the trails.
Hikers should be banned from their use. There are perfectly good sidewalks for you to hike on, why
don't you use them and leave the trails to those of us that take care of them. You don't deseve to
use the trails.

>
>===
>I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
>help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
>
>http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Derral]

Just look at the damage those damn dinasours did, they are still finding their footprints millions
and millions of years after they destroyed a trail, wonder if they will find our single tracks 100
or so million years from now?

"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:44:27 -0500, Ken B
<[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> . .I'd like to see one shred of proof that mountain biking is destroing .the environment.
>
> That's easy. Just look at any mountain biking trail.
>
> Ha! I've seen no evidence WHAT SO EVER here,or .anywhere else for that matter, proving that
> statement. None.
>
> Your nose is growing.
>
> .The latest attempt at proof of environmental destruction is:
> .http://www.santabarbarahikes.com/ComparisonTrails/damage.shtml. Nice .try, but no luck there. All
> I see are perfectly normal mountiain .biking trails.
>
> Yeah, with huge ruts and other erosion.
>
> No vast expanses of deforestation, no depletion of the .ozone layer, no global warming green
> house gas emissions, no carcasses .of endangered animal species (or any species for that matter)
> .littering the side of the trail. All I read in the linked site are .lies and misrepresentations.
> . .The plain and simple fact of the matter is that if ANYTHING is .detructive, it is the hikers.
> They are the ones who leave trash all .along the trails. They are the ones who cut down trees to
> block access .to the trails for those of us who like to ride them. They are the ones .who bring
> their pets along for the walk, disobeying leash laws and not .packing out the animal's waste
> products. Add to that the fact that .hikers are ignorant and rude -- when's the last time a hiker
> said hi,
>
> Who wants to talk with an environmental rapist?
>
> .or moved out of the way when you were grunting up a hill past him/her,
>
> Because they have the right of way. Oh, you forgot?
>
> .or picked up their trash??? Yeah, right. Keep dreaming. Hikers are a .menace and they should be
> treated as such when met on the trail. . . .On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:49:57 GMT, Mike Vandeman
> <[email protected]> .wrote: . .>At 06:37 PM 11/28/02 -0700, Gunther, Jeff wrote: .> .>> Mike, .>
> .>> Just so you know, I am a mountain biker and a mountaineer who cares .>deeply about the
> environment. .> .>Caring is as caring DOES. People who truly care reflect that in their
ACTIONS.
> .> .>> I think it is wrong to say that mountain .>bikers are out to harm the environment. .> .>I
> never said it is INTENTIONAL! But it is still destructive. .> .>>Everyone that I ride with is very
> .>conscious of leaving no trace when we are out and we frequently pick up .>after hikers that have
> left wrappers, tissues, etc. on the trail. .> .>Good. So keep your bikes on pavement, and HIKE in
> nature. .> .>> As you know, getting outside and into the mountains is a very .>fulfilling and
> uplifting experience that should not be off limits to
someone
> .>just because they are on a bike. .> .>You are LYING. There isn't a single trail in the world
> closed to
mountain
> .>bikers. It is only BIKES that are banned. You CAN walk, can't you? .> .>> If we really want to
> address the issue of wildlife having no place .>to live then we should start talking about the
> real source of the
problem;
> .>overpopulation. .> .>I have a vasectomy and no kids. But that's not enough: the remaining
people can
> .>still destroy the environment by their ACTIONS, so ACTIONS need to be
changed.
> .> .>> If people would quit having so many damn babies this world .>would be a much better place
> and the balance could begin to be restored
but
> .>no one seems to have the balls to stand up and say that. .> .>Actually, a lot of people are
> saying just that. But very few people have
the
> .>balls to say that mountain biking should be banned, partly because
mountain
> .>bikers ******** anyone who has the guts to speak out against their
selfish,
> .>destructive sport. .> .>By the way, I have NEVER heard any mountain biker talk about the issue
of
> .>overpopulation in their newsgroup. You are just trying to change the
subject
> .>away from the destruction that mountain biking does. .> .>> Peace, .> Jeff .> .> .> .>=== .>I am
> working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to .>humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
> help? (I spent the previous 8 .>years fighting auto dependence and road construction.) .>
> .>http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande
>
> ===
> I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to
> help? (I spent the previous 8 years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)
>
> http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande